Dean Greig on Raph and Luke

howlinwolf · Sat 10 Oct 2009 10:29am

I'm not sure how many of you were listening to SEN last night around
11.30pm ?

Former StKilda player Dean Greig was on giving his opinion on Raph and
Luke Ball.

To be honest I was gobsmacked at what he said. Not because it was his
opinion but that he was saying it on air.

I won't go into all of the details of the Raph comments but let's say they
weren't flattering in general.

He did say his efforts against the Dogs in the prelim were not up to scratch.
The GF neither as they were all loose possesions and handballs in front into trouble.

Then he said Luke had been very hard done by, by the club.

And this one.... that on the Thursday before the GF Ross called Luke in
and asked him " give me one good reason i should play you ?"

It may all be his opinion but I was in disbelief he would go on air and
say all of this.

saint patrick · Sat 10 Oct 2009 10:34am

Interesting comments by one of the most gutsy/hard players I have seen in my lifetime.

He was as hard and tough as anyone who has played the game

...and called it as he saw it..

Hasn't changed apparently

Eastern · Post: # 847016Post **Eastern** » Sat 10 Oct 2009 10:36am

Is this the same Dean Greig who, when he was the non-playing coach of Scoresby entered the playing field at Vermont, assaulted an opposition player and got himself banned from the Eastern Footy League for a very long time?

His whole outlook on footy & life might have changed when he lost 1/2 his leg after it was broken playing suburban footy !!

Solar · Post: # 847017Post **Solar** » Sat 10 Oct 2009 10:38am

don't care who said it, it's a bulls*** opinion. Anyone with any sense of football knowledge would know that raph had a very good second half of the pelim final and was one of the reasons we made the grand final. I find it disgusting the amount of heat this player gets while others seem to escape with nothing (eddy 4 possesions in a prelim final, milne going missing, schneider missing goals in the grand final).

On the luke one, this is becoming chinese whispers....

how SEN allows such slander on the radio is beyond the belief

Eastern · Post: # 847018Post **Eastern** » Sat 10 Oct 2009 10:39am

Solar wrote:
how SEN allows such slander on the radio is beyond the belief

Dean Greig is a mate of Mark Fine (SEN presenter) !!

howlinwolf · Sat 10 Oct 2009 10:42am

I realise he is an ex player and free to say whatever but you don't hear
many other ex players as scathing as he was publicly.

I tried to work out if he was generally as outspoken a guy or had he had
a few ? It was 11.30pm.

Anyway I can't see it as being to helpful to the club or Raph's state of mind.

In my opinion I trust the way the Club handle these things as we improved
vastly on last year and almost tasted the ultimate success. they can't be
doing much wrong.

saint patrick · Sat 10 Oct 2009 10:46am

As a very good ex player he has a right to his opinion Solar and some credibility IMO...you obviously don't agree and thats your right as well.

Its not a bulls*** opinion its just an opinion

Can't people have one re team selections without being regarded as divisive or even worse.... a racist

chook23 · Post: # 847022Post **chook23** » Sat 10 Oct 2009 10:51am

one answer 11.30pm

saint patrick · Sat 10 Oct 2009 10:54am

chook23 wrote:one answer 11.30pm

To simplistic Chook..it was 11.30 so he was pissed.

May not have had a drink!!May have had a couple!...

who cares!!

SaintWodonga · Sat 10 Oct 2009 10:56am

Anyone got a replay link?

Solar · Post: # 847031Post **Solar** » Sat 10 Oct 2009 11:05am

saint patrick wrote:As a very good ex player he has a right to his opinion Solar and some credibility IMO...you obviously don't agree and thats your right as well.

Its not a bulls*** opinion its just an opinion

Can't people have one re team selections without being regarded as divisive or even worse.... a racist

That's fine, a little bit of scapegoating and witch burning sounds like fun. It's a running theme and I'm sick of it. In my humble opinion SEN seem to allow alot of potting of a certain st kilda player over and over, not allowing people on to defend him. If it happens once or twice, thats fine but it's been happening EVERY week this year. I'm over it......

I guess it's right because everyone thinks so

of all players I'm suprised raph wasn't the one to ask for a trade, not sure I would want to work my guts out for a club with a bunch of spineless d**khead supporters who actively get off on my mistakes

Beej · Post: # 847035Post **Beej** » Sat 10 Oct 2009 11:07am

saint patrick wrote:As a very good ex player he has a right to his opinion Solar and some credibility IMO...you obviously don't agree and thats your right as well.

Its not a bulls*** opinion its just an opinion

Can't people have one re team selections without being regarded as divisive or even worse.... a racist

Agreed.

I love it how people are unbelievably quick to defend Raph yet just as quickly portion the blame to Milne, Schneider, Eddy, Dempster and even Ross Lyon for playing Raph on Byrnes in a GF. How dare Ross Lyon put his trust in Raph to do a job!

IMO Raph's good and bad are too far apart. When he's good, as we saw in the 2nd half of the prelim, he can play, but when he's bad he's a liability.

Re Ball, I'm beginning to lean towards the view that the club has made it impossible for him to stay. The guy is playing great footy in a GF, in conditions that suit him perfectly, yet only plays 46% of the game. Then they offer him a new contract but tell him to expect a bit-part role.

I reckon most players with even the smallest amount of self-respect would have requested a move under the same circumstances.

If Lyon doesn't rate him, as he obviously doesn't, I'll back his judgement but Bally's being forced out in the nicest way possible IMO.

Solar · Post: # 847039Post **Solar** » Sat 10 Oct 2009 11:16am

OLB wrote:
I love it how people are unbelievably quick to defend Raph yet just as quickly portion the blame to Milne, Schneider, Eddy, Dempster and even Ross Lyon for playing Raph on Byrnes in a GF. How dare Ross Lyon put his trust in Raph to do a job!

IMO Raph's good and bad are too far apart. When he's good, as we saw in the 2nd half of the prelim, he can play, but when he's bad he's a liability.

thats strange, the small amount of saints supporters who actually give raph the time of day agree that his good and bad are far apart. He has bad games and good. But this happens to most young players. Hell of those players you named, all those players have had very bad games as well as great games. The only poblem is that those players are not abused at every turn, each game I hear large portions of the crowd abuse him, on facebook and saitsational people are always potting him. People always ring up radio and TV stations asking why he is selected.....

We have every right to askwh the spotlight is ALWAYS on this single player. Heaps of others have shockers and barely get a word about them. We are not blaming those players, just pointing out that there is more the raph out there.

And yes ross would admit that mistakes were made, and IMO playing a tall utility on a quick small was a wrong decision when you had the likes of mini getting cold at the other end. I still think overall ross was very good on the day.

anyway I'm sick of one player copping it day in day out.

kaos theory · Sat 10 Oct 2009 11:16am

saint patrick wrote:As a very good ex player he has a right to his opinion Solar and some credibility IMO...you obviously don't agree and thats your right as well.

Its not a bulls*** opinion its just an opinion

Can't people have one re team selections without being regarded as divisive or even worse.... a racist

HE has ZERO credibility on the Ball issue. How the F*** does he know what has been said and all the facts around how Ball was handled & why??

He knows SH*T.

As far as his opinion on raph, fine, he can say what he likes, he isn't part of the club or knows the plans & strategies.

saint patrick · Sat 10 Oct 2009 11:28am

kaos theory wrote:
saint patrick wrote:As a very good ex player he has a right to his opinion Solar and some credibility IMO...you obviously don't agree and thats your right as well.

Its not a bulls*** opinion its just an opinion

Can't people have one re team selections without being regarded as divisive or even worse.... a racist
HE has ZERO credibility on the Ball issue. How the F*** does he know what has been said and all the facts around how Ball was handled & why??

He knows SH*T.

As far as his opinion on raph, fine, he can say what he likes, he isn't part of the club or knows the plans & strategies.

How do you know he hasn't spoken to someone connected at the club or to Ball who relayed that statement????

The answer is...you don't

Probably just made it up...yeh that makes sense

Mr Magic · Post: # 847046Post **Mr Magic** » Sat 10 Oct 2009 11:29am

OLB wrote:
saint patrick wrote:As a very good ex player he has a right to his opinion Solar and some credibility IMO...you obviously don't agree and thats your right as well.

Its not a bulls*** opinion its just an opinion

Can't people have one re team selections without being regarded as divisive or even worse.... a racist

Re Ball, I'm beginning to lean towards the view that the club has made it impossible for him to stay. The guy is playing great footy in a GF, in conditions that suit him perfectly, yet only plays 46% of the game. Then they offer him a new contract but tell him to expect a bit-part role.

I reckon most players with even the smallest amount of self-respect would have requested a move under the same circumstances.

If Lyon doesn't rate him, as he obviously doesn't, I'll back his judgement but Bally's being forced out in the nicest way possible IMO.

There's a flaw in your argument.

Ball was offered the contract 3 months before the GF.
3 months before he was 'dropped' to Sandringham.

And after Gram was dropped to Sandringham for failing to meet Club standards.

He like Dal and Milne seem to have acceoted that they needed to improve according to teh coaches and match committee.

Ball seems to have decided on a different path.

Interesting how the only 'stories' coming out seem to be from the Ball side of the 'conflict'?

I wonder why?

So far any comments coming from the Saints seem to be going out of their way not to denigrate Luke Ball in any way.

Can we say the same applies to Ball's management?

Moods · Post: # 847048Post **Moods** » Sat 10 Oct 2009 11:36am

GF aside. How did Ball play in the other 2 finals we played that were in dry weather? THis is where the majority of games are played these days anyway. Or are we all just going to focus on a good performance in the GF b/c it suits our particular argument.

Do the Gram knockers suddenly believe that GRam's disposal is up to scratch now? Do the Gram defenders point at the GF and say, see this proves my point.

Whilst a very important game, the GF is just one game. The club makes decisions on players over the entire season. Yes, some games are more important than others, but if decisions were made on the GF alone then Raph, Milne, mini, King etc would all have been traded last week.

As for Dean Greig. At least he's not afraid to express an opinion, whether I agree with it or not. Far more thought provoking than most former players who are too worried who they are going to upset.

kaos theory · Sat 10 Oct 2009 11:44am

saint patrick wrote:
kaos theory wrote:
saint patrick wrote:As a very good ex player he has a right to his opinion Solar and some credibility IMO...you obviously don't agree and thats your right as well.

Its not a bulls*** opinion its just an opinion

Can't people have one re team selections without being regarded as divisive or even worse.... a racist
HE has ZERO credibility on the Ball issue. How the F*** does he know what has been said and all the facts around how Ball was handled & why??

He knows SH*T.

As far as his opinion on raph, fine, he can say what he likes, he isn't part of the club or knows the plans & strategies.
How do you know he hasn't spoken to someone connected at the club or to Ball who relayed that statement????

The answer is...you don't

Probably just made it up...yeh that makes sense

So you know for a fact that he has? Where is your evidence?

Until there is clear evidence of such a claim, it is just speculation.....Greig has 'form' so I'm not taking what he says as gospel.

SainterK · Post: # 847051Post **SainterK** » Sat 10 Oct 2009 11:44am

I just wish people would give Raph a fair go, other players in this age bracket are referred to as young and developing...

In regards to the OP, it's an opinion shared by many...this is our trade report card from the Herald Sun.

ST KILDA

GAIN: Andrew Lovett, Brett Peake. Pick 60

LOSE: Xavier Clarke. Picks 16, 48.

GRADE: B+

Lovett is a massive win, given he provides pace and an X-factor. Peake also has leg speed.

X. Clarke loss not an issue, although some Saints fans will be disappointed brother Raph didn't go as the steak knives in the deal. The Luke Ball mess should have been handled better. Such a respected player deserved more.

DRAFT ORDER: 32, 60, 64, 80, 96

Enrico_Misso · Sat 10 Oct 2009 11:53am

chook23 wrote:one answer 11.30pm

I don't think it is politically correct to describe him as "legless"

borderbarry · Sat 10 Oct 2009 12:12pm

The Raph knockers are not taking into account that he got cleaned up near half time, and was taken off and into the rooms. His game after would have suffered because of the knock, just as I believe Roos game suffered as a result of the heavy fall he had early.

Gurgman · Post: # 847066Post **Gurgman** » Sat 10 Oct 2009 12:17pm

Dean is a good mate of mine and i will say he doesnt like Raph in the team to say the least , He wouldnt have needed a drink to say what he said i can tell you that .
ps , just because you dont like what he said , no need for any smartass legless remarks

bigred · Post: # 847088Post **bigred** » Sat 10 Oct 2009 12:53pm

Agreed.

Who cares really. I mean, Dean Greig played over a decade ago.

What relevance does it have to today?

Pfft...means nothing.

Just another Raph basher on SEN.

GrumpyOne · Post: # 847092Post **GrumpyOne** » Sat 10 Oct 2009 12:55pm

Enrico_Misso wrote:
chook23 wrote:one answer 11.30pm
I don't think it is politically correct to describe him as "legless"

It would be the same as saying that his comments don't stand up to scrutiny. Statements like that are best left off postings.

saint66au · Post: # 847094Post **saint66au** » Sat 10 Oct 2009 12:59pm

Raph-bashing Radio...SEN