This Is Where Ross Earns His Money

[bergholt]

...not that he hasn't been already.

It was a good win but a team performance obviously a bit worse than previous weeks. The opposition met us well and teams will probably do that more often as we're identified as top of the ladder. More players were quiet than the superb team performances of past weeks.

This is why Ross earns the big bucks. He has to work out how we keep fresh and winning well. Yes, we know he prefers to make few changes, but keeping the same side until they all get stale at the same time sounds dangerous. I reckon at some point in the next few weeks there might have to be a couple of changes (injury aside).

That said, it's not obvious to me exactly what these changes are. I guess the bottom few on exposed form are, in approximate order:

Gwilt
Geary
McQualter
Baker
Blake
Schneider
Gram

All have done jobs to some extent but are definitely last picked. Luke Ball's been pretty quiet too, but you can't drop him so forget about it. Then pushing up from Sandy are, in approximate order:

Hudghton
Eddy
Clarke, R
Maguire
McEvoy
Miles
Fisher, L
Armitage
Begley
Steven
Simpkin
Howard

Ross makes his money by putting those two lists together and coming up with a plan for keeping St Kilda playing well.

That might be by making no changes, but I don't think so. We probably ran out of legs today, and it's not going to get easier. Let's not assume that we can make no changes each week and everyone will keep motivation and fitness up.

So maybe he rotates out a kid like Geary and brings Eddy in to his place. Or replaces Blake with Hudghton to shore up the backline, or replaces Blake with Miles to give a bit more run. Maybe Gwilt goes out and R Clarke comes in, playing about the same role. Maybe Begley comes in to play Baker's back pocket role.

Not sure, but I'm glad the choice is with Ross instead of with me. It looks hard.

[DWOODROW]

Considering Armitage was in the rooms bouncing a ball as the emergency last night I would probably say he is a little futrher up the list than you have him.

[bergholt]

Considering Armitage was in the rooms bouncing a ball as the emergency last night I would probably say he is a little futrher up the list than you have him.

all of eddy, mcevoy, miles, begley and r clarke have also been emergencies this year, begley and eddy 4 times ahead of armo's 3. armo's played 5 reserves games and been in the best once. as i said, not exactly setting the world on fire at sandy.

i wouldn't be surprised if he got a game soon, but i wish he was playing a bit better at vfl level to make it easy to pick him.

[DWOODROW]

I agree with it all but Ross must see something to name him as an emergency the last couple of weeks even if he has gone a bit soft.

[doggerel]

Can anyone see Max and Zac playing in the same side? I can't personally....

[InkerSaint]

Luke Ball's been pretty quiet too, but you can't drop him so forget about it.

That amounts to getting picked on reputation, something Ross has already made a stand against.

It's about effort - he's made that much clear. I just wish I knew what the deliverables are - I'm sure we're all in the same boat - but we know tackling, adherence to structures, and aggression at the contests are among them.

[bergholt]

Can anyone see Max and Zac playing in the same side? I can't personally....

this week it woulda worked fine - max on lloyd, zac on neagle. most weeks there are at least two big forwards in the opposition, and max at his best can play on a small. (though i doubt he's fit enough to do that right now.)

this week it looked a bit worrying with either gilbert, fisher or blake being dragged deep. gilbert and fisher don't really want to play right back there, and we're better served with their run from half-back. and i'm still not 100% confident in blake one out with a good forward.

but we also don't want to have too many pure defensive players in one side, so i see your point.

[Marcus1232]

Can anyone see Max and Zac playing in the same side? I can't personally....

I thought zac was soundly beaten last night

[Sobraz]

Can anyone see Max and Zac playing in the same side? I can't personally....

I thought zac was soundly beaten last night

what a crock.... Zac took another major step last night... He was brilliant... I honestly belive a straight swap Zac for Max would weaken our side... Yes, that means in the exact possie, Zac > Max atm... And getting better...

Max, fully fit and firing, obviously is in our best 22.... but IMO its at the expense of Blake...

[plugger66]

Can anyone see Max and Zac playing in the same side? I can't personally....

I thought zac was soundly beaten last night

what a crock.... Zac took another major step last night... He was brilliant... I honestly belive a straight swap Zac for Max would weaken our side... Yes, that means in the exact possie, Zac > Max atm... And getting better...

Max, fully fit and firing, obviously is in our best 22.... but IMO its at the expense of Blake...

Firstly Blake was one of our better players yesterday and we lose run, carry and possession if he went for Max. I see it that only one of Max and Zac can play as they are to similar and dont get enough of the ball.

[rexy]

Definately a very interesting week at the selection table, Goose, Raph, Eddy, McEvoy and Armitage seem to be pushing for a spot and Max would only be two weeks away from demanding one if he stays fit.

Dawson and Blake have done well as the key defenders but neither fill me with confidence one on one, they are both however match fit at the top level and hold the spots in a winning side. Gooses only chance for a game is to drop one of these guys IMO.

Gram to me is in poor form in the defensive side of the game, he gets a lot of tackles but IMO only because he allows his opponent(spelling?) to get the ball in the one on one contest and then tackles. Currently he is the only guy in the side that I have noticed who doesnt put his head over it when he should. Just my observation. The question is do we have another player who can run and carry with his pace and evasive skills. Could Raph do his role or could Fisher do it and raph fill his spot?

Ball was not 100% fit and with 4 or 5 short breaks in a row and his injury record should he have a week off as a precaution? Armitage the obvious inclusion here.

Who provides better value, Geary with the ball or Eddy without it? combined they would be a beautiful player, lets hope they can both push on and work on the other side of their games.

Is two 30 year old ruckman the best prospect or should a top 10 draft pick in McEvoy be able to displace one by seasons end, and if so when. He is playing good footy in the VFL and was quite good in the pies game I thought. At this stage Gardiner in front of King?

For me this week In Goose Raph Armitage
Out Blake, Gram, Ball(precautionary week off)

Ruthless I know but we need to be careful managing our players in the next 4 weeks.

[bigcarl]

Gram to me is in poor form in the defensive side of the game, he gets a lot of tackles but IMO only because he allows his opponent(spelling?) to get the ball in the one on one contest and then tackles. Currently he is the only guy in the side that I have noticed who doesnt put his head over it when he should.

imo gram's been good for us this season. has given us a lot of drive and run and taken a lot of pressure off midfielders like dal santo and joey.

i'd say there are quite a few whose place in the side is more vulnerable. i'd dearly love to see raph back in, but not at the expense of gram.

[rexy]

Gram to me is in poor form in the defensive side of the game, he gets a lot of tackles but IMO only because he allows his opponent(spelling?) to get the ball in the one on one contest and then tackles. Currently he is the only guy in the side that I have noticed who doesnt put his head over it when he should.

imo gram's been good for us this season. has given us a lot of drive and run and taken a lot of pressure off midfielders like dal santo and joey.

i'd say there are quite a few whose place in the side is more vulnerable. i'd dearly love to see raph back in, but not at the expense of gram.

Agree whole heartedly on all the things you have said bigcarl, it is his willingness to win it for himself that worries me, and before anyone jumps at me, no I dont want him to win it at the stoppages or become luke ball. I mean when he is running to a lose ball with an opp. player, to often he does not commit his body which seems to go against the rest of the teams ethos. Would be a big call to drop him I know but????

How I see it.

[Saint Bev]

Funny how we all see things differently. I thought Baker was off his game, lost his cool a few times. I also thought McQualter was up to scratch. Schinderman quiet also, but I would drop him. I have no idea who we drop for Max. Certainly not Geary or Gwilt, they have been very good in my book.

[ThomasR]

Dawson will go for Max and I think it will be sooner rather than later. Sure he's done his job and last night was the first time he actually impressed me but he is a depth player, and that is how he is judged.

I think we all too quickly forget just how good Max is. An absolute champion of this club, shortlisted for AA last year and incredibly stiff not to make it. Gives Fev and Buddy nightmares and is capable of beating them one-out. Zac, nice story and I hope he can maintain his confidence, but it's a straight swap for mine.

As for the others, I too would like to see Raph get a game soon, as Ross says you need to be banging down the door and it's hard to find anyone to leave out. Geary in an interview the other day made note of the number of consecutive games he has played and the confidence it has given him, the goal from 50 yesterday was very classy, he is still building. Gwilt just doing enough still.

Good problems to have in any case

[saint3d]

To address the OP, I think it's where the conditioning staff earn their money. It's like Dal Santo said a couple of weeks ago, the players leave it all on the ground and come off completely spent. Then it's up to those guys to make sure they're right for the next match.

[vacuous space]

Can anyone see Max and Zac playing in the same side? I can't personally....

Short answer, yes.

I think we may be trying to work out a way to play them both as well. Blake was playing on Monfries by the end of yesterday's game with Fisher playing a key back role. I can see us using Zac and Max as keys with Fisher, Blake, Gilbert and Baker playing on small/mediums. I think they'll want to get another game into Max before bringing him in, but I'm becoming less and less certain that Dawson will be the one who comes out for Max.

[saintsRrising]

Max and Zac...play both..yes why not??

Though it depends in part on our opponents.

Say if we are playing the Hawks..Max on Buddy...and Zac on Roughead.

If we are playing the Blues...then Max gets Fev...anda match-up for Zac may not present.

I can see us have two key stoppers...because the other down back are all runners and attacking..Sam, Gilbert, Blake, Goddard...and then Baker. Whhich 4 depends on match-ups...with some rotating through other poistions...ie Sam and BJ.

But Goose coming in as well may squeeze out Zac...till 2010 from when on Zac will most likely be our regular FB.

[remboy]

I think we all too quickly forget just how good Max is. An absolute champion of this club, shortlisted for AA last year and incredibly stiff not to make it. Gives Fev and Buddy nightmares and is capable of beating them one-out. Zac, nice story and I hope he can maintain his confidence, but it's a straight swap for mine.

I agree. Dawson has done a good job but you've got to be kidding to say he should keep Max out of the side. Are people's memories that short?
Max is one of (if not THE) best defender in the AFL. How many goals did he concede last year? He'll play for Sandy this week and if he gets through that I'd expect him to come in the week after.

[mbogo]

I cannot believe I am suggesting this - but for a tall side Bakes out for Max.
What a problem to have!

[bigcarl]

Dawson will go for Max and I think it will be sooner rather than later. Sure he's done his job and last night was the first time he actually impressed me but he is a depth player, and that is how he is judged.

i think he might be a bit better than that.

[Legendary]

Dawson is in good form, and performing his job to a very capable level.

There is no question though that Hudghton can play the same role to a higher level. He is a better player.


The question is what to do with Dawson when Maxie comes back into the side? I see three options:

1. Drop Dawson for Maxie ... a straight swap, the simplest of decisions but in many ways the most unfair, and not making use of a guy with some talents.

2. Send Sam Fisher or Sam Gilbert into the middle/up forward ... keep Dawson down back with Maxie, and send Gilbo or Chips to run through the middle, run through the forward line ... wherever they are needed and can cause damage.

3. Play Dawson forward, see how he goes in Gwilt's role as the third marking/target up forward, applying some defence pressure too. In his favour, he has kicked a few bags of goals playing forward in the VFL.

[ausfatcat]

Zac has done a job and done it well and he doesn't deserve to lose his spot, but he is no where near the player Max is and has looked a bit shaky at times, if max is 100% he comes in if not he stays out untill he is.

[Teflon]

Gram to me is in poor form in the defensive side of the game, he gets a lot of tackles but IMO only because he allows his opponent(spelling?) to get the ball in the one on one contest and then tackles. Currently he is the only guy in the side that I have noticed who doesnt put his head over it when he should.

imo gram's been good for us this season. has given us a lot of drive and run and taken a lot of pressure off midfielders like dal santo and joey.

i'd say there are quite a few whose place in the side is more vulnerable. i'd dearly love to see raph back in, but not at the expense of gram.

Agree whole heartedly on all the things you have said bigcarl, it is his willingness to win it for himself that worries me, and before anyone jumps at me, no I dont want him to win it at the stoppages or become luke ball. I mean when he is running to a lose ball with an opp. player, to often he does not commit his body which seems to go against the rest of the teams ethos. Would be a big call to drop him I know but????

How I see it.

Good call rex I agree.

Gram when IN the game to run looks good. When require to win his own ball looks average IMO.

Struggles to make a tackle stick aka Aussie Jones. I know hes not Luke BALL but his defensive efforts lack and he fades in/out games a lot.

[Simon Templar]

I have enjoyed reading these posts very much. It's interesting just how many of the aforementioned suggestions look plausible. I would never have thought of most of them myself....eg. Zac to forward line.

It certainly is a heavenly position the Saints find themselves in at the moment.....down on injuries, too, therefore our depth is more obvious.

But for my 20 cents worth, if it's not broken then don't fix it. Leave the team alone.

As to the idea that if our conditioning staff decide the odd rotation would keep some players fresh.....I really dont think that would be necessary. I think the players would crawl over broken glass to stay in the team. I think they're fresh enough each week. Don't see Geelong resting players.

However, if it would give us an edge over them.....hmmmm, maybe.