The Lyon Game Plan

[perfectionist]

If you can keep the opposition down to 7 goals, you'll win the game (2005).

The Thomas game plan: If we can kick 15 goals we'll win the game.

It's Hafey V Kennedy all over again. Hafey won four and Kennedy three, although never in direct competition in a GF.

Jeans believed in a strong defence as well - he won four.

It would be nice to have both I suppose. My preference is defence - it's harder to kick goals than to stop them.

[SainterX]

I actually preferred when we attacked continuously and no matter how much the other guys scored we would almost always score alot more. Back then our defense was trusted to do a job on its own, as it should be and you always knew we would rebound off the backline, down the other end and score another goal.
Interestingly though we were one of the highest scoring teams then, and also in the top defensive sides behind only Adelaide.
Run and Gun football is so entertaining.

[perfectionist]

But it didn't produce a flag.

[SainterX]

For the injuries we had, and with a seemingly clueless (to some) coach I think we can all be proud that we got within 1 (stupid Wanganeem) kick of a grand final in 2004. Although I think we may have been beaten by the Lions that year I have no doubt, given how we owned West Coast in Melbourne back then, that 2005 would have been our year.

However if things are so hectic now cause we have not won a flag in 42 years how do you think things would have been in 1965 when we had not won one for 60?

[perfectionist]

It was 68 in '65.

[Batnoe]

IF we can learn our game plan we should be ok

we played an attacking brand of footy and it was also defensive...

very hard to do against good teams

we must keep our pressure up and get first use, this genearlly means the opposition rushes their kicks and stuff it up

[SainterX]

Very hard to do against good teams?

We can still smoke anybody on our best day, or as this year has shown, best quarter

[meher baba]

The problem with lyons game plan is that it requires players to be in top form every week and to give 100 per cent every week. Also, because it is inevitably a lower scoring game plan, it has to be ditched whenever we get too far behind in a game

I have no doubt that it is a good strategy for finals and other close games. It served the swans well in the 2005 and 2006 finals series (although people should go back and watch replays of the games in which the swans played the eagles and geelong and count up how many simple shots at goal those teams missed).

But, in order to take advantage of that game plan in finals, you have to make the finals And, even in 2005 and 2006,the Swans were not particularly dominant in home and away and lost to some less fancied teams. And they had the enormous advantage of playing a lot of games on a home ground which is not really suited to AFL but which they have learnt to exploit.

And it has a beautiful lush playing surface which provides less wear and tear and enables them to play their high intensity brand of footy week in and week out

Alas, so much of the thinking behind lyon being brought to the club and being encouraged to coach the way he does was based on the way the swans outplayed us in one crucial quarter in 2005. The Swans don't even play quite the same way any more

They, and the rest of the afl world have moved on from septemer 2005, but effectively we have not!!

[rodgerfox]

Where does the perception come from that we weren't a defensive team under Thomas?

Is it another one of those things that if it's said often enough, it will become a fact?

[saintsRrising]

Alas, so much of the thinking behind lyon being brought to the club and being encouraged to coach the way he does was based on the way the swans outplayed us in one crucial quarter in 2005. The Swans don't even play quite the same way any more

They, and the rest of the afl world have moved on from septemer 2005, but effectively we have not!!

??

So you know that for a fact do you?


So you really really believe that Ross Smith and the rest of the coaching panel appointed Lyon based upon one quarter of football...

[JeffDunne]

I think it's irrelevant what Ross Smith thought.

I'm pretty sure RB, AF & RW did too.

[meher baba]

Alas, so much of the thinking behind lyon being brought to the club and being encouraged to coach the way he does was based on the way the swans outplayed us in one crucial quarter in 2005. The Swans don't even play quite the same way any more

They, and the rest of the afl world have moved on from septemer 2005, but effectively we have not!!

??

So you know that for a fact do you?


So you really really believe that Ross Smith and the rest of the coaching panel appointed Lyon based upon one quarter of football...

Not so much the specific choice of Lyon, but the decision to sack GT and replace him with a club and coaching setup like the Swans was hatched in the weeks and months following our loss in the 2005 PF.

Fact: RB and a number of Board members were spitting chips after the 2005 loss and began to feel that - despite what was supposed to be the best list in the AFL (and that's what those guys genuinely thought back then) -we lost that game because we were stuck in the past while the Swans' way of doing things was the way of the future. Right back then these worthies were envying the Swans' use of flooding, "accountability", and creating as many stoppages as possible to give opportunities to their two "genuine ruckmen" to set up domination of the clearances. This is what they started to want to see at our club, along with, of course, a move from our horrendous record with injuries to something closer to what the Swans had achieved.

Fact: when GT was sacked, one of the key reasons that Butterss gave was that we were looking to set up our club to compete with our key "interstate rivals". (Funny thing is that we have achieved this - we are pretty competitive now with the Swans - it's just a damn shame about Geelong, the Bulldogs, Hawthorn and co)

Fact: Archie Fraser is close to the Swans in general and Roos in particular and considers that the Swans style of football is state of the art. Every time he is asked in an interview about Lyon he says something like "he has the right game plan for our team".

Fact: Lyon came to us from the Swans.

Fact: despite Lyon's continual denials, and leaving aside the recent strange experiment with three talls up front, our current game plan under Lyon has generally looked very much like that of the Swans circa 2005.

Put it all together, and you come up with the inevitable conclusion that among Butterss, the former board, Archie Fraser and the people we appointed to advise us on GT's replacement, there was a general working assumption that we should model as much of our approach as possible upon that of the Swans.

What we had on the old Board was a bunch of businessmen and lawyers who mistakenly saw football in terms of the then prevailing corporate cliches about "you must make sure we keep up with market leaders", "businesses are like sharks: if you don't keep moving you die", etc. They wrongly fixated on the Swans as market leaders.

And you might say that the rest is history, but - alas - it isn't history, it's the nightmare which we have all been experiencing for the last 18 months.

[krabb]

Another fact is...

He spent time at Richmond and Carlton too as an assistant Coach...

Gawd some people ramble on with some crap.

[meher baba]

Another fact is...

He spent time at Richmond and Carlton too as an assistant Coach...

Gawd some people ramble on with some crap.

Sorry? And your point is........?

[krabb]

Another fact is...

He spent time at Richmond and Carlton too as an assistant Coach...

Gawd some people ramble on with some crap.

Sorry? And your point is........?

You assume a lot and actually know nothing.

Fact that one into your teamsheet.

[Mr Magic]

So GT wasn't sacked by Butters' Board for 'personal reasons' but for a 'faulty' football reason?

[aussiejones]

Does a Sydney style suit the Dome size ground ?


Do we have the type of players for the Sydney style of game ?

We sure seemed to have pace and teamwork last sunday ?
But was that because Melb were so bad ?

[meher baba]

Another fact is...

He spent time at Richmond and Carlton too as an assistant Coach...

Gawd some people ramble on with some crap.

Sorry? And your point is........?

You assume a lot and actually know nothing.

Fact that one into your teamsheet.

That's not very polite: I don't like these online slanging matches.

Anyway, how do you know what I do and do not know. If you read my post carefully, I wasn't actually talking about Lyon himself, but what he represented to the Board that chose him to be our coach.

[saintsRrising]

What we had on the old Board was a bunch of businessmen and lawyers who mistakenly saw football in terms of the then prevailing corporate cliches about "you must make sure we keep up with market leaders", "businesses are like sharks: if you don't keep moving you die", etc. .

Now this is genuinely amusing as GT was clearly full of management speak...and from memory you use to revel in such GT-isms.

We have gone from a mangement-speak coach....to a footballing coach.....but you want to hold out mangement speak as reason why they ditch GT for RL

[saintsRrising]

.

Anyway, how do you know what I do and do not know.

Well we do not not....for not one of your facts has source or a quote.

[saintsRrising]

Fact: Archie Fraser is close to the Swans in general and Roos in particular .

Fact????

Can you kindly actually back this up with anything....I mean anything...factual that is???

Or is this really just your opinion???

[meher baba]

Fact: Archie Fraser is close to the Swans in general and Roos in particular .

Fact????

Can you kindly actually back this up with anything....I mean anything...factual that is???

Or is this really just your opinion???

He used to be Roos's boss.

[saintsRrising]

Fact: Archie Fraser is close to the Swans in general and Roos in particular .

Fact????

Can you kindly actually back this up with anything....I mean anything...factual that is???

Or is this really just your opinion???

He used to be Roos's boss.

So???...I think my previous boss is an ares****

When and where did Roos work under Archie?

[meher baba]

Fact: Archie Fraser is close to the Swans in general and Roos in particular .

Fact????

Can you kindly actually back this up with anything....I mean anything...factual that is???

Or is this really just your opinion???

He used to be Roos's boss.

So???...I think my previous boss is an ares****

When and where did Roos work under Archie?

Selling photocopiers: I vaguely recall that Ross Lyon might have worked there too, but I might be wrong about that.

[JeffDunne]

We have gone from a mangement-speak coach....to a footballing coach.....

What nonsense.

Compare Lyon's stat-speak to what's said by successful coaches.

Chalk and cheese.

If Lyon speaks to the players the way he speaks to us then it's little wonder they collectively look like they need an upper.