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PJ wrote:2 observable weaknesses in the current team
Hit outs
Aerial dominance
Do you mean hit outs or centre clearances. Maybe you mean hit outs to advantage?
Aerial dominance? You usually take more marks when you have more possesions. Macas doing ok there.
Our number of hit outs and hit outs to advantage have both been below opposition numbers.
I don't mean number of marks, more the contested pack marks. Yep, Mac is doing good in this area but when Kosi goes out, ala Sydney game, we get throttled in marking contests in the air.
I've never seen a bad St.Kilda player - that's just how they are.
Over the time I have supported Gardiner - including during the year he was unable to get onto the park for an AFL game - but was running into good form in the VFL and really should have been included for the finals.
What you see on the field is exactly what you get from Gardiner around the club.
Strong, fierce, hard, committed, proud - and an excellent ruckman.
Throughout this period Plugit of the trillion posts has attacked every time Gardiner is supported by me or others.
So what Plugit of the trillion posts is is consistent. In fact, given his opinion of ruckmen per se, he could very well be GT!
What I would hope to see for the remainder of this season, now that Gardiner is fit and has some match condition, is Gardiner doing what Gardiner does - and bringing to the team what only Gardiner can bring to it.
And I trust he is (again) convinced by the Club to continue on next season.
Because one player we do lack in his absence is a very experienced, very hard bodied and very talented ruckman who hits the contest.
And it is at the contests that the game is won and lost - look at the match v Sydney as the most recent example.
No doubt our mid-field are looking to again having the ball served up to them by Gardiner.
In regards the lack of balance, this is because of Blake and Geary.
Full stop.
Geary has no potency - he is just an everage near 6' mid-fielder in a competition where average 6" mid-fielders do not survive (unless they "invent" as Jones has done) whilst Blake can only influence as the "spare" back freeing Fisher - and why would you do that?
The lack of balance referred to is not because we look to have an influence thru our ruck division courtesy of Gardiner and McEvoy.
I understood that Smith would be very near to getting a go (nearly - he is an Emergency) and I heard Cahill was very, very close because (after an injury ravaged season) he is now building to producing what he has promised - a natural 192cm forward who knows how to find space and can work the ground.
Gardiner was always going to be chosen on his build up - a build up which has been very carefully managed by the Club - to even Gardiner's frustration!
But having in him that frame of mind certainly will not detract.
Most likely finals scenarios...if we keep winning is:
Swans
Cats
Pies
Gardiner matches up well against those team's rucks.
Sorry but I dont see how Blake and MG are fighting for the same position. Blake cand and will play back if he plays. MG can only play in one spot and that is the ruck and with 3 interchange that just doesnt work IMO.
Not sure if you watched the Kanga game last week or not.....but Kosi did not play No 2 ruck...Blake did.
Pretty sure that Blake has often played as No 2 ruck.
Pretty sure Gardi plays ruck.
Pretty sure both are tall or tallish...and none too quick. While both are different both IMO are up for the No2 ruck....
Can't see them both playing in a finals match.
If Gardi comes in and burns...he may then squeeze Blake out.
Against the big Mummy...who is in great form....Lyon would be tempting to have Gardiner in support.
Midfield has been a HUGE problem all year for us...and so if our ruck gets beaten like it did against Mummy, the Saints will be exposed.
Blake can play elsewhere, MG cant and kosi did play at stages in the ruck last week as did Blake. If you can give me a spot for MG or Ben when they arent rucking that wont make our forward line slower than it is now I will be happy. Sorry but I totally disagree but are happy to be proved wrong.
Can only be a wish and a prayer from Ross and a farewell to Gardi.
He's played one full game for Sandy, last week. I'd be surprised if he sees the game out.
saintsRrising wrote:
Not sure if you watched the Kanga game last week or not.....but Kosi did not play No 2 ruck...Blake did.
Pretty sure that Blake has often played as No 2 ruck.
Pretty sure Gardi plays ruck.
Pretty sure both are tall or tallish...and none too quick. While both are different both IMO are up for the No2 ruck....
Can't see them both playing in a finals match.
If Gardi comes in and burns...he may then squeeze Blake out.
Against the big Mummy...who is in great form....Lyon would be tempting to have Gardiner in support.
Midfield has been a HUGE problem all year for us...and so if our ruck gets beaten like it did against Mummy, the Saints will be exposed.
Blake can play elsewhere, MG cant and kosi did play at stages in the ruck last week as did Blake. If you can give me a spot for MG or Ben when they arent rucking that wont make our forward line slower than it is now I will be happy. Sorry but I totally disagree but are happy to be proved wrong.
GLad someone else noticed but me sRs. The game changed when we played Roo and Kosi in tandem up forward. It was the most potent we have looked going forward all year.
The times in games we have been exposed in this year have been the ones we have lost badly in the midfield/ruck (examples - Hawks after Q time, WCE Q2 and 3, Swans).
THese two facts lead me to realise that in order to have the best chance of progressing through finals we need.....
1. Two key forwards for most of the game. Hence Kosi no longer plays 2nd ruck, unless in an emergency.
2. We need bigger bodies and more back-up in the ruck. Hence Gardiner to come in. It would be madness to play him first up in the finals - best to bring him in round 24 and see how he goes. Hence Blake is the back-up in case he does go down.
Hird... The unflushable one is now... just a turd...
saintsRrising wrote:
Not sure if you watched the Kanga game last week or not.....but Kosi did not play No 2 ruck...Blake did.
Pretty sure that Blake has often played as No 2 ruck.
Pretty sure Gardi plays ruck.
Pretty sure both are tall or tallish...and none too quick. While both are different both IMO are up for the No2 ruck....
Can't see them both playing in a finals match.
If Gardi comes in and burns...he may then squeeze Blake out.
Against the big Mummy...who is in great form....Lyon would be tempting to have Gardiner in support.
Midfield has been a HUGE problem all year for us...and so if our ruck gets beaten like it did against Mummy, the Saints will be exposed.
Blake can play elsewhere, MG cant and kosi did play at stages in the ruck last week as did Blake. If you can give me a spot for MG or Ben when they arent rucking that wont make our forward line slower than it is now I will be happy. Sorry but I totally disagree but are happy to be proved wrong.
GLad someone else noticed but me sRs. The game changed when we played Roo and Kosi in tandem up forward. It was the most potent we have looked going forward all year.
The times in games we have been exposed in this year have been the ones we have lost badly in the midfield/ruck (examples - Hawks after Q time, WCE Q2 and 3, Swans).
THese two facts lead me to realise that in order to have the best chance of progressing through finals we need.....
1. Two key forwards for most of the game. Hence Kosi no longer plays 2nd ruck, unless in an emergency.
2. We need bigger bodies and more back-up in the ruck. Hence Gardiner to come in. It would be madness to play him first up in the finals - best to bring him in round 24 and see how he goes. Hence Blake is the back-up in case he does go down.
And again I ask where does Ben or MG play when not rucking and Kosi did ruck last week as did Blake.
saintsRrising wrote:
Not sure if you watched the Kanga game last week or not.....but Kosi did not play No 2 ruck...Blake did.
Pretty sure that Blake has often played as No 2 ruck.
Pretty sure Gardi plays ruck.
Pretty sure both are tall or tallish...and none too quick. While both are different both IMO are up for the No2 ruck....
Can't see them both playing in a finals match.
If Gardi comes in and burns...he may then squeeze Blake out.
Against the big Mummy...who is in great form....Lyon would be tempting to have Gardiner in support.
Midfield has been a HUGE problem all year for us...and so if our ruck gets beaten like it did against Mummy, the Saints will be exposed.
Blake can play elsewhere, MG cant and kosi did play at stages in the ruck last week as did Blake. If you can give me a spot for MG or Ben when they arent rucking that wont make our forward line slower than it is now I will be happy. Sorry but I totally disagree but are happy to be proved wrong.
GLad someone else noticed but me sRs. The game changed when we played Roo and Kosi in tandem up forward. It was the most potent we have looked going forward all year.
The times in games we have been exposed in this year have been the ones we have lost badly in the midfield/ruck (examples - Hawks after Q time, WCE Q2 and 3, Swans).
THese two facts lead me to realise that in order to have the best chance of progressing through finals we need.....
1. Two key forwards for most of the game. Hence Kosi no longer plays 2nd ruck, unless in an emergency.
2. We need bigger bodies and more back-up in the ruck. Hence Gardiner to come in. It would be madness to play him first up in the finals - best to bring him in round 24 and see how he goes. Hence Blake is the back-up in case he does go down.
And again I ask where does Ben or MG play when not rucking and Kosi did ruck last week as did Blake.
Whether you agree with the selection or not Gards and Mac with be playing forward when not rucking or on the pine. kosi and Roo possibly more bench time than normal. Agree though strange selection.
We got smashed in the ruck against Sydney, and next week we face them again. It's no coincidence that Gardi's in this week. I'm a bit excited about seeing him out there again.
Gardi can go forward resting, kosi rucks and ben on bench - rotating
This
I seem to remember that we played the majority of seasons 2009 and 2010 with all of Roo, Kosi, Ben, Gardy and Blake in the team.
Someone remind me..... how did we go those two seasons?
Can you explain the interchange rules in those years and the form of MG this year. Also Ben missed a fair few games so that is not quite true.
Interchange rules have not significantly changed. Substitute rule has. And I for one think that its importance is over exaggerated. Has having a Geary, Blake or Raph coming off the bench in the last quarter really push us over the line for a win? Only time it has been helpful in that way was when Cripps came on as sub earlier in the season. We have no-one like Cripps fit enough to play. The real importance of the sub rule is to cover an unexpected injury. Whether this is a Tall or small is pot-luck, hence I believe that Blake would be the best chance of sub as he is the closest we have to being a utility.
ST KILDA ruckman Michael Gardiner saved his best VFL game for last, dominating Geelong's Dawson Simpson and marking strongly to keep his name in contention for AFL finals.
'Gardy' is that real X-factor and he's such a terrific talent and person around the club,' King said.
'You'd love to see him get back and from what he's been through (with) this injury, it's been a credit to him to get himself in the shape he's in at the moment.'
2009 - Ben played 11 games, but that's because King and Gard were the no.1 ruck duo.
2010 - Ben played 19/25 games.
Very rarely did we play with only one specialist ruck combo in those seasons - especially at the pointy ends.
Hird... The unflushable one is now... just a turd...
Winmar wrote:We got smashed in the ruck against Sydney, and next week we face them again. It's no coincidence that Gardi's in this week. I'm a bit excited about seeing him out there again.
Spot on...without Kosi we got polaxed. I don't think Ben, Kosi and MG will play all together but be certain that if either Ben or kosi goes down then our finals campagne goes down as well. unless you have Gardi ready
I've never seen a bad St.Kilda player - that's just how they are.
Gardi can go forward resting, kosi rucks and ben on bench - rotating
This
I seem to remember that we played the majority of seasons 2009 and 2010 with all of Roo, Kosi, Ben, Gardy and Blake in the team.
Someone remind me..... how did we go those two seasons?
Can you explain the interchange rules in those years and the form of MG this year. Also Ben missed a fair few games so that is not quite true.
Interchange rules have not significantly changed. Substitute rule has. And I for one think that its importance is over exaggerated. Has having a Geary, Blake or Raph coming off the bench in the last quarter really push us over the line for a win? Only time it has been helpful in that way was when Cripps came on as sub earlier in the season. We have no-one like Cripps fit enough to play. The real importance of the sub rule is to cover an unexpected injury. Whether this is a Tall or small is pot-luck, hence I believe that Blake would be the best chance of sub as he is the closest we have to being a utility.
ST KILDA ruckman Michael Gardiner saved his best VFL game for last, dominating Geelong's Dawson Simpson and marking strongly to keep his name in contention for AFL finals.
'Gardy' is that real X-factor and he's such a terrific talent and person around the club,' King said.
'You'd love to see him get back and from what he's been through (with) this injury, it's been a credit to him to get himself in the shape he's in at the moment.'
2009 - Ben played 11 games, but that's because King and Gard were the no.1 ruck duo.
2010 - Ben played 19/25 games.
Very rarely did we play with only one specialist ruck combo in those seasons - especially at the pointy ends.
Tell me you are joking regarding the interchange. Previously most side had a ruckman on the bench because there were 4, now there are 3 and a ruckman can only rest for about 15 mintes compared to up to 60 minutes. A huge difference and before last week MG was really struggling so his form was ordinary.
Gardi can go forward resting, kosi rucks and ben on bench - rotating
You wont be liking selection at about 10:30 Saturday Night.
Why are ppl in our Cheersquad so damned negative all the time???
I wont be re joining the Cheer Squad next year so please count me out of it!!
You are in the Cheersquad?? What a f****** travesty. Anyone who has anything negative to say about the club, the team, the players or the staff should leave IMMEDIATELY, not wait until next year. You are a disgrace to the concept of a cheer squad.
This club demands a cheersquad who CHEER, support and provide positive energy and who are together like a SQUAD. Otherwise they are POISON.
I like the Gardiner selection, for what it's worth. Maybe it will pay off to give him a run ahead of finals, and a farewell bow is a nice touch. Carlton are quick, but if we can't hurt them with pace at least let's try and hurt them in the air. Gardi is good around the ground and we all know he can kick goals. If we do lose, I don't see his inclusion or anyone else's exclusion as the reason.
But we won't lose. You can count on it.
Are you serious?
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oh and 1 other thing to consider...even though Ben has improved out of sight, Gardi is still our best tap ruckman and that means first use of the ball regardless of where he plays when he's not on the ball.
and another thought...
How will the sub get used in finals as opposed to regular season. Could or would coaches role the dice at half time?
I've never seen a bad St.Kilda player - that's just how they are.
''I still get really excited, and I've got the '66 thing up on the wall in a frame … You look at it and think: one day, we want to achieve that.''- Arryn Siposs
Ross noticed.... think a few here are going off tap a little prematurely....
