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TimeToShineFellas wrote:I am getting quite a chuckle reading this thread actually.
Oooh Didak's a pisshead, he's a cancer blah blah blah (btw the term 'cancer' should NOT be used when talking about football clubs)
Want to talk about pissheads?
Steve Johnson anyone?
Think he may have won a Norm Smith last year and is the most creative forward in the league.
Geelong didn't want a bar of him at the start of last year. But their "culture" down there and the way they handled him spoke volumes about how players with a bad past can turn it around.
I heard Jimmy Bartel come out and say that Geelong would be keen on Didak at the end of the year if he was tradeable.
If such a dominant team like Geelong is keen, then that says maybe their culture is strong enough to handle someone like Didak. The way people on this forum bang on about our "culture" shouldn't have an issue with it, should they?
Still if we don't want to take a chance then that's fine. We'll just keep embracing our "heroes" who are more than happy to take their pay-cheques and keep producing mediocre performances.
Best post in the thread mate. Well written.
It's all about how our culture can handle those who have a history of indiscretions, like a drink etc. We have to be realistic about this. Didak would slot straight into our team on the HFF/rotating midfielder (improvement on Schneider).
Gee Dal gets the rough end of the stick from so called supporters....
Now we're looking to trade him for someone who is as equally inconsistant to what he has been lately, and is by all accounts a sh1t bloke as well.... makes sense...
Ask any pies supporter with teeth, and they'll tell you how up and down Didak is, and is nowhere near as good as the media play up... he has kick 15 goals LESS than milne this year for Gods sake, another saint who many want to cut...
We should stop looking elsewhere for short term fixes... Keep topping up with kids and our core will come good...
TimeToShineFellas wrote:I am getting quite a chuckle reading this thread actually.
Oooh Didak's a pisshead, he's a cancer blah blah blah (btw the term 'cancer' should NOT be used when talking about football clubs)
Want to talk about pissheads?
Steve Johnson anyone?
Think he may have won a Norm Smith last year and is the most creative forward in the league.
Geelong didn't want a bar of him at the start of last year. But their "culture" down there and the way they handled him spoke volumes about how players with a bad past can turn it around.
I heard Jimmy Bartel come out and say that Geelong would be keen on Didak at the end of the year if he was tradeable.
If such a dominant team like Geelong is keen, then that says maybe their culture is strong enough to handle someone like Didak. The way people on this forum bang on about our "culture" shouldn't have an issue with it, should they?
Still if we don't want to take a chance then that's fine. We'll just keep embracing our "heroes" who are more than happy to take their pay-cheques and keep producing mediocre performances.
Culture is not the issue IMO, an overrated excuse... but would Geelong give up any one of Corey, Selwood, Ling etc for Didak...
I think not... Thats their second stringers behind Ablett and Bartell, much like Dal is to us behind Hayes and Ball...
For free, or a Fiora trade, ofcourse i'd take Didak...
Sobraz wrote:Gee Dal gets the rough end of the stick from so called supporters....
Now we're looking to trade him for someone who is as equally inconsistant to what he has been lately, and is by all accounts a sh1t bloke as well.... makes sense...
Ask any pies supporter with teeth, and they'll tell you how up and down Didak is, and is nowhere near as good as the media play up... he has kick 15 goals LESS than milne this year for Gods sake, another saint who many want to cut...
We should stop looking elsewhere for short term fixes... Keep topping up with kids and our core will come good...
I don't know about up and down. Over 22 disposals a game. Leading the AFL in kicks (comfortably), and also in long kicks. How is that inconsistency? Didak is a much more consistent performer than Milne, and is a much more well-rounded footballer (i.e. He can push into the midfield and turn a game).
Would take Didak & Wellingham for Dal. Or Didak and Goldsack. Or Didak and a 2nd rounder.
While I agree with you I woudn't be surprised to see a Johnothan Brown, Kerr, Didak swap with Port outlaying several players and draft picks to secure Didak in the overall deal.
Will make end of year interesting.
Midfield clearances and clear winners are needed to make an effective forward line.
You need to protect the ball handler to increase posession efficiency
Sobraz wrote:but would Geelong give up any one of Corey, Selwood, Ling etc for Didak...
I think not...
I don't think they would have to. Just posed the question to a Cats fan in the office - he said players such as either Gamble, Prismall or Varcoe. and a 2nd Round Pick.
All 3 of them would walk into the Pies team.
Actually all 3 of them would walk into our team come to think of it.
Meh... when talking trades, you have to consider the overall sum of the parts. It's not just about who's better than who.
It's OK to compare performances etc, but you also need to consider who the player is, and how he fits in to our future plans. If this means getting rid of Dal, and the club believes it is the right decision, then it has a responsibility to trade for the better.
Teams have traded good players in the past. But they look at their structure and list, and identify where the holes are. They then set about trying to plug those holes. If a particular player is dispensible in order to plug the hole... the trade is considered.
If a player is available that will solve your problem, you'd be silly not look at the options. Then you wiegh it up against what you have to give in return... and the overall effect. Will a trade take you forwards or backwards?
The lid is off after Round 2! Enjoy the journey, coz you just don't know where we'll end up. Live for today and seize the moment.
Sobraz wrote:but would Geelong give up any one of Corey, Selwood, Ling etc for Didak...
I think not...
I don't think they would have to. Just posed the question to a Cats fan in the office - he said players such as either Gamble, Prismall or Varcoe. and a 2nd Round Pick.
All 3 of them would walk into the Pies team.
Actually all 3 of them would walk into our team come to think of it.
All good comments.
I think the answer is not with the perormance of our best players but the poor value of second stringers and new younger players (maybe a little harsh with this).
The resason is that our best players are always minded well and unless you have Roo's aerobic capacity, they dont deal with ths well.
We have always had a list of champions as good as any side but the next level never seems to lift like i other sides. I have always been against Blake but this year he has proven me wrong but there are others that just haven't cut it at this level.
I believe Dal Santo would be a stand out at any other club as long as he received the honour of some player protection at times. This is the culture needed at St' Kilda, not a reformed drinkers culture.
Quote Steve Johnson all you like but Geelong would have won that premiership without him if he continued to play up. We cant afford this at the moment due to lack of promise in our player depth.
Midfield clearances and clear winners are needed to make an effective forward line.
You need to protect the ball handler to increase posession efficiency
Sobraz wrote:but would Geelong give up any one of Corey, Selwood, Ling etc for Didak...
I think not...
I don't think they would have to. Just posed the question to a Cats fan in the office - he said players such as either Gamble, Prismall or Varcoe. and a 2nd Round Pick.
All 3 of them would walk into the Pies team.
Actually all 3 of them would walk into our team come to think of it.
All good comments.
I think the answer is not with the perormance of our best players but the poor value of second stringers and new younger players (maybe a little harsh with this).
The resason is that our best players are always minded well and unless you have Roo's aerobic capacity, they dont deal with ths well.
We have always had a list of champions as good as any side but the next level never seems to lift like i other sides. I have always been against Blake but this year he has proven me wrong but there are others that just haven't cut it at this level.
I believe Dal Santo would be a stand out at any other club as long as he received the honour of some player protection at times. This is the culture needed at St' Kilda, not a reformed drinkers culture.
Quote Steve Johnson all you like but Geelong would have won that premiership without him if he continued to play up. We cant afford this at the moment due to lack of promise in our player depth.
Spot on.
I posted once where I heard Matthews give a talk about leadership and players roles within the team. He basically stated that the good players took care of themselves.
BUT, the key was to have the 2nd string players protecting and making space for them so that they could excell.
Now think back... we had Powell who used to do this a fair bit, and do it well. We lack these players ATM apart from Baker. One thing I like about MG is that he uses his body in the centre to help our mids.
So is it a coincedence that Dal's form has also dropped?
Last edited by WayneJudson42 on Wed 13 Aug 2008 12:33pm, edited 1 time in total.
The lid is off after Round 2! Enjoy the journey, coz you just don't know where we'll end up. Live for today and seize the moment.
Agree 100% Kalsaint... It is the depth that lets us down and puts too much pressure on too few...
Geelong's Gamble, Prismall and Varcoe are our version of Fiora, Birss and C. Gardiner... Massive difference there, and consequently there is far greater pressure on our stars... Including Dal... Swapping Didak for Dal would make no change to this problem...
Agree also, Kalsaint with your assesment of Blake.. Has been one of the few second/third stringers to really step up...
I posted once where I heard Matthews give a talk about leadership and players roles within the team. He basically stated that the good players took care of themselves.
BUT, the key was to have the 2nd string players protecting and making space for them so that they could excell.
Now think back... we had Powell who used to do this a fair bit, and do it well. We lack these players ATM apart from Baker. One thing I like about MG is that he uses his body in the centre to help our mids.
So is it a coincedence that Dal's form has also dropped?[/quote]
Its no surprise to me at all that Dal is doing poorer than in past years.
Cast your mind back to 1997. I remember a 24year old Thompson playing his first season. I specifically remember him playing Fremantle at Subi (round 6 I think), throwing his body into packs to get the ball. We lost by 6 points but not due to his effort.
I remember thinking if the remainder of the team start playing like this guy we will improve. He was a half froward with the role of being a stopper to running half backs.
Saints were 1 and 5 at that stage of the season and were about to go into conference about retaining Stan Alves as the coach during the next week. We made the grand final from there and our stars looked like stars due to second stringers like Thompson doing their bit for forward pressure.
Midfield clearances and clear winners are needed to make an effective forward line.
You need to protect the ball handler to increase posession efficiency
Dan Warna wrote:didak, flashy forward who plays a couple of quarters a year.
a slightly improved version of Milne
Dal Santo = capable of being a dominant midfielder, atm currently playing as 20 plus possession a game, 3 tackle per game very good midfielder.
Dal Santo is so far ahead of Didak that im sure collingwood would throw in a draft pick as well to be rid of Didak and get a quality midfielder.
jesus you're a hard man when you get down on someone Dan ( think Michael Clarke). Milne is 12 th on the goalkicking table this year with 42 from 18 games. Didak is 44th with 24 from 18 games.
Saints43 wrote:How good do we reckon Gamble & Varcoe are? Walk into our side?
I don't think so.
They take their chances when selected at Geelong and contribute to the Team on the day. They have the right desire, attitude, dedication and application
Saints43 wrote:How good do we reckon Gamble & Varcoe are? Walk into our side?
I don't think so.
They take their chances when selected at Geelong and contribute to the Team on the day. They have the right desire, attitude, dedication and application
As opposed to a fair few playing for us!
So therefore they WOULD walk into the team
Gamble & Varcoe would also immediately sort out two of our glaring weaknesses (a 3rd marking target forward & a pacey, defensive, goal kicking forward).
However, we should be trying very hard to get Didak.
We should also be trying very hard to get Kerr.
Only Roo, Dal, BJ, Goose, Bakes, Kosi, McEvoy, Armitage, Ball, Hayes, Max, Joey, Jack Steven, Gram and Sam Fisher should not be on the table at year's end.
Saints43 wrote:How good do we reckon Gamble & Varcoe are? Walk into our side?
I don't think so.
They take their chances when selected at Geelong and contribute to the Team on the day. They have the right desire, attitude, dedication and application
As opposed to a fair few playing for us!
So therefore they WOULD walk into the team
Gamble & Varcoe would also immediately sort out two of our glaring weaknesses (a 3rd marking target forward & a pacey, defensive, goal kicking forward).
I reckon it might be easier to have an impact playing in the forward line for Geelong than us at the minute.
Do you guys really think these two are better players than Schneider?
They've done nothing in the game. They might walk into the team but they'd be discarded just as quickly.
I don't think you need to mix up a players ability with how well the team they occasionally appear for plays.
Last edited by Saints43 on Wed 13 Aug 2008 3:41pm, edited 1 time in total.
A more interesting trade might be both Clarkes for Kerr or both Clarkes for Brown. I know they both have suffered terribly this year with their farther's illness but on the other hand I dont know if we will ever consistently see the best from X due to injuries and Raph just doesnt seem to be able to cut the mustard. I would love to see Kerr in our midfield or alternatively Brown in the goal square with Roo roaming between the arcs and Kosi as the third forward option/ruck.
BJ has arrived!!!!!!!!!!
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Winner of the half time Social Club auction for Kosi's jumper Round 19 2005
Can we build it? Yes we can!!
