Lovett lodges notice of grievance with club

[stinger]

got nothing to do with stalking or revenge...you made a deadset racist comment in my view..so i called you out on it...i'm happy for others to judge your comments...as they already appear to be doing.....

not once have i resorted to personal abuse as you have in several posts.....calling me a fool and a bully along the way....

[JMsainter]

I sincerely hope for Andrew's sake that it all works out for the best, because I'm afraid to think of where his life will go without a positive club environment to support him. My guess is that it would spiral into oblivion.

A very sad state of affairs.

are you a clairvoyant, fortune teller or do you just read tea leaves...???

...and you called me a racist ffs....

Interesting point raised by Stinger. Unless ppl on here know AL personally why would they assume that his life will fall apart without a footy club environment? His cousin, for instance, seems like a very well respected citizen of the aboriginal community - are we assuming that b/c AL is aboriginal that he must need football and that he has no ther skills?

I'm not sure that his life was travelling all that smoothly with a footy club environment supporting him. Depending on the person, a footy club environment can be the worst things for some blokes - look no further than Matthew Stokes who has been told to get a 'real' job for a few months. Many of them live in a bubble and are protected beyond belief. THis can assist them or be to their detriment.

With respect, I was commenting on Lovett. Can you please point out where I mentioned his race? I would say the same about any player in that situation, even Ben Cousins or Wayne Carey.

[JMsainter]

got nothing to do with stalking or revenge...you made a deadset racist comment in my view..so i called you out on it...i'm happy for others to judge your comments...as they already appear to be doing.....

not once have i resorted to personal abuse as you have in several posts.....calling me a fool and a bully along the way....

Are you calling me a racist?

[stinger]

Half of this thread has been loosely veiled racist claptrap.

and..like the post from jmsainter...not that loosely veiled.....

[stinger]

got nothing to do with stalking or revenge...you made a deadset racist comment in my view..so i called you out on it...i'm happy for others to judge your comments...as they already appear to be doing.....

not once have i resorted to personal abuse as you have in several posts.....calling me a fool and a bully along the way....

Are you calling me a racist?

plain and simple?.....yes....

[stinger]

I sincerely hope for Andrew's sake that it all works out for the best, because I'm afraid to think of where his life will go without a positive club environment to support him. My guess is that it would spiral into oblivion.

A very sad state of affairs.

are you a clairvoyant, fortune teller or do you just read tea leaves...???

...and you called me a racist ffs....

Interesting point raised by Stinger. Unless ppl on here know AL personally why would they assume that his life will fall apart without a footy club environment? His cousin, for instance, seems like a very well respected citizen of the aboriginal community - are we assuming that b/c AL is aboriginal that he must need football and that he has no ther skills?

I'm not sure that his life was travelling all that smoothly with a footy club environment supporting him. Depending on the person, a footy club environment can be the worst things for some blokes - look no further than Matthew Stokes who has been told to get a 'real' job for a few months. Many of them live in a bubble and are protected beyond belief. THis can assist them or be to their detriment.

With respect, I was commenting on Lovett..

didn't need to ..it was obvious to me...and others i note....

[bozza1980]

Solar....

You mis-understand me.

If the club believes he's guilty .... Sack him. Cause they will then anyway. If they believe he's innocent then back him and support him like they did with Milne and Montagna in 03 or 04.

As my daily job involves charging people, i'd hazzard to guess it's not an open and shut matter or Andrew would have been charged already. There appears to be areas of inconsistency which requires a more indepth investigation.

So as far as the club goes,.. Stop pussy footing around and support Andrew.. Let him train, let him play, let him bond with his team mates and then make a decision when courts (if it gets that far) have made theirs.

Where does any of this come from? It's all opinion and heresay...I'm glad you're not charging me with anything! MACE, the club stands nothing to gain from sacking him without a pretext, other than being sued by AL. They're doing the right thing, right now.

I'm with you.

At the end of the day, they have suspended (with pay) a person who is the centre of a seriouse police investigation.

They have not passed judgement on his guilt or innocence and seem to be leaving their next decision to when the investigation has run it's course.

What the decision will be, like the outcome of the investigation, is unknown. There has been plenty of speculating but as the club has made it a point to not answer any question regarding the man it is hard to know which way they are leaning, without making assumptions.

And you know what they say about assumptions...

[JMsainter]

got nothing to do with stalking or revenge...you made a deadset racist comment in my view..so i called you out on it...i'm happy for others to judge your comments...as they already appear to be doing.....

not once have i resorted to personal abuse as you have in several posts.....calling me a fool and a bully along the way....

Are you calling me a racist?

plain and simple?.....yes....

Oh ok. Sticks and stone, you petty fool. Takes one to know one, eh? More proof of your infantile insecurity in that you actually believe that what others think of my views actually affects me. LOL. Seriously, your comments only display typical bullying traits in that your bravado gets bigger behind the comfort of other people's comments. As someone else commented on another topic: You're like the coward standing behind the crowd yelling "hit him, hit him". Whatever makes you feel good sonny, whatever.

Maybe you should join forces with Mr Baba and tar and feather me?

[stinger]

Maybe you should join forces with Mr Baba and tar and feather me?

oh if only i could....


gives me a nice glow thinking about it though...thanx for sharing.....

[bozza1980]

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/l ... -nsfi.html

some interesting points made by Sam Lane

It is an interesting article.

How it will be resolved is uncertain and it will be interesting to see how it pans out.

I reckon she's mainly been talking to Lovett's people and the AFLPA.

The article contains some incorrect assumptions: eg, for Lovett to be "found innocent" of anything, he first of all has to be charged.

Let's assume that the police eventually decide not to lay charges (BTW, looking back over newppaper articles about the M&M case, the police decision to drop their case took well over 2 months, so there's nothing unusual about AL yet). I am pretty certain from what I've heard that the club has got avenues in terms of terminating his contract or, at least, suspending indefinitely him from the playing staff, on the grounds of misconduct.

While his contract might not include any specific "no d**khead behaviour" clauses, the club has other powers to use against players who misbehave.

I assume that they intend to exercise these powers if and when the police decide not to lay charges.

If there was any realistic chance of a negotiated arrangement whereby Lovett could come back onto the playing list, I think we'd be reading something different in the press to what Sam Lane has written.

However, it's amazing how the course of these types of cases can twist and turn, so nothing would surprise me.

You make some good points.

The Milne and Montagna investigation took some time and like this one, it was reported more than once that the laying of charges were imminent.

At the end of the day the only difference on the evidence that we are privvy to, is the fact that St Kilda isn't commenting on the guilt or innocence of the accused party.

Most people have taken this as being a silent admission of his guilt, I would suggest that it is a more non-pre-judicial approach by the club.

Most interviews I have heard or read where a St Kilda person has been asked anything at all regarding Lovett they have avoided the question all together. On SEN the other night Greg (?)Hutchison used the non prejudicial excuse in answer to a question regarding how the investigation has affected the playing group.

It is quite possible that they believe his guilt or innocence or have no idea whatsoever, but the only reason why anyone is reading anything into it is because of a different approach by the club SIX years ago.

At the end of the day, I believe they are doing the right thing, regardless of his guilt or innocence, these are serious accusations and the investigation into them must take place without the football club's opinion muddying the waters.

[bozza1980]

I thought this was interesting from the AGM thread...

Westaway then called for questions, but first made it clear that there would be no discussion or questions taken about Andrew Lovett.

He did point out that AL is on full pay, is being supervised by the club in terms of weight training, fitness, sprints, he is time trialled each week, and receives weekly briefings on tactics from coaching staff.

I'm going to make an assumption on this (I do know what they say about assumptions) he may still yet play for St Kilda.

[bigred]

I thought this was interesting from the AGM thread...

Westaway then called for questions, but first made it clear that there would be no discussion or questions taken about Andrew Lovett.

He did point out that AL is on full pay, is being supervised by the club in terms of weight training, fitness, sprints, he is time trialled each week, and receives weekly briefings on tactics from coaching staff.

I'm going to make an assumption on this (I do know what they say about assumptions) he may still yet play for St Kilda.

I would be more inclined to consider the club is just covering its arse.

[S.A Saint]

I thought this was interesting from the AGM thread...

Westaway then called for questions, but first made it clear that there would be no discussion or questions taken about Andrew Lovett.

He did point out that AL is on full pay, is being supervised by the club in terms of weight training, fitness, sprints, he is time trialled each week, and receives weekly briefings on tactics from coaching staff.

I'm going to make an assumption on this (I do know what they say about assumptions) he may still yet play for St Kilda.

and i for one hope he does.....

[JMsainter]

Maybe you should join forces with Mr Baba and tar and feather me?

oh if only i could....


gives me a nice glow thinking about it though...thanx for sharing.....

And I somehow get the feeling that you wouldn't have the courage to try it. However, the thought of it gives me an inner glow. And stop giving me those gay winks. People will talk.

[degruch]

I thought this was interesting from the AGM thread...

Westaway then called for questions, but first made it clear that there would be no discussion or questions taken about Andrew Lovett.

He did point out that AL is on full pay, is being supervised by the club in terms of weight training, fitness, sprints, he is time trialled each week, and receives weekly briefings on tactics from coaching staff.

I'm going to make an assumption on this (I do know what they say about assumptions) he may still yet play for St Kilda.

I would be more inclined to consider the club is just covering its arse.

That'd be my arse-umption too.

[IluvHarvey]

I wish people would stop Bringing up how the club treated the Milne and Montagna incident. That was six years a go. Things change in that time. There is a lot more emphasis on the way footballers treat women now. Everything changes in time. I'm sure the club would treat this incident the same no matter who the player was.
I'm not saying the Lovett is guilty or not. Personally I will never know the full truth of what happened, but if the club is helping with his personal training and still paying him in full what is the problem? It is my understanding that the club has said that this is only while the investigation is going.
If the rumour that Lyon has a problem with Lovetts behaviour and wants him gone is true, that is a different kettle of fish that wont really come to light until after the investigation of the alleged incident is over. Until that time evrything is just heresay.
Personally I don't mind the current stance that the club has taken.

[markp]

I thought this was interesting from the AGM thread...

Westaway then called for questions, but first made it clear that there would be no discussion or questions taken about Andrew Lovett.

He did point out that AL is on full pay, is being supervised by the club in terms of weight training, fitness, sprints, he is time trialled each week, and receives weekly briefings on tactics from coaching staff.

I'm going to make an assumption on this (I do know what they say about assumptions) he may still yet play for St Kilda.

I would be more inclined to consider the club is just covering its arse.

That'd be my arse-umption too.

Bum-p

That's my arsessment also.

[bozza1980]

I thought this was interesting from the AGM thread...

Westaway then called for questions, but first made it clear that there would be no discussion or questions taken about Andrew Lovett.

He did point out that AL is on full pay, is being supervised by the club in terms of weight training, fitness, sprints, he is time trialled each week, and receives weekly briefings on tactics from coaching staff.

I'm going to make an assumption on this (I do know what they say about assumptions) he may still yet play for St Kilda.

I would be more inclined to consider the club is just covering its arse.

You may well be right.

I would suggest we will only find out in the event that no charges are laid.

[bigred]

I think it may be even more apparent if charges are NOT laid.

[saintspremiers]

Interesting bit in an article in the age today:

A police spokeswoman yesterday confirmed that the lead investigator on the Lovett case has been on annual leave for several weeks

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/l ... -nv3a.html

The piggy probably barracks for Carlton!

[stinger]

Maybe you should join forces with Mr Baba and tar and feather me?

oh if only i could....


gives me a nice glow thinking about it though...thanx for sharing.....

And I somehow get the feeling that you wouldn't have the courage to try it. However, the thought of it gives me an inner glow. And stop giving me those gay winks. People will talk.

still homophobic i see.....you make my skin crawl....

[IluvHarvey]

Can you guys please start a thread where you can just abuse the living daylights out each other and leave other threads alone.
This is ridiculous.

This is a Football forum! Let's talk about football!

[markp]

Can you guys please start a thread where you can just abuse the living daylights out each other and leave other threads alone.
This is ridiculous.

This is a Football forum! Let's talk about football!

Or better yet, take it to PM.

Do they really think anyone else is at all interested???

[stinger]

Can you guys please start a thread where you can just abuse the living daylights out each other and leave other threads alone.
This is ridiculous.

This is a Football forum! Let's talk about football!

i haven't abused anyone...just picked them up on a very racist statement...got abused for my trouble...as usual.....

, don't read it....and don't give me directions...


....for the record..i find your post abusive as well as bullying......

[JMsainter]

Can you guys please start a thread where you can just abuse the living daylights out each other and leave other threads alone.
This is ridiculous.

This is a Football forum! Let's talk about football!

I htought I was talking about footy, until someone saw an opportunity to call me racist.