Proven again tonight!!!!!

[Con Gorozidis]

Yeah which team does Buddy play for?

The Swans. And he only kicked 2 from 15 last night. Have you actually watched him play? He is a complete team man. He doesnt play as an individual like Dangerflog. Buddy shepherds and tackles and plays his role.

I am with citywest on this one. 22 blokes win finals. Not messiahs.

[CURLY]

Dangerfield is a machine his will to get the footy is second to no one. Make no mistake Sydney having Buddy was one of the main reasons they won.

[Jacks Back]

Dangerfield is a machine his will to get the footy is second to no one. Make no mistake Sydney having Buddy was one of the main reasons they won.

But Dangerfield hardly ever kicks it to someone. Most of the time their long bombs or grubbers.

[Teflon]

Mike Pike went ok in the 2012 finals series
Papley has been one of the best forwards in the 2016 finals hasn't he?

Yeah
Buddy goes ok
Hall went ok
Lockett went ok
Tippet ok

.....trend here...

You asked in recent times if Sydney had developed their own ruck or any forwards, so I was just answering your query

Out of all those forwards you listed I'd say that Tony had the biggest impact and could turn a game with his brilliance. At his best, and back in the day when a FF played out of the goal square, he was undoubtedly a matchwinner...

So....did they win the flag with him? Did Geelong get into a GF after recruiting the best midfielder in the league?

By the way, I don't agree with the original post but I do admire the way Sydney is coached and their footy development. I mean there are clubs that get handouts and priority picks and clubs like Melbourne and Carlton and Richmond have botched their drafting for years. Gold Coast have had a fair amount of help but they're still putrid

How many finals series they missing in last decade?
Do they need to win a GF to justify recruiting a Lockett as a successful raid?? Or a Hall for that matter?
Again, when have Sydney DEVELOPED a bona fide star forward? When have they had to punt that a no 1 draft pick with diabetes just might, hopefully live up to expectation?

Facts are they don't have to do it - they don't need to cause their generous additional salary room in recent years means they more often than not (and more than Melb clubs) can just buy it in

Please spare me Papley as examples of an elite match winning forward ...
They've been propped up at the expense of the comp and this "we must have Sydney successful" by the AFL I doubt will ultimately pay off

[Wayne42]

No one cared at all when the Swans first went to Sydney and struggled like f*** to win a game over 20 years,

now that they have developed a successful formula it has opened the door to the whinging minority to cut loose.

f*** em i say , go the under doggies.

[Teflon]

No one cared at all when the Swans first went to Sydney and struggled like f*** to win a game over 20 years,

now that they have developed a successful formula it has opened the door to the whinging minority to cut loose.

f*** em i say , go the under doggies.

Of course they didn't Wayne
No one expected to be propping them up for 20 f@&$$& years either?
Still doing it
Nuffs enough

[Scollop]

I wonder if the sponsorship and tv rights for a local Victorian based game would have been the same as a national competition? I wonder if the AFL hadn't have expanded if there would have been the same growth in our game versus other sports? Should they have only expanded to traditional Aussie rules states? Should they have had limits?

We know it's an advantage for southern states to retain their young recruits so there has to be some sort of support doesn't there? COLA is gone and yes they are still enjoying some benefit from that legacy, but it's not all doom and gloom for Melbourne clubs. How is whinging and moaning about the Northern Academies or COLA going to help the Saints?

We also don't have the Eagles or Crows or Geelong's home ground advantages and we don't have a facility like the Holden Centre in the heart of town. Instead of us whinging about their success and complaining about the past we need to get on with creating our own success. We need to emulate the things that we can copy from the successful clubs.

The Dogs are proving it's possible

[ace]

Do you honestly reckon Heeney, and an absent Mills got them to a grand final?

I'd say bigger factors were

Kennedy - trade
Parker - pick 40 (somehow?)
Jack - Rookie
Hannebury - at late 20s I think as a f/s
McViegh - Seasoned Vet

Grundy - Rookie
Rampe - Rookie
Nick Smith - late pick
Aliir - pick 44
Laidler - trade

Forwards
Franklin - Free Agent
Tippett - Trade
Xavier Richards - Rookie
Papley - Rookie
Heeney - Academy
McGlynn - Trade

Then there's
Naismith, Number 10?

There's a side put together well, using and abusing all avenues.

drafting

There is one thing you have all missed.
Clubs have for at least a decade been required to have a minimum of 38 players and a maximum of 40 players on their senior list.
While the rest of the competition has gone with 40 Sydney have one with 38.

We will have to cut players who won't make it as usual this year to keep our list at 40.
But there will be at least 2 players lucky enough to get "another chance".
They will be lucky if they get a game next year and will be finally cut.
Sydney have the discipline to cut them from the senior list but have more rookies.
This gives them not only a salary cap advantage but the opportunity to assess more players over time because of the shorter assessments.
Just look at our list for the year completed.
There were more than 2 who could have been cut 12 months earlier weren't there.

[ace]

The guy in the saints scarf and beanie.
You know the guy I mean.
Seems to be at every training session.
Talk to him,
He can give you details on every players training, strengths and weaknesses.
He has amazing knowledge of all our players, senior, rookie or scholarship.
The same knowledge that he reports to his boss at say Collingwood every week.

It is so easy when you live in the same town, a bit harder to keep tabs on those rookies and scholarship guys when they are isolated in an interstate city.
Just another advantage to Sydney.

[ace]

The big blonde bombshell.
You know who I mean.
OK let me help you.
Tony Lockett, Barry Hall, Buddy Franklin, Kurt Tippett and Nick Riewoldt.
You know the must have superstar key forward.

Every season many clubs go to the draft in search of one.
And they do it year after year.
How many first round tall forwards do you expend to find one Nick Riewoldt.
How many millions in salary cap do you expend trying testing and finally rejecting candidates.

Now ignore the draft.
Offer up only 3 of those wasted first round picks for a proven product.
Offer up the salary of all those rejects to the proven product.
Mission accomplished.
With a bit of help the AFL will devise a scheme where you don't have to offer up those draft picks.
Remind anyone of Sydney.

[Con Gorozidis]

The other thing is that has been proven is the power of the draft and making your own talent by developing kids.

Everyone has been banging on about how well Geelong have managed their mini rebuild but think about this.

They paid overs for Henderson. Retained Mackie. Got rid of Hamling.

A classic case of writing off young talent wy too soon and going for the short term sugar hit. Hamling is going to be a gun player for the Dogs for the next five years.

How many good kids have the Dog produced on their own via the draft? Lots.

Even the swans have developed their own. Everyone talks about buddy and cola but how many young kids have the swans drafted and developed? Plenty. Many with mediocre picks or as rookies.

[Teflon]

I wonder if the sponsorship and tv rights for a local Victorian based game would have been the same as a national competition? I wonder if the AFL hadn't have expanded if there would have been the same growth in our game versus other sports? Should they have only expanded to traditional Aussie rules states? Should they have had limits?

We know it's an advantage for southern states to retain their young recruits so there has to be some sort of support doesn't there? COLA is gone and yes they are still enjoying some benefit from that legacy, but it's not all doom and gloom for Melbourne clubs. How is whinging and moaning about the Northern Academies or COLA going to help the Saints?

We also don't have the Eagles or Crows or Geelong's home ground advantages and we don't have a facility like the Holden Centre in the heart of town. Instead of us whinging about their success and complaining about the past we need to get on with creating our own success. We need to emulate the things that we can copy from the successful clubs.

The Dogs are proving it's possible

Again, not the point
How long do you give handouts for ?
20 years?
What your saying is - it's ok to continue with an uneven playing field as long as we get cash??
And I will bet you my left one that WHEN GWS or Sydney take a 3 year turn at the bottom of the ladder that "purchased AFL success" won't mean squat and they (like Brisbane) will again put out their hands and say "we can't compete and our members have dropped off"

How successful will the years of gifted finals, players and cash have really been??

Of course these sides need a leg up - the question is for how long before it damages the fabric of an even competition - and why us asking for a level playing field now seen as whinging??

F?&$@ me!

[CURLY]

The other thing is that has been proven is the power of the draft and making your own talent by developing kids.

Everyone has been banging on about how well Geelong have managed their mini rebuild but think about this.

They paid overs for Henderson. Retained Mackie. Got rid of Hamling.

A classic case of writing off young talent wy too soon and going for the short term sugar hit. Hamling is going to be a gun player for the Dogs for the next five years.

How many good kids have the Dog produced on their own via the draft? Lots.

Even the swans have developed their own. Everyone talks about buddy and cola but how many young kids have the swans drafted and developed? Plenty. Many with mediocre picks or as rookies.

All clubs produce young kids all clubs have late picks or rookies that are now stars. What all clubs don't have is extra cap access to father sons and then academy kids.

[Scollop]

"the fabric of an even competition"

That's a good one. I didn't realise you were protecting the integrity of the game.

Buried in your whinge I see that you acknowledge that the northern states need some sort of assistance. Just accept it and move on. That's what every club has accepted and when clubs deem that the system is 'uneven' I'm sure the assistance will be adjusted

And...if the Demons win a premiership in the next five years I hope you won't be whinging that it was their priority picks and financial assistance from the AFL that won them their flag.

[Teflon]

"the fabric of an even competition"

That's a good one. I didn't realise you were protecting the integrity of the game.

Buried in your whinge I see that you acknowledge that the northern states need some sort of assistance. Just accept it and move on. That's what every club has accepted and when clubs deem that the system is 'uneven' I'm sure the assistance will be adjusted

And...if the Demons win a premiership in the next five years I hope you won't be whinging that it was their priority picks and financial assistance from the AFL that won them their flag.

So none of us have the right to discuss the unevenness of the competition because you're happy to be the AFL bend over boy??? - if that's your go, good for you but don't insist on what I can/can't say in a friggin football forum discussing football

I note several other threads also bemoaning the GWS monster the AFL has created but note your silence in those ones?? At least be consistent in your strident defence of all things AFL

When did asking for a balanced, even playing field become whinging ?
And fancy using Melbourne as your example - do show me their extra list size, AFL sanctioned academy and additional salary cap over the rest of the comp??

[Con Gorozidis]

The other thing is that has been proven is the power of the draft and making your own talent by developing kids.

Everyone has been banging on about how well Geelong have managed their mini rebuild but think about this.

They paid overs for Henderson. Retained Mackie. Got rid of Hamling.

A classic case of writing off young talent wy too soon and going for the short term sugar hit. Hamling is going to be a gun player for the Dogs for the next five years.

How many good kids have the Dog produced on their own via the draft? Lots.

Even the swans have developed their own. Everyone talks about buddy and cola but how many young kids have the swans drafted and developed? Plenty. Many with mediocre picks or as rookies.

All clubs produce young kids all clubs have late picks or rookies that are now stars. What all clubs don't have is extra cap access to father sons and then academy kids.

Who are Richmond's late picks that are now stars? None that I know of.

[CURLY]

The other thing is that has been proven is the power of the draft and making your own talent by developing kids.

Everyone has been banging on about how well Geelong have managed their mini rebuild but think about this.

They paid overs for Henderson. Retained Mackie. Got rid of Hamling.

A classic case of writing off young talent wy too soon and going for the short term sugar hit. Hamling is going to be a gun player for the Dogs for the next five years.

How many good kids have the Dog produced on their own via the draft? Lots.

Even the swans have developed their own. Everyone talks about buddy and cola but how many young kids have the swans drafted and developed? Plenty. Many with mediocre picks or as rookies.

All clubs produce young kids all clubs have late picks or rookies that are now stars. What all clubs don't have is extra cap access to father sons and then academy kids.

Who are Richmond's late picks that are now stars? None that I know of.

They've had wins with Miles , Lloyd, Houli, Edwards to name a few. Im sure if you chucked Buddy in with them they'ed look a hell of a lot better.

[White Winmar]

And to think, the Tigers could've had Buddy. Instead, the got Tambling! Oh dear!

[barneyboyz]

I wonder if the sponsorship and tv rights for a local Victorian based game would have been the same as a national competition? I wonder if the AFL hadn't have expanded if there would have been the same growth in our game versus other sports? Should they have only expanded to traditional Aussie rules states? Should they have had limits?

We know it's an advantage for southern states to retain their young recruits so there has to be some sort of support doesn't there? COLA is gone and yes they are still enjoying some benefit from that legacy, but it's not all doom and gloom for Melbourne clubs. How is whinging and moaning about the Northern Academies or COLA going to help the Saints?

We also don't have the Eagles or Crows or Geelong's home ground advantages and we don't have a facility like the Holden Centre in the heart of town. Instead of us whinging about their success and complaining about the past we need to get on with creating our own success. We need to emulate the things that we can copy from the successful clubs.

The Dogs are proving it's possible

As much as it hurts, I actually agree. I can understand the arguments on both sides, however we did have a crack several times recently and buggered it (so it can be done).
I also reckon that the AFL, Sydney, GWS, and all the other interstaters need us and the doggies to be strong as well. I think we are going to be just as good, if not better as a club than 2009/10 and remember, we aren't Richmond or Carlton

[Teflon]

GWS have not hit their straps yet
The Dogs rebuild is 18mths ahead of us IMO with much of their drafting and father sons ahead of GWS peak
IMO we will run smack bang into a side choc full with top draft picks - we hope to get scraps like Steel who can't get a game and is fringe ffs
GWS will still accrue their academy picks PLUS offload good kids (cause they have so much) and be able to easily top up inside top 10 draft picks
What do they have this year 2 or 3 top 10 picks??
Propping up interstate clubs where football is not their preferred game is fine..... for a little while....but IMO if that goes on to long and clubs in the heartland see they have bugger all chance on competing the AFL risk supporters walking away where it matters
As an aside, soccer in junior ranks is already making huge strides locally so they have a fight on their hands in the next decade or so anyway