Who do we now delist?
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- Junction Oval
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- mad saint guy
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i though i read that zac re-signed this morning?Junction Oval wrote:With the word at Trade Week being that Zac and Farren are not happy with the Saints offer, they could both walk in the Draft.
Collectively, they would be on reasonable money. Polo, Gamble and the other lesser lights, can't save us much in salaryt cap.
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Yep. They're all on the chopping block.To the top wrote:Start with the ordinary players who have had opportunity at AFL level - Geary, Gamble, Heyne (only a couple of games but at that 187cm mid-fielder build that is easy to replace), Blake and Polo.
A shame we didn't go for Bower. Much more gifted as a defender than Dawson who deserved much more opportunity than Carlton gave him. Definitely go for him in the PSD.Unfortunately there is no real option on the list for Dawson - unless Watters can identify someone.
And thank goodness for that.Along with Baker, McQualter, Lynch and Eddy that gets rid of 9/10 of our "role players" who have held us back in recent seasons.
I think that would result in a Gehrig-like comeback. Gardiner seems physically finished and I'd rather see Rhys Stanley given a go as McEvoy's deputy.Can Watters do a Gehrig and talk Gardiner into one final season?
Broc McCauley could be worth investigating as a potential back-up, as Daniel Archer's ability is tantamount to mine.
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What's to stop another club putting them on the rookie list and they end up getting less?Junction Oval wrote:With the word at Trade Week being that Zac and Farren are not happy with the Saints offer, they could both walk in the Draft.
Collectively, they would be on reasonable money. Polo, Gamble and the other lesser lights, can't save us much in salaryt cap.
This is my concern, we haven't really sorted anything out with trade week. With Pelchin wanting to use the first 6 picks in the draft, what was the point in keeping the last two? Didn't we get 8 in the end? I would have bundled our last 3 and turned it into a 50? Maybe thats just too simplistic for this complex trade week.stinger wrote:one or two might still walk...there a a few still not signed up and money is short....
I really don't know who will want out, I fear Blakey may have run his race which is sad for a great clubman. Polo and Gamble are replacable but are they contracted for next year? Pauly C would have to be the luckiest bloke around, having said that, if we picked up a decent tall 18 year old he'd almost be ahead of Cahill anyway... We do have Simpkin and Johnson, maybe Cahill on way out?
Don't want to lose Ray, Gram, Dawson, Peake, Dempster, CJ all for nothing, suitable trade I would have begrudgingly accepted it but for any of them to walk it will be pretty dire and terrible list management if you ask me.
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if their managers are any good then they'll know what else is out there. all they need is a firm offer from another club and then they'll be happy to walk. and other clubs know that so they'll be sniffing around.SainterK wrote:I know we may lose them for nothing, but why is there a guarantee that they will get more?
otherwise they will probably sign for reduced money, but that will only happen when they're sure there is nothing else around. basically means we cannot hope to keep a player which any other club wants.
- sax
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I actually think Archer will be safe with Walsh leaving.
Polo did enough to keep his spot also.
I think one or two of Blake, Dawson, Clarke, Peake, Ray & Dempster will walk (Please not Ray & Dempster)
I'd say Gamble, Heyne, Smith, Cahill & Johnson will probably be delisted. Gamble may be another one that might be safe with Walsh leaving.
Polo did enough to keep his spot also.
I think one or two of Blake, Dawson, Clarke, Peake, Ray & Dempster will walk (Please not Ray & Dempster)
I'd say Gamble, Heyne, Smith, Cahill & Johnson will probably be delisted. Gamble may be another one that might be safe with Walsh leaving.
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- Wrote for Luck
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IF Dawson wants to "walk" then so be it as far as I'm concerned. I reckon if he thinks he can do better at somewhere like the dockers then the very best of luck to him and I wish him well. Polo, I thought, had a reasonable season (after an indifferent start) Gamble? time to say goodbye I'm afraid. Gardiner to play on? NO! For the first time in years, I feel some degree of confidence in our list management/recruiting and it could be that we can put a few noses out of joint next year among those "pundits" ready to write us off!
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- dragit
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I think the final against Sydney highlighted for me that Raph's worst is just too much of a liability. While his best is amazing, in high pressure situations he has been found out one too many times.
Compared with Farren Ray, who doesn't set the world on fire like Raph can, but he is very consistent, you know what he is going to bring every week.
Is it time to say goodbye to Raph?
Others for me would be Gamble & maybe Blake if we are really short on cap space? Peake can go missing in bigger games too so I would move him on before any of Dawson, Ray or Dempster.
It all really depends on actually how bad our cap situation is, as mentioned we could move Heyne & Cahill down to the rookie list to free up 2 senior spots…
We're all probably hoping that 3-4 of Saad, Cripps, Stanley, Winmar, Johnson, Ledger & Siposs become regular players next year.
For this to happen, some of these guys will have to miss out:
Blake, Clarke, Peake, Jones, Ray, Kosi, Geary & even Gilbert on last years form.
Compared with Farren Ray, who doesn't set the world on fire like Raph can, but he is very consistent, you know what he is going to bring every week.
Is it time to say goodbye to Raph?
Others for me would be Gamble & maybe Blake if we are really short on cap space? Peake can go missing in bigger games too so I would move him on before any of Dawson, Ray or Dempster.
It all really depends on actually how bad our cap situation is, as mentioned we could move Heyne & Cahill down to the rookie list to free up 2 senior spots…
We're all probably hoping that 3-4 of Saad, Cripps, Stanley, Winmar, Johnson, Ledger & Siposs become regular players next year.
For this to happen, some of these guys will have to miss out:
Blake, Clarke, Peake, Jones, Ray, Kosi, Geary & even Gilbert on last years form.
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IF the salary cap is as bad as we are led to believe players such as;
Cahill
Heyne
Archer
Gamble
Polo
Will make SFA difference to the situation.
Basically i think either 3-5 players will need to take a hair cut in salary or one will be gone.
Dawson- Depends where Simpkins at but with Gwilt not back until mid year hard to replace
Gram/Clarke/Ray - Interesting mix here, Gram inconsistent best very good but norm is ok and sprays kicks like a sprinkler. Ray more consistent less brilliant. Good overhead and i think more versatile. Clarke - Whipping boy who's good has been great but bad has been horrid. Would be surprised if on as much as the other 2 so may not provide as much benefit either in delisting
Blake- Saving grace for him is we are short on back up Rucks/utilities and also based on how long he has been atthe club may be some ability to use veterans list concessions?
Delist due to performance:
Gamble
Heyne
Archer- Rookie
Cahill
Baker
Gardiner
Eddy(Rookie)
Cahill
Heyne
Archer
Gamble
Polo
Will make SFA difference to the situation.
Basically i think either 3-5 players will need to take a hair cut in salary or one will be gone.
Dawson- Depends where Simpkins at but with Gwilt not back until mid year hard to replace
Gram/Clarke/Ray - Interesting mix here, Gram inconsistent best very good but norm is ok and sprays kicks like a sprinkler. Ray more consistent less brilliant. Good overhead and i think more versatile. Clarke - Whipping boy who's good has been great but bad has been horrid. Would be surprised if on as much as the other 2 so may not provide as much benefit either in delisting
Blake- Saving grace for him is we are short on back up Rucks/utilities and also based on how long he has been atthe club may be some ability to use veterans list concessions?
Delist due to performance:
Gamble
Heyne
Archer- Rookie
Cahill
Baker
Gardiner
Eddy(Rookie)
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If we need a significant cut, then I reckon Ray's the one who will be sacrificed.
I think he'd be on reasonable dough. He was a high draft pick and we traded for him, which suggests we paid him reasonable money.
Dawson got there via the rookie list. I can't see how he'd be on anywhere near Ray's salary. Then there's the B&F, which all clubs use when establishing a list of who to keep. The B&F is a reasonable guide to how the club thinks a bloke is going. It's an internal measure that we can see.
Based on the B&F, Ray had a poor year. He polled about 9 per game he played. Dawson polled 18 per game, which suggests to me the club thought he went pretty well.
The next closest to Ray, per game were Kosi (12), Armitage (13) and Blake (15).
Ray's a midfielder type, good overhead and can run. But, his disposal is indecisive and poor. I don't think he's that hard to replace.
Dawson's a key defender with a solid record. They're harder to get and we don't have many (no-one does).
This will be a relative value for money decision. Given Ray's year, and his higher salary, the options to replace him and his deficiencies, I reckon he's the one under most pressure, if we have to make a significant cut.
I
I think he'd be on reasonable dough. He was a high draft pick and we traded for him, which suggests we paid him reasonable money.
Dawson got there via the rookie list. I can't see how he'd be on anywhere near Ray's salary. Then there's the B&F, which all clubs use when establishing a list of who to keep. The B&F is a reasonable guide to how the club thinks a bloke is going. It's an internal measure that we can see.
Based on the B&F, Ray had a poor year. He polled about 9 per game he played. Dawson polled 18 per game, which suggests to me the club thought he went pretty well.
The next closest to Ray, per game were Kosi (12), Armitage (13) and Blake (15).
Ray's a midfielder type, good overhead and can run. But, his disposal is indecisive and poor. I don't think he's that hard to replace.
Dawson's a key defender with a solid record. They're harder to get and we don't have many (no-one does).
This will be a relative value for money decision. Given Ray's year, and his higher salary, the options to replace him and his deficiencies, I reckon he's the one under most pressure, if we have to make a significant cut.
I
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I don't think Ray, Polo and Clarke have much choice but to take a pay cut or risk missing out all together. Freo showed interest in Dawson so he looks the most likely to go to another club through the PSD. Time to put games into Tom Simpkin.
Tom Simpkin 191cm & 90kg is around about the right size and we have Blakey as a back up. The best two full backs in the AFL, Glass & Scarlett are 192 and weigh in around the same.
Rutten is heavier and Harry Taylor a couple of centimetres taller but Simpkin and Blake stack up ok in the tale of the tape.
Tom Simpkin 191cm & 90kg is around about the right size and we have Blakey as a back up. The best two full backs in the AFL, Glass & Scarlett are 192 and weigh in around the same.
Rutten is heavier and Harry Taylor a couple of centimetres taller but Simpkin and Blake stack up ok in the tale of the tape.
Last edited by gurubob101 on Tue 18 Oct 2011 12:33pm, edited 1 time in total.
- ralphsmith
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Raph Clarke - Bad awareness and bad decision making
Clint Jones - Can't kick
Zac Dawon - Overall apathy and lack of aggression
Gram - Long bombs to nobody too often. Doesn't think when kicking, goes for the borrrrk instead of the first option too often.
Clint Jones - Can't kick
Zac Dawon - Overall apathy and lack of aggression
Gram - Long bombs to nobody too often. Doesn't think when kicking, goes for the borrrrk instead of the first option too often.
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- Wrote for Luck
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why do people want to delist so many players!!!!millarsaint wrote:don't really think we should be talking about Jonesy amongst this should we!
correct me if i am wrong but we can up to 40 senior players. we have 4 veterans so we can have 6 rookies and potentially 2 more international rookies.
is this correct?
- Little Dozer
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Agree about Clarke and Dawson, time to go. Jones is one of the best taggers in the league and must stay. Gram can stay if he'll play for less money, otherwise seeya.ralphsmith wrote:Raph Clarke - Bad awareness and bad decision making
Clint Jones - Can't kick
Zac Dawon - Overall apathy and lack of aggression
Gram - Long bombs to nobody too often. Doesn't think when kicking, goes for the borrrrk instead of the first option too often.