Sandringham v Werribee Game Thread..

[thirty-seven!?]

Blake is not a full back - even Maguire is a better full back than Blake!

Simpkin is more at home using a defensive fist - but is his pace up to scratch to handle full back?

Johnson is another alternative given his experience in the position.

However we are now at a position where we must continue to win to consolidate our crack at the business end.

Therefore I would go with Gilbert if Dawson is out.

The outer defensive positions are well covered, noting Clarke got the guy from Adelaide when he was moved forward last night.

Gave away size but made sure he had no impact forward after being BOG until moved from defence.

Gilbert is a running back. If he is used in another position it changes our backline. If Zac goes he will not play FB. It will be left for Simpkin, Blake or Walsh.

Would have to agree with this. Also worth considering the opposition, Fremantle. Lot of talk that neither Sandilands or Griffin will be passed fit for the game, plus Kepler is already injured too. So it means they will go in with Clarke in the ruck, plus Michael Johnson as backup. Obviously they have Pavlich, but he still plays a lot more through the middle and Fisher/Gilbert would both be reasonable matchups for him anyway. They played Jack Anthony this week and he was horrendous, but will likely stay due to their lack of fit talls. Mayne is also there but out of form.

So due to the fact they have no fit full-forwards, it's not a terrible time for Zac to be suspended. Raph/Fisher/Gilbo can all play on talls, which would occupy Pav/Mayne/Anthony. It must be remembered though that Ballantyne is one of their most dangerous forwards, so Ross may even recall Baker to play on him, happy with the other three taking the talls. Otherwise, Gram/Geary may get first crack at him.

[AnythingsPossibleSaints]

Pretty sure no-one has mentioned it, where exactly was Tommy playing yesterday?

If Zac does miss, I really hope we give Tommy a run (to see how he goes both forward and back) as we really ought to have Freo's measure, whoever comes in for Zac.

Here's hoping we don't play it safe!

[SainterK]

Pretty sure no-one has mentioned it, where exactly was Tommy playing yesterday?

If Zac does miss, I really hope we give Tommy a run (to see how he goes both forward and back) as we really ought to have Freo's measure, whoever comes in for Zac.

Here's hoping we don't play it safe!

Don't you want Lynch to play though?

Couldn't they just move Lynch back if Dawson is suspended?

[AnythingsPossibleSaints]

Pretty sure no-one has mentioned it, where exactly was Tommy playing yesterday?

If Zac does miss, I really hope we give Tommy a run (to see how he goes both forward and back) as we really ought to have Freo's measure, whoever comes in for Zac.

Here's hoping we don't play it safe!

Don't you want Lynch to play though?

Couldn't they just move Lynch back if Dawson is suspended?

I haven't checked, but I'm pretty sure you can actually play both. I'll have to check with the AFL rules on that, though.
If it's OK to play both, I would really like to see both of them out there and I hope we take this weeks game as an opportunity to give someone who needs it a rest.
I doubt we'll be any chance of winning the flag if we go into the finals with a handful carrying injuries, so I think we now need to look seriously into giving those who really need it a game off, especially this week, against Freo. If we're not good enough to beat an injury ravaged Freo, who are coming off a 6 day break, without say a Fisher, or a Gram, or maybe two of them, then it won't matter anyway, as we won't be good enough to win the flag, so I say at least one or two who are carrying an injury ought to be rested this week. Maybe even McEvoy for Gardi, just to freshen Mac up.
As I said, we have to take some brave chances if we're to be any chance of winning the flag, and in this case, back ourselves to win without our best team this week. Freo and Hawthorn have been doing it for much of the year and we did it against Hawthorn in 2009 without our best 8 or so, so it can certainly be done. We need to back ourselves to do it at least once in the run home, IMO
Otherwise we'll end up in the finals against the likes of Geelong and Collingwood, who will be fresh as a daisy (if we get that far). Collingwood looked a lot fresher than us in the second GF last year and I think we all remember how that turned out.

[SainterK]

Pretty sure no-one has mentioned it, where exactly was Tommy playing yesterday?

If Zac does miss, I really hope we give Tommy a run (to see how he goes both forward and back) as we really ought to have Freo's measure, whoever comes in for Zac.

Here's hoping we don't play it safe!

Don't you want Lynch to play though?

Couldn't they just move Lynch back if Dawson is suspended?

I haven't checked, but I'm pretty sure you can actually play both. I'll have to check with the AFL rules on that, though.
If it's OK to play both, I would really like to see both of them out there and I hope we take this weeks game as an opportunity to give someone who needs it a rest.
I doubt we'll be any chance of winning the flag if we go into the finals with a handful carrying injuries, so I think we now need to look seriously into giving those who really need it a game off, especially this week, against Freo. If we're not good enough to beat an injury ravaged Freo, who are coming off a 6 day break, without say a Fisher, or a Gram, or maybe two of them, then it won't matter anyway, as we won't be good enough to win the flag, so I say at least one or two who are carrying an injury ought to be rested this week. Maybe even McEvoy for Gardi, just to freshen Mac up.
As I said, we have to take some brave chances if we're to be any chance of winning the flag, and in this case, back ourselves to win without our best team this week.
Otherwise we'll end up in the finals against the likes of Geelong and Collingwood, who will be fresh as a daisy (if we get that far).

You don't have to be sarcastic.

I don't think making wholesale changes worked that well for us the year before last, momentum is also very important, and we certainly have that working in our advantage.

I agree that Gardi will play soon, as Ben looks very much in need of a rest.

I just can't see the selection committee having Fisher, Gram, McEvoy, Dawson all miss at the same time.

[saint66au]

Not sure about Gardy being ready...reports vary, but some have said he was taken to the cleaners by Majak Daw yesterday

[SainterK]

Not sure about Gardy being ready...reports vary, but some have said he was taken to the cleaners by Majak Daw yesterday

He will have Kosi to help him, it's just that Ben has Jolly, Mummy and Goldstein coming up...and I reckon he looks like he needs a break.

Don't think Sandilands is likely, so it would be a good game to test the waters with Gardi, and give Ben a much deserved refresher.

[Thinline]

McEvoy looked very sore on Saturday night, limped to half time, and carried himself through the second on a combination of rare will and pure guts.

Something about that kid.

Gold.

[matrix]

agreed
im sure he was limping after the final siren went
looked sore, maybe a corky or a knock??

pushed thru it obviously and contributed
gotta love that
done a fair bit of work recently being the only true big tall we have thats being picked
go bigboy

[AnythingsPossibleSaints]

You don't have to be sarcastic.

I don't think making wholesale changes worked that well for us the year before last, momentum is also very important, and we certainly have that working in our advantage.

I agree that Gardi will play soon, as Ben looks very much in need of a rest.

I just can't see the selection committee having Fisher, Gram, McEvoy, Dawson all miss at the same time.

My bad, I thought your post was being sarcastic. Apologies.
I think the main problem with what we did two years ago was making so many changes in one game. 8 is a hell of a lot. I'm not suggesting we go anywhere near that far.
I was more suggesting Mac/Gardi as one of the two potential changes, plus Zac, if he gets rubbed out. I reckon 3 all up would be a good number.
If Zac plays, I think Fisher is apparently carrying something, so he could miss and as others have mentioned, it seems the ideal week for Mac to have a break, if Sandilands is expected to miss. Then one more, whoever needs it the most.
If Zac misses, then Fisher will probably be needed for Pavlich, so maybe Ben misses, plus someone else (whoever needs it the most), bringing it to 3 changes.

[To the top]

Gilbert is 194cm and this week is the time for him to take the second tall - behind Fisher who will probably get Pavlich.

McEvoy was hobbled by late in the game - and had an ice pack on his upper thigh immediately after the game.

A few others looked a bit short in their actions as well.

The game was virtually non stop circle work because of our lack of an effective target forward and our manic desire to play on which has been in evidence over the past couple of weeks - and it told on our players many of whom were totally spent by games end.

As were the opposition.

The only time we straightened up was when we were able to put Koschitzke forward - which rarely happened.

I do not think that either of Baker or Blake suit this play on regime.

[plugger66]

Gilbert is 194cm and this week is the time for him to take the second tall - behind Fisher who will probably get Pavlich.

McEvoy was hobbled by late in the game - and had an ice pack on his upper thigh immediately after the game.

A few others looked a bit short in their actions as well.

The game was virtually non stop circle work because of our lack of an effective target forward and our manic desire to play on which has been in evidence over the past couple of weeks - and it told on our players many of whom were totally spent by games end.

As were the opposition.

The only time we straightened up was when we were able to put Koschitzke forward - which rarely happened.

I do not think that either of Baker or Blake suit this play on regime.

I dont care if he 210cm. He is our running back so it isnt and will never been time to play FB unless there isnt one other possible option. At the moment we have Simpkin, Blake and Walsh as options so we will not use Gilbert in other position but as a running HB. That is where he clearly plays his best footy.

[BigMart]

And what a dangerous running back he is, lethal by foot.

Similar to grant birchall...

[plugger66]

And what a dangerous running back he is, lethal by foot.

Similar to grant birchall...

Do you have anything positive to say? So you would play him where this week?

[Dr Spaceman]

And what a dangerous running back he is, lethal by foot.

Similar to grant birchall...

Do you have anything positive to say? So you would play him where this week?

His disposal in 2 of the last 3 games, including Saturday night, was close to his best IMO. One sided no doubt but he was regularly hitting his targets.

[AnythingsPossibleSaints]

And at least when Gilbert hits his kicks well they're about as good as anyone in the league's. Not too many are capable of those low, worm burning passes that get to you in a flash and don't ever get above about head height. (Or that travel 55m+, with penetration, if kicking it long.)
He has a very low margain-of-error kicking style. They're usually either extremely good and incredibly pinpoint, or really bad. There's not a whole lot in between.

[BigMart]

He does turn it over occasionally doesnt he

Would you rate him a reliable kick p66??
or do you need to ask ross for all the facts in case he has any ailments or slept bad during the week or is mentally fatigued...Who knows whats causing his clangers

But then again its hard to tell if your not there, if he actually turns it over, or whether it just appears that way on the tv......hard to judge.....


So i better not make an ill informed comment, dressed up as fact about his disposal....

[AnythingsPossibleSaints]

I like that!

[plugger66]

He does turn it over occasionally doesnt he

Would you rate him a reliable kick p66??
or do you need to ask ross for all the facts in case he has any ailments or slept bad during the week or is mentally fatigued...Who knows whats causing his clangers

But then again its hard to tell if your not there, if he actually turns it over, or whether it just appears that way on the tv......hard to judge.....


So i better not make an ill informed comment, dressed up as fact about his disposal....

He isnt a great kick but what that has to do with him playing FB is beyond me. I know what you like doing and that is critisizing so any excuse to tell how bad a kick he is you jump at. And another thing you are good at is avoiding any question you are asked. Where should Gilbert play this week?

[maverick]

He does turn it over occasionally doesnt he

Would you rate him a reliable kick p66??
or do you need to ask ross for all the facts in case he has any ailments or slept bad during the week or is mentally fatigued...Who knows whats causing his clangers

But then again its hard to tell if your not there, if he actually turns it over, or whether it just appears that way on the tv......hard to judge.....


So i better not make an ill informed comment, dressed up as fact about his disposal....

Well he is getting a bit old now, I think he is 23 or older now probably in the way of a youngster whose development is being held back

[Spinner]

And what a dangerous running back he is, lethal by foot.

Similar to grant birchall...

I actually agree with this comment.

Great defender, great mark thou...

[To the top]

Full Back is a specialised position.

You need weight, height and reach employed to be an effective spoiler in contested situations.

You also need off the mark pace to counter leads - and get a fist on the ball.

And you need absolute discipline.

Look at Max as a prime example (except on Nietz!).

Dawson has the physical attributes of weight, height and pace - but I sometimes worry in contested situations where body is required and, off his petty retaliations, I ponder on his mental toughness and hence his discipline.

Quite frankly none of Simpkin, Walsh or Blake appeal to me as full back material.

They are all outer line defenders not last line defenders by my assessments.

This was always my assessment of Maguire - and this continues to be verified at Brisbane.

The only option we have available who fits the criteria of discipline, height, inspector gadget reach and off the mark pace is Gilbert.

This lack of option is the reason I have previously mentioned Johnson, who has experience and was drafted off that experience and performance.

Gilbert played at full back in the VFL during his formative years at St Kilda, including playing on Franklin from memory.

[Bernard Shakey]

Johnno wears a glove. No time for the glove. Shows lack of confidence.

[BigMart]

Wing