Luke Bloody Ball

[Teflon]

Most rant, because they still cant get past the fact he was once a saint, and still shake their heads about the way we handled the situation....

He was, and still is....a class act

Who was calling him a dog in 2005??

Or when he played on one leg in 2006??

Yes because under your logic ALL blame is Ross Lyons.

Team loses - All Lyons fault.

Ball wants out - All Lyons fault.

Make no mention of Luke's intention in that at all??? just blindly trot out "class act" rhetoric cause poor Luke was let down by big bad Ross Lyon.....

Ball plays for the filth and has nothing to do with us now. This thread belongs over on their boards.

[suss]

Most rant, because they still cant get past the fact he was once a saint, and still shake their heads about the way we handled the situation....

He was, and still is....a class act

Who was calling him a dog in 2005??

Or when he played on one leg in 2006??

Not sure what you expected the club to do - accept an offer that was well below his worth or 'take a stand' against a little squib and a bully club that manipulated the draft and rail-roaded us into a crap situation.

When the club does take a stand you complain and when it doesn't take a stand you complain...

http://www.saintsational.com/forum/view ... hp?t=70401

[tony74]

I think you may have all missed the point of my original post. Can I take you back to a stones classic- " Mothers Little Helper "

[sunsaint]

Aggression is the new trading. Would love to see the Saints see target, get target.

Becca

agreed
saints lose ball
saints eye target
saints get target
saints gain Lovett

[PaytonPlace]

Aggression is the new trading. Would love to see the Saints see target, get target.

Becca

agreed
saints lose ball
saints eye target
saints get target
saints gain Lovett

I'll give you that, I'll put in the middle of my request, "Saints do more thorough background check"...

Don't forget, the Pies gave up a first round pick for Cameron Wood, it's an inexact science. More to do with the fact that one team is manipulating the draft and everyone else is playing fair...

[Grantaire]

Aggression is the new trading. Would love to see the Saints see target, get target.

Becca

agreed
saints lose ball
saints eye target
saints get target
saints gain Lovett

I'll give you that, I'll put in the middle of my request, "Saints do more thorough background check"...

Don't forget, the Pies gave up a first round pick for Cameron Wood, it's an inexact science. More to do with the fact that one team is manipulating the draft and everyone else is playing fair...

Yep, that Cameron Wood one looks like it will turn out a shocker. We had a need at the time, though- Josh Fraser was a soft dud. Turns out (after last night at least) Cam Wood could well be the same.

[Grantaire]

I just can't watch him
but in his own words

. However, I’ve witnessed the cumulative benefit which annual training camps, first-rate training and recovery facilities and a host of dedicated coaching and support staff can have in striving for ultimate success.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Despite being proud of, and grateful for, the success of my club (and long may it continue), it would be great to be hearing and reading about every club’s success in getting the very best out of its players by providing them with the best resources and opportunities to pursue their sporting dreams.

I think playing on the MCG rather than the hard Docklands surface is probably making a difference as well. But he certainly looks quicker this year, and his kicking has improved markedly as well.

[Mr Magic]

I just can't watch him
but in his own words

. However, I’ve witnessed the cumulative benefit which annual training camps, first-rate training and recovery facilities and a host of dedicated coaching and support staff can have in striving for ultimate success.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Despite being proud of, and grateful for, the success of my club (and long may it continue), it would be great to be hearing and reading about every club’s success in getting the very best out of its players by providing them with the best resources and opportunities to pursue their sporting dreams.

I think playing on the MCG rather than the hard Docklands surface is probably making a difference as well. But he certainly looks quicker this year, and his kicking has improved markedly as well.

I'm sure that Collingwood's medical abilities, coupled with a myriad of other thing s (including finally getting over OP) have assisted his return to peak physical fitness.

Lucky for you he's agreed to play for virtually nothing next season.
He's turned out to be a really great clubman in a relatively short period of time.
Just a pity he seemingly never felt the need/desire to be as thoughtful to his previous club when discussing salary and salary cap restraints.

[sasaint]

Having grown up watching NFL and NBA a lot, I'm used to the concept of "supporting laundry" as it's known back home, where your best players essentially are always looking to move on and loyal servants are flicked at a GMs whim.

It's what the AFL will become too.

However, with Luke Ball, I do wonder why other clubs don't simply look to be as aggressive in trading and recruitment.

If one clubs bullies the draft and tells the player not to take phone calls from other clubs, that's what everyone should do. They've done it twice the Pies. manipulated the system.

Aggression is the new trading. Would love to see the Saints see target, get target.

Becca

+1

[dragit]

Yawn… are we still talking about this traitor?

[Moccha]

did Ball play well?

[meher baba]

I think Ball - at his post-2006 level of fitness- is much better suited by the role that Malthouse and Buckley have given him.

There isn't really scope in Lyon's game plan for him to play that way: Ball isn't mobile enough or quick enough to be an inside player according to Lyon's model. This is why Steven is being preferred to Armo in the middle.

Ball is also helped by having a lot of quick players around him. We don't have many.

I don't think Lyon would ever want Ball back, even as a free trade for $100k per annum.

[Grantaire]

I just can't watch him
but in his own words

. However, I’ve witnessed the cumulative benefit which annual training camps, first-rate training and recovery facilities and a host of dedicated coaching and support staff can have in striving for ultimate success.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Despite being proud of, and grateful for, the success of my club (and long may it continue), it would be great to be hearing and reading about every club’s success in getting the very best out of its players by providing them with the best resources and opportunities to pursue their sporting dreams.

I think playing on the MCG rather than the hard Docklands surface is probably making a difference as well. But he certainly looks quicker this year, and his kicking has improved markedly as well.

I'm sure that Collingwood's medical abilities, coupled with a myriad of other thing s (including finally getting over OP) have assisted his return to peak physical fitness.

Lucky for you he's agreed to play for virtually nothing next season.
He's turned out to be a really great clubman in a relatively short period of time.
Just a pity he seemingly never felt the need/desire to be as thoughtful to his previous club when discussing salary and salary cap restraints.

I won't get into an argument about his desire while at St Kilda, but yeah he has really won the fans over. Much the same as Krak has this year, and Medhurst did a few years ago- lately we've been loving our recycled players because they seem to love us.

[SaintPav]

Stop picking at the scab. Time to move on.

[BigMart]

Teflon, are you seriosly suggesting the trade was handled well??

Or

Are you saying Luke made a poor decision, or he is hopeless, what are you saying??

History tends to suggest we were the big losers.....ball finished 5th in a premiership b&f last year, this year will finish 4th and have a second medal..

Good on him, and good on collingwood for giving him the go he deserved...he paid back the faith, and then some....most pundits would suggest he and collingwood were the big winners...most stk fans try to deny this, to make themselves feel better or paint a bad picture of ball, whatever softens the blow i suppose....

As for 'big bad lyon'........ he and his list management team made a strong call, hindsight says it was an error....thats a part of the reason that the whole recruiting team were sacked.....the 2009 draft period was as good as an example of poor management as you could ever wish to see.....

[MC Gusto]

losing him cost us a flag

[tweedaletomanning]

losing him cost us a flag

Ironically, getting him in the first place probably cost us four flags

[BigMart]

Yes, Chris would have been nice..

[desertsaint]

can only speculate as to why he left - although money offered from the pies obviously wasn't a factor.
we look very poor with player management decisions.
not taking a risk on cousins
taking a risk on a much lesser player in lovett
losing ball for nothing to a major rival
can only leave it all in the past and move on.
good luck to ball - deserves his second chance and has reinvigorated his career.

[Teflon]

Teflon, are you seriosly suggesting the trade was handled well??

Or

Are you saying Luke made a poor decision, or he is hopeless, what are you saying??

History tends to suggest we were the big losers.....ball finished 5th in a premiership b&f last year, this year will finish 4th and have a second medal..

Good on him, and good on collingwood for giving him the go he deserved...he paid back the faith, and then some....most pundits would suggest he and collingwood were the big winners...most stk fans try to deny this, to make themselves feel better or paint a bad picture of ball, whatever softens the blow i suppose....

As for 'big bad lyon'........ he and his list management team made a strong call, hindsight says it was an error....thats a part of the reason that the whole recruiting team were sacked.....the 2009 draft period was as good as an example of poor management as you could ever wish to see.....

See...there it is again...

Who talked about winners and losers in the trade - Ive not met 1 saints fan that suggests we were the winner????

But again, you paint the whole scenario as if it was solely played on St Kilda's terms with St Kilda driving ALL the decisions and ignore the FACTS that Luke Ball and Collingwood also drove majority of these decisions by painting St Kilda into a corner through the negotiations. Again to you its ALL Lyons fault. Sure the club took a stand.....and lost...but the principle was right - the guy wanted more cash and got it.

Once again lets be clear Ball WAS a required player. He'd been advised this by coach and players at St Kilda....but on $600k a season?

Are you suggesting with his output at the time he was worth $600k? Does anyone truly believe this guy is anywhere near L Hayes??

What I AM saying is Ross Lyon and St Kilda arent blameless in the Ball saga...but they aint the sole reason for that outcome.


As for those lauding Balls new found abilities (mostly trolling Pie fans) - sorry I dotn buy it. Sure he's contributing in a VERY GOOD SIDE.....he did that at St Kilda when we were also BUT I still see the same speed/lack of acceleration and the same guy who can't kick over a jam tin. Whoever said this guy was Hodge/Judd level had hold of their groins.

What we are seeing from Ball now is a player fit into a role at a side that really needs him so the results are magnified.

Collingwood dont have L Hayes..(thank god for us).

[Teflon]

can only speculate as to why he left - although money offered from the pies obviously wasn't a factor.

This HAS to be sarcasm....surely.

[St Ick]

Teflon, are you seriosly suggesting the trade was handled well??

Or

Are you saying Luke made a poor decision, or he is hopeless, what are you saying??

History tends to suggest we were the big losers.....ball finished 5th in a premiership b&f last year, this year will finish 4th and have a second medal..

Good on him, and good on collingwood for giving him the go he deserved...he paid back the faith, and then some....most pundits would suggest he and collingwood were the big winners...most stk fans try to deny this, to make themselves feel better or paint a bad picture of ball, whatever softens the blow i suppose....

As for 'big bad lyon'........ he and his list management team made a strong call, hindsight says it was an error....thats a part of the reason that the whole recruiting team were sacked.....the 2009 draft period was as good as an example of poor management as you could ever wish to see.....

Not that I can speak for him, but I'm guessing he was referring to the fact Ball f'd St Kilda over. Too many people believe the media dribble story that Ball was stuffed around by the Saints. His form was questioned, he sooked it up, he left for more money and guaranteed time on the field.

That was bad enough, but to decide he wanted to leave (or go public about leaving) the day AFTER the Lovett trade was completed completely dug the knife into the back of every St Kilda person because it meant we didn't have anything to play with in the trade period.

Hindsight is wonderful, but I very much doubt we would have traded our only piece of bargaining power in pick 16 or whatever it was if we knew Ball wanted out.

I take offence to anyone saying Ball is a top bloke and he did nothing wrong during that period. If you remember, he even sooked it up when he stood down as captain because he said he was too young and it was too much pressure.

I'm over the issue of LB leaving, but what really pi$$es me off is the notion, even by Saints supporters that we either did the wrong thing or are to blame for LB leaving.

[desertsaint]

can only speculate as to why he left - although money offered from the pies obviously wasn't a factor.

This HAS to be sarcasm....surely.

no -basically on the same pay over the 3 years as we offered. anyone not blind with rage or sadness could see the front loaded contract was purely to get him through the draft.

money offered from us was a factor - as we offered close to a 50% paycut - and with that came the associated loss in standing in the team. i would've done the same - sought a fresh start elsewhere.

[BigMart]

They took the offer off the table......from there they made the decision before the trade offers.....that he had to go, so we needed to find compensation.....but also lost bargaining power, because we had signalled we did not want his services...

Luke did knock back the 50% pay cut, as many would.......he left for the reasons any player leaves a club...More money, more opportunity, lost faith of the coaches....

[ozrulestrace]

I know I'm only new to this site, but what is this love affair people seem to have with Luke Ball?

Honestly, he is a filth player. Has been for a year and a half now.

We should forget about him and worry about our own players!

Rant Over.

I totally agree, he's gone, he sold his soul and there will be a day hwhen he pays for it..

In the meantime, has anyone else noticed how mnay times a week he pops up in the Herald Sun sports section especiall nany photographic representation of CFC players? Over the past few monhts it's been at least once, twice a week.

Considering he's only been there for 12 months, it is my hope that the other players of the CFC start to get a little jealous and start sniping behind his back.

Also raises question as to the role of Mike Sheahan in convincing him to sign up with the CFC. eg "Luke sign with them and I promise that if you turn up to the opening of an envelope and I'll guarantee your photo will appear in our quality newspaper, no matter how bad your haircut is...."