Would you rather 8 years of service from a quality big-bodied defender (a position we are sorely lacking in), or 3 years from an unreliable, moronic full-forward that brings bad attention to the club?maverick wrote:What about Goose for Fev?
Our Next Full Forward
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- mad saint guy
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Can't see Fev (who is contracted next year) leaving Carlton except if someone is stupid enough to pay Carlton way more than he is worth and given Carlton will have plenty of picks they will be looking for players (and Goose would not be enough for a trade)
Given that the full forward role will need to be picked up within the existing list. Also as Gardiner and Hamill can't be relied to be on the field at all next yearplanning has to assume they are not going to be there.
This means IMO Kosi can't be considered for the role in 07 (unless we pick up another ruck propsect). Kosi also plays his best footy playing on the ruck and moving forward.
Unfortunately IMO this means that I think both Brooks and Watts will be retained on the list to fight out for the role however I don't think for different reasons either of them are up to the job and I suspect both will be delisted in 08.
Given that the full forward role will need to be picked up within the existing list. Also as Gardiner and Hamill can't be relied to be on the field at all next yearplanning has to assume they are not going to be there.
This means IMO Kosi can't be considered for the role in 07 (unless we pick up another ruck propsect). Kosi also plays his best footy playing on the ruck and moving forward.
Unfortunately IMO this means that I think both Brooks and Watts will be retained on the list to fight out for the role however I don't think for different reasons either of them are up to the job and I suspect both will be delisted in 08.
- evertonfc
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Great thread - such an important issue, because it brings up another big issue as well.
Should we go for Fev? Absolutely, he'd be sensational. But the asking price would be a first and second round pick. We couldn't match what other clubs would be willing to pay. Make no mistakes, the Bulldogs will offer a big, big offer to get him on their books - probably their first pick + McMahon. Can we match that? Probably not.
I believe Justin Koschitzke is actually not showing his full worth to us in the ruck. He's a good ruckman, maybe even just handy, but a potentially brilliant full-forward.
And let me back that up by saying he's not just full of potential there, he's actually done it quite a few times now. The way he carved up Glass at Subiaco was proof that he's the man.
However, this means we simply have to recruit a top-notch ruckman.
Jamie Charman is my top pick. He'd be great and could go slightly below his trade value. 26 and out of contract - well, if our second pick is 24 or so, it could be enough. I'm loathe to trade picks, but he'd be a great get.
I wouldn't want to trade second rounder for Jolly - and I doubt our third round pick (40-ish) would get him.
I believe, however, that Fergus Watts simply must make the grade next year. After two years on our list, he's not done enough - probably through lack of opportunity - and he will get ample chances next year through injuries to Riewoldt/Kosi/Maguire.
At this stage, he's not first choice in our starting 22. However, he's now on the fringe, like it or not. Let's hope he wants to succeed as much as we need him too.
If we do the right things at trade week, I'm confident we can soften the blow of Gehrig leaving, and possibly turn it into a positive.
Should we go for Fev? Absolutely, he'd be sensational. But the asking price would be a first and second round pick. We couldn't match what other clubs would be willing to pay. Make no mistakes, the Bulldogs will offer a big, big offer to get him on their books - probably their first pick + McMahon. Can we match that? Probably not.
I believe Justin Koschitzke is actually not showing his full worth to us in the ruck. He's a good ruckman, maybe even just handy, but a potentially brilliant full-forward.
And let me back that up by saying he's not just full of potential there, he's actually done it quite a few times now. The way he carved up Glass at Subiaco was proof that he's the man.
However, this means we simply have to recruit a top-notch ruckman.
Jamie Charman is my top pick. He'd be great and could go slightly below his trade value. 26 and out of contract - well, if our second pick is 24 or so, it could be enough. I'm loathe to trade picks, but he'd be a great get.
I wouldn't want to trade second rounder for Jolly - and I doubt our third round pick (40-ish) would get him.
I believe, however, that Fergus Watts simply must make the grade next year. After two years on our list, he's not done enough - probably through lack of opportunity - and he will get ample chances next year through injuries to Riewoldt/Kosi/Maguire.
At this stage, he's not first choice in our starting 22. However, he's now on the fringe, like it or not. Let's hope he wants to succeed as much as we need him too.
If we do the right things at trade week, I'm confident we can soften the blow of Gehrig leaving, and possibly turn it into a positive.
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exactly. he's potentially a very dangerous match-winner for us there.evertonfc wrote:I believe Justin Koschitzke is actually not showing his full worth to us in the ruck. He's a good ruckman, maybe even just handy, but a potentially brilliant full-forward.
there is no-one better qualified. find another ruckman
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no. goose is better than what his performances since his comeback from a broken leg suggest. it's a trade that would come back to haunt us imomaverick wrote:What about Goose for Fev?
anyhow, kosi is potentially a better full-forward than fev.
more explosive and doesn't rely on pinpoint disposal because of his ability to take pack marks. he's more like a lockett than a dunstall.
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The Ferg Berger, big Watts down there at FF will go very nicely. Ideally I think Kosi would be a better Full Forward, but we all know the ruck situation. If there was a god, the team would go like this
1st Ruck: Gardiner
2nd Ruck: Kosi
Fullforward: Watts
CHF: Roo
Both Kosi and Gardiner can roatate forward, nick can go to a wing, and we can have 3 talls going etc etc.
1st Ruck: Gardiner
2nd Ruck: Kosi
Fullforward: Watts
CHF: Roo
Both Kosi and Gardiner can roatate forward, nick can go to a wing, and we can have 3 talls going etc etc.
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- The_Dud
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u r joking, right....?Mcghee wrote:I think getting Fev would be the greatest thing for us. Imagine having Roey Kosi and Fev, and as a bonus he can actually kick straight where our forwards having being shocking this year. I know he has signed with the Blues but Fev is a dead eye and a character and our game needs the characters like Gehrig, Fev and Richo, it was a sad day yesterday losing one of the best characters in footy...
Sob sob
Fev has a worse scoring accuracy that Riewoldt, Gehrig and Kosi
possibly the dumbest statement of the year......
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hey everyone i am eppo's daughter i just want to say that Frasier you will be well remembered you brang many good things to the STkilda football club your a champion! im so sad to have you go... Im a HUGE fan of the Saints and Frasier was DEFANATELY one of my fav players your a champion Frasier I LOVE YOU! Your the human gun Frasier you made Saints the way they are now Good luck!
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I'd rather 8 years of good service over 3 years of very good service, but I am not sure we will get good service from Goose, am very worried he is no longer up to it.mad saint guy wrote:Would you rather 8 years of service from a quality big-bodied defender (a position we are sorely lacking in), or 3 years from an unreliable, moronic full-forward that brings bad attention to the club?maverick wrote:What about Goose for Fev?
WOuld love to be wrong.
Aaron Hamill will get the first crack IMO.....with Kosi next to him.....and Gardiner in the ruck.....
if Gardiner does not crack it........Brooks (who will be delisted) should be in reserve....
If Hamill does not make it back......F.Watts....
IMO
Clarke, Thompson, Gehrig, Voss, Sweeney, Raymond, Brroks are gone (Brooks a mistake)
McQualter, Gwilt and Ferg on thin ice
if Gardiner does not crack it........Brooks (who will be delisted) should be in reserve....
If Hamill does not make it back......F.Watts....
IMO
Clarke, Thompson, Gehrig, Voss, Sweeney, Raymond, Brroks are gone (Brooks a mistake)
McQualter, Gwilt and Ferg on thin ice
- saintsRrising
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Firstly Fev is not going to be traded to anyne. ratten is now the coach and wants him and will keep him..so end of story there.
Watts BIGGEST problem.......is that we have recruited him too late. SLOW moving big forwards CAN now be quite a liabilty if a GOOD opposition rebounds quickly.
Even Kosi can be exposed this way.... Watts is going to have to show that he can apply defensive pressure.
It is not enough to be a TARGET any more.
For Watts the FACT that Kosi will be in the 22 is a drawback.....for as forwards they would play similar roles.
OWTS point on Allen is agood one....BUT he is young.....and raw....
Brooks is actually a better fit than Watts...but is lazy and has not applied himself as much as he coud......and i think that this quite rightly has put him on the oute with his coaches past and present. He has lacked the HUNGER....and I think that this is why PA gave him the fick. Will the Gtrain having retired cause hi to lift???? It may be too late.
Hamill...if fit...I want as the third forward which wasa major are of lack in 2008. I think that if Hamill drew the best defender in 2008 I think he would struggle.
So no Gardi....watts is likely to get the gig.
With Gardi...it looks like it will be Kosi....
However if both scenarios I think it is vital that Roo rotates through FF as well....to share the load with them.
Watts BIGGEST problem.......is that we have recruited him too late. SLOW moving big forwards CAN now be quite a liabilty if a GOOD opposition rebounds quickly.
Even Kosi can be exposed this way.... Watts is going to have to show that he can apply defensive pressure.
It is not enough to be a TARGET any more.
For Watts the FACT that Kosi will be in the 22 is a drawback.....for as forwards they would play similar roles.
OWTS point on Allen is agood one....BUT he is young.....and raw....
Brooks is actually a better fit than Watts...but is lazy and has not applied himself as much as he coud......and i think that this quite rightly has put him on the oute with his coaches past and present. He has lacked the HUNGER....and I think that this is why PA gave him the fick. Will the Gtrain having retired cause hi to lift???? It may be too late.
Hamill...if fit...I want as the third forward which wasa major are of lack in 2008. I think that if Hamill drew the best defender in 2008 I think he would struggle.
So no Gardi....watts is likely to get the gig.
With Gardi...it looks like it will be Kosi....
However if both scenarios I think it is vital that Roo rotates through FF as well....to share the load with them.
Flying the World in comfort thanks to FF Points....
bigcarl wrote:fevola is a d*ckhead and just what this club doesn't need.
you got that right...anyway butters stated on the radio that the feeling around the club is that it has to recruit youth ...not f-wits......
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I suspect Port gave him the flick because he was surplus and we made them an incredibly generous offersaintsRrising wrote:Brooks is actually a better fit than Watts...but is lazy and has not applied himself as much as he coud......and i think that this quite rightly has put him on the oute with his coaches past and present. He has lacked the HUNGER....and I think that this is why PA gave him the fick. Will the Gtrain having retired cause hi to lift???? It may be too late.
- St. Luke
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I know he hasn't got the body of a full forward yet, but Sam Gilbert is tall, fast and accurate. It would only take for him to make a good lead which wouldn't be too hard considering his pace....thoughts anyone??
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I mentioned Gilbert earlier as a left field option. He's got the pace on the lead, but would struggle to out mark the key defenders in a one-on-one contest. If we did play Gilbert from the goal square he'd have to be a different kind of full forward. Hawthorn went left field for a while with Mark Williams and that worked. However I can't see Gilbert as a serious option.
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yeah. he's the type of player who can play virtually anywhere. tall quick and strong. in the past couple of weeks he's been mentioned as a possible full-back, full-forward, winger or on-baller. i reckon he could do any of the above.St. Luke wrote:I know he hasn't got the body of a full forward yet, but Sam Gilbert is tall, fast and accurate. It would only take for him to make a good lead which wouldn't be too hard considering his pace....thoughts anyone??
he reminds me of a younger gehrig, in fact. an awkward proposition for any opponent
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Gilbert at FF would fail to fully exploit one of his greatest assests....his tackling.
It would add to our forward pressure though.....
I am currently thinking of Gilbert as our next likely FB to replace Max....
Sam and Mguire do not have the pace to handle fast leading FFs.
Gilbert at FB could provide pleanty of Dash..a bit like the David Dench (North Melbourne) of old.
It would add to our forward pressure though.....
I am currently thinking of Gilbert as our next likely FB to replace Max....
Sam and Mguire do not have the pace to handle fast leading FFs.
Gilbert at FB could provide pleanty of Dash..a bit like the David Dench (North Melbourne) of old.
Flying the World in comfort thanks to FF Points....
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