Age guide to this years draft.

[B.M]

He would have an opponent rather than zoning off

He hasn’t got a big tank so repeat efforts, defensive pressure and double and triple leads and presenting would not be his thing.

Playing forward is a different beast and far harder than playing back.

Battle will find it tougher this season

[SaintPav]

Carlile's .....
IMO he is not a great forward. .....just doesn't suit him. ..

I just have to ask, from afar, seeing only a handful of games....

1) reads the play well...positioning natural
2) great physicality
3) marking
4) kicking

Speaking from my unique experience at the U15 "C" team at high school, what rules him out in your opinion, other than the oft stated claim he hated playing up forward. I remember Essendon had a little conundrum about it too.

I think you might get a few arguments on no 2.

[SaintPav]

He would have an opponent rather than zoning off

He hasn’t got a big tank so repeat efforts, defensive pressure and double and triple leads and presenting would not be his thing.

Playing forward is a different beast and far harder than playing back.

Battle will find it tougher this season

I think long term Battle is better played as a back. He was and I hate to use this word, a revelation.

Should have kept Bruce and let Jake go IMO.

[shanegrambeau]

He would have an opponent rather than zoning off

He hasn’t got a big tank so repeat efforts, defensive pressure and double and triple leads and presenting would not be his thing.

Playing forward is a different beast and far harder than playing back.

Battle will find it tougher this season

Now is that is interesting. Surely lack of second and third efforts are more of a liability for a defender rather than a power forward...? But I'm not arguing with you about that..but curious.
So you think Battle will find it tough with a close checking defender? What if Battle and Carlisle were both up forward? Interesting dilemma for opposition coach?

[freely]

Has Carlisle ever kicked a goal for us? Can't be many cos I can only remember a couple of shanks. He can't be arsed. The only place you can play when you can't be arsed is drifting about with no accountability across half back. So I expect that's where he'll play. Agree meanwhile that he's a great reader of the ball, etc., etc. Just he'd rather be reading it on a sofa with his feet up.

[shanegrambeau]

I found this bit written about him on the eve of his departure, kinda interesting,

From The Roar circa 2015.
https://www.theroar.com.au/2015/10/14/j ... hat-gives/

But it never really got going to be. 2014 Joe Daniher played like a newborn giraffe just finding its feet, and while his marking ability commanded a match-up early in the season, more often than not the opponent could assign any defender they pleased such was his ability to get tangled up. It meant that Carlisle was the focal point, and copped the number one tall defender week in, week out. Teams with a penchant for rolling off would have a field day on the Bombers.

The experiment continued throughout the year, and paid off handsomely on a couple of occasions. Carlisle put up a video game-like stats in Round 18, 2014, with eight goals, seven tackles, 12 marks (of which five were contested and 10 were inside 50) and 19 disposals; a game which followed a 26-disposal, four-goal effort the week before.

But in many ways, it was the worst thing that could have happened, because it was seen by most as proof that Thompson is, in fact, an evil genius, and Carlisle was playing in his rightful position.

Under the reinstalled Hird, Carlisle continued to play forward of the ball in 2015, but never reached the heights of Round 17 and 18 from the previous year. After injuring his ankle in Round 13, Carlisle came back and played as a defender, a role which persisted following Hird’s self-removal and the installation of backline coach Matthew Egan as interim.

The tumult has been with him for almost all of his AFL life. Is it any wonder Carlisle is a little jaded and wants a fresh start? He was so excited about the prospect of change that he joined the tyre fire that is the AFL’s trade radio show to nominate St Kilda as his preferred destination.





When he’s in peak form, Carlisle is excellent at reading the play, a skill useful as a key forward, sure, but doubly so down back. His size and strength make him an obvious match-up on the 400-pound gorilla types populating the forward lines of those around the top of the ladder, while his straight line speed means he can match up on the more nimble tall forwards when required.

His agility-for-height ratio is what gets everyone so excited. A performance against Sydney in 2013 shows he’s an underrated threat with the ground ball, too, with long, rangy arms capable of wrapping up all manner of opponents.

In short, he’s made to be a defender.

At just 24 years of age, Carlisle isn’t quite at his peak from an AFL perspective, and is seeking to join a list at a similar stage of development. More than half of St Kilda’s playing list are 24 or younger, and there’s an emerging core group of players coalescing around the 24-27 years of age bracket in the next two years.

The Saints have just five players aged over 30 and one that’s 29, and for three of them the end is likely nigh this year or next. A fourth, current captain Nick Reiwoldt, likely has a golden ticket down at Seaford, but a degenerative knee complaint is one tweak away from a bad ending.

Two of those older players are the aforementioned key-defender-by-defaults in Dempster and Fisher. The spare parts tall defensive set has served the Saints okay… well, maybe not, but it’s served them… and Carlisle has come into the picture at exactly the right time.

So what’s he worth?



The trade week hot takes are a nuisance and a distraction at this time of year. So let’s take our time with this one.

........

Carlisle has shown at times that he can join that class behind the ball, and while he’s not there yet, that’s not of his making. He’ll be 24 coming into the 2016 season, and with just 85 games on the odometer he has so much football ahead of him.

Carlisle is blue ribbon material, even if a large part of his appeal is what could be, rather than what is right now. And the Saints have one absolutely glaring omission on their list: key defender. Dynamite.

As for the precise value of things? This is more art than science, and requires a keen sense of judgement from both sides. As my favourite ESPN sports analyst likes to say: ‘you never get what you deserve, only what you have the leverage to negotiate’. That couldn’t be a more true reflection of this particular situation if we tried.

The Saints currently have pick five in this year’s national draft, and unless Essendon offer Brisbane’s Matthew Leuenberger – one of the most exciting ruckmen in the competition according to well placed sources – a crazy contract, that’s where the pick will stay. St Kilda aren’t quite ready to part with that pick, while Carlisle’s former team, Essendon, will accept nothing less.

In business, we call that posturing. In the end, neither side is right when it comes to a negotiation like this, when there is so much uncertainty on both sides. The fifth pick in the draft has plenty of utility and upside (a 200-game player, or even a 300-gamer), but it’s only as good as the list management team that holds it.

Meanwhile, a key position player that’s just about to enter prime age is largely a known quantity; but Carlisle isn’t an ordinary player, because he’s been tossed around both ends of the ground in his relatively short career.

......
Carlisle is one piece, albeit a central one, in St Kilda’s rapidly completing playing list puzzle. He’s not the last one, but once he’s in place the Saints’ finals picture will begin to take shape.
......ends here....

Seems Bomber wanted him up forward, he showed some promise, got injured and rarely ventured back...

Maybe it speaks more about our defensive weakness than anything about his so called lack of motivation?

[silverhalo]

He would have an opponent rather than zoning off

He hasn’t got a big tank so repeat efforts, defensive pressure and double and triple leads and presenting would not be his thing.

Playing forward is a different beast and far harder than playing back.

Battle will find it tougher this season

I think long term Battle is better played as a back. He was and I hate to use this word, a revelation.

Should have kept Bruce and let Jake go IMO.

Josh was definitely a revelation down back but I think it's a waste not to play him forward as he doesn't need many opportunities to hurt the opposition given that he's such an accurate kick. Our conversion rate has been pretty ordinary the last couple of years so having Battle up forward will definitely help with that.