Is our Bottom Six that bad?
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- saintsRrising
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Is our Bottom Six that bad?
St Kilda
Backs: Jason Gram / Jason Blake / Sam Gilbert
Half Backs: Steven Baker / Sam Fisher / James Gwilt
Centreline: Brendon Goddard / Nick Dal Santo / Farren Ray
Half Forwards: Andrew McQualter / Justin Koschitzke / Leigh Montagna
Forwards:Brett Peake / Nick Riewoldt / Stephen Milne
Followers: Michael Gardiner / Lenny Hayes / Clint Jones
Interchange: Ben McEvoy / Zac Dawson / Adam Schneider / Jarryn Geary
Looking at the team for our final against the Cats, I don't think our bottom six is as bad as the media paints it to be?
B: Andrew Mackie - Matthew Scarlett - Darren Milburn
HB: Corey Enright - Harry Taylor - James Kelly
C: Cameron Ling - Jimmy Bartel - Joel Corey
HF: Paul Chapman - Tom Hawkins - Mathew Stokes
F: Steve Johnson - Cameron Mooney - Travis Varcoe
Foll: Brad Ottens - Joel Selwood - Gary Ablett
Int : Tom Lonergan, Josh Hunt, David Wojcinski, Mark Blake
The Cats certainly bat deeper though.
Thoughts?
Backs: Jason Gram / Jason Blake / Sam Gilbert
Half Backs: Steven Baker / Sam Fisher / James Gwilt
Centreline: Brendon Goddard / Nick Dal Santo / Farren Ray
Half Forwards: Andrew McQualter / Justin Koschitzke / Leigh Montagna
Forwards:Brett Peake / Nick Riewoldt / Stephen Milne
Followers: Michael Gardiner / Lenny Hayes / Clint Jones
Interchange: Ben McEvoy / Zac Dawson / Adam Schneider / Jarryn Geary
Looking at the team for our final against the Cats, I don't think our bottom six is as bad as the media paints it to be?
B: Andrew Mackie - Matthew Scarlett - Darren Milburn
HB: Corey Enright - Harry Taylor - James Kelly
C: Cameron Ling - Jimmy Bartel - Joel Corey
HF: Paul Chapman - Tom Hawkins - Mathew Stokes
F: Steve Johnson - Cameron Mooney - Travis Varcoe
Foll: Brad Ottens - Joel Selwood - Gary Ablett
Int : Tom Lonergan, Josh Hunt, David Wojcinski, Mark Blake
The Cats certainly bat deeper though.
Thoughts?
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- kosifantutti23
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Yes and 3 Cats...kosifantutti23 wrote:Our bottom six is so good there's only five of them.
ie You have to choose the extra one...and which three of the Cat's. Sorry if that caused confusion and distracted from my question.
I just highlighted the less contentious ones.
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Re: Is our Bottom Six that bad?
Bottom 6s in order from best to worst as I see it:
Ottens
Stokes
Wojcinski
Hawkins
Blake
Lonergan
Kosi
Peake
McEvoy
McQualter
Dawson
Geary
Ottens
Stokes
Wojcinski
Hawkins
Blake
Lonergan
Kosi
Peake
McEvoy
McQualter
Dawson
Geary
bottom sixes:
McEvoy, Baker, Peake, Dawson, Geary, McQualter
Mooney, Stokes, Wojcinski, Blake, Lonergan, Hawkins
geelong bottom six is better, though not by a huge amount.
top sixes:
Riewoldt, Hayes, Goddard, Dal Santo, Montagna, S Fisher
Ablett, Chapman, Selwood, Bartel, Scarlett, Johnson
saints top six is better, though not by a huge amount.
so the game's decided in the middle 10:
Gilbert, Jones, Schneider, Gram, Milne, Gwilt, Gardiner, Ray, Koschitzke, Blake
Enright, Kelly, Corey, Ling, Taylor, Ottens, Mackie, Hunt, Varcoe, Milburn
geelong's middle 10 is more consistently good. saints middle 10 has more potential.
if players like gwilt, gardy, kosi, gram have stormers then we're very close to a win. on the other hand, if kelly, taylor, ottens, mackie, hunt, varcoe are allowed to play their normal games, and be on the upward side of decent as they usually are, then we've got problems.
McEvoy, Baker, Peake, Dawson, Geary, McQualter
Mooney, Stokes, Wojcinski, Blake, Lonergan, Hawkins
geelong bottom six is better, though not by a huge amount.
top sixes:
Riewoldt, Hayes, Goddard, Dal Santo, Montagna, S Fisher
Ablett, Chapman, Selwood, Bartel, Scarlett, Johnson
saints top six is better, though not by a huge amount.
so the game's decided in the middle 10:
Gilbert, Jones, Schneider, Gram, Milne, Gwilt, Gardiner, Ray, Koschitzke, Blake
Enright, Kelly, Corey, Ling, Taylor, Ottens, Mackie, Hunt, Varcoe, Milburn
geelong's middle 10 is more consistently good. saints middle 10 has more potential.
if players like gwilt, gardy, kosi, gram have stormers then we're very close to a win. on the other hand, if kelly, taylor, ottens, mackie, hunt, varcoe are allowed to play their normal games, and be on the upward side of decent as they usually are, then we've got problems.
If we go by pure talent and skill our bottom 6 is not flash. Which is why Lyon and his game plan has got so much out of the list. It's about people playing a team game not everyone doing there own thing.
Not sure I wopuld rate Dawson in our bottom 6. These days full back is a very hard spot to play. Dawson has not been as good as last year but remember he is still young and leraning the game. How many second year players are a bit flat compared to there first full season?
Not sure I wopuld rate Dawson in our bottom 6. These days full back is a very hard spot to play. Dawson has not been as good as last year but remember he is still young and leraning the game. How many second year players are a bit flat compared to there first full season?
GET UP AND ABOUT SAINTERS!
Kosi, Peake, Geray, Mini, Ben and Blake.bergholt wrote:i agree with your arguments, but there have to be six players in your bottom six - who are yours, then?Saint Pup wrote:Not sure I wopuld rate Dawson in our bottom 6.
Put Blake in there before Dawson as he is 3-4th tall back and a lot of the time doesn't take a few forward. Dawson takes the Full Forward every game he plays.
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- InkerSaint
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Tonight's result will have bugger all to do with matchups and almost everything to do with roles and structures.
The Saints game plan is all about maximising the talents of our players and minimising their weaknesses. When executed by a fit and firing team there are none who can beat it.
Forget about the Cats - individually, that is. Do you back the Saints to be fit and firing? That is the question.
I believe the team is about as fit as they're ever likely to be, and while there are queries about whether they are firing, if there was ever a time to make a statement it is tonight - or bust.
With the stakes at play this September, tonight's game may well be career-defining for the majority of our list. Geelong may wane but there will only be more challengers next year. Our window is NOW.
Very very nervous - not because I think we'll lose - but because so much is on the line.
The Saints game plan is all about maximising the talents of our players and minimising their weaknesses. When executed by a fit and firing team there are none who can beat it.
Forget about the Cats - individually, that is. Do you back the Saints to be fit and firing? That is the question.
I believe the team is about as fit as they're ever likely to be, and while there are queries about whether they are firing, if there was ever a time to make a statement it is tonight - or bust.
With the stakes at play this September, tonight's game may well be career-defining for the majority of our list. Geelong may wane but there will only be more challengers next year. Our window is NOW.
Very very nervous - not because I think we'll lose - but because so much is on the line.
"... You want to pose a threat to the opposition in as many ways as you can, both defensively and offensively. We've got a responsibility to explore all those possibilities - and we will."
- saintsRrising
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- samoht
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- saintsRrising
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Having essentially watched the game over and over and over since Fri night it is glaringly obvious to me that we beat the Cats by being a more even side for longer. Our so called lessers - Peake, Mini (had a real impact early on - to say oterwise is disingenuous), Eddy, Ray, Dawson etc were all absolutely busting their arses when we were on for the first two and a half qrs. Conversely guys like Hawkins, Milburn, Hunt, Stokes, Ottens, Blake, Wojinski...All outclassed and well beaten...saintsRrising wrote:Well post Cats's game I think our "bottom" players compared very favourably with the Cats.
Indeed Peake played a blinder!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Blake, Hawkins and Hunt were all very ordinary.
Maybe indicative of a bit of shift in dynamics at the top? Hope so.
"The inches we need are everywhere around us. They're in every break in the game. Every minute, every second. On this team we fight for that inch. On this team we tear ourselves and everyone around us to pieces for that inch. We claw with our fingernails for that inch. Because we know when we add up all those inches that's gonna make the f***in' difference between winning and losing! Between living and dying!'