At the risk of starting a war....GT on Footy Class..

[bigred]

Grant "hindsight" Thomas.

What a load of self important claptrap.

[plugger66]

Grant "hindsight" Thomas.

What a load of self important claptrap.

What do you think of the recruitment of Michael Gardiner?

[SainterK]

I don't think he wanted to say anything at all, seemed uncomfortable the entire time the focus was on St Kilda.

[bob__71]

I don't think he wanted to say anything at all, seemed uncomfortable the entire time the focus was on St Kilda.

Sad he has to whore himself to the media. I once thought he was a man of integrity. Now he just seems bitter, bitter and willing to sell his bitterness for the money a comentary job brings.

I await in anticipation the babbling about kids to feed and Brighton mansion to pay mortgage on.

[St DAC]

[What do you think of the recruitment of Michael Gardiner?

Initially, it was one of those suspect deals; could work out, but might not.

As it's turned out, he's been on the list 3 years, has had one pretty good year, and a couple dogged with injury.

Probably a 60/40 trade in our favour; in hindsight of course.

If trades didn't have an element of risk they'd be called certainties ...

[saintsRrising]

I don't think he wanted to say anything at all, seemed uncomfortable the entire time the focus was on St Kilda.

I doubt that..on both counts.

His blog basically made the same points not long ago...

Besides TV Shows always do run throughts (rehearsals prior)...

PS: I have no problem with his media role at all...but lets not pretend that he is not as happy as pig in mud doing it! GT has sought to build a career in the media post-Saints..and good luck to him as we all have to earn a $ somehow.

[SainterK]

I don't think he wanted to say anything at all, seemed uncomfortable the entire time the focus was on St Kilda.

I doubt that..on both counts.

His blog basically made the same points not long ago...

Besides TV Shows always do run throughts (rehearsals prior)...

PS: I have no problem with his media role at all...but lets not pretend that he is not as happy as pig in mud doing it! GT has sought to build a career in the media post-Saints..and good luck to him as we all have to earn a $ somehow.

Sure, he was always going to bring up the Lovett trade, of that I have no doubt. However I still think by his body language, that he was provoked by Hutchy into talking more emotively about Luke and Nick than he would of liked, IMO of course.

[bigred]

What do you think of the recruitment of Michael Gardiner?

I thought it was a calculated risk.
Cost us nothing in terms of draft/Salary.
He WAS on his last chance and he knew it.
Personally I honestly believed that MG was going to be our wildcard.

[older saint]

As much as he hates to say it StKilda has achieved more under RL than GT and GT's deficiencies as a coach have been shown up in the last 2 seasons and it bugs him.

He is in the media to comment and make sensational type comments. He talked about Ball and not the whole storybeing told and players being fed lines etc, so what he is saying then is : a) he spoke to Luke Ball and RL and therefore got both sides of the story - Unlikely and b) his lovechild Nick Riewoldt is nothing more than a patsy mouth piece for the club.

He has placed Ball's word over that of Roo and then tried to soften it by saying players were fed a line to say.

His inability under pressure to make good decisions cost us at least one GF (2005) and it is also shown in the media.

He is quickly becoming a modern version of Patrick Smith, ironic really

He is in the media and is paid by them to make comment. Dont like it dont listen to him. Usually much more positive things said by him the negative.

Two questions. Was our recruiting good this year and secondly what the hell did GT do wrong under pressure that cost us a flag even though we didnt even play in the GF?

In answer to your questions:
1. I did not talk anywhere about our recruiting so not sure of hte relevance here. I made comment about his comments on Ball and the 1 sided nature of them and the contradictory way he then accused StKilda of only giving one side of the story. For what it is worth without Hindsight i thought Lovett was worth the risk - obviously not and good ridence to bad rubbish. Ball wanted to go and you could argue that salary cap space is of more value than Tyson Goldstien and an unknown draft pick.

Question 2:Never said cost a flag, i said cost GF ( appearance). Watch the way Sydney destroyed us in the last quarter and the lack of changes made , smashed in the ruck and was like adear in the headlights. no plan B all attack and no defence, no tempo footy.

I like the show so am stuck watching him but really i must miss the bits where he is positive. For the record probably coached as well has he could it is just his best was not good enough at the crucial times IMO.

[meher baba]

It's nice to see some of the posters who have been inclined to bag GT in the past trying to be a little bit fair about this.

GT expressed his doubts about recruiting Lovett well before the Xmas Eve incident. He has been proven right to an extent that I'm sure embarasses him to some extent (as a 100% loyal Saints man, which he genuinely is). It's not always the easiest position in the world being able to say "I told you so" when something you recommended against goes terribly, hopelessly wrong.

Given all that, I think he handled himself with a fair bit of dignity last night about this.

Re Ball: GT's views are well-known. He is not an objective source of comment about the matter and he would do well to keep quiet.

More generally re the recruiting in GT's era, it remains wildly underrated by posters on here. When you look at the development of the list as a whole over the 2001-05 period, I think JB, BW, GT and others did a pretty reasonable job. Happy to explain why, but we've been over this ground many times in the past.

[degruch]

The off-season trading has only been bad in hindsight. I was thrilled to pick up Lovett initially and, had Ball gone to Richmond, we'd all be laughing. Kudos to the club for not putting up with Collingwood's crap...karma will get them.

Hey, we could have picked up Scully with pick #1, then he does a knee at ttraining and never plays again...would that be crap recruiting too?

I'm not sure that the two examples are like for like. I don't think any coach would be blamed for a recruit doing a knee (although I did read Barry Brooks name somewhere recently).

I don't think anyone would deny that Lovett was the right type of on-field player to get when you think about his pace and skills. He had only been questioned on work-rate and character as far as I remember.

The Lovett situation is going to make it hard for us this year, though. We are now like one of those clubs who receive hand-outs and are have restricted salary caps (not having access to AL).

That's true, they're not the same, except that both selection involve luck...rather, lack thereof. A #1 pick can turn out bad, injury or not, if they're an unproven quantity you never really know how they're gonna turn out. In Lovett's case, we picked a proven performer with a bad attitude, and the result was poor. Was it the club's fault? Due dilligence? You make your own luck, and in this regard, the Saints looked to me to be taking the safest route. Turns out I was wrong. Some of GT's selections were speculative at best, some were good...but having made some bad selections, you'd have to say its dangerous to cast stones in glass houses.

So you think on a show where he is paid to comment he should have said nothing because he had made poor selections. I dont think that is going to work.

Yeh...that's exactly what I said. Get a little precious when our favourites get challenged, don't we?

[bigred]

No one expected Lovett to be this much of a douche.

[Saintsfan]

Well this seems like an absolute wankfest.

Where can I download Footy Classified over the internet? I don't mind the show and it would be great to view it weekly. Cheers

[BigMart]

The trade for Brooks I would have done in a heartbeat......AA U18 ruckman with a year in the system at Port, when we just lost the #1 Ruck....but never going to get a game with Tredrea/Lade/Brogan in the squad....ther was another aswell...

Rendell (a good operater) was the inside source on Brooks..

Brooks had great skills, moved well, was a top bloke but lacked intensity especially after his Knee Reco in a VFL game against Tassie....whilst coming down from being on someones shoulders

What about the Gram trade???? no good...

Remember that injuries can end or cripple a players career

Begley - second season
Brooks - first season
Penny - second season
Ferguson - continual
Watts - first season
Ball - 2006
Hamill - 2006
X.Clarke - continual
Kosi - 2002
Maguire - 2007

the list goes on.......

you cannot predict this when drafting/trading.....what you can understandis poor character

[saintsRrising]

The trade for Brooks I would have done in a heartbeat......AA U18 ruckman with a year in the system at Port, when we just lost the #1 Ruck....

Lost???

Odd word to describe the situation of a coach and player not getting on.

Brooks may have had talent but we paid over the odds for him with two first round picks.

Painting him to have perfect attitide as well is not what was said at the time. He was no bad boy but was not the mosy disciplined and foccussed player.

Port loved trading with the Saints.

[saintsRrising]

Anyone else see the irony in GT complaining about a coach not keeping a player (ignoring that he walked) who in GT's view you can build a premiership team around...

GT exited out one player that was big factor in one AFL team winning a flag...and may well help a second team too as well......the same one that GT now sees as a good fit ..


Lots of very good footballers have not been very nice guys. Ablett Snr, Locket, Carey etc etc....

As for recruiting character....GT had his fair share of misfits despite the regular tosh that he only recruited those of good character.

Main thing of GT's reign that was evident that he could not manage difficult personalities. Would not surprise that is one reason why he goes purple at the thought of Lovett because GT could not in general turn around "misfits". GTrain is about the sole exception, but GTrain was a loveable larrikin rather than an arsehole.

[degruch]

Remember that injuries can end or cripple a players career

Begley - second season
Brooks - first season
Penny - second season
Ferguson - continual
Watts - first season
Ball - 2006
Hamill - 2006
X.Clarke - continual
Kosi - 2002
Maguire - 2007

the list goes on.......

you cannot predict this when drafting/trading.....what you can understandis poor character

You missed Attard and Allen.

Poor character, yes, lucky we didn't recruit Gehrig or Gardiner.

[BigMart]

What was wrong with Gehrigs Character????

eccentric and laid back bloke, but his committment to footy, fitness should never be questioned....he played with some cruel injuries...

Gardner, whilst doing well in 2009.....did not finish in the top dozen in the B&F....he is no superstar....he has played 32 games out of 72 since we recruited him......cain ackland finished 8th in the B&F in 2005 and we all thought 'sugar' was awesome....until 2006...

[saintsRrising]

What was wrong with Gehrigs Character????

...

To many on this forum including me, nothing.

But GT's measure of character including being squeekie clean off-field.

Now you may have forgotten but GTrain had a colorful off-field collection...ie pissing in a bar (on a gal was it not???)....late night drinking with Lawrence the night he wrote of his car etc etc..

Now Gardiner is a good trainer too...and often played with injuries too....

[saintsRrising]

Gardner, whilst doing well in 2009.....did not finish in the top dozen in the B&F....he is no superstar.......

Not sure why that was relevant?

Are you implying that only talented "bad boys" should be kept?

While GT bristles with indignation on Ball he was not shy on showing Hall and Everitt the door.

Put both (- Dal) into the 2004/2005 teams and you may well have had a flag or two.

Interesting that the Cats in the end harnessed Mooney and Stevie J....."bad boys" harnessed rather than traded. Yes they tested the Cats, but in the end both were harnessed. They would probaly be minus 2 flags if they had shwon them the door.