At the risk of starting a war....GT on Footy Class..

[fingers]

GT on Footy Classified has a crack at Lyon's trading over the summer.

Talk about pot calling the kettle black.

I guess once you join the media all bets are off and your own history doesn't matter.

Let the games begin....

[jonesy]

Come on.... .. Trading two first rounders for Barry Brooks was genius like

[fingers]

Come on.... .. Trading two first rounders for Barry Brooks was genius like

yeah...my mistake

[rodgerfox]

I don't think he was comparing Lyon's trading to the trading that took place whilst he was coach.

I think he was offering an opinion on it's merit.


To be honest, that's what I'd expect anyone in the media to do.

[fingers]

I don't think he was comparing Lyon's trading to the trading that took place whilst he was coach.

I think he was offering an opinion on it's merit.


To be honest, that's what I'd expect anyone in the media to do.

Yeah logically I absolutely agree with. Just gave me the sh1ts

[BAM! (shhhh)]

Those who continue interpreting Thomas doing his job in the media by commenting on the Saints (an area he's got a fair amount of expertise) as Thomas saying "I could do better" only achieve to give themselves ulcers.

[Saints43]

Come on.... .. Trading two first rounders for Barry Brooks was genius like

One of the picks (7) was received for sending Everitt to Hawthorn which reportedly - at the time - freed up somewhere around 20% of our salary cap.

The other pick (31) was used on Joel Perry.

With Everitt gone we needed a ruckman. So we traded for an up and coming ruckman who Port has already used pick 15 to secure.

It's an example of moving out a high profile player who was not contributing enough to warrant his wages and bringing in a player to fill a list requirement.

[GrumpyOne]

I'm sure even Grant Thomas is wiser in hindsight.

Just a few too many recruitments were done on a "seemed like a good idea at the time" principle.

[bergsone]

Got to agree ,our trading doesnt look great does it.Regardless of the past,what do you expect him to say,great trade period,when he thinks it isnt?

[saintsRrising]

GT on Footy Classified has a crack at Lyon's trading over the summer.

Talk about pot calling the kettle black.

I guess once you join the media all bets are off and your own history doesn't matter.

Let the games begin....

Perhaps...but trading this time round was not so good.

Has been outstanding the several years prior though.

However with Lovett being pick 16 it is probably copping too much attention as pick 16' are never certain. Losing Ball for naught was not good....but the other picks/trades in what was a weak draft were reasonable enough.

If they can get Jesse's body right we might be smiling yet.

[barks4eva]

By the same principle Thomas said he wouldn't have touched Michael Gardiner with a ten foot pole and last year IMO he was worthy of AA ruck status and was a key factor in our team structure!

So the gamble didn't pay off, but the fact is Lyon was attempting to remedy an achilles heel by fast tracking some pace into the team with us currently being a serious premiership contender.

This need was due to the fact that under the previous coaches tenure, Thomas oversaw and on occasions directly selected players with no leg speed rendering the entire list as a whole very slow paced and in particular through the midfield, whether that be inside mids or out runners.

Once again another fine mess Thomas got us into!

[st_Trav_ofWA]

it comes down to thomas's love affair with "good blokes" over lyons affection to "good players " ..... well the good players win flags .. the good blokes end up asking to be traded to collingwood

[saintsRrising]

it comes down to thomas's love affair with "good blokes" over lyons affection to "good players " ..... well the good players win flags .. the good blokes end up asking to be traded to collingwood

Yes GT's record with the "bad boys" is not good.....though it is myth that he did not recruit any.

Stevie Lawrence!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!, Black, Guerra...and the kid from Hastings. So he must have griited his teeth in recruiting on occasion.

However the "bad boys" under GT tended to hit the Highway.

Hall
Everitt
Black
Lawrence (literally in this case!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

Guerra was an interesting one picked as a bad biy , starred for a while and then fell fowl of GT "code".....and then off to the Hawks where he has performed well.

The GTrain was about the only one that stayed...and that may have had lot to do with the GTrain really being a lovable larrikin rather than true "bad boy".

[rodgerfox]

it comes down to thomas's love affair with "good blokes" over lyons affection to "good players " ..... well the good players win flags .. the good blokes end up asking to be traded to collingwood

I don't think it was 'good blokes' as such. But 'good people'.

[Thinline]

it comes down to thomas's love affair with "good blokes" over lyons affection to "good players " ..... well the good players win flags .. the good blokes end up asking to be traded to collingwood

I don't think it was 'good blokes' as such. But 'good people'.

Hey RF. I agree. Well I never...

[plugger66]

You could not disagree with what GT said. Of course our trading this year was shocking and of course it was said in hindsight but anyone who argues MG was a good trade is also arguing in hindsight.

[Saints43]

I'm sure even Grant Thomas is wiser in hindsight.

Just a few too many recruitments were done on a "seemed like a good idea at the time" principle.

But that's what you get when your footy club is broke and you have a one-man recruitment department. It's why the members voted in FootyFirst. It's funny when you hear peoples disbelief if/when JB's decisions got over-ridden. I wouldn't think twice about making a decision that directly affected my career over the man who brought in Caydn Beethem. His track record is solid rather than spectacular.

But of course the club had to get to a state where footy, not finances, could come first.

Queue - $250K on London/S African holidays (which the players/staff mostly paid for as it was a tax deduction). And none of the young players who attended these character building camps has ever been in trouble - coincidence?

[degruch]

The off-season trading has only been bad in hindsight. I was thrilled to pick up Lovett initially and, had Ball gone to Richmond, we'd all be laughing. Kudos to the club for not putting up with Collingwood's crap...karma will get them.

Hey, we could have picked up Scully with pick #1, then he does a knee at ttraining and never plays again...would that be crap recruiting too?

[older saint]

As much as he hates to say it StKilda has achieved more under RL than GT and GT's deficiencies as a coach have been shown up in the last 2 seasons and it bugs him.

He is in the media to comment and make sensational type comments. He talked about Ball and not the whole storybeing told and players being fed lines etc, so what he is saying then is : a) he spoke to Luke Ball and RL and therefore got both sides of the story - Unlikely and b) his lovechild Nick Riewoldt is nothing more than a patsy mouth piece for the club.

He has placed Ball's word over that of Roo and then tried to soften it by saying players were fed a line to say.

His inability under pressure to make good decisions cost us at least one GF (2005) and it is also shown in the media.

He is quickly becoming a modern version of Patrick Smith, ironic really

[plugger66]

As much as he hates to say it StKilda has achieved more under RL than GT and GT's deficiencies as a coach have been shown up in the last 2 seasons and it bugs him.

He is in the media to comment and make sensational type comments. He talked about Ball and not the whole storybeing told and players being fed lines etc, so what he is saying then is : a) he spoke to Luke Ball and RL and therefore got both sides of the story - Unlikely and b) his lovechild Nick Riewoldt is nothing more than a patsy mouth piece for the club.

He has placed Ball's word over that of Roo and then tried to soften it by saying players were fed a line to say.

His inability under pressure to make good decisions cost us at least one GF (2005) and it is also shown in the media.

He is quickly becoming a modern version of Patrick Smith, ironic really

He is in the media and is paid by them to make comment. Dont like it dont listen to him. Usually much more positive things said by him the negative.

Two questions. Was our recruiting good this year and secondly what the hell did GT do wrong under pressure that cost us a flag even though we didnt even play in the GF?

[Saints43]

The off-season trading has only been bad in hindsight. I was thrilled to pick up Lovett initially and, had Ball gone to Richmond, we'd all be laughing. Kudos to the club for not putting up with Collingwood's crap...karma will get them.

Hey, we could have picked up Scully with pick #1, then he does a knee at ttraining and never plays again...would that be crap recruiting too?

I'm not sure that the two examples are like for like. I don't think any coach would be blamed for a recruit doing a knee (although I did read Barry Brooks name somewhere recently).

I don't think anyone would deny that Lovett was the right type of on-field player to get when you think about his pace and skills. He had only been questioned on work-rate and character as far as I remember.

[degruch]

The off-season trading has only been bad in hindsight. I was thrilled to pick up Lovett initially and, had Ball gone to Richmond, we'd all be laughing. Kudos to the club for not putting up with Collingwood's crap...karma will get them.

Hey, we could have picked up Scully with pick #1, then he does a knee at ttraining and never plays again...would that be crap recruiting too?

I'm not sure that the two examples are like for like. I don't think any coach would be blamed for a recruit doing a knee (although I did read Barry Brooks name somewhere recently).

I don't think anyone would deny that Lovett was the right type of on-field player to get when you think about his pace and skills. He had only been questioned on work-rate and character as far as I remember.

The Lovett situation is going to make it hard for us this year, though. We are now like one of those clubs who receive hand-outs and are have restricted salary caps (not having access to AL).

That's true, they're not the same, except that both selection involve luck...rather, lack thereof. A #1 pick can turn out bad, injury or not, if they're an unproven quantity you never really know how they're gonna turn out. In Lovett's case, we picked a proven performer with a bad attitude, and the result was poor. Was it the club's fault? Due dilligence? You make your own luck, and in this regard, the Saints looked to me to be taking the safest route. Turns out I was wrong. Some of GT's selections were speculative at best, some were good...but having made some bad selections, you'd have to say its dangerous to cast stones in glass houses.

[plugger66]

The off-season trading has only been bad in hindsight. I was thrilled to pick up Lovett initially and, had Ball gone to Richmond, we'd all be laughing. Kudos to the club for not putting up with Collingwood's crap...karma will get them.

Hey, we could have picked up Scully with pick #1, then he does a knee at ttraining and never plays again...would that be crap recruiting too?

I'm not sure that the two examples are like for like. I don't think any coach would be blamed for a recruit doing a knee (although I did read Barry Brooks name somewhere recently).

I don't think anyone would deny that Lovett was the right type of on-field player to get when you think about his pace and skills. He had only been questioned on work-rate and character as far as I remember.

The Lovett situation is going to make it hard for us this year, though. We are now like one of those clubs who receive hand-outs and are have restricted salary caps (not having access to AL).

That's true, they're not the same, except that both selection involve luck...rather, lack thereof. A #1 pick can turn out bad, injury or not, if they're an unproven quantity you never really know how they're gonna turn out. In Lovett's case, we picked a proven performer with a bad attitude, and the result was poor. Was it the club's fault? Due dilligence? You make your own luck, and in this regard, the Saints looked to me to be taking the safest route. Turns out I was wrong. Some of GT's selections were speculative at best, some were good...but having made some bad selections, you'd have to say its dangerous to cast stones in glass houses.

So you think on a show where he is paid to comment he should have said nothing because he had made poor selections. I dont think that is going to work.

[Saints43]

The off-season trading has only been bad in hindsight. I was thrilled to pick up Lovett initially and, had Ball gone to Richmond, we'd all be laughing. Kudos to the club for not putting up with Collingwood's crap...karma will get them.

Hey, we could have picked up Scully with pick #1, then he does a knee at ttraining and never plays again...would that be crap recruiting too?

I'm not sure that the two examples are like for like. I don't think any coach would be blamed for a recruit doing a knee (although I did read Barry Brooks name somewhere recently).

I don't think anyone would deny that Lovett was the right type of on-field player to get when you think about his pace and skills. He had only been questioned on work-rate and character as far as I remember.

The Lovett situation is going to make it hard for us this year, though. We are now like one of those clubs who receive hand-outs and are have restricted salary caps (not having access to AL).

That's true, they're not the same, except that both selection involve luck...rather, lack thereof. A #1 pick can turn out bad, injury or not, if they're an unproven quantity you never really know how they're gonna turn out. In Lovett's case, we picked a proven performer with a bad attitude, and the result was poor. Was it the club's fault? Due dilligence? You make your own luck, and in this regard, the Saints looked to me to be taking the safest route. Turns out I was wrong. Some of GT's selections were speculative at best, some were good...but having made some bad selections, you'd have to say its dangerous to cast stones in glass houses.

I agree there's luck involved. Hopefully less and less as time goes on. The recruitement department will learn from this I'm sure.

GT's not in a glass house. He's sat on his arse talking to Hutchy. So far out of the game that it doesn't matter what he says.

By the way, I deleted the last paragraph of my post as it's mathematically incorrect and makes the situation sound worse than it is. There's no place for hyperbole on SS...

[saintly]

GT on Footy Classified has a crack at Lyon's trading over the summer.

Talk about pot calling the kettle black.

I guess once you join the media all bets are off and your own history doesn't matter.

Let the games begin....

Perhaps...but trading this time round was not so good.

Has been outstanding the several years prior though.

However with Lovett being pick 16 it is probably copping too much attention as pick 16' are never certain. Losing Ball for naught was not good....but the other picks/trades in what was a weak draft were reasonable enough.
If they can get Jesse's body right we might be smiling yet.

everyone keeps saying that this year was a weak draft. but we won't knbow until this year or next pans out!