Where do YOU rate Luke Ball ?????? !!

[Eastern]

We do know that St Kilda rates him somewhere better than pick 30 or whatever Collingwood were offering

We do know that Essendon & Brisbane rate him a "Good Buy" in the 20's

We do know (and will know for sure on Thu) that Melbourne even rate him as high as pick 11, but more likely pick 18

We do know that Port Adelaide will consider picking him up at around pick 16

That means that his club of choice, COLLINGWOOD rates him LOWER than any other club that has shown the slightest interest

I would rate him at around the pick 21 that it was reported that we wanted for him

Where would you rate him in this week's Draft ??????????? !!

[Spinner]

Pick 18 is what i think we should have gotten for him....

I think a bit higher, as he has only had a one poor half of 8 seasons at the club.

24, AA, Past Captain......easily pushing early teens.


But s***s me is how volatile players worth is after every season.....

[xander]

As above around pick 20. Collingwood seems to rate their own picks & players extremely high. I still believe Jolly was an absolute steal at picks 14 & 46 considering he is alot better than he was when the swans picked him up for pick 15.

[ace]

Somewhere between RAT and TRAITOR.

[plugger66]

Somewhere between RAT and TRAITOR.

Here we go again. A serious question asked by the poster and it will start again. I will go for pick 18 where he will go.

[Con Gorozidis]

As above around pick 20. Collingwood seems to rate their own picks & players extremely high. I still believe Jolly was an absolute steal at picks 14 & 46 considering he is alot better than he was when the swans picked him up for pick 15.

fair call. id say jolly better than ball - as is lovett. so ball around pick 20 - 25 i reckon. but i would not be surprised if melbourne used 18 on him given they really need some players in the 25-30 bracket to help out their kids in the next few years.

should we have taken 25 for him? yeah in hindsight 25 would be a nice pick to have this week. but thats footy trade week...

[To the top]

Courtesy of the media and reports attributed to the 2 Senior Coaches he played under and the playing list Ball had the personal attibutes we should all aspire to.

This is confirmed by achieving the joint captaincy at a very young age under Thomas's leadership rotation theory.

He missed the entire first season after being drafted as the club bowed to his pursuit of education, where he excelled in Year 12 with a very high ENTER Score - although what future career he has positioned himself for post Year 12 is not known.

He played several excellent games in his 140 odd with his highlight game, in my view, a match at Geelong where he hauled us back into the game we narrowly - and should not have - lost. This was a match in which our defensive stocks were undermanned and were occupied by Sam Fisher (little did we know) and Ferguson.

In that game he had over 20 disposals and double figure tackles and double figure clearances to a non existant ruck division.

What became apparant to me from that time was that he could not deliver with such output in consecutive games - and good games were followed by poor games.

The image from there was of his injury woes - but the Club continued to play him.

One of his strengths was his marking ability against like sized players but weaknesses such as an inability to run - images of him static with the ball when under no pressure, then jogging then being caught and images of his ineffiency by foot including over any distance became the detracting summary.

In close ball handling skills dropped off - and the image is of him hitting his fists on the ground in frustation after fumbles which became more frequent.

He played as a forward pocket against a weakended Brisbane team and kicked 4 in a game where he marked very well and actually provided us with some Inside 50 pressure.

I ranked him far in front of Milne, who kicked 11, that night.

But the inconsistency returned for the final the next week.

His ability is under-scored by him sharing a B&F with the Club's iconic 'tagger' and a man also lauded by the then Coach in Steven Baker.

However I would suggest that there has been no challenge to B&F honours since, and 2009 was indicative when you look thru media awards and see how many of our players challenged for these awards - and the Brownlow votes where he did get 2 behind Armitage against Hawthorn and after being re-instated for that game from the VFL side, to which he subsequently returned after another very poor game.

The circumstanmces between coaches and the player are alluded to in the media, as are the opportunities the Club offered him.

He was described by the Club as a required player.

But he made himself available to the AFL Draft, not speaking to at least Melbourne which advised they were keen for his services and which Club is in the premier position to draft him.

He will be 28 when his 3 year Contract at Melbourne terminates.

Whether he will be a better footballer at 28 than he is at 25 is for him and his body management because, no doubt, his physical stature does not compliment the skills he brings to the 'in and under' game and his footballing skills are deficient elsewhere - which were the reasons he found himself ultimately out of St Kilda's best 22 in 2009.

Of benefit is that the Club he has sought out and his suitor both have the MCG as their home - and outdoor conditions which suit his game.

That stand out game at Geelong was an out doors match in wintry conditions. It is also indicative that the game which saw his papers marked was against the very same Geelong in 2009, at Docklands which is St Kilda's home ground.

W wish him all the best as Melbourne fight for recognition in the AFL with Luke Ball as one of its leaders.

Nick Riewoldt shaking has hand before the toss at either Docklands or the MCG will be much photographed, no doubt.

The current St Kilda captain versus a past St Kilda captain.

[saintbrat]

He played several excellent games in his 140 odd with his highlight game, in my view, a match at Geelong where he hauled us back into the game we narrowly - and should not have - lost. This was a match in which our defensive stocks were undermanned and were occupied by Sam Fisher (little did we know) and Ferguson.

In that game he had over 20 disposals and double figure tackles and double figure clearances to a non existant ruck division.

great summary without the emotive excess, which many of us feel and causes us to look for only the negatives

BTW was that the game that Xavier was on fire untill taken out?

[Winmarvellous]

Probably 25-30. But will hopefully go to Port, just to say a big f**K you to him for walking on us.

[PJ]

It would be ironic if he went at 16 given that's the pick we gave up for lovett.

[Mr Magic]

I rate him as similar to what Carlton gave Melbourne for McLean.

Both play a similar style and both have been hampered by continual leg problems.
What pick did Carlton use to secure McLean

Pick 11

I think it will be quite ironic if Melbourne use that pick on Ball.

The pick #21 being mentioned was the pick Collingwood wanted from NM for Wellingham. This pick was to be ontraded by St Kilda to WB for Everitt.
It was never about how much/little we valued Ball.
It was always waht WB wanted for Everitt - and that was a pick in teh first 22.
So posters and media alike can go on about the 'pick 25', that was never secured by Collingwood, as much as they like. St Kilda was never intending to use the pick they would get for Ball other than to on-trade it.

Nothing I have read since trade week has made me change my opinion on what caused the deal to come 'unstuck'.

It is still my firm belief that Connors' inability to get Jolly to Hawthorn caused the problem. I still believe that Connors, Ball and Collingwood had always intended their pick #14 would go to St Kilda, but when Jolly became avaialble, Collingwood changed their plans.
In my mind it's as simple as that.
Therefore this blaming St Kilda for 'intransigence' is, and always has been' a disgraceful piece of 'passing the buck' by those who 'stuffed up' the deal.

If Ball doesn't get to Collingood then he should lay the blame at the door of those responsible:-
Collingwood for trying to get him too cheaply.
Connors for failing to stitch the deal up before his other client Jolly came 'onto the market'.

[Milan Faletic]

Imagine if he didn't get drafted at all

[ace]

Imagine if he didn't get drafted at all

He will be drafted by Collingwood at pick 30.

Other clubs wont touch him, he is unlikely stand out of football for 2 years but he could sign on then could demand a trade to Collingwood after 1 year - do a Buckley.

I think Collingwood are forced to take him at 30 or ignore him for ever.
Other clubs will feel free to move on him if Collingwood ignores him at 30.
It would be clear even to Ball, under those circumstances, that Collingwood were not serious in pursuing him.

Essendon could then strike at 33, Melbourne at 34 or Brisbane at 47.
He would not last to Collingwood at 62.

He will not be taken at picks 32, 60, 64 or 77, that bridge has been permanently burnt for ever.

[Spinner]

Imagine if he didn't get drafted at all

He will be drafted by Collingwood at pick 30.

Other clubs wont touch him, he is unlikely stand out of football for 2 years but he could sign on then could demand a trade to Collingwood after 1 year - do a Buckley.

I think Collingwood are forced to take him at 30 or ignore him for ever.
Other clubs will feel free to move on him if Collingwood ignores him at 30.
It would be clear even to Ball, under those circumstances, that Collingwood were not serious in pursuing him.

Essendon could then strike at 33, Melbourne at 34 or Brisbane at 47.
He would not last to Collingwood at 62.

He will not be taken at picks 32, 60, 64 or 77, that bridge has been permanently burnt for ever.

Is this post a joke post?

[goodie]

Pick 18 at a minimum.

[S.A Saint]

it all depends on how you look at it...if he was playing for some other club i would prob offer a pick somewhere between 18 and 24 if we had that...for a club that needs inside mids and clearance players eg filth then he around pick 10-14

overall i would rate him around pick 16....

[ace]

Imagine if he didn't get drafted at all

He will be drafted by Collingwood at pick 30.

Other clubs wont touch him, he is unlikely stand out of football for 2 years but he could sign on then could demand a trade to Collingwood after 1 year - do a Buckley.

I think Collingwood are forced to take him at 30 or ignore him for ever.
Other clubs will feel free to move on him if Collingwood ignores him at 30.
It would be clear even to Ball, under those circumstances, that Collingwood were not serious in pursuing him.

Essendon could then strike at 33, Melbourne at 34 or Brisbane at 47.
He would not last to Collingwood at 62.

He will not be taken at picks 32, 60, 64 or 77, that bridge has been permanently burnt for ever.

Is this post a joke post?

No, just that I believe coaches when they say they don't want players at their club if the player is not commited.

I don't believe the same coaches when they say they might do this or that in contradition of the previous sentence.

He only has half of his career left and the best half is behind him.
If there had not been any (what I believe to be) draft tampering and no price placed on his head, I would rate Ball a late round 2 pick in an uncompromised draft.
That puts him at around 30 normally.

But this draft is compromised so I would expect around pick 20.
But that is without the price on his head which should be seen by all clubs to be excessive.

The excessive price eliminates due to salary caps, many clubs that may like him .

[saintdooley]

i think there could be a big move, meybe brisbane will use their first round. i think the dees will try to get him at 18 but someone will jump the gun early.
as a joke i rate him as a bag of shyt, but seriously, around pick 22-28 he would be at.

[Armoooo]

TBH I think a fair result would be pick 14 for our third rounder and Ball...

I would say he is worth about pick 20-25...

However I would rather let him go for free than let him go to Collingwood... He should be worth a lot more to Collingwood than that as he is a missing piece of the puzzle for them...

[SainterK]

From the interest shown the last couple of weeks, I think if the bidding had been opened up to a few clubs, instead of only one....the club could of got perhaps more than he was worth.

[ace]

i think there could be a big move, meybe brisbane will use their first round. i think the dees will try to get him at 18 but someone will jump the gun early.
as a joke i rate him as a bag of shyt, but seriously, around pick 22-28 he would be at.

No chance of Brisbane using their 1st round, that went to Carlton for Fevola.

Brisbane's first selection is at pick 27 but ahead of Collingwood's first selection at pick 30.


But I would like to see Voss stick it up Malthouse and Buckley.

[n1ck]

Brock McLean is a poor mans Luke Ball.

Enough said.

[To the top]

Saintbrat, it was a game won with a disputed kick (free?) to a taller Geelong player in the last minute or so going to the City (Melbourne) end - I have in mind Graham but that might not be correct because they had another big player down there as well.

Your mention of X being taken out may be correct - and we may have lost someone esle also. I would not have said that without prompting, so it may just as well have been that X (and one other) was lost in another match, not that one.

We did lose Pekin, Burke and Frawley early in a final v. Geelong, then lost by 9 points at Waverley.

We clawed back at Geelong after being a few down and actually hit the front but just could not land the sealer - and then it turned out as it did.

I do recall that Ferguson was at CHB and Sam Fisher at full back because of an extensive injury list.

Both performed credibly.

They may both have been on debut - but, if not, had played very, very few games prior.

Sam Fisher consolidated his position and the rest is history for the ex West Adelaide CHF who has been a supurb pick up.

Ferguson just lacked those vital inches to hold down the position his skills equipped him for - and went by the wayside accordingly.

Ball's game thay day was supurb and gave evidence as to why he was up with Hodge and Judd.

I never thought it healthy that Ball spoke to watching the performances of Hodge and Judd and comparing himself including in conversation with them.

Perhaps that told us something about why Luke Ball played football.

Much the same as X saying why he sought the warmer climes of Brisbane - those little signs of insecurity which can manifest.

Bit like Langer always referring to Hayden - so he could pocket credits from a partnership regardless of contribution.

Nit picking I know - but there is an underlying question of why introduce the performance of others to your performance - after all, Ball, Judd and Hodge played for different teams and bought their respective skills to different teams and different directives.

And that game v. Hawthorn where Armitage got the Brownlow votes was played in Tasmania.

I do not think Ball and his family would be unaware of St Kilda at Docklands not being the best match for Luke Ball and his evolving skills.

Whether having Docklands as St Kilda's home ground is ultimately detrimental to St Kilda's premiership chances at the MCG will be debated until we actually have some Premiership Cups on the mantle.

But, until then, we have to firstly position ourselves to compete in finals - and that means winning at home.

[Hurricane]

Dispite my personal felings I belive that as a former #2 pick, former club captain, integeral cog of a doninant midfield group he should go before pick 20.

I rate the Demons a great chance to pick him up at 18 as he has all the tools they need to help their young core midfield, however he will probably slip to 30 and the filth due to his price tag and the fact he stated he doesnt want to go anywhere but Collingwood

BANG BANG

[samoht]

I rate Luke Ball somewhere between $ & $

around pig 30