I wouldn't be responding to your opinions if I wasn't interested in your reply, I am not sure why you keep rolling your eyes...stinger wrote:no...but it is now obvious that he didn't react the same.....SainterK wrote:Because being dropped from a side is something that is exclusive to Ross Lyon and St Kilda?stinger wrote:yep eastern..i would say he started making them around the time he got dropped the first time.....
No deal with Magpies over Ball, says Lyon
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it's not at you....SainterK wrote:I wouldn't be responding to your opinions if I wasn't interested in your reply, I am not sure why you keep rolling your eyes...stinger wrote:no...but it is now obvious that he didn't react the same.....SainterK wrote:Because being dropped from a side is something that is exclusive to Ross Lyon and St Kilda?stinger wrote:yep eastern..i would say he started making them around the time he got dropped the first time.....
.everybody still loves lenny....and we always will
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Milton66
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Isn't it obvious then that the club is to blame for him not responding the same?SainterK wrote:I wouldn't be responding to your opinions if I wasn't interested in your reply, I am not sure why you keep rolling your eyes...stinger wrote:no...but it is now obvious that he didn't react the same.....SainterK wrote:Because being dropped from a side is something that is exclusive to Ross Lyon and St Kilda?stinger wrote:yep eastern..i would say he started making them around the time he got dropped the first time.....
Hotel De Los Muertos: Your room is ready... Care to step inside?
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Eastern
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I would suggest that Connors was "MORE THAN" sussing out the options. Luke had an offer of a 3 yr deal on the table in June !!B W and R all over wrote:I'm tipping his manager was in discussions just to suss out the options. I don't think Ball would have been personally shopping himself around. He would have been focussed on winning a flag.Eastern wrote:The timing is interesting here.Mr Magic wrote:That's what is intriguing me.joffaboy wrote:
Still it would be interesting to know if Ball was working with Collingwood prior to the Grand Final.
If so....well
All this 'gnashing of teeth' over 'poor Luke' having to find another home because 'bad old Ross Lyon' wasn't giving him what he deserved.
Maybe we should get all the facts before we pillory any party on here (and that includes Ball). At the moment though the gossip/inuendo/spin being portrayed as facts seems to be going one way.
The GF loss, followed by a week of grieving, followed by the B&F, then comes the 1st day of trade week and Luke wants to go to Collingwood. The manager would have been working with Collingwood for some time on this. It would take a fair bit to convince me that Luke didn't know about it prior to even the Prelim.
Come to think of it. Some of the things Luke said at the family day (in hindsight) suggested he already had plans in place !!
Connors was just doing what managers are paid to do.
NEW scarf signature (hopefully with correct spelling) will be here as soon as it arrives !!
Oh FFSMilton66 wrote:
Isn't it obvious then that the club is to blame for him not responding the same?
Lance or James??
There comes a point in every man's life when he has to say, "Enough is enough." For me, that time is now. I have been dealing with claims that I cheated and had an unfair advantage in <redacted>. Over the past three years, I have been subjected to a <redacted>investigation followed by <redacted> witch hunt. The toll this has taken on my family, and my work for <redacted>and on me leads me to where I am today – finished with this nonsense. (Oops just got a spontaneous errection <unredacted>)
There comes a point in every man's life when he has to say, "Enough is enough." For me, that time is now. I have been dealing with claims that I cheated and had an unfair advantage in <redacted>. Over the past three years, I have been subjected to a <redacted>investigation followed by <redacted> witch hunt. The toll this has taken on my family, and my work for <redacted>and on me leads me to where I am today – finished with this nonsense. (Oops just got a spontaneous errection <unredacted>)
i have said all along that there appears to be blame...or reasons for both parties.... acting the way they had...usually is......if goslings prefer to be selective in their comments on my comments..then that reflects poorly on them ..not me....
i find the readiness of some to condemn ball whilst at the same time readily absolving the club from all blame to be highly amusing.....the naivety has to be seen to be believed.....
i find the readiness of some to condemn ball whilst at the same time readily absolving the club from all blame to be highly amusing.....the naivety has to be seen to be believed.....
.everybody still loves lenny....and we always will
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saintsRrising
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On Ball, the reality is that other players at the Saints have moved past him.
Whether it is his body, his mind (ie as with Fiora)...or even that he and Lyon do not see eye to eye is largely irrelevant.
Over the last season or two virtually every player on the St Kilda list improved...even Lenny, Dal and Roo all became better players (ie Roo is a much more complete footballer now).
Ball is a notable exception. This season he became a player used when Lenny, Dal etc needed resting.
Armo and other players were also pushing to move past Ball..and in 2010, may well have of anyway.
Ball we assume is not content to just be a support player with the Saints, and has sought other pastures. that has been his decision.
Good luck to him..but he is no longer a Saint..he is the opposition.
Competition for the Saints 22 will be fierce.
Lovett is pretty much certain.
Geary, Armo, Steven, Peake & others will all be seeking to push in as well.
Kingy will have Ben knocking on his door too!!
Whether it is his body, his mind (ie as with Fiora)...or even that he and Lyon do not see eye to eye is largely irrelevant.
Over the last season or two virtually every player on the St Kilda list improved...even Lenny, Dal and Roo all became better players (ie Roo is a much more complete footballer now).
Ball is a notable exception. This season he became a player used when Lenny, Dal etc needed resting.
Armo and other players were also pushing to move past Ball..and in 2010, may well have of anyway.
Ball we assume is not content to just be a support player with the Saints, and has sought other pastures. that has been his decision.
Good luck to him..but he is no longer a Saint..he is the opposition.
Competition for the Saints 22 will be fierce.
Lovett is pretty much certain.
Geary, Armo, Steven, Peake & others will all be seeking to push in as well.
Kingy will have Ben knocking on his door too!!
Flying the World in comfort thanks to FF Points....
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barks4eva
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Oh reallystinger wrote:i have said all along that there appears to be blame...or reasons for both parties.... acting the way they had...usually is......if goslings prefer to be selective in their comments on my comments..then that reflects poorly on them ..not me....
i find the readiness of some to condemn ball whilst at the same time readily absolving the club from all blame to be highly amusing.....the naivety has to be seen to be believed.....
After the flowering shytestorm you created when your flowering hero got exited out, the flower who was taking the club south and demanding he maintain full control of the football department, it is galling beyond belief that you have the flowering temerity to call others flowering naive!
That a new professional football department and a Real McCoy coach were installed immediately did nothing to ease your rage,
whereas visionaries like myself knew that finally the club were getting FAIR DINKUM,
NAIVE nuffies, numbnuts, gimps, gumps, geeks, goofballs and not forgetting the throng of dong bongers and dumbed down dingbats, much like yourself were taking the let's wait and see approach, still seething that your Thomas in wonderland fairy story had come to an end.
Seriously the naivety of you GT doll worshippers, who willingly sipped the poisoned cordial and swallowed the snake oil routine completely unaware of the smoke and mirrors and a massive con job from day one knows no bounds.
At least we NOW have a professional football department and a tactically astute coach who sets trends and I'll back his judgement over some nuffy like you who once rated Knobel as a better ruck prospect than Cox!
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FortiusQuoFidelius
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OMG!!!! For once I find myself agreeing wholeheartedly with you B4E!barks4eva wrote:Oh reallystinger wrote:i have said all along that there appears to be blame...or reasons for both parties.... acting the way they had...usually is......if goslings prefer to be selective in their comments on my comments..then that reflects poorly on them ..not me....
i find the readiness of some to condemn ball whilst at the same time readily absolving the club from all blame to be highly amusing.....the naivety has to be seen to be believed.....
After the flowering shytestorm you created when your flowering hero got exited out, the flower who was taking the club south and demanding he maintain full control of the football department, it is galling beyond belief that you have the flowering temerity to call others flowering naive!
That a new professional football department and a Real McCoy coach were installed immediately did nothing to ease your rage,
whereas visionaries like myself knew that finally the club were getting FAIR DINKUM,
NAIVE nuffies, numbnuts, gimps, gumps, geeks, goofballs and not forgetting the throng of dong bongers and dumbed down dingbats, much like yourself were taking the let's wait and see approach, still seething that your Thomas in wonderland fairy story had come to an end.
Seriously the naivety of you GT doll worshippers, who willingly sipped the poisoned cordial and swallowed the snake oil routine completely unaware of the smoke and mirrors and a massive con job from day one knows no bounds.
At least we NOW have a professional football department and a tactically astute coach who sets trends and I'll back his judgement over some nuffy like you who once rated Knobel as a better ruck prospect than Cox!
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Spinner
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Mr Magic wrote:I'm sorry, but I'm starting to get billious about all this.axcellence wrote:+1stinger wrote:an excellent post ..well reasoned ..full of logic...even if i say so......not that the poster would care......skeptic wrote:I think you guys are being so harsh on Ball
He's a young guy trying to make a career for himself.
He's worried about his spot in the team and has reason to believe that he may not be in Lyon's bigger picture and has opted to go to a club that may require him more.
A move like this may well extend his career if he goes.
I don't see how any level headed person could hate him for this train of thought. I get so tired of this mentality that if someone doesn't do purely what is in the best interest of the club ONLY, he's a selfish, greedy egomaniac.
Justin Plapp got 1 last last chance to keep his spot on the list, backed into a pack against Essendon "for the team", got seriously injured as a result, didn't play again that season and was delisted. The club didn't reward his loyalty
If the deal falls through, I for one would welcome him back to fold with open arms. All this talk about delisting him or making him play the season out in the 2s is stupid.
Sure make him earn his spot, after he does, why hold malice?
For some of you guys, this whole thing has gotten out of proportion in your minds. The righteousness I hear
Luke Ball has made a decision - and he'll cop it whichever way it comes. Let's not heap abuse on him. Have any of you ever refused a much better paying job out of loyalty? Most of working people these days switch jobs at the drop of a hat...
Those who live in glass houses...
IMO,Paul Connors has been feeding stories to Denham at The Oz that are nothing more than blatantly trying to spin this situation.
Facts of the situation as I understand them:-
Ball was on 600k, the result of a back-loaded long-term contract signed when he was at his peak of playing abilities.
Ball was offered in June a much lower 3 year contract based on what St Kilda felt he was currently worth (300-400k?)
As the season wore on, Ball's inability to quickly recover from playing games impacted his ability to train, tehreby imp[acting on the amount of actual game time he could play under our gameplan.
As a result of that he started to get less and less actual game time.
A decision was made by the match committee, in conjunction with the fitness people, to stop him playing and get some hardcore training into him so that he could regain some of his base fitness and return to a more acceptable game time. This included a period of playing in the Sandringham side where he could maintain some 'match fitness' without the rigours of AFL football.
When the finals came around Ball was selected to play.
On Grand Final day he started in the centre square.
Somewhere in all of this a decision was reached between Ball and Connors to check out his other playing options.
Now I really have no issue with him going to another CLub if that is what he wants to do. He's a big boy and is responsible for his decisions.
WHat I will not cop though is this 'campaign' by Connors and others from the Ball camp to somehow 'paint' my Saints as the 'bad guys' in all of this.
What is so wrong in just telling the truth? Ball/Connors wanted more money adn Collingwood apparently has offered it. (anybody who believes the nonsense being peddled by Connors and his mouthpiece Denham that Ball was offered more by the Saints than Collingwood needs a reality check, IMO).
Obviously Ball/Connors/the camp fear that being known as having left the Saints for more money is not good for his image?
Hence this farcical bs crapola that is being spread as a defense of Luke Ball's decision.
'Saints offered more'
'more game time'
'untenable under Lyon'
BTW, the 'more game time' excuse is a beauty. The connotation is that St Kilda deliberately didn't play him more. Does anybody actually believe that teh match committee, coaches adn fitness staf conspired to stop Luke Ball from playing as much as he could?
Of course not.
The truth is they believed he couldn't play more than the time they gave him on the field.
Maybe they were wrong in their assesment? Only time will tell.
Very interesting post..... Just a query, this, especially the bolded part is inside work from the club???
Very interesting, and something I could really believe to be the case. Makes a lot of sense.... Definitely makes me feel a lot better.
barks4eva wrote:Oh reallystinger wrote:i have said all along that there appears to be blame...or reasons for both parties.... acting the way they had...usually is......if goslings prefer to be selective in their comments on my comments..then that reflects poorly on them ..not me....
i find the readiness of some to condemn ball whilst at the same time readily absolving the club from all blame to be highly amusing.....the naivety has to be seen to be believed.....
After the flowering shytestorm you created when your flowering hero got exited out, the flower who was taking the club south and demanding he maintain full control of the football department, it is galling beyond belief that you have the flowering temerity to call others flowering naive!
That a new professional football department and a Real McCoy coach were installed immediately did nothing to ease your rage,
whereas visionaries like myself knew that finally the club were getting FAIR DINKUM,
NAIVE nuffies, numbnuts, gimps, gumps, geeks, goofballs and not forgetting the throng of dong bongers and dumbed down dingbats, much like yourself were taking the let's wait and see approach, still seething that your Thomas in wonderland fairy story had come to an end.
Seriously the naivety of you GT doll worshippers, who willingly sipped the poisoned cordial and swallowed the snake oil routine completely unaware of the smoke and mirrors and a massive con job from day one knows no bounds.
At least we NOW have a professional football department and a tactically astute coach who sets trends and I'll back his judgement over some nuffy like you who once rated Knobel as a better ruck prospect than Cox!
you never fail to amuse me...bring a smile to my face even....did you manage to catch up with gt for a coffee at the grannie....have you even got over the disappointment at the loss yet.?..i haven't...
...talking about astute judges..i haven;t forgotten.you rated rix as an afl ruckman.....bhahahaha
he was the worst player to ever don the red white and black....
ps.... stick by my comments....all of them.....if there is one thing i'm not it's naive......can't work in the criminal justice system in this country and remain naive ffs....
.everybody still loves lenny....and we always will
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ace
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OLB wrote:
Exactly but it is Collingwood that is saying no deal.
They can simply shut up shop and go home.
They have used up their 1st and 3rd round picks and probably space under the salary cap.
They have caused Ball to walk out on St Kilda.
Premiership rival sabotaged - job well done.
Slimey Eddie wins again.
Its is time to force Ball to choose between playing for wooden spoons at Melbourne via the pre-season draft or agree to a trade elsewhere.
The more you know, the more you know you don't know.
When I was a young child, I knew that I knew so much about so much.
Now that I am old and know so much more, I know that I know so much about so little, and so little about so much.
If you are not engaging AI actively and aggressively, you are doing it wrong.
You are not going to lose your job to AI.
You are going lose your job to somebody who uses AI.
Your company is not going to go out of business because of AI.
Your company is going to go out of business because another company used AI.
- Jensen Huang, CEO of NVIDIA
When I was a young child, I knew that I knew so much about so much.
Now that I am old and know so much more, I know that I know so much about so little, and so little about so much.
If you are not engaging AI actively and aggressively, you are doing it wrong.
You are not going to lose your job to AI.
You are going lose your job to somebody who uses AI.
Your company is not going to go out of business because of AI.
Your company is going to go out of business because another company used AI.
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barks4eva
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Only next years premiership delivered on the last Saturday in September will go anyway to erasing this.stinger wrote: you never fail to amuse me...bring a smile to my face even....did you manage to catch up with gt for a goffee atbthe grannie....have you even got over the disappointment at the loss yet...i haven't...
I will only fully enjoy football again once the Premiership has been claimed,
even if we were to pump Geelong in round one, I will not be satisfied, it will only mean 4 points,
ONLY A PREMIERSHIP WILL DO
2010 is ours, anyone who gets in the way needs to be destroyed, including Luke Ball, if that's the path and SOFT option HE chooses!
...talking about astute judges..i haven;t forgotten.you rated rix as an afl ruckman.....bhahahaha
he was the worst player to ever don the red white and black....
Truth is I never really rated him as an AFL player, but seeing as though we had no ruckmen, amazing how we have an abundance of them now with a REAL COACH, I preferred him to having Blake crucified in there,
besides, have you never been in love?
Ross will not run out of petrol!
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Joffa Burns
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How where when and why has the situation between Ball and Lyon become untenable? If a deal cannot be struck and Luke is not man enough to walk back into the club and front the coaching and playing groups and say.....â€
Proudly assuming the title of forum Oracle and serving as the inaugural Saintsational ‘weak as piss brigade’ President.
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SaintSimmo
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id take that can play midfield and medium forward young and is already capable of playing afl, good trade lets do it.St Chris wrote:Heard a rumour that Steele Sidebottom has been put forward to the Saints as a trade for Ball...
I'd take that in a second, but not sure why the 'Pies would offer him....
barks4eva wrote:
Ross will not run out of petrol!
no ...not in his car.....not sure about him personally though anymore i'm sorry to say......lost one or two players too it would seem
..will take a long long time for me to forget losing the unloseable grand final.....
.everybody still loves lenny....and we always will
"Freedom of expression is the cornerstone of a free society,"
However, freedom of expression is not encouraged in certain forums.
"Freedom of expression is the cornerstone of a free society,"
However, freedom of expression is not encouraged in certain forums.
http://www.foxsports.com.au/story/0,865 ... l#Thursday
Just a rumour though, on the foxsports blog...
Just a rumour though, on the foxsports blog...
SainterK wrote:http://www.foxsports.com.au/story/0,865 ... l#Thursday
Just a rumour though, on the foxsports blog...
even i would say yes to that one...in an instant....
.everybody still loves lenny....and we always will
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Spinner
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St Chris wrote:Heard a rumour that Steele Sidebottom has been put forward to the Saints as a trade for Ball...
I'd take that in a second, but not sure why the 'Pies would offer him....
Im listening!!!!
Doubt the pies would after his performance in the semi final.....
Collingwood overrates every one of their players.