Luke Ball - the challenge

[To the top]

By reputation Luke Ball is an elite footballer - and a past Best & Fairest winner at St Kilda to add credibility to that claim.

But the challenge Luke has at the present time and into the future is to deliver to St Kilda as does Lenny Hayes.

Lenny not only lays the tackles, including the bone crunching tackles, and wins the contested ball but he brings an attacking focus once he has the ball.

Luke should dissect Lenny's game and attempt to emulate it.

Because currently, and unfortunately, there is a big, big gap between what these players are bringing to the St Kilda performance.

Hayes is absolutely elite.

And totally consistent to boot.

[iwantmeseats]

huh? Ball's in and under work tackling etc for most of the year has been second ONLY to Lenny, and by bugger all, I couldnt disagree more. Where he is let down is he cant run or kick, not his fault his injured FFS.

There may be some things he needs to work on, hence he is missing, I tend to think its just as much injury related as it is going back to the twos to work on his game.

Dont understand the thread at all.

[Red]

Ball is not as important to the structure as he was 12 months ago.

12 months ago we only had 2 midfielders who could win their own ball,

now almost everybody can.

So while he got away with not being an elite runner or very efficient in his

disposal he can't anymore. Hopefully he can work on these things and become

the player he was 4 years ago.

[iwantmeseats]

Isnt he ??

How many games you seen this year?

[evertonfc]

Luke Ball should aim to emulate the style of Greg Williams rather than Lenny Hayes.

Williams moved like a snail and wasn't a great long kick, but had great hands and could direct traffic by organising players around him.

A leader of the engine room. That should be Ball.

[aussiejones]

Cannot fault his in and under work .

His run and kicking lets him down. Op difficulties.

Best wishes Luke

[perfectionist]

How quickly people forget! Then again, how quickly some players can lose that "edge". Looking at the early games this year (thanks, Sainter_Dad) Luke Ball was our main clearance driver. Remember, Lenny was missing at the start of the season and took one or two weeks to get back into the swing of things. Luke got coaches votes in Rounds 1 and 4 and in Round 9, against Brisbane, got 5 votes from one coach.

From the outside, it looked to me that he was carrying an injury since the break, but we have been assured that he is fitter now than at any other time this year. I am not been sure whether he was asked to play a tagging role that was outside his abilities. No doubt he is not the player that he was in 2005 when he was AA, and I am certain that injuries are to blame for that, not only his groin problems, but the massive number of concussions that he suffered, almost in consecutive weeks, perhaps dulled his reflexes. Young brains can recover, but he is not getting any younger.

His will to succeed is second to none at the club and we should never underestimate the power of this factor in sport. I hope he comes back and enjoys the success he has earned while wearing the red, white and black.

[Eastern]

The problems with Luke Ball at present are more perception than reality (especially on here). The club said he was "DROPPED". That says his form was not up to the standard that Ross & the team require. The fans (myself included) are suspicious that it is more injury related. We can all see that he has lost his run, lost penetration with his kicking and for all intents & purposes his OP has returned. There is also a Left thumb injury that appears to be pretty bad. We can all speculate on where Luke is at;

Is it form related?

Is it injury related?

Is it a bit of both?

!!

[stinger]

huh? Ball's in and under work tackling etc for most of the year has been second ONLY to Lenny, and by bugger all, I couldnt disagree more. Where he is let down is he cant run or kick, not his fault his injured FFS.

There may be some things he needs to work on, hence he is missing, I tend to think its just as much injury related as it is going back to the twos to work on his game.

Dont understand the thread at all.

gotta agree with you mate...not the op.....when i read the post...i thouht.......wtf....

[donthglfa]

How quickly people forget! Then again, how quickly some players can lose that "edge". Looking at the early games this year (thanks, Sainter_Dad) Luke Ball was our main clearance driver. Remember, Lenny was missing at the start of the season and took one or two weeks to get back into the swing of things. Luke got coaches votes in Rounds 1 and 4 and in Round 9, against Brisbane, got 5 votes from one coach.

From the outside, it looked to me that he was carrying an injury since the break, but we have been assured that he is fitter now than at any other time this year. I am not been sure whether he was asked to play a tagging role that was outside his abilities. No doubt he is not the player that he was in 2005 when he was AA, and I am certain that injuries are to blame for that, not only his groin problems, but the massive number of concussions that he suffered, almost in consecutive weeks, perhaps dulled his reflexes. Young brains can recover, but he is not getting any younger.

His will to succeed is second to none at the club and we should never underestimate the power of this factor in sport. I hope he comes back and enjoys the success he has earned while wearing the red, white and black.

Well said, Bally has been smashed around alot over the last few years and has been an awsome in and under ball(no pun)winner. I think the way the game has sped up so much has made players like him look slow and a little lost at times. Injuries have not helped and i think he will come back into the team at some stage with a different mind set. we have more players winning there own ball now so I think he can learn to concentrate more on the tactics and look at the bigger picture in the game rather than just going at the ball like a bull at a red rag.


I'm not very good at putting things into words but I think that shows how I feel

[busso mick]

I think the game against Geelong was where our midfield deficiences were highlighted and both Ball and Geary were exposed against the best midfield in the comp. Theres nothing vindictive about it, but more like a preview of the big stage we will appear on later this year. Geary got dropped for the next game and Ball for the game after. To not give these two a bit of a rev-up or wake-up call to let them know that more is required is not in Ross Lyon's nature.

Lets remember it is only Round 17 and another 5 rounds are available before the finals. There is ample time for both Ball and Geary to come back into our side. Remember that humble pie was also sampled by both Dal Santo and Milne last year, and (like the man who invented the rear view mirror) they haven't looked back since.

I think some fans are having a bit of difficulty with the paradigm shift in what our club represents at this moment, where less than a certain standard is not good enough any more. We all have our favourites and wonder why Matt Maguire can't get a gig and why Bally was dropped, but the standard that Ross Lyon and the coaching panel are setting at our club implies that the team is way bigger than the individual. I am confident Bally will be back soon as he is a smart young man and will realise just what is required to be part of the new St Kilda.

[saintspremiers]

The problems with Luke Ball at present are more perception than reality (especially on here). The club said he was "DROPPED". That says his form was not up to the standard that Ross & the team require. The fans (myself included) are suspicious that it is more injury related. We can all see that he has lost his run, lost penetration with his kicking and for all intents & purposes his OP has returned. There is also a Left thumb injury that appears to be pretty bad. We can all speculate on where Luke is at;

Is it form related?

Is it injury related?

Is it a bit of both?

!!

Both IMO.

....let's first see if he plays for Sandy on Sunday - if he is a no-show, then let the suspicions of injury resurface!

[saint75]

The problems with Luke Ball at present are more perception than reality (especially on here). The club said he was "DROPPED". That says his form was not up to the standard that Ross & the team require. The fans (myself included) are suspicious that it is more injury related. We can all see that he has lost his run, lost penetration with his kicking and for all intents & purposes his OP has returned. There is also a Left thumb injury that appears to be pretty bad. We can all speculate on where Luke is at;

Is it form related?

Is it injury related?

Is it a bit of both?

!!

It is not so much a matter of how fast you can run, it is how fast you can MOVE THE BALL. Look at Geelong, their midfield is not particularly fast, however, their fast flowing handball game is what makes them appear to be fast. They rarely hesitate when the ball is in their hands.

In regards to where Luke is at, I believe he was dropped due to form. He may be carrying a few niggles, but hell, what player at this time of the year isn't? If a player is not playing to the standard required, I have no problems with the coach dropping them (Roo included). When looking at a team selected by the match panel, you have to take your emotions out of it. We are playing to win, not to stroke the egos of players and supporters alike!

[saintly_safes]

I love Luke Ball like a brother & i really feel for the guy. He is an out & out champion in my eyes anyway.You dont have to be Einstein to realise he is struggling but you dont hear him whinging or making excuses ,he just keeps on griding away. I think we all saw last year when we were playing finals how much we missed his leadership & contested ball qualities.As I have posted many times he might not be phyically capable of doing what he once could of but his work rate & his passion for the jumper wins me over every time hes on the park

[Red]

Isnt he ??

How many games you seen this year?

I've being to every game - yourself fly to Subi, Aami?

Did we miss him last week?

Last year when he didn't play he was really missed.

[CaptainRiewoldt]

most amazing season ever and probably will have... ti think luke ball is now on the fringes... he was top 10 for last 6 years who wouldve dreamt up that jones, macqualter, schnieder, dawson, gilbert all would be ahead of ball be more important to this team??? who???

macqualter is one who hasnt been mentioned like gilbert, jones or dawson but his work in the forwardline and kicks into forwardd 50 have been faultless. And he is averageing a goal a game. what a GUN!!

He also went to the hawks and they didnt take him boy ...

[saint patrick]

Ball is not as important to the structure as he was 12 months ago.

12 months ago we only had 2 midfielders who could win their own ball,

now almost everybody can.

So while he got away with not being an elite runner or very efficient in his

disposal he can't anymore. Hopefully he can work on these things and become

the player he was 4 years ago.

Understand where you are coming from but think it is unselling Lukes special ability to win the very hard ball swimming upstream...

His leadership qualities are also difficult to quantify in terms of the difference it makes to our team structure.

Is still the 1% king in my book.

Ball will be back and part of of our greatest triump I have no doubt

[HarveysDeciple]

Luke Ball should aim to emulate the style of Greg Williams rather than Lenny Hayes.

Williams moved like a snail and wasn't a great long kick, but had great hands and could direct traffic by organising players around him.

A leader of the engine room. That should be Ball.

Yep has the attributes to do that....tough, smart, good tackler and great hands in traffic.

[To the top]

Closest to the mark is Busso Mick.

Luke Ball looks to play in the mid-field for St Kilda, the very position(s) the game starts from and where we have improved under Lyon because we finally have 2 genuine ruckmen who are giving our mid-field first look.

We have to capitalise on that first look.

Luke Ball is not capitalising on that first look including because his hands are letting him down and the fumble negates the excellent ruck work we now enjoy.

Then there are the reasons the apologists have detailed on this thread.

When you are making excuses, you have a problem.

And Luke Ball has a problem.

I, like everyone else, hopes and trusts he comes back to playing the elite game which he once paraded - but from where he is now he has to come back.

That is why he has been dropped by the team selection panel - and given the challenge which confronts him.

Pertinent also is that the Coach (including, no doubt, the panel) have been speaking with him over a period of weeks.

He has not been able to deliver on the basis of that talk, so he is at Sandringham.

With Maguire.

You do not have favourites in this competition.

You have players who perform the multitude of tasks they are challenged to perform week in and week out throughout the season - and sometimes those tasks can change during a game.

[bergholt]

huh? Ball's in and under work tackling etc for most of the year has been second ONLY to Lenny, and by bugger all, I couldnt disagree more. Where he is let down is he cant run or kick, not his fault his injured FFS.

There may be some things he needs to work on, hence he is missing, I tend to think its just as much injury related as it is going back to the twos to work on his game.

i guess we'll see if he plays for sandy - but if he does then it's not (completely) injury.

yes, it's not his fault if he is hampered by injury, but that doesn't mean his performances haven't been below the standard we know he's capable of. i'm sure bally would be first to admit that. either way, he's got work to do to become a top player once again.

[The OtherThommo]

So many miss the point. If RTB says Luke is out of the senior side and has things to work on, then he has freakin' things to work on.

Go back a month before he was dropped - his form was shytehouse. I have absolutely no doubt RTB wants Bally to get more outside bally. Forget martydom, Bally, win some easier ball and run with it. Life is not all about getting crunched.

By all reports he was kicking goals from 50 and beyond at training this week. HE NEEDS TO DO IT IN GAMES. I saw him do it in his first 2 years, then OP hit, Grantlee decided he could be sacrificed in the name of the greater good, bash his tit every time the kid got a head injury, and celebrate bandages. Always was bullshmyte, still is bullshymte.

RTB has stated publically that Luke has some stuff to work on. Grand. He does. And, this footy club now has the structures to make it work.

16-0 is not a fluke - it's a result of thoroughness, top to bottom. Bally will play finals, IF he gets with the program.

[Teflon]

Busso Mick, Saints 75, TTT - awesome posts. Non drivel, emotion based...just pure footy - good stuff!

I went to the Cats game telling everyone we had the antidote to Joel Sellwod aka Luke Ball. He could do all a Sellwood/Bartel could for that matter and would. He didnt, couldnt and I walked away thinking (again) - Is there something wrong with Luke Ball...or is he just a bottom of the pack bruiser (a great one) but never the less...that is all?

Our midfield was shown up that day - Cats centre clearance work in the 3rd especially was awesome - Ball couldnt get near it. But aside from that, as Saints 75 points out, ball movement (not just running speed) is critical....and Luke seems to second guess here...

As OP suggests - he needs to develop an attacking side to his game- become even more damaging and then we will see the true potential of Luke Ball. Until then we have half the equation and Lyon knows this and also knows what another 30% from Luke Ball will mean to this team/midfield come September.

[The OtherThommo]

Teffers, the comparison was with Sir Lenny in the last 1/4 of the game against Geelong. RTB left SL with a bit up his sleeve and his last 1/4 was one of the great 1/4's of footy you'd see - 13 possies, 5 clearances, ball use to Rooey and the Kosmeister to die for - the man's a freakin' genius. Footy talent wise he's a poor man's Luke Ball, but he knows how to play and lead, AND that's what Bally needs to grasp.

He can, and I reckon RTB is in the process of teaching him how to.

[SainterK]

Maybe he is not injured, but is still thinking like someone who is injured. It happens, but it can also be overcome. This would mean it's not form related, not injury related, but between the ears stuff....

[plugger66]

Luke Ball is not injured but what happens is after a game he struggles to train and is basically in recovery mode for the next week. By doing this he has gradually lost fitness and is now training very hard to get his fitness back. After the game this week in a lower competition with less pressure he should be able to train with the main group which will give him 3 weeks of full training. As long as he goes ok Sunday and can train next week I would expect to see him back next Saturday.