Geelong's Depth Vs Our Depth

[makemytime]

Geelong suffered its 2nd consecutive defeat but one can say that they may have given the game away considering 8 players were omitted from the 22 that played the great game on that sunday not too long ago.

In: Wojcinski, Gillies, Gamble, Lonergan, Tenace, Djerrkura
Out: Cameron Ling (knee), Matthew Scarlett (back), James Kelly (hamstring), Darren Milburn (ankle), Gary Ablett (calf), Travis Varcoe (shoulder soreness), Mackie (late withdrawal)

Clearly, 8 players is a big loss to any team but I remember distinctly that the media was simply marvelling at Geeloing's depth when premiership player Stokes was left out a side... HOWEVER, looking at this now, their fringe players don't look to have the experience or the quality needed for a team that has only lost a handful of games in their last 60 games.

Depth in our club (players ready for call-up, not including 22 to play WC):
Armo
Begley
Dempster (in for Geary)
Eddy
L. Fisher (arguable, but he was breaking all club records in the preseason)
Geary
Gwilt
Maxy (slight injury atm )
King (suspended)
Goose
Miles (has been emergency in a number of games now)
Jack Steven


that list looks might impressive and far more than geelong's. Of the players that joined the Cats in the lions game, i would only think that wojcinski can be considered for a grand final.

WHO HAS THE BETTER DEPTH?
how do u make a poll?

[James]

I posted this in another thread on the cats. It's quite relevant to the topic at hand.

I tried to do a respective match up of their players to ours in order to gauge our side with similar injuries.

Unfortunately I couldn't find enough downhill skiers on our list to get the match-ups right, nor for Scarlett, as I'm sure there aren't any pigs listed at St Kilda?

Anyway, the side I came up with was something like...

B: Baker - Dawson - Eddy
HB: Gilbert - Fisher - Goddard
C: Dal Santo - Hayes - Ray
HF: Gram - Riewoldt - R. Clarke
F: Milne - Koschitzke - Schneider
R: Gardiner - Ball - Jones
INT: McEvoy - Geary - McQualter - Gwilt

If we can't win with that, why are we trying?

Our side barely takes a dent with similar injuries. I'd back that over 90% of sides.

[plugger66]

I posted this in another thread on the cats. It's quite relevant to the topic at hand.

I tried to do a respective match up of their players to ours in order to gauge our side with similar injuries.

Unfortunately I couldn't find enough downhill skiers on our list to get the match-ups right, nor for Scarlett, as I'm sure there aren't any pigs listed at St Kilda?

Anyway, the side I came up with was something like...

B: Baker - Dawson - Eddy
HB: Gilbert - Fisher - Goddard
C: Dal Santo - Hayes - Ray
HF: Gram - Riewoldt - R. Clarke
F: Milne - Koschitzke - Schneider
R: Gardiner - Ball - Jones
INT: McEvoy - Geary - McQualter - Gwilt

If we can't win with that, why are we trying?

Our side barely takes a dent with similar injuries. I'd back that over 90% of sides.

They had 9 out of their best side. You have about 4 out so of course it doesnt take a dent.

[ace]

Sorry but if you have to rely on your depth when you play in a grand final you have already lost.
The bottom six may loose a final but if you play your bottom 6 plus another worse bottom 6 you are gone.
Depth can only get you to the finals, then you need to field close to your best team with very few injuries.

[jonesy]

If we lost the equal amount of quality players over the past 7 days we would of got mauled in Brisbane last night also,by more.

[mad saint guy]

Not taking into account the season-over players (Hunt, Egan and Ottens. Nor X.Clarke or Allen for us)

Scarlett - Hudghton
Johnson - Milne
Ling - Jones
Milburn - R.Clarke
Mackie - S.Fisher
Ablett - Montagna
Kelly - McQuater

B: Gilbert, Dawson, Baker
HB: Gram, Blake, Goddard
C: Ray, Hayes, Dempster
HF: Schneider, Riewoldt, Geary
F: Gwilt, Koschitzke, Armitage

Foll: Gardiner, Ball, Dal Santo
Int: Begley, Eddy, King, L.Fisher

That side would not have had any trouble with the Brisbane team that flogged Geelong.

[Schillaci]

I posted this in another thread on the cats. It's quite relevant to the topic at hand.

I tried to do a respective match up of their players to ours in order to gauge our side with similar injuries.

Unfortunately I couldn't find enough downhill skiers on our list to get the match-ups right, nor for Scarlett, as I'm sure there aren't any pigs listed at St Kilda?

Anyway, the side I came up with was something like...

B: Baker - Dawson - Eddy
HB: Gilbert - Fisher - Goddard
C: Dal Santo - Hayes - Ray
HF: Gram - Riewoldt - R. Clarke
F: Milne - Koschitzke - Schneider
R: Gardiner - Ball - Jones
INT: McEvoy - Geary - McQualter - Gwilt

If we can't win with that, why are we trying?

Our side barely takes a dent with similar injuries. I'd back that over 90% of sides.

They had 9 out of their best side. You have about 4 out so of course it doesnt take a dent.

Agree.
They had their best player in Ablett out so take our best player out- Riewoldt....bit of a dent there already....some perspective is needed I think

[bigcarl]

If we lost the equal amount of quality players over the past 7 days we would of got mauled in Brisbane last night also,by more.

exactly. injuries can derail your season pretty quickly as our own recent history shows,

if they are just resting a few up, they had better hope for their own sakes that they can turn winning form on and off like a tap. i'm not sure that you can.

winning is habit forming but so is losing.

[vacuous space]

That side would not have had any trouble with the Brisbane team that flogged Geelong.

Our full side struggled with Brisbane at Docklands. I'm not confident we'd travel any better than Geelong did if we had our depth tested on a road trip to the Gabba.

[supersaints]

Ive said it before, Geelong missed the finals a few years ago when they had a couple of injuries, they don't have great depth, the fact that we have had a lot of injuries over the last five seasons (exept this one) enabled us to get game time into fringe players who developed. Most on the forum were saying that we had no depth but the fact was we were still very competative when we had half a dozen good players out for long periods this proved we had good depth. When the pussies got some injuries they fell in a hole three years ago, collingwood did the same and the Hawks this year......

[desertsaint]

Not taking into account the season-over players (Hunt, Egan and Ottens. Nor X.Clarke or Allen for us)

Scarlett - Hudghton
Johnson - Milne
Ling - Jones
Milburn - R.Clarke
Mackie - S.Fisher
Ablett - Montagna
Kelly - McQuater

B: Gilbert, Dawson, Baker
HB: Gram, Blake, Goddard
C: Ray, Hayes, Dempster
HF: Schneider, Riewoldt, Geary
F: Gwilt, Koschitzke, Armitage

Foll: Gardiner, Ball, Dal Santo
Int: Begley, Eddy, King, L.Fisher

That side would not have had any trouble with the Brisbane team that flogged Geelong.

Goose not in our best 29?

[Nattens]

Not taking into account the season-over players (Hunt, Egan and Ottens. Nor X.Clarke or Allen for us)

Scarlett - Hudghton
Johnson - Milne
Ling - Jones
Milburn - R.Clarke
Mackie - S.Fisher
Ablett - Montagna
Kelly - McQuater

B: Gilbert, Dawson, Baker
HB: Gram, Blake, Goddard
C: Ray, Hayes, Dempster
HF: Schneider, Riewoldt, Geary
F: Gwilt, Koschitzke, Armitage

Foll: Gardiner, Ball, Dal Santo
Int: Begley, Eddy, King, L.Fisher

That side would not have had any trouble with the Brisbane team that flogged Geelong.

Goose not in our best 29?

I like the part where he has Darren Milburn on the same page as Raph Clarke.

Hate to say this but Milburn will be ten times the better player than Raph will ever be.

[bergholt]

Not taking into account the season-over players (Hunt, Egan and Ottens. Nor X.Clarke or Allen for us)

Scarlett - Hudghton
Johnson - Milne
Ling - Jones
Milburn - R.Clarke
Mackie - S.Fisher
Ablett - Montagna
Kelly - McQuater

i don't reckon you've done this really well. why are you not taking into account season ended players? and for that matter isn't ottens back soon? and i think the matches themselves are dubious.

- ottens is first ruckman so that's gardiner.
- between egan, scarlett, milburn, mackie and hunt, that's an entire backline, so let's say hudghton, s fisher, gilbert, blake, r clarke - i reckon that's pretty close.
- midfielders ablett, ling, kelly. ablett's number one so that's hayes, the other two are down the list a bit, say jones and ray.
- forward johnson is leading goalkicker and most important forward. sounds like riewoldt to me.

so make up a st kilda team without:

gardiner, hudghton, s fisher, gilbert, blake, r clarke, hayes, jones, ray, riewoldt.

(though you can add in x clarke and allen, since i've taken into account those with an ended season.)

B: baker, dawson, dempster
HB: goddard, maguire, geary
C: gram, ball, armitage
HF: mcqualter, allen, gwilt
F: milne, koschitzke, schneider
R: king, dal santo, montagna
IC: mcevoy, eddy, begley, x clarke
E: miles, l fisher, steven

it's not a horrible side but the key positions have a bit of trouble, relying on allen in the front half and maguire in the back. also, eddy and begley have a lot of proving in front of them, not to mention x clarke!

[Schillaci]

That side would not have had any trouble with the Brisbane team that flogged Geelong.

Our full side struggled with Brisbane at Docklands. I'm not confident we'd travel any better than Geelong did if we had our depth tested on a road trip to the Gabba.

True. Brisbane have won 6 of 8 at the Gabba this year. Lost to the Pies and Blues. Blues only by 6 pts too. Gabba trip = likely loss for most teams

[plugger66]

Lets face neither side will win a GF with those injuries so it is a bit of luck at least on who can field the best side GF day. As for depth no side in the AFL has depth to cover 9 injuries. Who has the better depth, who knows but I can say one thing for certain, I hope we dont have to find out.

[Red]

How do you use Miles and Steven as depth when they haven't played

a league game yet? A little hopeful.

Also Geelong lost their best forward, best midfielder and best defender.

Take Roo, Lenny and imo Fisher and see how we would do?

[bergholt]

Depth in our club (players ready for call-up, not including 22 to play WC):
Armo
Begley
Dempster (in for Geary)
Eddy
L. Fisher (arguable, but he was breaking all club records in the preseason)
Geary
Gwilt
Maxy (slight injury atm )
King (suspended)
Goose
Miles (has been emergency in a number of games now)
Jack Steven

i'm sure the cats thought simon hogan, djerrkura, gamble, etc were "ready for call-up" but they were proved wrong. guess what? our players 22-35 aren't superstars either.

dempster, max, king are in, yep. l fisher and goose basically haven't played seniors for two years. armo, geary, eddy and gwilt have all been around the edges of the side without really securing a permanent spot, which suggests they aren't that amazing. miles, steven, begley are completely unproven. none of them are a replacement for the top few - hayes, riewoldt, etc.

look, they've got more injuries than us. hence their depth is being more sorely tested. on the weekend they were down past about number 30ish on their list. that's a long, long way from number one - who was out.

let's not lull ourselves into a false sense of security about our wonderful, untested "depth".

[Schillaci]

Not taking into account the season-over players (Hunt, Egan and Ottens. Nor X.Clarke or Allen for us)

Scarlett - Hudghton
Johnson - Milne
Ling - Jones
Milburn - R.Clarke
Mackie - S.Fisher
Ablett - Montagna
Kelly - McQuater

B: Gilbert, Dawson, Baker
HB: Gram, Blake, Goddard
C: Ray, Hayes, Dempster
HF: Schneider, Riewoldt, Geary
F: Gwilt, Koschitzke, Armitage

Foll: Gardiner, Ball, Dal Santo
Int: Begley, Eddy, King, L.Fisher

That side would not have had any trouble with the Brisbane team that flogged Geelong.

Goose not in our best 29?

I like the part where he has Darren Milburn on the same page as Raph Clarke.

Hate to say this but Milburn will be ten times the better player than Raph will ever be.

Here we go again...this Raph Clark bashing is giving me the sh!t$....agree that Milburn is a great player and Raph is not his equal but for the life of me I can't recall too many bagging him in September.
If you want to compare Raph to Milburn then let me say Montagna isn't fit to be Ablett's butt and Milne shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath as Stevie J...and as for McQualter and Kelly....hmmmmm.

[desertsaint]

Okay - how about this -and as ottens was alreay missing i have also excluded king.

ablett - hayes,
ling - CJ
Johnson - roo
milburn - baker
mackie - ray
kelly - schneider
scarlett - hudghton
ottens - king

giving us:

B: Gilbert, Dawson, Blake
HB: Gram, Fisher, Dempster
C: Montagna, Armitage, Goddard
HF: Gwilt, Kosi, Geary
F: Milne, Goose, Mcqualter

Foll: Gardiner, Ball, Dal Santo
Int: Begley, Eddy, McEvoy, L.Fisher

And goose is in!!

[bergholt]

Here we go again...this Raph Clark bashing is giving me the sh!t$....agree that Milburn is a great player and Raph is not his equal but for the life of me I can't recall too many bagging him in September.
If you want to compare Raph to Milburn then let me say Montagna isn't fit to be Ablett's butt and Milne shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath as Stevie J...and as for McQualter and Kelly....hmmmmm.

all agreed, what's your point? i don't think it was raph bashing, just stating the facts.

[Schillaci]

Here we go again...this Raph Clark bashing is giving me the sh!t$....agree that Milburn is a great player and Raph is not his equal but for the life of me I can't recall too many bagging him in September.
If you want to compare Raph to Milburn then let me say Montagna isn't fit to be Ablett's butt and Milne shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath as Stevie J...and as for McQualter and Kelly....hmmmmm.

all agreed, what's your point? i don't think it was raph bashing, just stating the facts.

Might not be Raph bashing...but why post just that one and not the others?

[mad saint guy]

- ottens is first ruckman so that's gardiner.
- between egan, scarlett, milburn, mackie and hunt, that's an entire backline, so let's say hudghton, s fisher, gilbert, blake, r clarke - i reckon that's pretty close.
- midfielders ablett, ling, kelly. ablett's number one so that's hayes, the other two are down the list a bit, say jones and ray.
- forward johnson is leading goalkicker and most important forward. sounds like riewoldt to me.

The way I did it was more for roles in the side rather than standing in the team, so some would do it differently. And the way I did it was in relation to now and a likely team by finals time, so no season-over players included.

I've got real doubts over Ottens' future. Much like Hamill, the club can't even guess when he'll be fit. He's apparently making no progress in his recovery and looks in real trouble.

Goose not in our best 29?

He won't be in the side at the same time as two of Max, Dawson and Blake. Lyon won't compromise structure to play Goose.

I like the part where he has Darren Milburn on the same page as Raph Clarke

Again, I was doing this on role and structure rather than quality. Milburn seemed to be the guy who can take the 2nd/3rd small/medium forwards and give a bit of run.