Double teaming our forwards

howlinwolf · Post: # 767101Post **howlinwolf** » Thu 02 Jul 2009 7:06pm

Geelong's plan is to double team Kosi and Nick as they did well in the final
last year. The media down here claims Harley and Taylor to play on Nick.

Whenever we've been comprehensively beaten this has happened because
we've add few other options up forward.

Logic therefore says we need to take advantage of this and add quality forwards

Double teaming will allow any other forward less pressure as there are
fewer defenders.

Here is an explanation why Goose missed out.

Gwilt in for me.

Dan Warna · Post: # 767120Post **Dan Warna** » Thu 02 Jul 2009 7:31pm

its an interesting one, that st kilda work to choke opposition forward lines.

the two teams that chased us so far are essendung and carlton who have a lot of running scoring midfielders.

Geelong have a lot of run in their team, their structure is so fluid.

It would be hard to choke them.

I'm really looking forward to see where we are at.

remember footscrag nearly capped the cats.

Animal Enclosure · Fri 03 Jul 2009 12:15am

It's hugely important that our 3rd forward stands up & puts some scoreboard pressure on Geelong.

Harley, Milburn and Mackie will cheat & drop off their men at every opportunity to help our Taylor and Scarlett.

Our mids need to move it exceptionally fast to Roo & Kosi one out or make sure they hit up one of the spare blokes we will have when the abovementioned drop off.

This is the game for BJ to stamp his authority as an elite player. He & Joey (and Dal) have taken huge strides this year but an ordinary showing will again put question marks on them.

jay young · Post: # 767332Post **jay young** » Fri 03 Jul 2009 10:39am

I hope Harley plays on Nick cause Harley is crap so is hawkins

InkerSaint · Fri 03 Jul 2009 11:16am

Roo and Kosi will be more than a handful this time around. There's just no comparison to last year. Kosi has already broken his goal tally record and Roo is on track to do the same. Taylor? Scarlett? Milburn? Harley? Pffft.

SainterK · Post: # 767357Post **SainterK** » Fri 03 Jul 2009 11:17am

They certainly doubled, even triple teamed Roo last meeting....the difference this year, we have Kosi in some great career best form.

Surely they can't take both forwards completely out of the game? Even if they managed to make a contest with our delivery, we have Milne and Schneider ready to pick up the pieces.

It's also no fluke that Goddard and Gilbert have drifted up forward on occasions of late.

I am confident that Ross is the man with the plan....

ace · Post: # 767363Post **ace** » Fri 03 Jul 2009 11:23am

Our third tall forward must really hurt Geelong if he is to prevent Geelong double teaming Riewoldt and Koschitzke.
Gwilt has never even looked like kicking 5 goals if left unattended.

Come that last Saturday in September, St Kilda does not need it best 22.
It needs the 22 that can best beat Geelong.

Geelong is not a generic team.
They have strengths and weaknesses.
St Kilda's team must be selected to minimise those strengths and exploit those weaknesses.

The third tall forward must be a serious marking threat.
Goose is a serious marking threat.
Gwilt couldn't intimidate a 3 year old child.

SaintWodonga · Fri 03 Jul 2009 11:28am

Good let them double team, milne & Schider should have a feild day!

#1GILL · Post: # 767371Post **#1GILL** » Fri 03 Jul 2009 11:30am

I think the time has come for Goddard to play 60% of the game fwd and 40% in the midfield. He has as much talent as roo and kosi and as we saw against west coast (even tho their defenders are alot poorer) he can kick a bag quickly.

I can see him kicking 5 or 6 easily if he is given enough time down fwd and the delivery to him is adequate

SainterK · Post: # 767374Post **SainterK** » Fri 03 Jul 2009 11:32am

ace wrote:Our third tall forward must really hurt Geelong if he is to prevent Geelong double teaming Riewoldt and Koschitzke.
Gwilt has never even looked like kicking 5 goals if left unattended.

Come that last Saturday in September, St Kilda does not need it best 22.
It needs the 22 that can best beat Geelong.

Geelong is not a generic team.
They have strengths and weaknesses.
St Kilda's team must be selected to minimise those strengths and exploit those weaknesses.

The third tall forward must be a serious marking threat.
Goose is a serious marking threat.
Gwilt couldn't intimidate a 3 year old child.

We all have our opinions, no problems with that...

However, if you left out the last line of your post....maybe I would take you more seriously and you wouldn't come across so arrogant.

aussiejones · Fri 03 Jul 2009 11:44am

I am a Goddard fan and I reckon he will be busting for Sundays game.His leads need to be honoured as he is a great kick and loves a goal.
I agree giving him time on the fowrad line as long as we are not obsessed with Roo who will be double teamed. Kosi needs a good start .

Our backs are solid and mid fielders in great touch.

The game will be won by our forward options providing they get delivery.
Our miserly backs will prevent Geelog scoring sufficiently.

Saints by 19 points.

Red · Post: # 767404Post **Red** » Fri 03 Jul 2009 12:33pm

The third tall can only standup if the ball is kicked to him.

If the midfield only look for Roo and Kosi it allows for the Geelong defence

to zone off and double team. The reason you can't double team the geelong

forwards is their midfield look for the open man, no matter who it is.

InkerSaint · Fri 03 Jul 2009 12:38pm

ace wrote:The third tall forward must be a serious marking threat.
Goose is a serious marking threat.
Gwilt couldn't intimidate a 3 year old child.

Goose has had some great reports in the VFL. Hard to say what his value would be to the team though. Now is not the time to be finding out.

If Milne and Schneids return to the form they had when Gwilt was last in the team his inclusion will be justified for mine.

InkerSaint · Fri 03 Jul 2009 12:43pm

Red wrote:The third tall can only standup if the ball is kicked to him.

If the midfield only look for Roo and Kosi it allows for the Geelong defence

to zone off and double team.

Which is no different from any other opponent the Saints have faced this year.

Do Geelong have the best defence in the league? Hardly. They're about 6th.

No-one has kept both Roo and Kosi quiet in the same game this year. One of them will get off the leash.

aussiejones · Fri 03 Jul 2009 12:51pm

I am hoping Kosi as he has been great fom 50m arc.
They can double or triple on both Roo & Kosi . This is where Goddard and Dal could float down
I am expecting a good game from Milne .

Red · Post: # 767423Post **Red** » Fri 03 Jul 2009 1:05pm

InkerSaint wrote: Do Geelong have the best defence in the league? Hardly. They're about 6th.

Actually Geelong has the second best defence behind the saints.

spert · Post: # 767432Post **spert** » Fri 03 Jul 2009 1:16pm

The whole key to Geelong is Ablett's work in and around the packs, and S. Johnson getting space in the forward line. SJ has got them out of tight situations in a few games this year, so he is the man to watch. Geelong make a huge effort to get loose men around the middle corridor and always kick to the loose player automatically, so good defensive work is required by our mids.

InkerSaint · Post: # 767441Post **InkerSaint** » Fri 03 Jul 2009 1:33pm

Red wrote:Actually Geelong has the second best defence behind the saints.

Points conceded for the last 5 rounds:

St Kilda____315
Adelaide____346
Collingwood_353
Brisbane____397
Western B.__412
Geelong____424
Sydney_____445
North Melb__463

On current form Geelong are about 6th.

Geelong are still 2nd behind St Kilda for inside-50s against. In that sense both teams' defenders are flattered by the contested ball work and forward pressure figures up the ground. But unlike St Kilda, Geelong leak like a sieve once the ball is in their defensive 50. St Kilda is top 5 for least goals per inside 50. Geelong is bottom 3.

Stoppers on Roo and Kosi aren't the problem. Supply is.

Red · Post: # 767449Post **Red** » Fri 03 Jul 2009 2:00pm

Inker look at the entire year not the amount of rounds to make your argument work. Not every team played each other in the past 6 rounds

InkerSaint · Post: # 767454Post **InkerSaint** » Fri 03 Jul 2009 2:13pm

Well gee whiz... we haven't played Geelong or Hawthorn yet so the stats mean nothing...

I disagree. 5 rounds is plenty of data to get a fair indication of form. And these are not subtle differences I have highlighted... they are substantial.

In that time Geelong have belted the suitcase out of Essendon, and escaped by a whisker (!) against the Dogs. St. Kilda likewise have had some close escapes, and some resounding wins. The figures still clearly demonstrate game styles and strengths.

Red · Post: # 767465Post **Red** » Fri 03 Jul 2009 2:38pm

Yes, but not playing the same opponents. If your going to use stats you

need to get as much data otherwise outside variables have too much effect

on the end result. Do you actually believe that Collingwood or the Western

Bulldogs are better defensively than Geelong?

InkerSaint · Post: # 767488Post **InkerSaint** » Fri 03 Jul 2009 3:47pm

Form fluctuates over a season. Richmond defeated West Coast who defeated the Bulldogs who defeated Richmond. Figures for the season-to-date also lie.

But since you asked for it... here's the figures for goals conceded per inside 50 against, for the season:

St Kilda____5.235
Adelaide___4.661
Brisbane___4.459
Collingwood_4.204
North Melb__4.195
Western B.__4.032
Geelong____4.018

So, which set of figures would you like to use to counter my argument???

You can trust Nick Riewoldt when he says that this game will be won or lost in the midfield.

samoht · Post: # 767492Post **samoht** » Fri 03 Jul 2009 4:15pm

i reckon the game will be won or lost in our forward line..

We need to be less predictable going forward to beat the Cats and to apply heaps of forward pressure to keep the ball locked in our forward 50.
Once it rebounds and ends up with Ablett and co we'll be in serious trouble, because the Cats use the ball so well.

Our quality talls will provide great marking contests - so we need quick, medium sized players in the forward line to put forward pressure on in the event that the ball gets punched clear in these contests or to pressure a Cat defender who is rebounding. or to get to the loose balls first.

Port Adelaide made huge inroads at Skilled stadium late in the game, when they changed their forward set up and used quick medium sized players to create space and weave their way around slow moving Cat defenders.

the Cat defense actually looked ordinary - we need to do the same from the word go.

Mix it up with some quick medium ground level players (rather than a third tall)...and lock it in the F50 and away from Ablett and co.

Red · Post: # 767560Post **Red** » Fri 03 Jul 2009 6:39pm

So you still believe Geelong is worse defensively than Collingwood and the

Bulldogs

InkerSaint · Post: # 767575Post **InkerSaint** » Fri 03 Jul 2009 7:14pm

Red wrote:So you still believe Geelong is worse defensively than Collingwood and the

Bulldogs

Do you think they're not?

Geelong's defence never gets challenged, due to sheer weight of numbers for contested ball and time in possession. And the fact that they've slipped from 7th for the season to 14th in the last 6 weeks shows they're getting complacent. Rude shock coming up if the Saints square with them for hard ball gets.