Tough Decisions To Be Made - Are You Up To It

[ace]

It is easy to pick your best 22 but it becomes a lot harder when you are asked who would you cut loose at the end of the year.
It is far more comfortable to welcome new recruits to the club than to say goodbye to existing players but the AFL has rules that must be complied with.
These are
• a maximum of 40 senior and veteran players,.
• each club must make at least 3 picks at the national draft so must reduce numbers to make way for these picks before the national draft,
• a maximum of 6 normal rookies,
• a maximum of 3 bonus rookies (first two years of former NSW scholarship holders).

Among senior and veteran listed players, any player who
• is being slowed by age,
• is vulnerable to losing their place in the AFL team,
• is experienced but does not have a regular place in the AFL team,
• is a young player who is not progressing,
• has been unavailable due to long term injury,
must be considered.


Players who are being slowing by age would include
Max Hudghton
Steven Baker
Steven King

Players who are vulnerable to losing their place in the AFL team would include
Andrew McQualter
James Gwilt
Raph Clarke

Players who are experienced but do not have a regular place in the AFL team would include
Leigh Fisher
Colm Begley
David Armitage
Robert Eddy
Luke Miles (included because he can not be rookied again due to age)
Sean Dempster
Matthew Maguire

Young players who are not progressing would include
Eljay Connors
Paul Cahill
Alistair Smith
Nicholas Heyne
Rhys Stanley
Tom Lynch
Jack Steven
Ben McEvoy

Players who have been unavailable due to long term injury would include
Jarryd Allen
Xavier Clarke

Players who seem safe due to having regular AFL places would include
Luke Ball
Jason Blake
Nick Dal Santo
Sam Fisher
Michael Gardiner
Jarryn Geary
Sam Gilbert
Brendon Goddard
Jason Gram
Lenny Hayes
Clinton Jones
Justin Koschitzke
Stephen Milne
Leigh Montagna
Farren Ray
Nick Riewoldt
Adam Schneider
Zac Dawson (can not be rookied again due to age)

A minimum of 4 players must be cut to reduce the number of senior and veterans to 37.
I would like to retain but would say goodbye to
• Eljay Connors – playing for Sandringham reserves is a no-no for a second year senior player hoping to be retained,
• Leigh Fisher – simply out of favour with the selection committee and likely to be by-passed for younger players if and when places in the AFL team become available,
• At least one of Max Hudghton and Steven King – probably ready to retire,
But in danger if they both don’t retire
• Jarryd Allen – has not shown his ability due to long term injuries
• Paul Cahill – playing for Sandringham seconds
• David Armitage – not getting regular AFL games
• Robert Eddy– not getting regular AFL games
• Luke Miles – not getting regular AFL games.


A young player like Eljay Connors may be cut with the possibility of being rookied like Brad Howard and previously Andrew McQualter.

Many of you will want to criticise my selections but if you do have the balls to nominate a replacement to be cut loose.

[CaptainRiewoldt]

Armitage - clearly going to gold coast
Ejay Connors -had his time to show something
Leigh Fisher possibly??? doesnt have defensive pressure ross requires.

so theres ya 3. Cahill i never liked just looks like a charlie gardiner nothin special. the rest you wouldnt want to let go all seem potentially great.


Miles and Eddy are going nowhere they are emergencies and will be in our top 22 next year I believe.

[saint vince]

Armitage - clearly going to gold coast

Why does everyone think he is going to the Gold Coast. Apart from on this site I have never heard this mentioned. Even in passing. Can you tell me where this info comes from CR since it is so clear to you.

[saint vince]

This is nearly impossible to do this far out from th end of the season. I was told by someone close to Maxy that he was due to retire at the en of 07 so I think this will be his last year. He will love going out with a flag. The other changes are nearly impossible to guess. Some players may want to leave some others may retire.

[Beno88]

Cahill cannot be delisted. Any player picked up in the national draft must remain on the senior list for a minimum of two years.

The only players under threat at this stage would be Leigh Fisher, Connors and Allen. Along with some of the rookies.

[Spinner]

Cahill cannot be delisted. Any player picked up in the national draft must remain on the senior list for a minimum of two years.

The only players under threat at this stage would be Leigh Fisher, Connors and Allen. Along with some of the rookies.

You have a two year contrcat...but u can be delisted.

[saintlee]

This is a tough gig, no one really stands out as a dud at the moment....

I would guess the following may be in trouble:
Leigh Fisher
Brad Howard
Khan Haretaku
Colm Begley

[ausfatcat]

Cahill cannot be delisted. Any player picked up in the national draft must remain on the senior list for a minimum of two years.

The only players under threat at this stage would be Leigh Fisher, Connors and Allen. Along with some of the rookies.

Cahill can be delisted but the saints would have to pay him out which would still be included in next years salary cap.

[Hurricane]

Players who are vulnerable to losing their place in the AFL team would include
Andrew McQualter
James Gwilt
Raph Clarke

Why is McQualter vulnerable? I am tired of reading posts that say Mini should be dropped or isnt worthy of a place in the senior side on a regular basis yet NOT ONE has given a valid reason (if a reason is given at all)

Mini has been great this year and IMHO is becoming more important to the structure every week, so why is he STILL a whipping boy on this site?

BANG BANG

[saint vince]

Players who are vulnerable to losing their place in the AFL team would include
Andrew McQualter
James Gwilt
Raph Clarke

Why is McQualter vulnerable? I am tired of reading posts that say Mini should be dropped or isnt worthy of a place in the senior side on a regular basis yet NOT ONE has given a valid reason (if a reason is given at all)

Mini has been great this year and IMHO is becoming more important to the structure every week, so why is he STILL a whipping boy on this site?

BANG BANG

I read that and started to write a reply and thought I wouljust leave it. Has been good all year.

[ace]

Rookie positions available next year will be 6 normal rookies and 3 bonus rookies (first two years of former NSW scholarship holders).

The 3 bonus rookie positions are easy to decide.
There are only three 3 candidates for 3 positions
Blake McGrath
Josh Duncan
Ted Widner

Normal rookie position contenders will be
• Young senior player dropped from senior list but hoping to be rookied e.g. Jarryd Allen, Paul Cahill, David Armitage,
• Tom Simpkin
• Brad Howard
• Steven Gaertner
• Ross Tungatalum
• Sam McGarry
• Khan Haretuku (no longer able to claim former NSW scholarship holder status, he must be promoted to senior list or face the national draft before being rookied again for only one more year).

The rookie draft will be impacted by the 4 months age increase in the national draft.
I would want at least two rookie picks, one in the hope of retaining the dropped senior player and the other if only to have the option to take a preselected Irish recruit.
I would definitely retain
• the young senior player dropped from senior list but hoping to be rookied e.g. Jarryd Allen, Paul Cahill, David Armitage,
• Tom Simpkin
• one or two of Steven Gaertner, Ross Tungatalum, Sam McGarry.

But I would say goodbye to
• Khan Haretuku – if he is going to make it he should be playing for Sandringham firsts in his second year as a rookie,
• Brad Howard – being dropped to Sandringham seconds sealed his fate.
• one or two of Steven Gaertner, Ross Tungatalum, Sam McGarry.


Again many of you will want to criticise my selections but if you do have the balls to nominate a replacement to be cut loose.

[ausfatcat]

tough decision but I would be delisting

L Fisher
C Begley
X Clarke (even thou he appears safe).

And maybe ask King to retire


BTW this is half a season off and many many things can happen in this time, we shouldn't be talking about this now.

[thirty-seven!?]

Also remember that we may want to elevate rookies.

If we want to keep them, there are three rookies who MUST be either elevated or delisted due to age or time on list.

These are;

Zac Dawson
Luke Miles
Khan Haretuku

Correct me if im wrong Ace, but if we choose to elevate a rookie (i assume we will at least elevate Dawson), does this mean we must then delist another member of the senior squad? ie. leaving 3 spaces on the senior list would involve 1 elevation and 4 delistings??

Also, there is potential to trade players...

We may be able to trade someone (eg Armo or Allen) who may have more opportunity at another club, and in turn, get a higher pick than we wouldve otherwise... as well as freeing up a position... Does this make sense?

[Unforgiven]

Cahill cannot be delisted. Any player picked up in the national draft must remain on the senior list for a minimum of two years.

Essendon delisted Tom Hislop after one season for discipline reasons. I beleive all they had to do way pay him out.

The 2 years is the minimum contract they must recieve, and rarely do they get offered any more, although Dayne Beams from the pies got offered 3 years.

Can't see Cahill being delisted, I have seen very little of him, but as the Gold Coast team is comming in soon, I would assume the club would like to hold onto most of it's youth.

[Animal Enclosure]

I love these threads that make judgments on players that the people have never seen play.

The list of 'young players that have not come on' is very amusing (or disturbing).

All I can say is thank god we have people running the club that know what they're doing & you muppets are kept at a safe distance.

Is it school holidays yet??? Or has the local sheltered workshop just got new computers???

Absolute nuff nuffs.

[Beno88]

I stand corrected. It wouldn't be a smart move to delist a first year player after one season of very limited chances. No point point paying for two unproven players in 2010 when we don't have to. Unless of course it's a similar scenario to Hislop.

[ace]

Armitage - clearly going to gold coast
Ejay Connors -had his time to show something
Leigh Fisher possibly??? doesnt have defensive pressure ross requires.

so theres ya 3. Cahill i never liked just looks like a charlie gardiner nothin special. the rest you wouldnt want to let go all seem potentially great.


Miles and Eddy are going nowhere they are emergencies and will be in our top 22 next year I believe.

Sorry but when Miles and Dawson are added to the seniors + veterans the total comes to 41.
That means that you need to nominate at least 4 players.

Also the only way Armitage can go to the Gold Coast Bikinis for next year is as a priority rookie pick, after facing the national draft.
This year Gold Coast can sign up to 12 kids aged between 17 2/3 and under 18 at the end of the year.
They also get 5 priority rookie picks.

This years draft is thin due to the raising of the national draft age from 17 2/3 at the end of the year to 18.
But Gold coast does not participate in this year's national draft as they won't have a senior team next year.
The draft next year will be impacted by the Gold Coast Bikinis
3 Northern Territory Zone picks,
5 Queensland Zone picks.
National draft priority picks 1, 2, 3, 5, 7, 9, 11, 13, 15.
First pick in subsequent rounds of the national draft, pre season draft and rookie draft.
Recruitment of up to one uncontracted player per club.

If Armitage is dropped this year he can go into the national draft this year or wait until next year in the hope that Gold Coast will recruit him.

St Kilda could well adopt a strategy to retain him for one more year so that he could becomes the uncontracted player recruited by Gold Coast next year.

[Quixote]

My advice is -

Enjoy the season first!!

[DWOODROW]

Armitage - clearly going to gold coast
Ejay Connors -had his time to show something
Leigh Fisher possibly??? doesnt have defensive pressure ross requires.

so theres ya 3. Cahill i never liked just looks like a charlie gardiner nothin special. the rest you wouldnt want to let go all seem potentially great.


Miles and Eddy are going nowhere they are emergencies and will be in our top 22 next year I believe.

You are a muppet if you think Armitage is going to Gold Coast. ha hahahahahahahahahah

[Ghost Like]

I don't think this is a case of whether or not we have the 'balls' to do this exercise, it's more a case of waiting until we have all the information to make these decisions. There is still a long way to go in this season, a lot can happen in terms of form, improvement, opportunities, injuries, discipline. I think we should wait until we see how the season pans out so we have an idea of what we need and what we don't need.

[DWOODROW]

I don't think this is a case of whether or not we have the 'balls' to do this exercise, it's more a case of waiting until we have all the information to make these decisions. There is still a long way to go in this season, a lot can happen in terms of form, improvement, opportunities, injuries, discipline. I think we should wait until we see how the season pans out so we have an idea of what we need and what we don't need.

Good Post.

[ace]

Also remember that we may want to elevate rookies.

If we want to keep them, there are three rookies who MUST be either elevated or delisted due to age or time on list.

These are;

Zac Dawson
Luke Miles
Khan Haretuku

Correct me if im wrong Ace, but if we choose to elevate a rookie (i assume we will at least elevate Dawson), does this mean we must then delist another member of the senior squad? ie. leaving 3 spaces on the senior list would involve 1 elevation and 4 delistings??

Also, there is potential to trade players...

We may be able to trade someone (eg Armo or Allen) who may have more opportunity at another club, and in turn, get a higher pick than we wouldve otherwise... as well as freeing up a position... Does this make sense?

We had 39 senior and veteran players after last years draft so were entitled to 1 nominated rookie over and above the 6 normal and 3 bonus rookie places (only 2 used).

With 3 potentially veterans next year- Hudghton, Baker & Hayes we should have a full count of 40 next year.
So the first permanent promotion of a rookie is at the expense of the nominated rookie.

Every other permanent promotion is at the expense of senior player.
Miles and Dawson can not be rookies again due to age.

Haretuku's two years are up, he must face the national draft before he can be preselected as a rookie for only one more year.

Yes trading a player for improved draft picks (no-one in return) would free up a place.
But then again you must make the tough decision of whom.

[ace]

I don't think this is a case of whether or not we have the 'balls' to do this exercise, it's more a case of waiting until we have all the information to make these decisions. There is still a long way to go in this season, a lot can happen in terms of form, improvement, opportunities, injuries, discipline. I think we should wait until we see how the season pans out so we have an idea of what we need and what we don't need.

Good Post.

We posters may be able to wait but the club has to start to make decisions on contracts and salaries so that they have everyone they intend to retain is bedded down before the end of the season.

[ace]

Players who are vulnerable to losing their place in the AFL team would include
Andrew McQualter
James Gwilt
Raph Clarke

Why is McQualter vulnerable? I am tired of reading posts that say Mini should be dropped or isnt worthy of a place in the senior side on a regular basis yet NOT ONE has given a valid reason (if a reason is given at all)

Mini has been great this year and IMHO is becoming more important to the structure every week, so why is he STILL a whipping boy on this site?

BANG BANG

I agree I would not cut Mini either but his name does come up in this forum's discussions so I included him in that category.
I think he does a good job in applying forward pressure and crumbing to the big guys.
By all means retain him but who would you cut is the question.

[BAM! (shhhh)]

From the above list, players I would think will come under scrutiny, either by themselves or otherwise will be:

VETERANS will always be scrutinised, but I don't think ours are in danger of being pushed out:
Hudghton's will be injury based, does he want to go around again? If the fire's in his belly I would still maintain that until he's back in the AFL side and gets beaten, he's as good as his last game - long list for AA. It's up to him.

King also is his own guide. Until McEvoy can challenge for the 2nd ruck in his own right, or at least demand the development time, King is not in danger. Based on the 1 game McEvoy has had so far, there's still value to seasoning him in the seconds.

Baker hadn't put a foot wrong until the last couple of weeks, and for mine, his hardness has been one of those team lifting things that had me thinking I hadn't quite appreciated just how much we missed him last year. Wouldn't expect him to even really come under scrutiny until Dempster is 100%, and that likely means next year.

"VULNERABLE"
Mini - Totally disagree. While he's a role player who doesn't put up spectacular possession numbers, he's totally convinced me in his role, and I'd expect him to continue to improve. Should the opportunity present, the way he attacks the contest and wins the ball, I wouldn't be surprised to see him step up as an inside ball winning mid.

Gwilt - Tough role, and totally sold the role is valuable, not necessarily sold Gwilt is the guy. Needs to be knocked out of the team before his list spot is in danger though... for mine, I'd wonder what happens if we re-distribute the resources, play Goddard in that role, push Raph up to the wing, bring in a Hudghton or Maguire and play Dawson in Raph's backline role.

Raph - I suspect the view of him within the club is different to that held here. For mine he's a love him/hate him type... when he's got time and space, I like him. When he's fit and throwing himself into contests as the 3rd man, I like him. When he's under pressure in the backline and putting panic handballs at his teammates feet, or kicking clearing balls straight to the opposition, I hate him. If he's going to truly make it, he needs to put a long stretch of fitness and form together at some stage, as we're starting to build up a likely pipeline of kids... again, given age, until he stops being selected, I don't see him in danger of delisting.

EXPERIENCED BUBBLE BOYS:
L. Fisher: Big trouble if he can't win himself into the team. Decent depth player, but many ahead at St Kilda.

Begley: Do we really have the need for him?

Armo: Would think he's okay for now... would think he may end up at the Gold Coast.

Maguire: May be trade bait?