Age Article bothers me.

roxanne · Post: # 738811Post **roxanne** » Thu 14 May 2009 1:15pm

Does anyone have a view on the article by Jake Niall in the Age today
'Harveys Sad Timing'. He makes some valid points but running underneath, unspoken but clear, is is intense dislike for the St Kilda Footy Club.
Or am I being too sensitive.
Some people just can't stand us having some success on the field. We should know our place as the whipping boy - we're not allowed a winning culture, we're all about the 'disco', we've only won one flag, we are not allowed to be winners bwah bwah.... St Kilda winning makes the Jake Nialls of the world really upset and they have a crack at us any way they can. That he cloaked it in a sympathy for Robert Harvey story makes me sick.
But then again...I could be too sensitive.

Sorry I don't know how to post the link by the way...it is on-line.

jonesy · Post: # 738818Post **jonesy** » Thu 14 May 2009 1:23pm

If Harves had of stayed with us as an assistant then I'd feel more sorry for him. The fact that he went to carlton makes me lose sympathy for him. Before you all jump down my throat saying it was the right thing for him to do,well you're probably right.
However I ask the question, do these former players love the club more than you or I ? Of course they don't!!!! If they did they'd never think of leaving the place. The supporters come first in my books,the premiership is about us and the current squad...dare I say it,but F*** Harves

!

saint vince · Thu 14 May 2009 1:25pm

Thought it wasn't a bad article. Pretty acurate account of our history of the last 20 years or so. Gave us a rap for this year bagged our culture which was terrible in the 80's and 90's. Not too bad for mine.

Here is the article link btw
http://www.theage.com.au/news/rfnews/ha ... 45421.html

joffaboy · Post: # 738828Post **joffaboy** » Thu 14 May 2009 1:32pm

I think the article is spot on.

However as i said after round two - in a macarbe way, the departure of Harvey may have had a psychological effect on the players left.

No longer can they rely on harvs to do all the hard work. No more letting the champion shoulder the burden.

When Lyon told the playing group they were kidding themselves if they think a 30 y.o. mid in Cousins was going to win them a flag, he could also have pointed to our champ Harv's.

Harv's was a Saints champ and always will be - but he couldn't do it alone.

Mabye with him gone and Lyon deciding not to pick up Cousins, the players have to finally accept responsibility for the TEAM - not leave for the typical Saints messiah to do it for them.

results would suggest this may be the case.

TriColourDisciple · Thu 14 May 2009 1:40pm

What a 'space-filler' of an article that is. meaningless rubbish scraped from the bottom of a barrell intended as a disguised put down to our club more than anything else. You're a real class act Jake...er..whatsyaname?

I, for one wont be jumping down your throat jonesy. Totally agree.

perfectionist · Thu 14 May 2009 2:00pm

If the point of the article was to rub Robert Harvey's nose into the ground then he has succeeded. Poor form, I say.

InkerSaint · Post: # 738853Post **InkerSaint** » Thu 14 May 2009 2:05pm

I don't think he's having a crack at St Kilda in its current incarnation, but maybe the Saints of old. And to be fair, his comments are pretty spot on. Gotta cop it on the chin.

Jake Niall wrote:But he will be entitled to feel dudded by the footy gods. He left the game as the player who had played more than anyone without a premiership.

Harvey's curse...

Jake Niall wrote:His great crime was that he played football for St Kilda between 1988 and 2008, a span in which the club flirted with greatness three times. St Kilda failed Robert Harvey. If the club wins its second premiership 12 months after his exit, he should be among the first thanked for carrying it on the journey.

St Kilda failed Harvey, it failed itself and its fans, and it failed many other fine players. But not for want of trying, or any other singular factor. In that way Harvey's curse was St Kilda's curse.

All this talk about flags is good and well, but we haven't won it yet. We look mighty good in May, and that's about it. However it's Jake Niall's job to take the lid off, and stir up hype - that's what sells newspapers.

IF they win the flag I'm sure Harvey won't be forgotten in the honours. In fact if they didn't dedicate it to him I'd be mildly disappointed. But - to reframe joffaboy's point - it may have taken his departure to make the playing group realise they needed to shoulder the burden themselves. It's just too bad.

B W and R all over · Thu 14 May 2009 2:47pm

jonesy wrote: However I ask the question, do these former players love the club more than you or I ? Of course they don't!!!! If they did they'd never think of leaving the place. The supporters come first in my books,the premiership is about us and the current squad...dare I say it,but F*** Harves !

Difference is our income and livelihoods don't depend on it.
It is just a hobby to us and finances don't come into it.

The bloke does have to earn money you know.

plugger66 · Post: # 738868Post **plugger66** » Thu 14 May 2009 2:53pm

Good article. Why do people think every article is a put down of the Saints in some way. Like earlier this year people were saying the Herald Sun dont say anything positive about us because we are sponsered by the Age. What rubbish. We are winning and the articles are positive. If we were losing they would be negative but it would have nothing to do with the Age sponsorship.

Ghost Like · Post: # 738870Post **Ghost Like** » Thu 14 May 2009 2:58pm

Can't complain about the article, a fair comment on what St Kilda was and is this season. Can't see Harves being put out by this, it is what it is...a history lesson.

Hugh Drod · Post: # 738872Post **Hugh Drod** » Thu 14 May 2009 3:01pm

its bulls***. Harvey tried and he failed to win a flag. he played a granny at least. if we win the flag the main reason will pobably be that we didnt' "do it for anyone" but as a team.
i reread that artciel and still dont really know what hes actually trying to say. we are s***. its our terible clubs fault Harvey didn't play in a flag?

get f***ed

plugger66 · Post: # 738873Post **plugger66** » Thu 14 May 2009 3:03pm

Hugh Drod wrote:its bulls***. Harvey tried and he failed to win a flag. he played a granny at least. if we win the flag the main reason will pobably be that we didnt' "do it for anyone" but as a team.
i reread that artciel and still dont really know what hes actually trying to say. we are s***. its our terible clubs fault Harvey didn't play in a flag?

get f***ed

Interesting perpective.

stinger · Post: # 738874Post **stinger** » Thu 14 May 2009 3:06pm

more than a bit of truth in that article ...but a lot of crap as well.... also...the guy's getting a bit ahead of himself ..
we have only won 7 games ffs.....

...don't worry....opposition supporters...including journos harbour hatred towards some other sides....we top the list in some eyes.....they will be queuing up to have a shot at us if we keep winning.....

Hugh Drod · Post: # 738878Post **Hugh Drod** » Thu 14 May 2009 3:12pm

these old geezers still harp on about the party days at moorabin but it was like 20 years ago.

InkerSaint · Post: # 738880Post **InkerSaint** » Thu 14 May 2009 3:18pm

Speaking of which, did anyone spot that little snippet in today's H-S?

Something along the lines of, they know who Harvey's kids are going to barrack for in the round 12 Carlton-St Kilda match... apparently they burst into tears the first time he came home in a Blues jumper.

roxanne · Post: # 738883Post **roxanne** » Thu 14 May 2009 3:26pm

So did I !

Stephen Theodore · Thu 14 May 2009 3:27pm

Unfortunately, there's a lot more truth than rubbish in that article.

Loyal · Post: # 738886Post **Loyal** » Thu 14 May 2009 3:38pm

TriColourDisciple wrote:You're a real class act Jake...er..whatsyaname?

De Niall, Jake De Niall.

Thu 14 May 2009 6:20pm

I think this is the worst bit of the article ... appauling bias from a journalist.

Jake Niall wrote:

His great crime was that he played football for St Kilda between 1988 and 2008

Firstly in that period, there were 21 premierships won. Not all clubs won a premiership in that period. Would it have been a crime if he played for Richmond or Melbourne or the Western Bulldogs or even Fremantle if they had been around for 21 years?

It was his honour to play for St Kilda and St Kilda's honour having him play 21 seasons and our honour to watch him play for the club and the jumper. He played during a period, where we had some great teams and he made some great friends and won many fans in and out of the club. In that period he tasted some success in the early then late 90s and then again in the period 2004 to 2008 playing many finals and one grand final but a premiership eluded him and the club despite winning two night premierships.

He commited no crime.

The only crime is that this was written about a club that he loves. I believe that harves would be embarrassed, shocked and even angry about this article.

He may wear navy blue and white for a job but he still bleeds red, white and black and if anyone has any doubts at all, then you need to take a good hard look at the man, his loyalty, his character and his selfless acts.

Legendary · Post: # 739016Post **Legendary** » Thu 14 May 2009 7:54pm

Moreover, the peer assessment systems for leadership groups, pioneered by Ray McLean, weren't around in the early and mid-90s.

Why then, Mr. Niall, was Ray McLean working with St Kilda between 1996 and 1998?

Can you explain this to us in your esteemed wisdom?

Perhaps St Kilda actually played with a semblance of professionalism under both Ken Sheldon and Stan Alves, and were a committed team under Alves in the same way they are now?

He attributes far too much responsibility for recent events with our history in the 1980's.

When Ken Sheldon took over, and most certainly by the time we were playing in a Grand Final in 1997, St Kilda had moved on.

We may have spent time at the bottom of the ladder in the early 2000's, but that was due to poor employment decisions, and not some party-boy culture.

St Kilda, like many clubs has had opportunities to win premierships and has not taken them.

That's footy.

People read far too much into history in an attempt to explain current events, because the TRUE, logical explanations for why we failed in 2004 and 2005 - injuries, mistakes with player management - are far too boring to write about.

Bernard Shakey · Thu 14 May 2009 9:34pm

Hugh Drod wrote:these old geezers still harp on about the party days at moorabin but it was like 20 years ago.

And our premiership was like 40 years ago, young fella.

Animal Enclosure · Thu 14 May 2009 9:59pm

jonesy wrote:If Harves had of stayed with us as an assistant then I'd feel more sorry for him. The fact that he went to carlton makes me lose sympathy for him. Before you all jump down my throat saying it was the right thing for him to do,well you're probably right.
However I ask the question, do these former players love the club more than you or I ? Of course they don't!!!! If they did they'd never think of leaving the place. The supporters come first in my books,the premiership is about us and the current squad...dare I say it,but F*** Harves !

Well said Jonesy, as soon as Banger pulled on that disgusting navy top he lost me.

He'll get me straight back when he takes it off however!