Who do we need to develop the most - going fwd...

[BigMart]

Niel Craig mentioned that we are a mature team which is seasoned, with hard bodies.....he is correct....

Our core team comes from the 1996-2004 drafts......many from the famous 2001 draft (Ball, X, Dal, Gram, Maguire, Joey, Schnieder)....they are all 25ish.....prior to that we have Vets from the 96 & 98 Drafts (Max, Kingy, Gards, Hayes and Bakes) & KPP's from 99/00 (Blakey, Roo, Kosi and Rookie Milne)...

That is 15

Post 2001 we have got 2002 players (BJ, Fish, Dempster)

2003 (Raph, Sam F)

2004 (Farren Ray and Mini) - There is around Half our squad - and the core of the best 22 all age 23 or more

So who (22 or under) is coming through that need to develop for the future....

A Key Defender is very important as Max is retiring at seasons end....and Goose an unknown....

Gilbert (22, 194cm)....is already developed and will get better
Dawson (22, 195cm)....a great rookie pick up IMO
Then one of
Allen (20, 193cm), Lynch (18, 192cm), Cahill (18, 193cm),
Were all recruited as Fwds.....one may well end up a defender
Gaertner (19, 199cm), Haretuku (19, 198cm) are both speculative Rookies and are a mile away (will play sandy seconds) the are both big boys and wonderful athletes learning the game....if one eventuates, it will be a win..

The Ruck is a problem area, with both senior ruckmen at the end....ideally your #2 Ruck would be an apprentice....

McEvoy (19, 200cm) is the obvious choice, and as a first rnd DP you would hope he will eventuate....but some worrying signs are concerning (mobility), has great leadership qualities...
Stanley (18, 202cm) looks a promising athlete, but a mile off it...
McGrath (18, 208cm) is a mouth watering prospect but again is a mile off it, and speculative, but has natural sporting ability..

The midfield is always important....cannot have to many developing

Armitage (20) is a First Rounder that must develop in 2009....like McEvoy there is a query on him....
Howard (21) has not developed as most would have liked, given another crack..
Steven (18) has many fans, but is yet to have a crack..
Conners (19) looked no where near it last year, but has been a bolter in 2009 IMO.....a Xavier Ellis type which can work out in modern footy....good skills.
Eddy (21) Looks to have a career there, but will probably never be a star, he may end up with a L.Fisher type career....solid..
Geary (20) is almost there....will make it eventually IMO
Jones (23) is older by age, but was taken later, he has limitations..
Begley (22) was given a second chance, much like dawson, a low risk.
Smith (18) is a speculative pick...
McGarry (18) looks in the Eddy type mould as a hard worker....could end up an Andrew Thompson or nothing.
Tungalutum (18) is primarily a small fwd, but is a great speculative pick with Milne at 28yo...

Mid-size defenders.....do not need a glut of them, as they are tweeners generally, but a couple is good
Miles (22, 185cm) good athlete, good character....good depth rookie atm
Simpkin (18, 188cm) speculative

Mid-size talented fwds are in demand as we DO NOT have a good one....Gwilt is NOT the answer IMO (not a good enough mark)
Lynch (18, 192cm) is not a KPP and was recruited for this in mind IMO...he was a safe bet.
Heyne (18, 187cm) could possibly turn out to be a steal, he has X-factor and talent, but has always had a query on consistency (which is why he fell through) can do the amazing and go missing...He has the raw ability to end up a S.Johnson or O'Keefe....but could also be a flop....

good thing is we now have a lot of developing players, rather than depth players......many may be misses.....but if we get half of those as hits, we will stay around the mark..

[saintsRrising]

Like you I in another thread today have flagged our most pressing need asa mid sized forward that can kick goals.
Most of our others bases are reasonably cobered...though the unknown is the quaity of our recruits and just hwo good enough will become....

The Ruck is a problem area, with both senior ruckmen at the end....ideally your #2 Ruck would be an apprentice....

McEvoy (19, 200cm) is the obvious choice, and as a first rnd DP you would hope he will eventuate....but some worrying signs are concerning (mobility), has great leadership qualities...
Stanley (18, 202cm) looks a promising athlete, but a mile off it...
McGrath (18, 208cm) is a mouth watering prospect but again is a mile off it, and speculative, but has natural sporting ability..

..

However on the ruckmen..I do not see King and Gardiner as being at the end yet. King is just over 30 and Gardi just under.

Both have a track record of injury.... which prides some doubt, but I would see both as most likely playing 2009 and 2010...and at least one as very likely to.

If so this will provide enough time for Ben or another to develop...as I think that they are all about two years away (and yes not all will most likely make it). Though Ben could play some games occassionally as he is more advanced than the others.

ideally your #2 Ruck would be an apprentice....


..

In terms of purely develop a new ruckman I agree.

But in terms of maximising our chances this year I thik the King Gardiner ruck duo is the better way to go.

Now fit...they makea very handy ruck duo.

Last week they got on top of Jolly which is no mean effort.
Againts Ottens/Blake they match up well. Ditto for the Hawks rucks or the Dogs.

[saintsRrising]

And one not on your list..Eljay...may surprise us all...

[joffaboy]

Great thread. I wonder if our young ones will be enough to whether the Gold Coast thievery of all the best youngsters for the next two or so years.

Our oldest players in Max the rucks and Lenny are covered (notionally) and if we can develop our defence - the mid sized forward may well be covered by Sam Gilbert.

[PJ]

And one not on your list..Eljay...may surprise us all...

Conners (19) looked no where near it last year, but has been a bolter in 2009 IMO.....a Xavier Ellis type which can work out in modern footy....good skills.

[Eastern]

Our list management needs to be evolutionary. I believe we need 3-5 players to step up to a new level each & every year. As for positions on the ground and players already at the club, I would look at it in this order;
McEvoy (ruck)
Armitage-Steven (midfielders)
Dawson-Miles (key back)
Lynch (3rd-key forward)
McGrath (ruck)
all other midfielders, especially those above 185cm

!!

[BigMart]

We would expect 'first rounders' Armo, Macca, Lynch to become players....

History says that our first picks generally are 'blue chip' investments...

Hall (95), Max (96), Lenny (98), Roo(00), Kosi (00), Ball (01), X (01), Dal (01), BJ (02), Raph (03) all became players....

only

Walton (97), Beetham (99), Watts (05 - inj) did not pan out....

Mini (04) is still in the mix...

Our rookies over the past 2 seasons are the interesting ones....
Jones, Eddy, Geary, Miles, Dawson - all looking OK...

[Bernard Shakey]

Steven, Eddy and Geary are ready to go (once Steven gets over his non reported ankle injury).

Lynch and Heyne are the key to the future.

McEvoy and Mcgrath could be great ruck prospects, but big guys don't mature physically and mentally until about 23 or 24.

Allen can hopefully make a full recovery.

Miles and Dawson also look to be part of the future.

I'm not sure about Armitage, but I hope he makes it.

Saints look good for the next few years at least.

[maverick]

AGree this is a vg thread, like it when regular ressie watchers put their gonads on the line and call a few.

I think its promising that McEvoy remains an emergency at this stage of the year, to me it means he has had a solid pre season.

I like the Eljay/Ellis comparison, really like Ellis.

I agree on our needs, a medium defender and medium/smallish forward, a Barker and Winmar type would be good

[Otiman]

I agree on our needs, a medium defender and medium/smallish forward, a Barker and Winmar type would be good

I would probably call Gram a "Winmar Type"

[chook23]

I agree on our needs, a medium defender and medium/smallish forward, a Barker and Winmar type would be good

I would probably call Gram a "Winmar Type"

only thing in common a st kilda jumper

[Bernard Shakey]

I would probably call Gram a "Winmar Type"

You must be kidding, or you never saw Neil Elvis Winmar play?

[PJ]

The next group of mids -

Armo & Steven both in and under and capable of kicking goals. Bit disappointed we haven't seen either so far but with injuries and pressure for spots that's to be expected.

I've heard really good reports from here in SA about Reece (spelling??) Stanley - a ruckman with attitude. The one thing that strikes me about Gardy is his absolute faith in himself - you can see it in this guys face, he doesn't give a rats who he's against he's gonna flog anybody that happens to be in front of him. Big men need to own the place and throw their weight around like they know it. The last few ruckmen we've had have been less than imposing.

Heyne, Lynch & Tunga - generation next forward line. This area looks good but will need to be managed well. They can't just wait in Sandy for the next 2 years they'll need introducing to the firsts in the next 12 mths - perhaps Tunga in 24 mths.

[Saintersss]

I've tried to make out a team of the youngsters mentioned and it turned out okay, most positions were filled, which is a good sign.

B: Miles Gilbert Gaertner
HB: Smith Dawson Begley
C: Geary Armitage Conners
HF: Allen Lynch Heyne
F: Tungalutum McEvoy Cahill
FOLL: Stanley Steven Jones
Inter: McGrath Eddy McGarry Haretuku Howard Simpkin

Seems like we have a lot of KKP, but not to many quality outside midfielders.

[Spinner]

Going by the above - I am extremely worried about on young talant coming through.....


It seems to go Armitage, Geary, Steven, McEvoy, Lynch........and then the rest. And three of those have only played 1 game between them.

[markinUSA]

Great thread thanks... really good read.

[borderbarry]

I dont think Jones should be in the youngsters team. He is about 25 now is'nt he? He is the 13th eldest player on the list.

[esaint66]

Lynch (18, 192cm) is not a KPP and was recruited for this in mind IMO...he was a safe bet.

He didn't play much of his junior football as a foward, only came into that role as a fill in for injury for the Dragons.

Spoke to him and he thinks he was recruited as a player that they were going to mould of the half back as a replacement for one of the backs when Hudgton retires. Remember he did get 15 on the beep test.

He has the speed, kick and Marking ability to be a 'Power Foward' of the future, but he is also strong in defence and has great endurance. A real utility.

[savatage]

I think Al Smith will be a beauty in a couple of years time. Keep an eye out on his development.

[evertonfc]

I think Al Smith will be a beauty in a couple of years time. Keep an eye out on his development.

I remember you talking up a similarly skinny fleet-footed midfielder with good skills when nobody else was too sure about him some seven or so years ago.

That player turned out to be very good. His name? Leigh Montagna.

Are you seeing similarities already, Sav?

[BigMart]

Lynch better be something......we overlooked Tom Swift for him.....don't be surprised if Swift ends up a star.....he has already shown a lot....

On draft day it was said that he was drated with medium fwd in mind....

[plugger66]

Lynch better be something......we overlooked Tom Swift for him.....don't be surprised if Swift ends up a star.....he has already shown a lot....

On draft day it was said that he was drated with medium fwd in mind....

Not being a smart arse but what has Swift done this year that Lynch hasnt.

[BigMart]

Played seniors......and impacted games....

he got into the best and had plenty of the ball in the opening NAB cup game....

[esaint66]

Played seniors......and impacted games....

he got into the best and had plenty of the ball in the opening NAB cup game....

Lynch played in the Challenge game against Port at AAMI, he kicked a goal and had a i think 5 or 6 tackles inside 50, whilst playing right back in the square.

May not be a brilliant game, but i didn't think it would be any worse than Swift's game against the Pies.