2009 Team Shaping Up

[Legendary]

I agree with plugger66


Jason Blake, whether you like it or not, is in our starting 18 players and has been for the last 2-3 seasons.

He's going to be in the side.

[Saints Premiers 2008]

this team is a bit different but it just clicks in my mind obviously question marks over Maguire and Baker aswell as Lynch and Dempster will be out for a while but if everyone was healthy next year this would be the team i would pick.

B: S Gilbert - M Hudghton – S Baker

HB: S Dempster - M Maguire - S Fisher

C: C Begley - L Hayes - J Gram

HF: N Dal Santo - N Riewoldt - L Montagna

F: S Milne - R Clarke - J Koschitzke

Foll: S King - B Goddard - L Ball

Inter : D Armitage - J Steven - T Lynch - F Ray


What does everyone think ?

Slow as a wet week

speed is over-rated...our niche is getting the pill in and under and if not tackling from our main tacklers

if we aren't a speedy side why try and play that way??? if we try and move it on at all costs we turn it over...supporters get cranky despite always wanting the 'play on at all costs' and begin to point their fingers at something/someone else...

to me begley and ray are runners...so is gram...so is joey...thats 4...we want to be a team of unaccountable runners now??? so who takes brown or franklin??? begley, gram and montagna who will all get slaughtered at the same time

perspective please

[WayneJudson42]

this team is a bit different but it just clicks in my mind obviously question marks over Maguire and Baker aswell as Lynch and Dempster will be out for a while but if everyone was healthy next year this would be the team i would pick.

B: S Gilbert - M Hudghton – S Baker

HB: S Dempster - M Maguire - S Fisher

C: C Begley - L Hayes - J Gram

HF: N Dal Santo - N Riewoldt - L Montagna

F: S Milne - R Clarke - J Koschitzke

Foll: S King - B Goddard - L Ball

Inter : D Armitage - J Steven - T Lynch - F Ray


What does everyone think ?

Slow as a wet week

speed is over-rated...our niche is getting the pill in and under and if not tackling from our main tacklers

if we aren't a speedy side why try and play that way??? if we try and move it on at all costs we turn it over...supporters get cranky despite always wanting the 'play on at all costs' and begin to point their fingers at something/someone else...

to me begley and ray are runners...so is gram...so is joey...thats 4...we want to be a team of unaccountable runners now??? so who takes brown or franklin??? begley, gram and montagna who will all get slaughtered at the same time

perspective please

Disagree on this. Extra speed allows you to create pressure on the opp'n players. Nothing sh1tted me more this year than watching our players fumble and turn over becoz of the pressure applied by fast opp'n players closing in quickly.

The flip side is trying to catch those buggers...

Quick ball movement and leg speed are the keys to getting the ball in quickly to our forwards. IMOO

[Saints Premiers 2008]

this team is a bit different but it just clicks in my mind obviously question marks over Maguire and Baker aswell as Lynch and Dempster will be out for a while but if everyone was healthy next year this would be the team i would pick.

B: S Gilbert - M Hudghton – S Baker

HB: S Dempster - M Maguire - S Fisher

C: C Begley - L Hayes - J Gram

HF: N Dal Santo - N Riewoldt - L Montagna

F: S Milne - R Clarke - J Koschitzke

Foll: S King - B Goddard - L Ball

Inter : D Armitage - J Steven - T Lynch - F Ray


What does everyone think ?

Slow as a wet week

speed is over-rated...our niche is getting the pill in and under and if not tackling from our main tacklers

if we aren't a speedy side why try and play that way??? if we try and move it on at all costs we turn it over...supporters get cranky despite always wanting the 'play on at all costs' and begin to point their fingers at something/someone else...

to me begley and ray are runners...so is gram...so is joey...thats 4...we want to be a team of unaccountable runners now??? so who takes brown or franklin??? begley, gram and montagna who will all get slaughtered at the same time

perspective please

Disagree on this. Extra speed allows you to create pressure on the opp'n players. Nothing sh1tted me more this year than watching our players fumble and turn over becoz of the pressure applied by fast opp'n players closing in quickly.

The flip side is trying to catch those buggers...

Quick ball movement and leg speed are the keys to getting the ball in quickly to our forwards. IMOO

we turn the ball over through fumbles due to our players not having the greatest of skills and or confidence

the younger players have pretty poor skills, they struggle to hit targets and kick goals...its a glaring weakness...opposition teams in the future would be more than happy to let an eddy or jones at the pill knowing they are going to more than likely stuff it up

im more than happy to play the hit up style that we tend to play...use the forwards and wait for a prime opportunity...what ive noticed is that when do it it well, we obviously score and then our play becomes quicker and more confident there

partially this is about who plays where...who is positioned where and who can get the ball frequently to set play up most often

truth is we want goddard, gram and s.fish with the pill...not beause of their speed...but the confidence they bring with the pill and the ability to bring our forwards and others into the game

kind of rambled on here...not entirely sure where this all goes

[WayneJudson42]

this team is a bit different but it just clicks in my mind obviously question marks over Maguire and Baker aswell as Lynch and Dempster will be out for a while but if everyone was healthy next year this would be the team i would pick.

B: S Gilbert - M Hudghton – S Baker

HB: S Dempster - M Maguire - S Fisher

C: C Begley - L Hayes - J Gram

HF: N Dal Santo - N Riewoldt - L Montagna

F: S Milne - R Clarke - J Koschitzke

Foll: S King - B Goddard - L Ball

Inter : D Armitage - J Steven - T Lynch - F Ray


What does everyone think ?

Slow as a wet week

speed is over-rated...our niche is getting the pill in and under and if not tackling from our main tacklers

if we aren't a speedy side why try and play that way??? if we try and move it on at all costs we turn it over...supporters get cranky despite always wanting the 'play on at all costs' and begin to point their fingers at something/someone else...

to me begley and ray are runners...so is gram...so is joey...thats 4...we want to be a team of unaccountable runners now??? so who takes brown or franklin??? begley, gram and montagna who will all get slaughtered at the same time

perspective please

Disagree on this. Extra speed allows you to create pressure on the opp'n players. Nothing sh1tted me more this year than watching our players fumble and turn over becoz of the pressure applied by fast opp'n players closing in quickly.

The flip side is trying to catch those buggers...

Quick ball movement and leg speed are the keys to getting the ball in quickly to our forwards. IMOO

we turn the ball over through fumbles due to our players not having the greatest of skills and or confidence

the younger players have pretty poor skills, they struggle to hit targets and kick goals...its a glaring weakness...opposition teams in the future would be more than happy to let an eddy or jones at the pill knowing they are going to more than likely stuff it up

im more than happy to play the hit up style that we tend to play...use the forwards and wait for a prime opportunity...what ive noticed is that when do it it well, we obviously score and then our play becomes quicker and more confident there

partially this is about who plays where...who is positioned where and who can get the ball frequently to set play up most often

truth is we want goddard, gram and s.fish with the pill...not beause of their speed...but the confidence they bring with the pill and the ability to bring our forwards and others into the game

kind of rambled on here...not entirely sure where this all goes

There's a case for both arguments.

What a team we both make! Combined IQ of a twisted gumboot.

[saintbob]

Rnd 1 NAB CUP

B :Gilbert, Houghton, R. Clarke

HB: S.Fisher, Kosi, Ray

C: Gram, Ball, Goddard

HF:Montagna, Roo, Schiender

F: Milne, McGuire, Blake

R: King, Hayes, Dal

Int: Jones, X. Clarke, Steven, Baker, Lynch, Heyne, McEvoy and Eddy

Mcguire to FF, doesn't have the pace anymore to play CHB.
Big body and strong over head, definetely worth a try.

Kosi to CHB, IMO this is his best spot seems to get get lost in games at FF and occassionally gets in Roo's way.

Raph to continue on from where he left off last year, taking the third tall
down back which also allows Fisher to play as an even more attacking defender.

Ray HBF will free up Goddard to play further up the gound, I've got him on a wing here but could play anywhere.

Jones and Eddy will both be given further chances, Lynch and Heyne are two of the new boys who I think will get a crack at it early on.

[borderbarry]

SAlow Slow Slow. We picked these new players to add speed. This team is slow.

[borderbarry]

For the NAB cup and pre season games, all the new recruits should play at least twice, and the rookies should get a game as well.

[borderbarry]

And who the hell is Houghton?

[saintbob]

And who the hell is Houghton?

Sorry for the typo!!!

Perhaps you can name the players with actual speed and ability on the list that aren't in that side

[Cro]

Rnd 1 NAB CUP

B :Gilbert, Houghton, R. Clarke

HB: S.Fisher, Kosi, Ray

C: Gram, Ball, Goddard

HF:Montagna, Roo, Schiender

F: Milne, McGuire, Blake

R: King, Hayes, Dal

Int: Jones, X. Clarke, Steven, Baker, Lynch, Heyne, McEvoy and Eddy

I'd be concerned if Max lined up in the NAB cup except for our last pre season game. At his age and given his soft tissue injuries he's not worth the risk in pre-season. Same goes with Kingy.

It's hard to predict a team not knowing how fit players like Goose and bakes will be. But def get as many of the young guys in as possible, see who wants the footy. We have a few too many who just don't want it enough.

[vacuous space]

you guys get hyped up over new players every year. lets wait and have a look at the nab cup first.

I wouldn't expect any of the new kids to jump straight in. If they look ready to go in the NAB cup, great. It shouldn't be the expectation though. Guys like Armo, Eddy and Jones have experience now. Guys like Geary and Steven would be ahead of the new kids. I'm guessing Gwilt and McQualter would get games ahead of the new guys. If Baker, Xavier Clarke and Maguire can get back to full fitness that makes it even harder for the kids to get games.

There's too many people that just write off players we already have. Most kids don't walk straight into the AFL, especially on good teams. Anybody hoping for a Selwood or Rioli type impact from these guys in their first year is setting themselves up for a major disappointment. This draft wasn't to secure immediate help. A handful of games would be a reasonable return from these kids.

[undecided]

you guys get hyped up over new players every year. lets wait and have a look at the nab cup first.

I wouldn't expect any of the new kids to jump straight in. If they look ready to go in the NAB cup, great. It shouldn't be the expectation though. Guys like Armo, Eddy and Jones have experience now. Guys like Geary and Steven would be ahead of the new kids. I'm guessing Gwilt and McQualter would get games ahead of the new guys. If Baker, Xavier Clarke and Maguire can get back to full fitness that makes it even harder for the kids to get games.

There's too many people that just write off players we already have. Most kids don't walk straight into the AFL, especially on good teams. Anybody hoping for a Selwood or Rioli type impact from these guys in their first year is setting themselves up for a major disappointment. This draft wasn't to secure immediate help. A handful of games would be a reasonable return from these kids.

i would also hope jack steven gets a go b4 them aswell

[FortiusQuoFidelius]

SAlow Slow Slow. We picked these new players to add speed. This team is slow.

What is this obsession with speed?? Leg speed counts little - it's the ability to move the ball quickly that counts. Leg speed is only crucial if you run with the ball.

Our players should be skillful enough that they can dispose of the ball quickly and accurately so leg speed doesnt matter nearly as much.

[sunsaint]

SAlow Slow Slow. We picked these new players to add speed. This team is slow.

What is this obsession with speed?? Leg speed counts little - it's the ability to move the ball quickly that counts. Leg speed is only crucial if you run with the ball.

Our players should be skillful enough that they can dispose of the ball quickly and accurately so leg speed doesnt matter nearly as much.

You are joking about leg speed, arent you?
Surely you are joking?
You have to be able to outsprint your oponent to get the loose ball.
You have to be able to break away with a burst of speed from a pack.
You have to be able to outsprint your opponent in a marking lead.
You have to be able to chase down your opponent when they have the ball.
You have to be able to close quickly in a marking contest to outspoil the attempt.

Our coach has had to implement a game plan of corralling due to our very lack of leg speed. Teams like Ess & carlton, with pace to burn keep running all day....
Its also funny that SP2008 doesnt rate two of our players, Eddy and Jones, because I would say the very reason they are getting games is because of their leg speed and ability to apply pressure on the opposition.

[WayneJudson42]

And who the hell is Houghton?

Houghton hears a who?

[Solar]

a couple of things

speed means little if
1. you can't get the ball
2. you can't dispose of it

(see jones for starters...)

Getting the hard ball, protecting the ball carrier and moving the ball around with speed and precision will be what takes us the next step. Balls hands, BJ's kicking, and our second stringers bulking up and sheparding the skillful players are a starting point. What we are missing are fit skilled inside players and gut running outside carriers. A fit ball and a more developed ray are a start....

On the NAB cup team, this will be very interesting because there are spots up for grabs.

Would like to see roo be given a wing on ball position and try to give leadership further up the field. This gives kosi, big mac and perhaps lynch room to play down forward without the blonde superstar around. Perhaps this is one problem with our second string forwards, they don't actually back themselves and the midfield don't either. Do you think gwilt would demand the ball when his captain is the other option... would you go for this back up when the key forward is running at you. We need to take this out of the calculation until we have a functioning forward line. Then pop him back there as the cream....

So anyway we start at the back,

Thankfully lyon relised late in the season that gilbert is a KP back and not a tall back pocket. He has very good closing speed, improved his marking and spoiling late and was up with raph as our best players in the final against the pies. So he takes FB and the big forward. There are almost no BIG forwards these days and talls like franklin lead hard and use their skills.

Place an experienced Blake with him as the other KP back. Look he will only be a flanker come the real season but in the NAB cup he gives stability to a developing backline. Goose gets a run along with raph in the third tall come flanker role. This is to push across in front of the leading forwards and rebound. Good easy job for goose to come back in with. Add belgely and ray into the mix.

The only position we are missing is the back pocket and I would look to develop jones in that position. Did the job late against the bombers, has speed, descipline and the guts to put himself on the line.




FB: Jones gilbert begley
HB raph blake goose

The midfield will include a fit ball, hayes and dal. BJ and gram add some add thrust. Steven, armo and geary need to be given time to develop in this midfield also. Don't be suprised if we rest kingy from this stuff and use gards and the younger rucks. with extra space on the bench we could go with stanley, mac and gards.

c: gram BJ ray
R: Gardiner ball steven

The forward line also needs some work. With allen out we need to look and new options

HF: Roo Kosi schneider/chips
FF milne Mac lynch/cahill/hynds

roo works onto a wing, which allows gram and BJ are able to slide forward without losing our numbers behind the ball. Thus the two talls of kosi with one of mac or chips. The draftees in lynch/cahill/hynds have a chance to work a pocket flank with schneider who needs some midfield time for fitness reasons.

Chips forward? Our best backman going forward? WTF... well it works on two levels. He relies on the reading of play and good ball use. I back the likes of raph/begley to do this is he stead and allows chips to do his stuff forward. The key to a forward is POSITION POSITION POSITION. They have to read where the ball will be heading and not only get to the prime marking spot but do this a split second before the backman. Chips has a natural ability to read the play and mark the ball. He is usually a third player in down back, reading it before the forward and cutting off attacks. This would be handy down forward and could score us 40-80 goals.

With roo out on a wing, kosi has the chance to leadup to the ball hard and then double back. This is where he is at him most devasting. Tall defenders don't have the agility to go with him when he does this. Keeping him too close to goal robs him of this, but it relies on him getting his knee right and getting to the fitness level required to play CHF.

Chuck some exciting new draftees, a very tall ruck from NSW and we have the chance to develop a whole new looking side.

[St Fidelius]

a couple of things

speed means little if
1. you can't get the ball
2. you can't dispose of it

(see jones for starters...)

Getting the hard ball, protecting the ball carrier and moving the ball around with speed and precision will be what takes us the next step. Balls hands, BJ's kicking, and our second stringers bulking up and sheparding the skillful players are a starting point. What we are missing are fit skilled inside players and gut running outside carriers. A fit ball and a more developed ray are a start....

On the NAB cup team, this will be very interesting because there are spots up for grabs.

Would like to see roo be given a wing on ball position and try to give leadership further up the field. This gives kosi, big mac and perhaps lynch room to play down forward without the blonde superstar around. Perhaps this is one problem with our second string forwards, they don't actually back themselves and the midfield don't either. Do you think gwilt would demand the ball when his captain is the other option... would you go for this back up when the key forward is running at you. We need to take this out of the calculation until we have a functioning forward line. Then pop him back there as the cream....

So anyway we start at the back,

Thankfully lyon relised late in the season that gilbert is a KP back and not a tall back pocket. He has very good closing speed, improved his marking and spoiling late and was up with raph as our best players in the final against the pies. So he takes FB and the big forward. There are almost no BIG forwards these days and talls like franklin lead hard and use their skills.

Place an experienced Blake with him as the other KP back. Look he will only be a flanker come the real season but in the NAB cup he gives stability to a developing backline. Goose gets a run along with raph in the third tall come flanker role. This is to push across in front of the leading forwards and rebound. Good easy job for goose to come back in with. Add belgely and ray into the mix.

The only position we are missing is the back pocket and I would look to develop jones in that position. Did the job late against the bombers, has speed, descipline and the guts to put himself on the line.




FB: Jones gilbert begley
HB raph blake goose

The midfield will include a fit ball, hayes and dal. BJ and gram add some add thrust. Steven, armo and geary need to be given time to develop in this midfield also. Don't be suprised if we rest kingy from this stuff and use gards and the younger rucks. with extra space on the bench we could go with stanley, mac and gards.

c: gram BJ ray
R: Gardiner ball steven

The forward line also needs some work. With allen out we need to look and new options

HF: Roo Kosi schneider/chips
FF milne Mac lynch/cahill/hynds

roo works onto a wing, which allows gram and BJ are able to slide forward without losing our numbers behind the ball. Thus the two talls of kosi with one of mac or chips. The draftees in lynch/cahill/hynds have a chance to work a pocket flank with schneider who needs some midfield time for fitness reasons.

Chips forward? Our best backman going forward? WTF... well it works on two levels. He relies on the reading of play and good ball use. I back the likes of raph/begley to do this is he stead and allows chips to do his stuff forward. The key to a forward is POSITION POSITION POSITION. They have to read where the ball will be heading and not only get to the prime marking spot but do this a split second before the backman. Chips has a natural ability to read the play and mark the ball. He is usually a third player in down back, reading it before the forward and cutting off attacks. This would be handy down forward and could score us 40-80 goals.

With roo out on a wing, kosi has the chance to leadup to the ball hard and then double back. This is where he is at him most devasting. Tall defenders don't have the agility to go with him when he does this. Keeping him too close to goal robs him of this, but it relies on him getting his knee right and getting to the fitness level required to play CHF.

Chuck some exciting new draftees, a very tall ruck from NSW and we have the chance to develop a whole new looking side.

Good post...

I feel though that Gram does not fit your criteria in point 2 you have stated.

His disposal is ordinary IMO...

Far too many times he goes for the long bomb and it is turned over...

Gram needs to look at options closer if he is going to succeed in a midfield role IMO

[the_D_train]

come rd 22 this would be the team that i would like to see (this is about the 3rd team i have put in but )

theres a few different selections, but here goes...

B: J Blake M Hudghton S Baker

HB: S Dempster M Maguire R Clarke

C: J Gram L Hayes L Montagna

HF: A Schneider N Riewoldt N Dal Santo

F: S Milne S Fisher T Lynch

Foll: S King* B Goddard L Ball

Inter: J Koschitzke* D Armitage S Gilbert F Ray

[LTN16]

I think the Round 1 team will look something like this:
ST KILDA
B: Gilbert, Hudghton, Baker
HB: S.Fisher, Maguire, R.Clarke
C: Montagna, Hayes, Gram
HF: Schneider, Koschitzke, Dal Santo
F: Milne, Riewoldt, Armitage

Foll: King, Ball, Goddard
Int: Jones, M.Gardiner, Ray, X.Clarke

Emg: Blake, Steven, L.Fisher

SANDRINGHAM VFL TEAM:
B: Begley, Blake, L.Fisher
HB: Miles, Haretuku, Geary
C: Smith, Steven, Howard
HF: Lynch, Gwilt, Heyne
F: Connors, Cahill, Stanley

Foll: McEvoy, McQualter, Eddy
Int: B.McGrath, ? ?, ? ?, ? ?

? ? Sandringham Listed Players or St Kilda Rookie List Players

[bigcarl]

LTN16: I think the Round 1 team will look something like this:


ST KILDA
B: Gilbert, Hudghton, Baker
HB: S.Fisher, Maguire, R.Clarke
C: Montagna, Hayes, Gram
HF: Schneider, Koschitzke, Dal Santo
F: Milne, Riewoldt, Armitage

Foll: King, Ball, Goddard
Int: Jones, M.Gardiner, Ray, X.Clarke

Emg: Blake, Steven, L.Fisher

not bad. quite like that.

always thought roo would be slightly wasted at full forward, but, in the absence of other goal-kicking key forwards we might have no alternative.

he and kosi would be surrounded by some handy goal-kicking offensive players in milne, dal, schneider and armitage.

I would have blake in before m. gardiner to pinch hit as second ruck, though, if kosi is being asked to hold down chf. blake's more versatile and mobile than gardi.

also, he might again be asked to hold down chb if goose doesn't make it back successfully.

[Cro]

I think the Round 1 team will look something like this:
ST KILDA
B: Gilbert, Hudghton, Baker
HB: S.Fisher, Maguire, R.Clarke
C: Montagna, Hayes, Gram
HF: Schneider, Koschitzke, Dal Santo
F: Milne, Riewoldt, Armitage

Foll: King, Ball, Goddard
Int: Jones, M.Gardiner, Ray, X.Clarke

Emg: Blake, Steven, L.Fisher

SANDRINGHAM VFL TEAM:
B: ? ? , Blake, L.Fisher
HB: Miles, Haretuku, Geary
C: Smith, Steven, Howard
HF: Lynch, Gwilt, Heyne
F: Connors, Cahill, Stanley

Foll: McEvoy, McQualter, Eddy
Int: B.McGrath, ? ?, ? ?, ? ?

? ? Sandringham Listed Players or St Kilda Rookie List Players

So umm.. what's Begley doing then?

Our Rnd 1 team would look pretty good, though I do wonder how bakes and Goose will go after so much time on the side lines.

[rodgerfox]

You are joking about leg speed, arent you?
Surely you are joking?
You have to be able to outsprint your oponent to get the loose ball.
You have to be able to break away with a burst of speed from a pack.
You have to be able to outsprint your opponent in a marking lead.
You have to be able to chase down your opponent when they have the ball.
You have to be able to close quickly in a marking contest to outspoil the attempt.

Geelong don't have much leg speed at all.

Neither do Hawthorn. Infact both midfields could even be described as slow.

It's overrated. Good to have, but not absolutely neccessary.

[LTN16]

I think the Round 1 team will look something like this:
ST KILDA
B: Gilbert, Hudghton, Baker
HB: S.Fisher, Maguire, R.Clarke
C: Montagna, Hayes, Gram
HF: Schneider, Koschitzke, Dal Santo
F: Milne, Riewoldt, Armitage

Foll: King, Ball, Goddard
Int: Jones, M.Gardiner, Ray, X.Clarke

Emg: Blake, Steven, L.Fisher

SANDRINGHAM VFL TEAM:
B: ? ? , Blake, L.Fisher
HB: Miles, Haretuku, Geary
C: Smith, Steven, Howard
HF: Lynch, Gwilt, Heyne
F: Connors, Cahill, Stanley

Foll: McEvoy, McQualter, Eddy
Int: B.McGrath, ? ?, ? ?, ? ?

? ? Sandringham Listed Players or St Kilda Rookie List Players

So umm.. what's Begley doing then?

I knew I had forgotten someone

Chuck him in the back pocket for Sandringham..

[WayneJudson42]

this team is a bit different but it just clicks in my mind obviously question marks over Maguire and Baker aswell as Lynch and Dempster will be out for a while but if everyone was healthy next year this would be the team i would pick.

B: S Gilbert - M Hudghton – S Baker

HB: S Dempster - M Maguire - S Fisher

C: C Begley - L Hayes - J Gram

HF: N Dal Santo - N Riewoldt - L Montagna

F: S Milne - R Clarke - J Koschitzke

Foll: S King - B Goddard - L Ball

Inter : D Armitage - J Steven - T Lynch - F Ray


What does everyone think ?

Slow as a wet week

speed is over-rated...our niche is getting the pill

Hmmmm very profound words had Ben Cousins joined us.