Thoughts on Farren Ray

[Iceman234]

Please explain "goes missing in big games" and
"shown no signs of of improvement in the past two seasons"

His last game was in the Qualifying Final against the Hawks, where he had 23 disposals and 8 marks... hardly gone missing IMO...

2007 Ray averaged 15 disposals a game

2008 Ray averaged 19 disposals a game

and that, in your opinion is showing no signs of improvement

The qualifying final from Ray was one of the worst finals performances I have ever seen. Everything he touched turned to crap.

It's not a matter of stats with Ray, it's about the amount of impact he has with his possessions. Maybe I've just happened to watch Bulldogs games when he's had off-days, but from what I've seen he often does more harm than good. His disposal has not improved since he has been in the AFL and he still gets pushed aside too easily.

He must have a bit of ability to be taken at pick 4, but I've seen nothing to suggest he offers anything more than Fiora.

Agree if its all about finals performance this year then you obviously dont have Dal in your best side.

Most of the queries with Ray have been the effectiveness of his disposal. I think people generally think it is a probably. And when I say 'people', I mean keen Bulldog observers.

I haven't seen enough - But boy am I excited!

PS - I seem to remember 22 CRAP performances in a final not too long ago.

Let's give him a chance, he's come cheap and was a high draft pick who averages good numbers for a 22yo.

A mate who is a Dog says they call him Apple, as in turnover and he's glad to be rid of him.

Let's give him a good skills coach - all the other attributes seems to be there.

[Armoooo]

I just hope that we don't see #31 (in a very solid draft) turn into a real get for the Dogs.

I haven't done the stats but I'm guessing that if you compared picks 31 and 48

1990 - 31- Nick Fual 48- Willie Rioli
1991 - 31- Hayden Kilmartin 48- Kevin Mitchell
1992 - 31- Shane Wakelin 48- Dillon Flavell
1993 - 31- Brett Jones 48- Mark Ballan
1994 - 31- Allen Nash 48- Austinn Jones
1995 - 31- Andrew Ukovic 48- Darren Milburn
1996 - 31- Jess Sinclair 48- Marty Warry
1997 - 31- Simon Black 48- Ben Thompson
1998 - 31- Gary Dhurrkay 48- Lucas Herbert
1999 - 31- Paul Chapman 48- Chance Bateman
2000 - 31- Blake Campbell 48 - Matthew Smith
2001 - 31- Joel Reynolds 48 - Simon Cox
2002 - 31- Joel Perry 48 - Greg Edgcumbe
2003 - 31- Joshua Krueger 48 - Heath Shaw
2004 - 31- Jarred Moore 48- Nathan Ablett
2005 - 31- Trent West 48- Alan Obst
2006 - 31- Clayton Collard 48- David Mackay
2007 - 31- John McCarthy 48- Jarrad Boumann

Works out about even IMO, pick 31 probably just better thanks to Simon Black...

[Con Gorozidis]

i just googled farren ray and this came up.

great pick up!

http://www.lenzfx.com/Farren.html

[st.byron]

I just hope that we don't see #31 (in a very solid draft) turn into a real get for the Dogs.

I haven't done the stats but I'm guessing that if you compared picks 31 and 48

1990 - 31- Nick Fual 48- Willie Rioli
1991 - 31- Hayden Kilmartin 48- Kevin Mitchell
1992 - 31- Shane Wakelin 48- Dillon Flavell
1993 - 31- Brett Jones 48- Mark Ballan
1994 - 31- Allen Nash 48- Austinn Jones
1995 - 31- Andrew Ukovic 48- Darren Milburn
1996 - 31- Jess Sinclair 48- Marty Warry
1997 - 31- Simon Black 48- Ben Thompson
1998 - 31- Gary Dhurrkay 48- Lucas Herbert
1999 - 31- Paul Chapman 48- Chance Bateman
2000 - 31- Blake Campbell 48 - Matthew Smith
2001 - 31- Joel Reynolds 48 - Simon Cox
2002 - 31- Joel Perry 48 - Greg Edgcumbe
2003 - 31- Joshua Krueger 48 - Heath Shaw
2004 - 31- Jarred Moore 48- Nathan Ablett
2005 - 31- Trent West 48- Alan Obst
2006 - 31- Clayton Collard 48- David Mackay
2007 - 31- John McCarthy 48- Jarrad Boumann

Works out about even IMO, pick 31 probably just better thanks to Simon Black...

Good on you Armoo. I hoped someone might be inclined to check it out.
Not surprising really. Just goes to show that once you get past pick thirty, it's a lottery with pick 48 about as much chance of succeeding as pick 31.

[Saints94]

He was a top 5 draft pick so that tells you something, the games I saw him

play were pretty darn good, so Farran have a big pre-season and have a

superb 2009

[SaintBot]

I just hope that we don't see #31 (in a very solid draft) turn into a real get for the Dogs.

I haven't done the stats but I'm guessing that if you compared picks 31 and 48

1990 - 31- Nick Fual 48- Willie Rioli
1991 - 31- Hayden Kilmartin 48- Kevin Mitchell
1992 - 31- Shane Wakelin 48- Dillon Flavell
1993 - 31- Brett Jones 48- Mark Ballan
1994 - 31- Allen Nash 48- Austinn Jones
1995 - 31- Andrew Ukovic 48- Darren Milburn
1996 - 31- Jess Sinclair 48- Marty Warry
1997 - 31- Simon Black 48- Ben Thompson
1998 - 31- Gary Dhurrkay 48- Lucas Herbert
1999 - 31- Paul Chapman 48- Chance Bateman
2000 - 31- Blake Campbell 48 - Matthew Smith
2001 - 31- Joel Reynolds 48 - Simon Cox
2002 - 31- Joel Perry 48 - Greg Edgcumbe
2003 - 31- Joshua Krueger 48 - Heath Shaw
2004 - 31- Jarred Moore 48- Nathan Ablett
2005 - 31- Trent West 48- Alan Obst
2006 - 31- Clayton Collard 48- David Mackay
2007 - 31- John McCarthy 48- Jarrad Boumann

Works out about even IMO, pick 31 probably just better thanks to Simon Black...

Good on you Armoo. I hoped someone might be inclined to check it out.
Not surprising really. Just goes to show that once you get past pick thirty, it's a lottery with pick 48 about as much chance of succeeding as pick 31.

There is also a slight possibility that a player that we prioritised highly for pick 31 will slip to 47/8 hence making Ray a free gimme.

[vacuous space]

I was surprised we went for Ray TBH. When I think of the team I think Lyon is trying to put together here, Farren Ray doesn't exactly spring to mind. He's consistently averaged less than 3 contested possessions a game over the course of his career. He gets a lot of uncontested footy, but handballs way too much and isn't at all reliable. There have definitely been occasions where I have questioned his efforts.

I also don't think we need him. There's no way he'll be ahead of our top five mids in Hayes, Ball, Goddard, Dal Santo and Montagna. I don't see him making a significant contribution down back or up forward either. At this stage, I see him as nothing more than depth. I've got to question the wisdom of moving down in such a talented draft for such a questionable player.

He really wasn't very impressive at the Bulldogs. Hopefully he comes in here with something to prove. At this stage I'd count myself among his doubters.

[Richter]

I also don't think we need him. There's no way he'll be ahead of our top five mids in Hayes, Ball, Goddard, Dal Santo and Montagna.

No, but we also played Clinton Jones, Robert Eddy, David Armitage, and Aaron Fiora as midfielders in finals. Also Allen and Gwilt as HFs. He is certainly better than these guys against whom he'll be competing for his spot.

(Although I'd be hoping that Armo will go past him - not holding my breath though).

[vacuous space]

No, but we also played Clinton Jones, Robert Eddy, David Armitage, and Aaron Fiora as midfielders in finals. Also Allen and Gwilt as HFs. He is certainly better than these guys against whom he'll be competing for his spot.

In what way is he 'better'? I'd back every single one of those players in a contest against Ray.

[Richter]

Gets more possessions than all of them.

Quicker than all bar Jones (probably on a par with Fiora).

Probably median in terms of disposal (Fiora better, Jones worse).

Tackling, courage - not as good as Jones, Eddy, Armo - probably similar to Fiora.

---------------------

I think he adds something that the above don't though.... when he receives the ball, which is often (av 19 disp per game this year), he plays on and breaks lines.

For mine he's a similar player to Fiora, though not as good a kick as Fiora, but sees much more of the ball than him and plays on more.

[skeptic]

No, but we also played Clinton Jones, Robert Eddy, David Armitage, and Aaron Fiora as midfielders in finals. Also Allen and Gwilt as HFs. He is certainly better than these guys against whom he'll be competing for his spot.

In what way is he 'better'? I'd back every single one of those players in a contest against Ray.

his disposal is much much better than Jones'

[vacuous space]

Gets more possessions than all of them.

Ray spent more time in the midfield at the Bulldogs than any of the guys you mentioned did here. He's going to struggle to get the same number of midfield minutes here. He'll find it difficult to get the same number of handball receives and uncontested marks playing for us. If he's going to come close to his 19.2 possessions a game from 08, he's going to have to start winning some contests.

I don't think he's enough of an improvement to be worth bothering with. He's slight, he's soft and his disposal is nothing special. I would have rather kept the earlier pick.

[maverick]

Surely the Doggies have a better midfield than us, he will get more mid time for us....

He is not soft, slight yes, soft no.

[vacuous space]

He is not soft

He had the lowest contested possession rate in the league (12.4%). He might get a few tackles, but so does every midfielder. Fact is, he had 31 contested possessions for the year playing as a midfielder. He's either not hard enough at the contest or not good enough.

[Raven]

Anyone think he'll most likely be played off half-back rather than midfield? This'll free up Grammy and BJ more.

[vacuous space]

Anyone think he'll most likely be played off half-back rather than midfield? This'll free up Grammy and BJ more.

RL suggested that might happen after the trade went down. He also mentioned Sam Fisher as potentially getting more midfield time. I would bet that he'll see some time in that kind of role during preseason.

[nicola69]

Farren Ray is an excellent pick up for choice 31. It's crazy that the Dogs let him go like that.

I have seen him play a many times due to WB connections.

He is not slight any more.

He goes in hard for the ball.

He has excellent disposal skills. The finals game everyone refers to was most uncharacteristic - a bad day.

He is fast with a great tank as the coach said.

However, he is not a strong overhead player, in my opinion. Marks well enough on a lead, but not in packs. Prefers to stay down.

He is the type of mid fielder who really hurts on the attack. Contrast to McQualter who is quite good defensively but doesn't impact going the other way, as they say. Ray is typical of a number of Bulldogs midfielders who play that blow the opposition away style of attack.

Any great thread, lots of good reading - most appreciative of everyone's efforts

[sax]

Who the hell is that picture of on WoM!
This link is a picture of Farren!

http://mm.afl.com.au/portals/0/Player_p ... le_med.jpg