I feel good about next year

[Zippy]

A few things need to change, but we're on a good track, despite tonights hammering. We're no Geelong, but I think we're looking good for another top 4 finish next year. And the year after that. We're not an old side - we have a lot of players entering their prime or still developing.

Coaching:

Ross Lyon has improved as a coach - he's more flexible, and has the list playing with more confidence. Next year, I think he'll be good for us.

Our forward structure is dysfunctional at times, though, so it might be time for a new forward coach. We're still not doing all that well with the chipping game, but we're doing better than we used to.

Player improvement

we're losing Harvey, and may lose Hudghton (geez, I hope note though). Other than that, we're a young list - most of our team will only get better next year.

Forwards:

We have the cattle to be dangerous. Roo is as good as it gets, Milne is kicking huge numbers of goals for a small forward, and Kosi and Schneider are both high-quality players. We have a depth concern - Allen, C. Gardiner and Ferguson are all marginal at best, although I have high hopes for Allen in a couple of years. Jack Steven could be an ace small forward next year - time will tell.

Defence:

Very well set up if Hudghton plays on. Hudghton and S Fisher are elite. Raph Clarke is finally looking the goods. Blake has been a revelation as a full-time key back. Gilbert's very nice - he's in the middle of a tricky transition from light player to strong Key Position Back, but is still good value and should be even better next year. And don't forget Jayden Attard, who is a great negator when he's not getting over season-ending injuries.

So we have a lot of decent tall-ish defenders, even if Maguire doesn't come back for us. And if he does, our defence looks awesome. The only concern is that it's a very tall defending crop - we could use L Fisher back in form and in the side, or Baker injury-free.

Rucks:

I'd really rather park Kosi as a full-time forward, if we can keep M Gardiner and King on the park. If we can't, Kosi's still good as a ruck/forward. McEvoy means we're developing for the future, and Rix is valuable depth (if he stays on the list).

Midfield:

We've lost Harvey, but don't forget:

Ball
Dal Santo
Hayes
Montagna
Gram
Goddard
Baker (yes, fully fit, he's a firstline midfielder - will murder a top-notch opposing midfielder, which is almost like having another topliner on our side).

That's a competitive lineup. None of the above will be getting too old - this is a young core group, with Hayes and Baker the "old men" at 29 - still at a peak age.

We also have:

Clinton Jones: wins a surprising amount of ball, great pace, and tough.
Robert Eddy: unbelievably fit - still not strong enough, but that'll come with time.
Shane Birss: how Fiora was picked ahead of him tonight I'll never know. A solid depth midfielder.
Armitage: looking promising. He'll be good next year.
X. Clarke: man, this guy can be so good, if he could just get his body right . . .
L Fisher: I prefer L Fisher in the Backline, but he can tag through the midfield if we're sticking with the tall backline.
Geary: smart and will get better with time. Comes off the backline, but could be a midfielder too.

Over the next year or two, I fully expect Eddy, Geary and Armitage to become very handy.

Utilities:

We have a lot of tall utilities - Blake is first and foremost, but I'd put Dempster, Gwilt and R Clarke in there too, which means we have a lot of ability to creat mismatches, and good resistance to them.

[Saints Premiers 2008]

emotional post, it is a long wat away

[clarky449]

Dont we say this every year though

[Zippy]

Dont we say this every year though

We do, but three prelims in five years shows that we haven't been that far wrong.

[degruch]

Dont we say this every year though

We do, but three prelims in five years shows that we haven't been that far wrong.

Bingo. Who make the top four then throws their whole team out??? Nuts. A few tweaks and a massive attitude transplant and we're the next Geelong. FFS, they were a joke a few years back but 'massaged' their existing list in to winners instead of rebuilding.

[LennyBoy]

To be honest I feel we far exceeded our expectations this year. No doubt we are going to be missing some leadership on the field and the kids will have to continue to step up.

As long as the club pushes forward I can see us playing finals footy in 2009. Just as long as we don't have a massive reality check like Port Adelaide (from 07 to 08) its certainly possible having so many young and inexperienced players. We must back it up!

[mad saint guy]

I don't feel good about next year at all.

We lose our best outside midfielder and our full back and ruckman will be on the decline.

We have almost no young talent coming though. Armitage has potential but can't find the ball. Eddy is a trier but has no skill. Geary looks the goods in the VFL but has struggled at senior level (may improve with time though). Connors will still be far too small. McEvoy is another two years off. Steven won't be ready next year. Allen looks like a Gwilt type player at best.

It is very unlikely that we'll have such a good run with injuries next year. Everything fell into place for us this year for us to make the top 4 and gave us an easy ride into a prelim.

We are in danger of being overtaken by the likes of Carlton and Richmond, who both have a strong core of young players who will soon be nearing their prime.

Our fantastic back 6 should make sure we are a strong chance of a finals spot, but I can't see us as a genuine contender along with Geelong and Hawthorn.

[coolingbaba]

We lose our best outside midfielder and our full back and ruckman will be on the decline.

Hudghton on the decline!? Ur kidding right? Tonight was possibly the greatest full-back performance ever.

[mad saint guy]

Hudghton on the decline!? Ur kidding right? Tonight was possibly the greatest full-back performance ever.

He has been awsome this year, but he's getting on and has to slow down some time.

[bigcarl]

Our fantastic back 6 should make sure we are a strong chance of a finals spot, but I can't see us as a genuine contender along with Geelong and Hawthorn.

i can't see us being a genuine contender without big changes to the game plan, which is too concerned with stopping and pays no respect to creating.

trying to hold teams such as hawthorn and geelong to losing scores is never going to work. to beat them you have to outscore them.

i'd genuinely consider trying out bj at ff, for a start, regardless of what it may or may not do to our midfield. and i'd also consider dal santo as a half forward.

get some class (other than roo and milne) closer to the goals ... you've seen how effective that has been for hawthorn.

we shut down buddy or roughhead and someone else bobs up with a bag of goals ... that's the sort of efficient and structured forward set up i'm talking about.

[clarky449]

I dont think next year will be one too look foward to but ofcourse i hope i am wrong

[chook23]

I don't

sick of it.

[timtam]

Just like to add that not only did Max perform BRILLIANTLY tonight (definite contender for BOG), he has played the last 3-4 weeks with a broken toe. Ross said tonight that Max is most likely to play next year, but Max wants a little time to think about it.

Absolutely amazed about some of the posts made my 'so-called' saints supporters. Nobody would have thought 8-10 weeks ago that we would make the finals let alone top 4. You don't just 'fall' into top 4 without having a very good list. Factor in a couple of crucial long-term injuries (Baker, Dempster, McGuire, etc) and there is your short fall. The 2 teams playing off in the GF have all of their Key players playing, no serious or season-ending injuries to their most crucial players. Granted we do need to draft wel, but to say there is nothing to look forward to next year you are either blind or stupid to put it bluntly.

[Richter]

We have almost no young talent coming though. Armitage has potential but can't find the ball. Eddy is a trier but has no skill. Geary looks the goods in the VFL but has struggled at senior level (may improve with time though). Connors will still be far too small. McEvoy is another two years off. Steven won't be ready next year. Allen looks like a Gwilt type player at best.

All this is true. Between ages 19-21 we have no potential jets. But this is a problem in 2-4 years not for next year.

But look at the 21-26 age group. We have around a dozen core and star first choice players who are all coming into their prime and are likely to at least be as good or improve again next year.

Ball - 24 - his best year since 2004. Entering his prime

Raph - 22 - starting to look like he'll become a top 10 player for us

X - 25 - zilch from him this year. Anything he gives will be an improvement but looks like injury is going to rob him of bring the out and out star he could have been.

Dal - 24 - Likely to remain the same, though may improve if others around him lift as pthers may become the focus of primary tagger attention in front of him. In his prime

Sam Fisher - 26 - likely to continue to be a star. In his prime

Goddard - 23 - I mark him down as potentially THE major chance to become an ELITE player - whether he does or not is likely to be the determinant in whether we can challenge the top 2. Entering his prime

Gram - 24 - likely to continue in the same vein. May improve with the experience gained from this year. Entering his prime

Kosi - 26 - unlikely to improve much more

Goose - 24 - can he finally come back from injury?

Joey - 24 - entering his prime

Roo - 26 - likely to remain our best player. In his prime

Schneider - entering his prime

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So for the next 2 or 3 years we're still "in our window" though after that we're likely top drop down as our core enter their dotage!

[battye]

Dont we say this every year though

We do, but three prelims in five years shows that we haven't been that far wrong.

True. On that note, if you go into each preliminary final as a 50% chance of a win, the probability of losing all three of those finals (04/05/08) is 0.5x0.5x0.5 = 0.125... 12.5%

That's an 87.5% chance that we should have made at least one grand final in the past few years

[True Blue Sainter]

To be honest, I'm feeling alot less confident about next year...

The only possible improvement in the list I see is through Armo, and maybe Steven blossoming into a small forward. I'm not sure if Eddy has what it takes to be anything more than a GOP.

Whilst our list is stagnating, lists like Brisbane, Richmond and Carlton will only continue to improve, as will the Hawks. The Dogs will be around the mark again and the Cats will still be the team to beat. Fremantle may also spring a few surprises, and Port are a much better team than their record this season suggested...

IMO we'll struggle to make the 8 next year... We need to have a serious crack at Kerr and Cousins, and bring in some decent kids in the draft.

[Zippy]

We lose our best outside midfielder and our full back and ruckman will be on the decline.

Harvey's been better than anyone, but on his current/recent abilities, Ball, Dal Santo, Hayes, Montagna and Goddard are all better.

King's not that old, and Hudghton, even if he declines, is still a worldbeater.

This starting 22 looks great to me:

Back 6:

Gilbert, Hudghton, Baker
R Clarke Maguire S Fisher

Lots of quality there. It still looks good if you swap Blake in for one of Maguire or Hudghton.

Middle 6:

Montagna Hayes Gram
King Ball Dal Santo

That's an a-list midfield.

Forward 6:

Schneider Reiwoldt Goddard
Milne Kosi X Clarke

That looks good to me.

Bench (from): Blake, Dempster, Armitage, Attard, Birss, L Fisher, Jones, Eddy, Geary, Gwilt

A lot of people who can do jobs there - Blake, Dempster, Jones and Armitage would be my first picks, with Eddy and Birss very unlucky.