how refreshing was it to see

[mad saint guy]

So everyone on here is complaining about our poor footskills and inability to move the ball forwards quickly...while the majority also seem to want Jones, who is the worst kick and decision-maker on the list to get a game.

I don't think he is really that similar to a blonde McGough. They are both terrible kicks, but McGough's strength was winning the ball at ground level and shovelling it out to the runners. Jones' strength is that he's willing to chase the guy who just beat him to the ball, and 1/10th of the time he catches him and gets a free kick. I think McGough's strong point was far more useful.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

So everyone on here is complaining about our poor footskills and inability to move the ball forwards quickly...while the majority also seem to want Jones, who is the worst kick and decision-maker on the list to get a game.

I don't think he is really that similar to a blonde McGough. They are both terrible kicks, but McGough's strength was winning the ball at ground level and shovelling it out to the runners. Jones' strength is that he's willing to chase the guy who just beat him to the ball, and 1/10th of the time he catches him and gets a free kick. I think McGough's strong point was far more useful.

heck why not drop Gram who i think is the worst kick and decisionmaker in the team and replace him with CJ at least then we lose nothing in the kicking and decision making but gain a player willing to chase and lay a tackle ?

[evertonfc]

So everyone on here is complaining about our poor footskills and inability to move the ball forwards quickly...while the majority also seem to want Jones, who is the worst kick and decision-maker on the list to get a game.

"But he tries hard..."

People bitch and moan about our disposal but want to make allowances for one of the worst ball users in the AFL?

I'd laugh...but people really do think that way

I don't think he is really that similar to a blonde McGough. They are both terrible kicks, but McGough's strength was winning the ball at ground level and shovelling it out to the runners. Jones' strength is that he's willing to chase the guy who just beat him to the ball, and 1/10th of the time he catches him and gets a free kick. I think McGough's strong point was far more useful.

That's all true; I think the likeness is more based on the fact they both couldn't kick and relied on endeavour.

It's also based on the fact that while both have occaisional moments, neither are equipped to play AFL football.

The fact that people think CJ is capable of playing AFL football I find horrifying - but also indicative of exactly where we stand as a club and how far we've receded that we no longer care about skill, but that we're happy to have plodders who "chase hard" in our best 22.

Scary.

heck why not drop Gram who i think is the worst kick and decisionmaker in the team and replace him with CJ at least then we lose nothing in the kicking and decision making but gain a player willing to chase and lay a tackle ?

Because Gram, whilst out of form, can actually play. He has proven this.

He needs a little bit of tweaking. CJ can't kick or win the footy - and won't improve.

[duckduckduckgoose]

he chases and chases hard.

Maybe has more potential as a greyhound then?


Does anyone else realise he's 24 and actually older than Jason Gram?

Now im not knocking him personally, but it certainly shows up our lack of depth when our "kids" need hearing aids.

[St Chris]

I don't think anyone's mentioned it, but Jones's IMPROVEMENT is the reason he is getting picked, and is still on the list.

He is never going to have silky skills, but he obviously works hard at it because his skills have improved out of sight since this time last year.

He is learning how to get around not having great skills too. He's not gonna thread a 50m worm burner onto Kosi's chest, but he isn't trying to. He can hit a free player 20m sideways, then that's better than not having the ball in the first place.

And to say he's chasing because he's second to the ball, there's only 2 guys (hayes and ball) actually getting their own footy at the moment. The others are second to the footy, but only jog behind in a half-ar$ed attempt to look interested.

[spert]

CJ deserves a spot, but it's a pity there are not many key position players for us who are standing up to the pressure. A small like CJ should not be expected to do the work of two, same goes for Harvs..these guys need to feed off the big bodies, not do all the bloody work.

[saintsRrising]

Look CJ is no star...


More talented players such as Fiora nad Raph should be keeping him out of the team....but they are currently not delivering enough to do so.

Schneider too should be way in front...but Schneiders last two games have been crap.

However even with his flaws..CJ's strength's currently outweigh his weaknesses compared with other options that we currently have at our disposal.

In particular we lack players at pressent that lack effort and commitment.


Based on his game against the Lion's CJ more than deserves his spot for the Demons game.

[ThomasR]

Now that is a big call - I must go back through the records and see which games McGough racked up all these possessions as "he is one of the best you have seen at getting his hands on the ball" You are joking.

Don't let a few facts spoil a good story !

13.2 touches a game whilst playing for us. Ball magnet!

[evertonfc]

Seriously, I give up.

We have massive problems with disposal, and people want to bring in more players with disposal so bad that it makes Jayson Daniels look good?

Oh man...intensity is one thing, but jesus, give me a jumper and I'll show you intensity. Doesn't mean I'm good enough to play AFL.

Look...

I've got nothing against CJ. I just can't stand that when one of our major problems is ball usage - it's crippling us - people want to promote such a dreadful user of the ball.

That doesn't fix the problem. Don't we need to fix our problems before exacerbating them?

[NoMore]

I honestly can't believe this post

If he didn't have blonde hair u wouldn't even notice him on the field.

I know alot of people on here must watch Casey Scorps play and if they did they would know the CJ has no time in the VFL. He is constantly rushed and misses simple targets by hand and foot. But at least he gets the ball

In the AFL he still misses targets and looks rushed but he only gets the footy maybe 6 times a game.

Lets not look through rose coloured glasses bedause we all love a blonde footballer at st kilda.

He is hopeless

He is Jason Daniels without the ability to get the ball. Or the time. Or the ability to stop a player.

If we just went on our ability to tackle every one on this site could get a game

Get Real

[derby Street]

Now that is a big call - I must go back through the records and see which games McGough racked up all these possessions as "he is one of the best you have seen at getting his hands on the ball" You are joking.

Don't let a few facts spoil a good story !

13.2 touches a game whilst playing for us. Ball magnet!

So Tommy you say 13.2 disposals per game is a ball magnet - heaven help us - using those stas we still have lots of " ball magnets" playing but are getting thrashed in contested possessions / disposals. ?????
Clint Jones actually is averaging 11.5 disposals per game so he is NEARLY a ball magnet like McGough. Something all our players could aspire to so that they could become as good as McGough - THE BALL MAGNET !!!!

[vacuous space]

I've got nothing against CJ. I just can't stand that when one of our major problems is ball usage - it's crippling us - people want to promote such a dreadful user of the ball.

Disposal efficiency:
Dal Santo - 81% (down from 84% last year)
Hayes - 71% (down from 78%)
Joey - 70% (down from 79%)
Ball - 65% (down from 75%)

Jones - 77% (up from 56%)

For a guy who's been called one of the worst users of the ball in the league and one of the worst decision-makers, he's been hitting an awful lot of targets. He's been getting a lot of footy in a relatively small amount of TOG. He's been getting it in contested and uncontested situations. He's cut down on the clangers considerably. I've seen a massive improvement in Jones since last year and think he can improve much more.

[BAM! (shhhh)]

In his Saints games so far this year, Jones disposal hasn't been bad.

He did have one kick at goal which I recall thinking any AFL level player should have been able to kick... but in general play, his hanballs have been fine, and he's limited his turnovers.

I expect it to revert, I'm not sold, but on form at the moment, he's earning his spot.

[redwhite&blackblood]

I've got nothing against CJ. I just can't stand that when one of our major problems is ball usage - it's crippling us - people want to promote such a dreadful user of the ball.

Disposal efficiency:
Dal Santo - 81% (down from 84% last year)
Hayes - 71% (down from 78%)
Joey - 70% (down from 79%)
Ball - 65% (down from 75%)

Jones - 77% (up from 56%)

For a guy who's been called one of the worst users of the ball in the league and one of the worst decision-makers, he's been hitting an awful lot of targets. He's been getting a lot of footy in a relatively small amount of TOG. He's been getting it in contested and uncontested situations. He's cut down on the clangers considerably. I've seen a massive improvement in Jones since last year and think he can improve much more.

Goes to show once an opinion has been made some people never change despite the evidence. Dare say if you consider the amount of ball CJ gets compared to Dal, Lendog, Joey and Bally his % should be higher. The more you get the ball more likely you are to turn it over. Only superstars get plenty and have high efficiency rates.

[plugger66]

I've got nothing against CJ. I just can't stand that when one of our major problems is ball usage - it's crippling us - people want to promote such a dreadful user of the ball.

Disposal efficiency:
Dal Santo - 81% (down from 84% last year)
Hayes - 71% (down from 78%)
Joey - 70% (down from 79%)
Ball - 65% (down from 75%)

Jones - 77% (up from 56%)

For a guy who's been called one of the worst users of the ball in the league and one of the worst decision-makers, he's been hitting an awful lot of targets. He's been getting a lot of footy in a relatively small amount of TOG. He's been getting it in contested and uncontested situations. He's cut down on the clangers considerably. I've seen a massive improvement in Jones since last year and think he can improve much more.

Goes to show once an opinion has been made some people never change despite the evidence. Dare say if you consider the amount of ball CJ gets compared to Dal, Lendog, Joey and Bally his % should be higher. The more you get the ball more likely you are to turn it over. Only superstars get plenty and have high efficiency rates.

Also he always kicks no more than 20 metres or handballs so you would hope he has a better %.

[redwhite&blackblood]

I've got nothing against CJ. I just can't stand that when one of our major problems is ball usage - it's crippling us - people want to promote such a dreadful user of the ball.

Disposal efficiency:
Dal Santo - 81% (down from 84% last year)
Hayes - 71% (down from 78%)
Joey - 70% (down from 79%)
Ball - 65% (down from 75%)

Jones - 77% (up from 56%)

For a guy who's been called one of the worst users of the ball in the league and one of the worst decision-makers, he's been hitting an awful lot of targets. He's been getting a lot of footy in a relatively small amount of TOG. He's been getting it in contested and uncontested situations. He's cut down on the clangers considerably. I've seen a massive improvement in Jones since last year and think he can improve much more.

Goes to show once an opinion has been made some people never change despite the evidence. Dare say if you consider the amount of ball CJ gets compared to Dal, Lendog, Joey and Bally his % should be higher. The more you get the ball more likely you are to turn it over. Only superstars get plenty and have high efficiency rates.

Also he always kicks no more than 20 metres or handballs so you would hope he has a better %.

You'd hope he is learning from the best 20m kick in the league....... one R Harvey.

[evertonfc]

When was the last time anyone saw Jones win contested footy in a real pack (not skirting the fringes)? He wins it outisde the contested zone, so, naturally his effectiveness will be up.

He's taken to kicking the ball sideways and short a lot this year (which slows up our play), and if he goes long, he lollypops it (which are not considered clangers).

There's so much more to kicking effectiveness than stats. Does he kick to space? Does he move the ball quickly? Does he take the best option? Can he find an teammate more than 30m forward of his current position? Can he kick in front of goals?

I don't rate Birss at all, but I'd much rather him...

Jones always seems second the ball; hence why people think he's a great chaser. And when he does get it, it's genuinely rabbit in the headlight stuff.

At 24, how much improvement can we really expect by the age of 26?