2007 vs 2008. Where can our improvement come from?
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2007 vs 2008. Where can our improvement come from?
Hi. Long time reader first time poster – so don’t rip me apart too much!
Been having a think about where our improvement can come from this year. Before I start I will preface this with – ‘I know it’s only pre-season’.
I can see improvements coming from both our players as individuals but also from the team as a whole with everyone pulling in the same direction and implementing RL’s game plan (which appears to be much more than copy the Swans).
Anyway – here I go….
PLAYERS
I feel that the potential improvement in our playing group due to our list management and injury management is massive. Potential is the key word here, especially when looking at injuries but that being said we have to have a better year in that area than last year. Surely! It can’t get any worse than having to play Howard and Sweeney in the same side! Or can it……
Drafting, Trading, Promotions & Delistings
Pluses – King, C Gardiner, Schneider, Dempster, Geary
Minuses – Voss, Thompson, M Clarke, Sweeney (hardly played), Hamill (didn’t play), Brooks (didn’t play), Watts (didn’t play).
Massive Improvement in the quality of our list here. Voss and Thompson were fantastic servants in their prime but offered little last year. Similarly Hamill was a gun but gave us zilch last year. As for the rest……Meh!
Injuries
Here are players who we should expect to have a bigger impact this year due to injuries holding them back in 2007.
Raph
Max
Ball
M Gardiner
Lenny
Kosi (injury ravaged 06 plus interrupted 07 pre-season)
Goddard (won’t be as good as early 07, but at least we’ll have him back)
Goose (this is a contentious one…..will he be the next Hamill? Nevertheless can only improve on 07)
The early signs this year are good. Kosi, M Gardiner, Raph, Lenny and Bally (he was rusty but his penetration seems to have improved – not bad for a first game back) all seem to be on the mend and hopefully Max’s tightness is just that……
Minus - Attard
Improved Players
Armitage
Allen
Jones
Summary
In summary these players should add improvement to the team compared to what they offered in 2007. King, C Gardiner, M Gardiner, Schneider, Dempster, Geary, Raph, Max, Ball, Lenny, Kosi, Goddard, Goose, Armitage, Allen, Jones. Should and will are 2 different things but it is a nice long list isn’t it!
We’ve lost 4 players who offered anything at all last year – Voss, Thompson, Attard, M Clarke. These 4 players have been more than covered as Attard was the only one who offered anything of note in 07.
Add to this the flow on effect on other players. Improvements from those around you makes life easier and takes the pressure off yourself. The perfect example is Dal Santo who can struggle to break a tag. With Lenny firing, a fit Bally (hopefully), Monty starting where he left off, Nick might regularly find himself pitted against second string midfielders. Also, King and Gardiner throwing their weight around to protect our midfielders is another flow on effect for a player like Dal. Chips is another example. He had a stellar year but if Max or Goose (both might be too much to hope for) can get back to something resembling their best the rest of the comp should watch out. Chips taking the third best tall? I like the idea of that. Grammy and Gilbo are in the same boat here.
COACHING
Lyon’s coaching appears to be rubbing off.
He obviously places a heavy emphasis on tackling pressure, especially in the forward line, as evidenced by his rating of and promotion of Jones. I remember thinking during Round 1 against Melb last year – how good is our pressure! Unfortunately, we were very inconsistent in this area throughout the year. Round 2 against Brissie was a case in point. However, so far this pre-season we have been able to string 3 games together in a row that have exemplified a commitment to applying pressure across the park. I read that Milne had 5 tackles on Fri night for Christ’s sake!
Another area where we were poor last year was stoppages. Hit outs, hit outs to advantage, getting first use, golas from stoppages. Blah blah blah. It’s been debated no end on this forum. Whether or not you believe that having a big hairy ruckmen who wins hitouts is important, no one can argue that winning the ball at the stoppage more than your opponent is not a good thing to do. We smashed Essendon in both the hit-outs and the clearances so whatever your stance, you’ve gotta be happy with that. Hille and Laycock is not a bad ruck combo either……
Thanks!
Been having a think about where our improvement can come from this year. Before I start I will preface this with – ‘I know it’s only pre-season’.
I can see improvements coming from both our players as individuals but also from the team as a whole with everyone pulling in the same direction and implementing RL’s game plan (which appears to be much more than copy the Swans).
Anyway – here I go….
PLAYERS
I feel that the potential improvement in our playing group due to our list management and injury management is massive. Potential is the key word here, especially when looking at injuries but that being said we have to have a better year in that area than last year. Surely! It can’t get any worse than having to play Howard and Sweeney in the same side! Or can it……
Drafting, Trading, Promotions & Delistings
Pluses – King, C Gardiner, Schneider, Dempster, Geary
Minuses – Voss, Thompson, M Clarke, Sweeney (hardly played), Hamill (didn’t play), Brooks (didn’t play), Watts (didn’t play).
Massive Improvement in the quality of our list here. Voss and Thompson were fantastic servants in their prime but offered little last year. Similarly Hamill was a gun but gave us zilch last year. As for the rest……Meh!
Injuries
Here are players who we should expect to have a bigger impact this year due to injuries holding them back in 2007.
Raph
Max
Ball
M Gardiner
Lenny
Kosi (injury ravaged 06 plus interrupted 07 pre-season)
Goddard (won’t be as good as early 07, but at least we’ll have him back)
Goose (this is a contentious one…..will he be the next Hamill? Nevertheless can only improve on 07)
The early signs this year are good. Kosi, M Gardiner, Raph, Lenny and Bally (he was rusty but his penetration seems to have improved – not bad for a first game back) all seem to be on the mend and hopefully Max’s tightness is just that……
Minus - Attard
Improved Players
Armitage
Allen
Jones
Summary
In summary these players should add improvement to the team compared to what they offered in 2007. King, C Gardiner, M Gardiner, Schneider, Dempster, Geary, Raph, Max, Ball, Lenny, Kosi, Goddard, Goose, Armitage, Allen, Jones. Should and will are 2 different things but it is a nice long list isn’t it!
We’ve lost 4 players who offered anything at all last year – Voss, Thompson, Attard, M Clarke. These 4 players have been more than covered as Attard was the only one who offered anything of note in 07.
Add to this the flow on effect on other players. Improvements from those around you makes life easier and takes the pressure off yourself. The perfect example is Dal Santo who can struggle to break a tag. With Lenny firing, a fit Bally (hopefully), Monty starting where he left off, Nick might regularly find himself pitted against second string midfielders. Also, King and Gardiner throwing their weight around to protect our midfielders is another flow on effect for a player like Dal. Chips is another example. He had a stellar year but if Max or Goose (both might be too much to hope for) can get back to something resembling their best the rest of the comp should watch out. Chips taking the third best tall? I like the idea of that. Grammy and Gilbo are in the same boat here.
COACHING
Lyon’s coaching appears to be rubbing off.
He obviously places a heavy emphasis on tackling pressure, especially in the forward line, as evidenced by his rating of and promotion of Jones. I remember thinking during Round 1 against Melb last year – how good is our pressure! Unfortunately, we were very inconsistent in this area throughout the year. Round 2 against Brissie was a case in point. However, so far this pre-season we have been able to string 3 games together in a row that have exemplified a commitment to applying pressure across the park. I read that Milne had 5 tackles on Fri night for Christ’s sake!
Another area where we were poor last year was stoppages. Hit outs, hit outs to advantage, getting first use, golas from stoppages. Blah blah blah. It’s been debated no end on this forum. Whether or not you believe that having a big hairy ruckmen who wins hitouts is important, no one can argue that winning the ball at the stoppage more than your opponent is not a good thing to do. We smashed Essendon in both the hit-outs and the clearances so whatever your stance, you’ve gotta be happy with that. Hille and Laycock is not a bad ruck combo either……
Thanks!
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Re: 2007 vs 2008. Where can our improvement come from?
nice first post jaun. welcome aboard the good ship saintsational
- saintsRrising
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- mad saint guy
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Aussie had an ordinary 2005 and was nowhere near as good as Gram in 2006.ausfatcat wrote:Aussie Jones at the time was a big loss.
To the OP - it is all good and well to list all the players who were injured/unfit last year, but don't forget that there wll be plenty of new injuries this year and there will be different players who struggle. How much we improve will depend on how well we can cover those injuries. Right now it looks like we finally have some midfield depth (Armitage, Geary, Birss, Eddy) and we've got a couple of forward options if we lose a couple of players from there. We still have no ruck depth, but hopefully at least one of King/Gardiner is available throughout the year.
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Exactly. We will have injuries this year but I am hopeful of a better year in this respect. At one stage last year we got to the point where only one fit player was left of out of the 22. Can't really get any worse than that.mad saint guy wrote:Aussie had an ordinary 2005 and was nowhere near as good as Gram in 2006.ausfatcat wrote:Aussie Jones at the time was a big loss.
To the OP - it is all good and well to list all the players who were injured/unfit last year, but don't forget that there wll be plenty of new injuries this year and there will be different players who struggle. How much we improve will depend on how well we can cover those injuries. Right now it looks like we finally have some midfield depth (Armitage, Geary, Birss, Eddy) and we've got a couple of forward options if we lose a couple of players from there. We still have no ruck depth, but hopefully at least one of King/Gardiner is available throughout the year.
But if it does occur again, you are right, we now have more depth to cover it. Depth wise, our backline is where we are lean and where we were hit hardest last year (Goose, Max & Chips all out at once). We can afford to have one out at any given time with Raph, Goddard, Gram or Gwilt taking the 3rd tall. Our other option is popping Kosi back (where it was touted he would play last year). Personally I don't like that idea though.
Ideally we have a King & Gardner ruck duo all season with Kosi in the forwardline. But even if it's King/Gardiner & Rix with Kosi up forward, this is better than Kosi & Rix with no Kosi up forward.
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Another area where there is a lot of improvement to be made is aour ability to run out games. RL mentioned last year that we needed to develop more gut runners during the pre-season with Harves and Lenny the only two he rated in this area.
Our 4th quarter efforts left a lot to be desired in a few games last year, most notably against Collingwood. In addition, from memory our starts were quite poor. Fitness wise the 1st and last quarters are the toughest. The last quarter is obvious but the first quarter is also where lack of fitness can be found wanting - the pace of the game is at its fastest then.
Things appear to be lookin up here. Against Richmond we drew away in the fourth quarter after they came at us a bit during the 3rd. Geelong - nice tight win, came from behind at the death. Ditto, Essendon......
I didn't catch the Geelong game but against Essendon we seemed to maintain our intensity, run and pressure for the entire game.
Our 4th quarter efforts left a lot to be desired in a few games last year, most notably against Collingwood. In addition, from memory our starts were quite poor. Fitness wise the 1st and last quarters are the toughest. The last quarter is obvious but the first quarter is also where lack of fitness can be found wanting - the pace of the game is at its fastest then.
Things appear to be lookin up here. Against Richmond we drew away in the fourth quarter after they came at us a bit during the 3rd. Geelong - nice tight win, came from behind at the death. Ditto, Essendon......
I didn't catch the Geelong game but against Essendon we seemed to maintain our intensity, run and pressure for the entire game.
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Not the way he played in his last year.ausfatcat wrote:Aussie Jones at the time was a big loss.
I honestly had described his mid season form as selfish.
Selfish in the way he would try and go for a run instead of first and best options. He seemed to be playing for himself.
Which was proven by his retirement; describing that he had lost his motivation to play.