Goose Concerns

[carn_sainter]

Whilst i am capable of seeing the positive in this situation, i thought i would play devil's advocate/pessimist on this one and see if posters can give me some real confidence about the following situation:

Goose's return.

For me last year was terrible for Goose. He was so far out of touch that i didn't think he deserved a game really. I understand that with the injury he was starting from a long way back, so to speak...but still, his gradient of improvement was pitifully slow and gradual (indeed almost wasn't there)...

Whereas i would have been accepting of it i got a bit anti-goose simply because he was giving away silly frees, contesting contests poorly and just being really stupid...not learning.

I mean, he himself was saying he was fully fit...without excuse...

So, i now find myself pondering just how, if he was fit (hence a pre-season will have aided only little his successful recapture of form), he is going to improve this season...

His approach to the game was wrong...the rule changes and everything really didn't suit him and he was trying to cut corners by holding, scragging and etc and he was getting caught...

So, my main concern is that the game may have passed him by...

Anyway, the question is: How will Goose improve this season?


NB: i also acknowledge that a poorly performing midfield (and team) allowing excellent ball delivery to opposition forward lines didn't help and hopefully that will be improved...however, there will always be good delivery so Goose is still a concern for mine...

[SaintBot]

i think i read somewhere that goose has been doing a lot of work at becoming more versatile, ie able to play on both talls and smalls


he is very committed and i have no doubt he can put his injury behind him and regain his form

[aussiejones]

In all fairness I bet he was frustrated and out of touch , hence scragging result.

OK he has taken a fair time , BUT ffs we know he is a good player.

Best wishes Goose may your fitness and skills return in 2008

[ausfatcat]

you also have to take into account with the new rules, that everyone struggled with them in the early rounds and NAB cup last year. It took all the defenders sometime to get right, but because Goose really only started playing midseason when everyone was used to them he was well and truely behind the eight ball in that regard.

[saintbrat]

Goose himself said he would start in a couple of weeks- with casey
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[JeffDunne]

Take a look at the vision of him in the qtr time huddle round 1 last year (if you can find it) and you'll see the reason for his form early last year.

[Solar]

I would like to see him developed into the next FB, he would have lost alot of his ability to turn and run away thus the simple tasks of spoiling larger forwards should be focused upon.

[Saints Premiers 2008]

look at nathan brown from the tigers as a prime example...he tried to come back...failed (im not criticizing)...it took him a good three months to come back and play good footy

and when he did he was easily the best player in the tiges line up...

give goose a few good games to get back into it...i have no doubt he will...he has already shown how damn good he is...

its a matter of the leg

[mad saint guy]

Goose is an extremely one-dimensional player and can only play effectively on the powerful, slow CHF's or on inexperienced kids (as he can read the play well and hurt the opposition on the rebound).

Without a full pre season I don't think we'll see the best of him this year either. I would like for him to aim to be close to full fitness (after 5-6 games with Casey) by round 11 and return to the seniors then, rather than playing unfit, risking further injury and being a liability. Then the main goal should be to make sure he makes it through the rest of the season uninjured so he can get back to his best in 2009.

[spert]

I think he needs to work on consistancy -once he gets back to 100% fitness. He has been great in some games and totally undisciplined and ordinary in other games. I think this might be the year that makes or breaks him.

[Sobraz]

Didnt he apparently knock back a rather hefty sum from the blues during the off season, taking less to stay a saint.. Not that the blues necassarily make great recruiting decisions, but he is a valuable player.. I have alot of respect for the way he plays the game and carries himself..

He will be back, 100%... Last year was a big eye opener for him, and this year both he and the coaching staff will have learned from their mistakes.

[BAM! (shhhh)]

Goose is an extremely one-dimensional player and can only play effectively on the powerful, slow CHF's or on inexperienced kids (as he can read the play well and hurt the opposition on the rebound).

Nonsense.

As well as being big and strong, he's got great straight line speed and closing speed, fantastic endurance, and a 60m kick. I'll back a fit Goose on any CHF in the comp, and back him to make those around him better defensively at the same time. What he lacks as a playmaker should be made up for by Goddard, Raph, Gram, Fisher and Gilbert.

While I'm dubious of this idea that he'll be able to play on smalls, and agree that without a preseason some of those attributes will be reduced, Goose is far from one dimensional.

[saintsRrising]

Goose is a valuable part of our backline..apart from the qualities mention by BAM! the other quality that Goose has is a measure of toughness and meaness....something which the Saints as a team lack.

He also has the knack of knowing when to run forward to present another option up forward.

I would not play him on very small forwards, particularly those blessed with pace....but remember with the height of players creeping up that many flankers these days are tallish...ie 190/191

[Otiman]

I have serious doubts about Goose. I do not believe he fits into our current gameplan. Whether the gameplan was made without him included is an interesting point, too.

He will also lack confidence in his fitness, ability, and also in his leg and foot.

I've not set my hopes too high for '08, but hope that by '09 he can have all of his niggles sorted, and Ross can slot him into our back half nicely.

[GrumpyOne]

Maguire - 2 weeks.

[CURLY]

I have serious doubts about Goose. I do not believe he fits into our current gameplan. Whether the gameplan was made without him included is an interesting point, too.

He will also lack confidence in his fitness, ability, and also in his leg and foot.

I've not set my hopes too high for '08, but hope that by '09 he can have all of his niggles sorted, and Ross can slot him into our back half nicely.

What coaches game plan wouldnt include a big bodied chb who takes contested marks. Goose is very important to our structure hence the reason he played every game he was deemed fit for.

[Otiman]

he's got great straight line speed and closing speed, fantastic endurance, and a 60m kick. I'll back a fit Goose on any CHF in the comp

This is where the problem lies, the operative word i'd use here is "had".

[BAM! (shhhh)]

he's got great straight line speed and closing speed, fantastic endurance, and a 60m kick. I'll back a fit Goose on any CHF in the comp

This is where the problem lies, the operative word i'd use here is "had".

What reason is there to believe he wouldn't make a full recovery?

[Otiman]

What reason is there to believe he wouldn't make a full recovery?

- Osteitis Pubis (current condition: unknown)
- Broken Tib+Fib
- Compartment Syndrome + further complications
- Stress fractures in foot
- Ongoing foot issues

There has to be some sort of permanent damage in amongst that lot, not including anything psychological.

[mad saint guy]

As well as being big and strong, he's got great straight line speed and closing speed, fantastic endurance, and a 60m kick. I'll back a fit Goose on any CHF in the comp, and back him to make those around him better defensively at the same time. What he lacks as a playmaker should be made up for by Goddard, Raph, Gram, Fisher and Gilbert.

His straight line speed (when 100% fit) is ok, but opposition forwards all know that now. His biggest weakness is the fact that he can't change direction. Against the powerful key forwards who are poor at ground level and have no agility Goose is an extremely effective player. And if he is lucky enough to get a match up against a kid with little experience or a GOP who reads the play poorly, then Goose is very good and knowing when to run forward thump the footy inside 50.

However many CHF's these days are extremely agile and good at ground level. Quinten Lynch would have no problem circles running around Goose all day. Lance Franklin would kill him once the ball hits the ground. Then there are players who are simply far too quick for him.

I don't think there is any problem with his "playmaking" or rebounding, he just isn't suited to playing on a lot of modern key forwards. Against most teams we could usually find a suitable match up for him, but unless he is 100% fit and in top form, he just isn't a very effective player. He is living off memories of his good '04 season and a couple of good games in '05 at the moment. If someone started watching footy in 2006 they would have no idea why he is regarded as being in our best 22.

[Dan Warna]

I was a big fan of the goose when I first saw those bug eyes focus on the footy and go for the ball despite getting hammered.

I remember that monkey anthony rocca move to take out a young goose maguire because he was so devastating on st kilda's line.

I would hate to see this prodigious talent wiped out by injury.

i look forward with anticipation to seeing him back in full flight for us.

[Otiman]

Would anyone care to name the players he would be the #1 match for? (ahead of Max and Sam Fisher)

[Ralphy]

how long is

hayes
schneider
and all the other injuries out for?
dempster

[Dan Warna]

tredrea, mooney, jonathon brown or any other so called 'power forward'

max is flexible enough to go on a small forward or a leading forward like ed hiloyd (yes lloyd smashed him his first game back from injury but by and large he's had the measuire of most leading forwards)

fisher is a jack of all trades but can get monstered (no critique of his courage) sometimes by power forwards.

I think a lot of folks have forgotten how influential goose can be because of his long time injured.

[Ralphy]

Roughead

lucas...

barry hall