Blake may have found a new role

[Broodruff]

Blake seems to either be a love him or hate him kinda player and while I will admit that he isnt quite up to the standard of some of our other players in terms of skills, I still do like him as a player.

To me, he seems like the silent achiever: He will always do what is expected of him, he will do what he needs to do and push himself to get it done, while never making much of a fuss about it.

Dont get me wrong. Blake is no superstar. He will never live up to names like Hudghton, Harvey or Gherig. Stop and think for a second though, you can't have a team FULL of 'superstars'

Blake is there, week in, week out, doing the job that he needs to do

[saintsRrising]

Stop and think for a second though, you can't have a team FULL of 'superstars'

I have.....

....but all of the following cannot fit into your best 22 if we have a low injury/suspension rate....and in particular once the NAB finishes and you can only select 22 players. Many of the group below will miss out.

* Baker, LFisher, Dempster, Raph, Schneider, Birss , C Gardiner, Blake All senior players with games under their belt.

(yes some may scream what Baker or Schneider????? But yes the pool of available players is better in 2008 than it was in 2007...plus we hope that there will be more players available through fitness. Personally I would see Schneider playing in the best 22 though).

* Geary and Armo... Kids ready to be blooded


To the above players such as Fior will be under the pump to play better than they did in 2007 to hold their places. Unless we havea crap year the 2007 form of many will not be good enough and the bar has been raised.


In 2008 we would seem to have a number of worthy players who are on the fringe and some will miss out.

= depth.

If Blake can raise his standards he will maintain his spot.....if not then players in the above group will ease him out.

[ausfatcat]

spot on




Also M Gardiner, King, Rix will be under pressure to from McVoy and Van Rheenan (hopefully anyway).

[Broodruff]

I have.....

....but all of the following cannot fit into your best 22 if we have a low injury/suspension rate....and in particular once the NAB finishes and you can only select 22 players. Many of the group below will miss out.

* Baker, LFisher, Dempster, Raph, Schneider, Birss , C Gardiner, Blake All senior players with games under their belt.

(yes some may scream what Baker or Schneider????? But yes the pool of available players is better in 2008 than it was in 2007...plus we hope that there will be more players available through fitness. Personally I would see Schneider playing in the best 22 though).

* Geary and Armo... Kids ready to be blooded


To the above players such as Fior will be under the pump to play better than they did in 2007 to hold their places. Unless we havea crap year the 2007 form of many will not be good enough and the bar has been raised.


In 2008 we would seem to have a number of worthy players who are on the fringe and some will miss out.

= depth.

If Blake can raise his standards he will maintain his spot.....if not then players in the above group will ease him out.

You do have a good point:
There are a number of kids who after a bit more game time would be knocking the door down for selection, the promise of depth that we are showing this early: well.. I just cant help but get excited:

However, I think, as some other people have pointed out (maybe not in this thread?) that Blake is being used to set an example that having skills arent enough.

Its obvious that Blakes spot in the side is under a LOT of pressure in terms of skills. There are a lot of players who are on par, or better than him in terms of this.

But think what a kick in the pants it would be for some of the guys who, are clearly better in the skills department, to be left out, for someone who wasnt quite as skilled, but applied himself, pushed himself, every minute of every quarter.

[saintsRrising]

Yes I agree...I think RL is look for better work rates this year.

One thing going for Blake is that he is a true utility and can play a variety of roles....so when they are picking player 22, his work rate and versatility may swing it his way.


But if player 22 is Schnieder vs Gilbo vs Blake.....who ya gonna call

[Broodruff]

But if player 22 is Schnieder vs Gilbo vs Blake.....who ya gonna call

I hate you for asking this question

If I was a coach trying to push the point of a good attitute and work rate to the rest of the team: I'd pick Blake

If I was just a starry-eyed supporter picking who he likes best: Gilbert


Despite all the arguing, bichering and debating, whatever you may like to call it, one main point sticks in the back of my my mind:

To have so many people, putting so many of our guys up on the chopping block speaks absoloute volumes about our depth this year

It is only the NAB cup, it doesnt count for much, but it doesnt count for nothing either. All that aside, I cannot help but get very very excited about the year ahead

[BelfastSaint]

Blake on SEN this morning - When asked about his onfield position referred to himself as "Selleys All Gap" .....

[BAM! (shhhh)]

Yes I agree...I think RL is look for better work rates this year.

One thing going for Blake is that he is a true utility and can play a variety of roles....so when they are picking player 22, his work rate and versatility may swing it his way.


But if player 22 is Schnieder vs Gilbo vs Blake.....who ya gonna call

An excellent and timely question given the effort we're seeing by some of the depth guys to push for a spot in the 22. Jones and C Gardiner for instance appear to be making a push, but where do the priorities lie? Is it the experience of Blake? Is it the development of Armitage? The tenacity of Jones?

As I've been pondering I've come to a single conclusion - I'm glad it's Lyon's job and not mine... so much easier to take potshots from the side when things don't work.

I'd think that Gilbo would be a walkup start this year, BUT who makes way for Gram, Goddard, Maguire, Baker, Schneider, Reiwoldt ,Hayes and Ball who are all walkups?

We can guess that Geary, Eddy, Birss, Jones, Allen, Armitage won't be in the 22, players such as Miles, Howard and Steven are really just seeitn time because of the NAB extended interchange... so that's 6 spots for 9 players... which means that guys like Blake, Leigh Fisher, Raph Clarke are in the firing line before we consider the press of guys who would be considered outside the 22.

It makes for some very interesting and doubtless controversial decisions to be made.

[saintsRrising]

Yes...much easier calling from the sidelines.

Greater depth is going to make it much harder at the selection table in 2008....particular with more players being avaiable as well.


Lets look at another tough call as an example.

Luke Ball...was still played last year despite obviously being limited.

He should be fitter this year...but may still be short of fitness so that he still plays restricted....at least say for the first 6 games.

IF he is still restricted.....does RL run with him still......or instead rotate X, Schneider, Birss through the midfiled...and or blood Arm?

So should Ball start the year at Casey????? I do note that Ball has withdrawn from the captaincy this year.



Or down forward

Two talls or three? Kosi, GTrain and Roo.....

Schneider vs Milne vs Jones vs X man vs C Gardiner (I fa 7 man backline with 3 talls there is only room for two...with one on the bench rotating through)

BP

Raph vs Geary vs L Fisher vs Baker (when available)

If Goose misses the start of the year S Fisher moving to CHB may open up another slot.

Fiora
Became an automatic pick in 2007...but suddenly Fizz is going to have to raise another gear. (and I am a Fizz fan).



In previous years you would picka team....and agonise of the last few spots in terms of wishing for better players......or picking your rucks based on "well someone has to ruck"....

2008 promises to still have you agaonsing over the last few places.....but this time in how does won narrow the 25/26 of p[layers that you are happy to have play into the final 22.

[Oh When the Saints]

Barring another '07-like run of injuries, there are going to be some very good footballers miss out on playing in our 22 this year.

Which is what you want.


But as others have said, I glad it's RL making all these decisions ... because I'd hate to have to do it myself

[bigcarl]

But as others have said, I glad it's RL making all these decisions ... because I'd hate to have to do it myself

hope he's real hard a*se because it will take one at times to get the best team out there.

he's already said there are no sacred cows at st kilda. whether that translates into action is yet to be seen.

all decisions will have to be made on the basis of what is best for the team ... not what's best for the coach or the individual player or the president or anyone else.

however i'd hate to be in his shoes should it become apparent that harvs, for instance, is keeping a better, younger player out.

I couldn't make a decision like that. too much of a soft touch.

having said all that every team looks to have depth when it is winning. when you are losing there are holes everywhere.

[barneyboyz]

half back line already filled by gram, fisher and maguire.

What if Gram moves to the middle as has been suggested? at any rate he should be alright starting off the bench, he is in my belief, to the team, a Schwarz type player , the heart and soul (should have been kept), these are the types of players that all premiership teams have and without giving examples, IMO this is why both Grant and now Ross have kept him; if we win a premiership in the very near future, he will have contributed.

Criticism?

Problem with Gram in midfield: Harvey, Dal Santo, Ball, Monty, Lenny, BJ, Fiora, Birss, Armitage, Jones et al. We already have an abundance of midfielders, as great as Gram is, I love him off half-back, gives us so much run. With him in the center, we have Sam Fisher running off half-back alone, which is good, but also easy to tag if he tries to play loose. Keep Gram where he is to provide us with the run and with options. Plus he has the experience now and the awareness. Gram is amazing, but so is our midfield. If we shift Gram to midfield, I do not think Blake can take his place.

Worthy idea, but we have a great midfield, so lets put as much fire-power in our backline as possible. We have had such a vulnerable backline since forever it has seemed, so lets not go back down that path in 08.

Sorry about the late reply, the interesting thing is that running H/B's almost require similar rotations these days and when you think about it, much of the play is like the midfield these days. At any rate Blake is a not too shabby utility and still getting better,

Just remember that Sheeds played all sorts of games with all players and as long as 'they' have an understanding....

[Oh When the Saints]

having said all that every team looks to have depth when it is winning. when you are losing there are holes everywhere.

Very good point.

Had we lost against Richmond, we might at this stage be bemoaning how we rely too much on our top 12 players ...

[nicola69]

I think Blakey fits the bill of;

DEFENSIVE MIDFIELDER !!

Agreed, that's what he was being played as most of the time in the second half of last season.

Blake is a quality player combining pretty awesome size with way above average overhead ability, excellent stamina, strong running and linking propensities and high ground level skills. No shrinking violet either - he's proven that for years by taking on the top ruckmen in the league without ever flinching.

He can play CHB, FB or CHF when required.

He would be snapped up as a starting 18 player by every other club in the comp if they could get their hands on him.

I don't understand why he cops negative criticism in some of the posts.

best regards to all you fanatics out there. Footy is sanity, Life is mad.

[barneyboyz]

I think Blakey fits the bill of;

DEFENSIVE MIDFIELDER !!

Agreed, that's what he was being played as most of the time in the second half of last season.

Blake is a quality player combining pretty awesome size with way above average overhead ability, excellent stamina, strong running and linking propensities and high ground level skills. No shrinking violet either - he's proven that for years by taking on the top ruckmen in the league without ever flinching.

He can play CHB, FB or CHF when required.

He would be snapped up as a starting 18 player by every other club in the comp if they could get their hands on him.

I don't understand why he cops negative criticism in some of the posts.

best regards to all you fanatics out there. Footy is sanity, Life is mad.

Probably because at St Kilda we haven't gotten used to the idea that good teams have these types of players and we expect them all to be stars

[nicola69]

Stop and think for a second though, you can't have a team FULL of 'superstars'

I have.....

....but all of the following cannot fit into your best 22 if we have a low injury/suspension rate....and in particular once the NAB finishes and you can only select 22 players. Many of the group below will miss out.

* Baker, LFisher, Dempster, Raph, Schneider, Birss , C Gardiner, Blake All senior players with games under their belt.

sorry, disagree strongy about Baker (in particular) and Blake. They are proven performers who don't give up if you go a few goals down. That's worth a lot. I really don't understand why you included "the Butcher, the Baker, the Haymaker". But the others (excl Blake) - you are spot on, although Scheider, Dempster and C Gardiner if given a chance... Raph makes the list because of the injury factor. I would add Fiora and Milne to your list

regards

(yes some may scream what Baker or Schneider????? But yes the pool of available players is better in 2008 than it was in 2007...plus we hope that there will be more players available through fitness. Personally I would see Schneider playing in the best 22 though).

* Geary and Armo... Kids ready to be blooded


To the above players such as Fior will be under the pump to play better than they did in 2007 to hold their places. Unless we havea crap year the 2007 form of many will not be good enough and the bar has been raised.


In 2008 we would seem to have a number of worthy players who are on the fringe and some will miss out.

= depth.

If Blake can raise his standards he will maintain his spot.....if not then players in the above group will ease him out.

[vacuous space]

....but all of the following cannot fit into your best 22 if we have a low injury/suspension rate....and in particular once the NAB finishes and you can only select 22 players. Many of the group below will miss out.

* Baker, LFisher, Dempster, Raph, Schneider, Birss , C Gardiner, Blake All senior players with games under their belt.

Michael Gardiner? I know he's a favourite of yours, but if it comes down to it, does RL think having a second ruckman is really that important? Would he choose Gardi while he's got King, Kosi and Blake in the lineup? If it came down to it, would he choose Gardiner over any of the guys you mentioned above?

Coaches love Blake and there's a reason for that. He can be beaten, but he makes his opponents earn it. He doesn't have the greatest skills, but he usually plays within his limitations. He played every single game last year and he frequently drew an exceptional opponent. RL obviously likes him, and I would be extremely surprised if he misses many games this year while healthy.

[saintsRrising]

Stop and think for a second though, you can't have a team FULL of 'superstars'

I have.....

....but all of the following cannot fit into your best 22 if we have a low injury/suspension rate....and in particular once the NAB finishes and you can only select 22 players. Many of the group below will miss out.

* Baker, LFisher, Dempster, Raph, Schneider, Birss , C Gardiner, Blake All senior players with games under their belt.

sorry, disagree strongy about Baker (in particular) and Blake. They are proven performers who don't give up if you go a few goals down. That's worth a lot. I really don't understand why you included "the Butcher, the Baker, the Haymaker". But the others (excl Blake) - you are spot on, although Scheider, Dempster and C Gardiner if given a chance... Raph makes the list because of the injury factor. I would add Fiora and Milne to your list

regards.

No need to be sorry...as you are free to express your opinion...and that is what a forum is largely about.

Might be more illuminating though if you pick your best 22 so we can see who you would have in...and leave out.

[saintsRrising]

....but all of the following cannot fit into your best 22 if we have a low injury/suspension rate....and in particular once the NAB finishes and you can only select 22 players. Many of the group below will miss out.

* Baker, LFisher, Dempster, Raph, Schneider, Birss , C Gardiner, Blake All senior players with games under their belt.

Michael Gardiner? .

The group of players was illustrative of the point that there are quite a number of players capable of playing AFL level football but who are not certainties for a "best 22"....and players that I see as competing with blake fora slot in the team.

You can add him (MG) to the list if you want.....I am still waiting to see if he can play regular football at a high enough standard.

His Tigers match was promising but he still needs to improve.

If he can...and King stays fit...then I personally do not see Blake displacing either of them.

A number of Saints players have commented about how good it will be to play midfield to King and Gardiner in the ruck.

I have not heard similar comments by Saints players taking joy in roving to Blake's ruckwork.

I know he's a favourite of yours, .

How do you know that??

I am hopeful yes that he can regain close to the form that he has played at WCE. If he can I see him as a potentially important cog in the Saints being a better football team.

But a favourite of mine??? No you are mistaken.

If I was rating players on how much I "like" them then Blake would rate very very highly. Gardi would be quite low.

Some forumites seem to want to love or hate players based on their ability...I am not one of them.

but if it comes down to it, does RL think having a second ruckman is really that important? Would he choose Gardi while he's got King, Kosi and Blake in the lineup? If it came down to it, would he choose Gardiner over any of the guys you mentioned above? .

Well if M Gardiner can get fit and show good form...then come the H&A you will have the answer to your question.

If I was a selector I would play two ruckmen in King and Gardiner if they are both fit and in good form. If not then I would look at other options.

Kosi I would mainly play as a forward.

Blake if in the 22 I would play as a utility...sometime tagging, sometimes back, sometimes as an extra ruck. Yes he can also go third man up on occasion or pinch hit in the ruck, but I would not play him as the No 2 ruckman unless the cupboard is bare.

His game against the tigers I thought was good....and that is what I posted post-game.

Coaches love Blake and there's a reason for that. He can be beaten, but he makes his opponents earn it. He doesn't have the greatest skills, but he usually plays within his limitations. He played every single game last year and he frequently drew an exceptional opponent. RL obviously likes him, and I would be extremely surprised if he misses many games this year while healthy.

[Broodruff]

Stop and think for a second though, you can't have a team FULL of 'superstars'

I have.....

....but all of the following cannot fit into your best 22 if we have a low injury/suspension rate....and in particular once the NAB finishes and you can only select 22 players. Many of the group below will miss out.

* Baker, LFisher, Dempster, Raph, Schneider, Birss , C Gardiner, Blake All senior players with games under their belt.

sorry, disagree strongy about Baker (in particular) and Blake. They are proven performers who don't give up if you go a few goals down. That's worth a lot. I really don't understand why you included "the Butcher, the Baker, the Haymaker". But the others (excl Blake) - you are spot on, although Scheider, Dempster and C Gardiner if given a chance... Raph makes the list because of the injury factor. I would add Fiora and Milne to your list

regards.

No need to be sorry...as you are free to express your opinion...and that is what a forum is largely about.

Thankyou!
I thought I might just point this out, because I rarely see it.
While you mightnt agree on something, it doesnt mean you have to argue about it.

Also, your next point you bring up some very fine points.

There is a big difference between getting excited about a players form, and wanting them to be included in the side, and LIKING a player.

I like X, if he were to get dropped from the side, I may curse and mumble nasty words under my breath, but then I come back to reality and realise that, its for the best of the team:

I, like all of you, have seen many times players have a blinder of a game, absoloute ripper, and when they come off to talk about it, they say how it doesnt really matter what THEY did themselves, the team won, and thats what important.

I think as fans, we sometimes need to remember that. While we always will have our favourites. The next time one of your favourite guys gets dropped, quit your whinging, chin up and remember the team