news on cousins

[Dan Warna]

Dan for your info many young kids come through my club with lots of problems including drugs. At times they can cause trouble and the easy option would be to show them the door but you stick by them some get back on track some dont thats how it is. Do you know why we stand by them Dan and help and encourage them do you ? Your so ignorant you dont! You just shoot your mouth off without any idea as to why we help.

ah well lets try and use our draft picks and fill our list with junkies, because now its st kilda's role to help out junkies, not win games right

You make it sound as though hes living in hells kitchen with tracks up his arm. You are a fool and an ignorent one at that.

so should we take all kids on drugs in the draft? given apparently our role is turn these people around and not win games

[CURLY]

Wouldnt Cousins help a team win games for any team? Better football judges than you obviously are have taken such kids so yes.

[stinger]

As I said Dan, I suspect it's because you are just a nasty, petty, inadequate, little, partick smith wannabe....

Edited for abuse

Edited for abuse

ooowwwhhh......what a nasty little post....nearly as nasty as your extremely offensive avatar.....


...and you reckon that dan has a nasty mouth....you my friend, have a real nasty streak.......

[Dan Warna]

Wouldnt Cousins help a team win games for any team? Better football judges than you obviously are have taken such kids so yes.

would he though?

cool lets sack all our quality players and fill the list with junkies then.

[CURLY]

Wouldnt Cousins help a team win games for any team? Better football judges than you obviously are have taken such kids so yes.

would he though?

cool lets sack all our quality players and fill the list with junkies then.

Yes he would, dont you watch games? Theres a lot of players with far less ability than hes got doing similar things that clubs are aware of and there kept so why would you overlook him.

[Dan Warna]

Wouldnt Cousins help a team win games for any team? Better football judges than you obviously are have taken such kids so yes.

would he though?

cool lets sack all our quality players and fill the list with junkies then.

Yes he would, dont you watch games? Theres a lot of players with far less ability than hes got doing similar things that clubs are aware of and there kept so why would you overlook him.

and who would they be

oh thats right, the AFL has injunctions on discussion of any issues as it continues to cover up the problem.

[stinger]

Wouldnt Cousins help a team win games for any team? Better football judges than you obviously are have taken such kids so yes.

would he though?

cool lets sack all our quality players and fill the list with junkies then.

Yes he would, dont you watch games? Theres a lot of players with far less ability than hes got doing similar things that clubs are aware of and there kept so why would you overlook him.

geez...what's the matter with you.....one of the reasons west coast pissed him off was because the parents of young kids in the draft have stated publicly that they don't want their kids mixing with cousins and his kind......but you want to bring him to st kilda.......without giving a flower for our kids...potential kids..their families....or i might add...our sponsers...get real......

[CURLY]

Wouldnt Cousins help a team win games for any team? Better football judges than you obviously are have taken such kids so yes.

would he though?

cool lets sack all our quality players and fill the list with junkies then.

Yes he would, dont you watch games? Theres a lot of players with far less ability than hes got doing similar things that clubs are aware of and there kept so why would you overlook him.

and who would they be

oh thats right, the AFL has injunctions on discussion of any issues as it continues to cover up the problem.

Just open your eyes Dan youd be suprised grown men at night clubs sucking lollypops isnt a good thing!

[CURLY]

Wouldnt Cousins help a team win games for any team? Better football judges than you obviously are have taken such kids so yes.

would he though?

cool lets sack all our quality players and fill the list with junkies then.

Yes he would, dont you watch games? Theres a lot of players with far less ability than hes got doing similar things that clubs are aware of and there kept so why would you overlook him.

geez...what's the matter with you.....one of the reasons west coast pissed him off was because the parents of young kids in the draft have stated publicly that they don't want their kids mixing with cousins and his kind......but you want to bring him to st kilda.......without giving a flower for our kids...potential kids..their families....or i might add...our sponsers...get real......

Please Stinger all thats just lip service parents of most of these kids dont know what there up to. Go to any sports club and open your eyes and ears its everywhere its how you deal with it is the important thing.

[buzfromgronggrong]

Dan can explain to me the difference between someone "wasting" their life on drugs to someone wasting their life talking endless crap about other people (people they dont know) on the internet?

Surely a wasted life is a wasted life?

How is it you are so high and mighty about what Ben Cousins (a guy who incidently keeps fit, plays football, is popular with women, flies around the world, makes great money, owns property, associates with all manner of REAL people, etc, etc) does but at the same time are so forgiving of yourself who does precious little other than pontificate on the internet?

I think if you asked people to make the choice between living the life of an iron depleted, vitamin E deficient, internet addicted, chronic self-abuser or living that of Ben Cousins - drugs or no drugs, the vast majority would chose the latter.

You certainly are a piece of work.

Why dont you put away the tissues for an hour and scribe anoher of your 'Oh so funny' 'Dans thought of the day' posts - Oh the jocularity!

[BAM! (shhhh)]

would your sympathy extend to everyone addicted to drugs or just cousins because of his talent?

is it st kilda responsibility to turn around every troublemaker in the league?

or does the fact Cousins is or was a superb talent mean that he is immune to criticism?

we are SUPPOSED to be a professional football club aiming to win, not a rehab centre for gangsters and junkies.

Fact of Cousins superb talent means in the coldest sense he's an assett. Fact of Cousins addiction means he's a liability off the field. Aquiring Cousins (for anyone, not just us) is the epitome of taking the tiger by the tail. He could win you a premiership. He could also be a non contributor who has a negative impact on other players.

The football club, as you point out, is supposed to be aiming to win. It would be foolish and negligent for them therefore not to consider Cousins the talent. It would also be foolish and negligent for them not to assess as part of that consideration whether they could isolate the talent from the addict in need of rehabilitation, including internal and external resources.

I think the final consideration *against* taking Cousins is the impact on culture. As Stinger points out, his presence will have a negative impact on other recruiting unless you can continually demonstrate at least a lack of negative influence. A difficult thing to do under the best of circumstances, and if circumstances aren't the best, the increased scrutiny may not be helpful.

If one had a list spot to waste, then it might be worth taking him, telling him he's not playing in '08, but if he gets himself straight (and Big Brother will be watching) he'll be considered in '09 (draft and immediately suspend). But he'd need to take responsibility for lessenging the risk involved in associating with Ben Cousins.

The Saints haven't got that list spot.

[Dis Believer]

would your sympathy extend to everyone addicted to drugs or just cousins because of his talent?

is it st kilda responsibility to turn around every troublemaker in the league?

or does the fact Cousins is or was a superb talent mean that he is immune to criticism?

we are SUPPOSED to be a professional football club aiming to win, not a rehab centre for gangsters and junkies.

Fact of Cousins superb talent means in the coldest sense he's an assett. Fact of Cousins addiction means he's a liability off the field. Aquiring Cousins (for anyone, not just us) is the epitome of taking the tiger by the tail. He could win you a premiership. He could also be a non contributor who has a negative impact on other players.

The football club, as you point out, is supposed to be aiming to win. It would be foolish and negligent for them therefore not to consider Cousins the talent. It would also be foolish and negligent for them not to assess as part of that consideration whether they could isolate the talent from the addict in need of rehabilitation, including internal and external resources.

I think the final consideration *against* taking Cousins is the impact on culture. As Stinger points out, his presence will have a negative impact on other recruiting unless you can continually demonstrate at least a lack of negative influence. A difficult thing to do under the best of circumstances, and if circumstances aren't the best, the increased scrutiny may not be helpful.

If one had a list spot to waste, then it might be worth taking him, telling him he's not playing in '08, but if he gets himself straight (and Big Brother will be watching) he'll be considered in '09 (draft and immediately suspend). But he'd need to take responsibility for lessenging the risk involved in associating with Ben Cousins.

The Saints haven't got that list spot.

Most intelligent and considered post in the whole thread!

[st_Trav_ofWA]

Wouldnt Cousins help a team win games for any team? Better football judges than you obviously are have taken such kids so yes.

would he though?

cool lets sack all our quality players and fill the list with junkies then.

Yes he would, dont you watch games? Theres a lot of players with far less ability than hes got doing similar things that clubs are aware of and there kept so why would you overlook him.

geez...what's the matter with you.....one of the reasons west coast pissed him off was because the parents of young kids in the draft have stated publicly that they don't want their kids mixing with cousins and his kind......but you want to bring him to st kilda.......without giving a flower for our kids...potential kids..their families....or i might add...our sponsers...get real......

Please Stinger all thats just lip service parents of most of these kids dont know what there up to. Go to any sports club and open your eyes and ears its everywhere its how you deal with it is the important thing.

i can tell you i know a lot of parents who wouldnt want their kids to hang around with benny boy and in a culture like a football team it is a huge issue

parents sending their boys to another state are sposed to trust that the club is going to look after their boys welfare when they blantantly show that winning is the overwhelming priority no matter the moral cost or the wellbeing of the players

[Richter]

I cant read anything by the AFLPA or Benny's lawyer without wanting to screamk

Ben Cousins..you need rehabilitaion from drug addiction. Youve proven that you have absolutely no self-control. You need to spend time in a facility, removed from all your dodgy friends, because when you are around them you cannot help yourself. Thats a fact.

The AFLPA and his lawyer are being heniously irresponsible urging him to play again in 2008 IMHIO . Just because policeman A signed a sheet of paper instead of policeman B doesnt suddenly absolve you of your misdoings. Its a paperwork stuffup, nothing more, nothing less. ANy talk of him playing AFL football again in the forseeable future (read: 2008 season) is laughable

Michael, no offence, but this is complete crap. There are a number of forms that rehab can take residential rehab is just one of them. From the little we can glean from the media about what Benny's problem is, the only real reason he would qualify for residential rehab is that he is a famous person. Otherwise community based rehab is the way to go. And that means attempting to continue working if at all possible.

Before we get more rubbish from Dan, yes I have worked in consultation, although not directly in the field, with both areas and it is perfectly clear from your and Dan's posts that you have not.

[stinger]

[
Please Stinger all thats just lip service parents of most of these kids dont know what there up to. Go to any sports club and open your eyes and ears its everywhere its how you deal with it is the important thing.

my eyes are open....so.i will stick with what i say.......grandma's sayings have withstood the test of time because they are 100% correct.......the one that fits here is

"only takes one rotten apple to spoil the whole barrel."


..........i know enough about drugs and the drugs culture to last me several lifetimes thanks.....don't lecture to people you know nothing about.....

[Oh When the Saints]

The most important thing is that Ben Cousins recovers his health as an individual.

Addiction is a difficult thing to deal with, and putting him in the environment which has allowed the addiction to flourish (i.e. football) would be a mistake IMO. I realise that maintaining some connection to that environment is important in the rehabilitation process, but Ben works in a unique setting.

He needs to get well, and that will be tough.

If he were to be available in the PSD, then the St Kilda Football Club need to protect their own interests, and Ben needs to protect his.

Ben's interest is getting well.
St Kilda's interest is winning a premiership and retaining sponsorship dollars.

Are the two compatible? I don't know.

But just as we are not a support network for recovering drug addicts, equally we should not be stupid enough to knock back a bloke who might turn himself around and help us win a premiership.

It's a very tough decision.

[CURLY]

[
Please Stinger all thats just lip service parents of most of these kids dont know what there up to. Go to any sports club and open your eyes and ears its everywhere its how you deal with it is the important thing.

my eyes are open....so.i will stick with what i say.......grandma's sayings have withstood the test of time because they are 100% correct.......the one that fits here is

"only takes one rotten apple to spoil the whole barrel."


..........i know enough about drugs and the drugs culture to last me several lifetimes thanks.....don't lecture to people you know nothing about.....

Were did I lecture all I said to was that its everywhere and it is.

[stinger]

Were did I lecture all I said to was that its everywhere and it is.

i don't need to be told to open my eyes and ears.....

[Saint Mik]

Yes stinger and it only takes one helping hand to turn a life around also

Ever heard the story of a bloke who was picked on at school and had his books knocked out of his arms on the way home one day, a bloke stopped and helped him pick up the books and told him not to worry about what others thought of him, they ended up mates for life, to cut a long story short he had emptied his locker out that day at school because he was going to do himself over and didnt want his mother to have to go to his school and empty his locker and now owes his life to his best freind, his freind never knew about it until he mentioned this in a speech at his wedding or something like that, so dont ever underestimate what can be achieved with the spirit of helping others.

There is some good that could come out of Bens position but it never will if someone doesn't give him the chance and the right support.

[CURLY]

just an expression to say its all around

[st_Trav_ofWA]

The most important thing is that Ben Cousins recovers his health as an individual.

Addiction is a difficult thing to deal with, and putting him in the environment which has allowed the addiction to flourish (i.e. football) would be a mistake IMO. I realise that maintaining some connection to that environment is important in the rehabilitation process, but Ben works in a unique setting.

He needs to get well, and that will be tough.

If he were to be available in the PSD, then the St Kilda Football Club need to protect their own interests, and Ben needs to protect his.

Ben's interest is getting well.
St Kilda's interest is winning a premiership and retaining sponsorship dollars.

Are the two compatible? I don't know.

But just as we are not a support network for recovering drug addicts, equally we should not be stupid enough to knock back a bloke who might turn himself around and help us win a premiership.

It's a very tough decision.

the problem i have is with ben the root of all the problems is the feelings of grandure he got from being the darling of WA that made him think he was bigger then the laws and he belived he wasable to cope with everything turning to poo cause he would bounce back as he did when he made his come back he was held as a hero his popularity was still intact his football abillity was still great and he had lost nothing so imo he would look at it like " im ben cousins im indestructable i shame my club my family and i get a heros welcomei can control drugs damn it im ben cousins !" hence the relaps. a person i know who was an ex heroin addict once told me about the ka-ching moment , its the moment when you are at your lowest and all of a sudden ka-ching it makes scence in your mind that you have no control and you have lost everything , thats when people choose to get better , this person i know went into rehab 3 times but only the last time after they had the Ka-ching moment did it work cause they chose to get better . i dont see benny choosing anything as yet ... for that point alone i think ben should just move on from football find somthing new for his next phase of his life .

[Richter]

Addiction is a difficult thing to deal with, and putting him in the environment which has allowed the addiction to flourish (i.e. football) would be a mistake IMO. I realise that maintaining some connection to that environment is important in the rehabilitation process, but Ben works in a unique setting.

Not sure that it is the "football" environment per se that allowed his problems to flourish. More likely the sandgropers and the club. Perhaps it would be easier for him to manage in a different city, different club. He would hardly be the first to have a new start elsewhere.

Agree with the rest of your post btw and you make some good points.

[Richter]

http://www.realfooty.com.au/news/news/k ... 75879.html

............if a recovering drug addict's recovery is always a tenuous proposition how much more difficult is it — and how more likely a relapse — when they've been put through another round of public humiliation? Humiliation that has now been proven to have been based on legally spurious grounds.

Of course that's the humane, touchy-feely view. Unfashionable about a man who has become a public pariah. Not nearly as satisfying as getting the boots into a now- soft target. It is also easier to do when you're not only kicking a tall poppy, but somebody else's son, brother or friend.

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Good on you Rohan Connolly.