Watts

[Oh When the Saints]

West Coast proved that 1 good KPP can win you a flag (Glass).

Midfielders and running players.



The game has changed markedly, and within 20 years, I believe all footballers will be between 190 and 200cm tall, and all athletes who run all day.

Unfortunately that is the way it is.

[evertonfc]

West Coast proved that 1 good KPP can win you a flag (Glass).

An unbelievable running brigade they had - with strength unlikely to be match for decades.

Yet even then, they still needed Glass in defence, and Lynch - who, let's not forget had an enourmous impact in 2006 - up forward.

Added to the likes of Hansen (a huge physical presence) and Hunter, well...

[RBnW]

I am not at all happy with the list changes we're made. We are short on true KPPs now, but we do have a few options. I wouldn't be surprised at all to see Gilbert or play a few games as our full forward.

The chances of Kosi lasting an entire season without injury, suspension or being desperately needed somehwre else are very slim.

I also wouldn't be surprised to see Whitnall play a few games as our full forward.

There's 42 spots on our list; with Gehrig going, surely that bit of insurance for Kosi is needed.

I'm struggling to comprehend this decision. I'm not convinved it was in the best interests of the football club.

He's only just turned 22. Just turned 22. When you've got the talent he supposedly has, you don't turn your back on it.

He's a 95% chance to be drafted or rookied by another club. I'm gutted we've decided not to continue with his development. He went to hell and back to get his leg right, and when he did, he played some really top-notch VFL football.

We recruited him as a long-term replacement for Fraser Gehrig - not to be chopped in the same season.

With even Brooks talked about as a potential forward option, we've lost KPP forwards, and are now relying on a player - marvellously talented as he is - who has consistently failed to get his body right over several years. Last year was his first full season for some time.

I accept Brooks has had his chance, and it was perhaps his time to go. I do not accept, however, that it was time to cut Watts.

With a bit of faith in the kid - we had him barely two years - he might have gone on to be something quite impressive.

I am holding out hope we re-draft him either in the national draft, or as a rookie.

your are kidding yourself I watched Watts at Casey all year, at AFL level they would run off him, if they can run off Vossie, they would run off him, they even run off Kosi, Watts is a great kid and I hope he gets picked up, but he's not a KPP in an AFL premiership contender, might get a game at the Kangaroos, but not with us...not quick enough

[saintsRrising]

Every time we delete duds........people want them re-instated.

Watts is not good enough. Yes he may have rattled the Blues backline...but Glass or Scarlett would have slaughtered him.

Schwarze was not good enough...yet some still want him back


If Kosi goes down......Gilbert, Allen or BJ would all be better options than Watts. Or rest King or M Gardiner down at FF and play an extra mid.

Even C Gardiner is a better option that Watts.

[saintsrule]

There's 42 spots on our list; with Gehrig going, surely that bit of insurance for Kosi is needed.

Nope. Key forwards aren't where the game's going. Maybe we'll only play Riewoldt tall forward this year and have him surrounded by more mobile forwards?

He's a 95% chance to be drafted or rookied by another club. I'm gutted we've decided not to continue with his development. He went to hell and back to get his leg right, and when he did, he played some really top-notch VFL football.

"top-notch"? He kicked 31 in 14 games - 2.2 goals per game in a level far below AFL. For comparison:

Nick Sautner: 69 goals, 19 games = 3.6 goals/game
James Podsiadly: 46 goals, 13 games = 3.54 goals/game
Andrew Williams: 53 goals, 20 games = 2.7 goals/game
Todd Grima: 51 goals, 19 games = 2.7 goals/game

These players - except Grima, I guess - are failed or finished at AFL level. We'll see if he is picked up by another AFL side but don't be surprised if he's full forward for Bendigo next year.

(And let's not read too much into Broad's articles for saints.com.au - they're pretty partisan.)

Recovering from a broken leg

[woooosaints]

do players get paid for playing in the VFL?

[evertonfc]

Every time we delete duds........people want them re-instead.

Poor argument - I'd have happily delisted the existing lot plus Ferguson and Jones, too.

Watts probably wasn't going to be a star, but should have been kept for insurance, a bit like Rix has been.

Heaven help us if we lose Kosi or Riewoldt at any point during the season...even to lump Watts in the square, with his massive physical frame, would have created contest after contest, and probably booted a few as well.

Would have made for excellent insurance. Allen must be rated very highly by Ross, or he must fancy Sam Fisher being able to play up forward once again. And C Gardiner isn't a full forward.

[True Blue Sainter]

I am not at all happy with the list changes we're made. We are short on true KPPs now, but we do have a few options. I wouldn't be surprised at all to see Gilbert or play a few games as our full forward.

The chances of Kosi lasting an entire season without injury, suspension or being desperately needed somehwre else are very slim.

I also wouldn't be surprised to see Whitnall play a few games as our full forward.

There's 42 spots on our list; with Gehrig going, surely that bit of insurance for Kosi is needed.

I'm struggling to comprehend this decision. I'm not convinved it was in the best interests of the football club.

He's only just turned 22. Just turned 22. When you've got the talent he supposedly has, you don't turn your back on it.

He's a 95% chance to be drafted or rookied by another club. I'm gutted we've decided not to continue with his development. He went to hell and back to get his leg right, and when he did, he played some really top-notch VFL football.

We recruited him as a long-term replacement for Fraser Gehrig - not to be chopped in the same season.

With even Brooks talked about as a potential forward option, we've lost KPP forwards, and are now relying on a player - marvellously talented as he is - who has consistently failed to get his body right over several years. Last year was his first full season for some time.

I accept Brooks has had his chance, and it was perhaps his time to go. I do not accept, however, that it was time to cut Watts.

With a bit of faith in the kid - we had him barely two years - he might have gone on to be something quite impressive.

I am holding out hope we re-draft him either in the national draft, or as a rookie.

your are kidding yourself I watched Watts at Casey all year, at AFL level they would run off him, if they can run off Vossie, they would run off him, they even run off Kosi, Watts is a great kid and I hope he gets picked up, but he's not a KPP in an AFL premiership contender, might get a game at the Kangaroos, but not with us...not quick enough

Terrific post everton! (not so terrific football team though )

Agree with you that there was no point de-listing Watts in the SAME season that Gehrig retired - wasn't that the whole purpose why we used a first round draft pick to get him here from Adelaide? To replace Fraser? Well, now with Fraser, Watts (& also Brooks gone) - what are we left with for FF?

1 - Koschitzke (can't be trusted to get his body right, even after this season)... obviously we all know his talent and ability and if he plays 22 games and kicks 65 goals, he's done his job

2 - Riewoldt...well, clearly he's best left as a roaming CHF

Really, after those 2, we aren't left with many FF options

Potentially one of the Gardiners could pinch-hit, especially Michael - the rest would have to be not true KPP's - i.e. Ferg, Gwilt, Goddard, Gilbo....

Perhaps Peake is looking at bringing McEvoy over as a long-term FF prospect? (which I hope he isn't btw, we need a quick and skilful midfielder at pick 9)

[mad saint guy]

Nope. Key forwards aren't where the game's going. Maybe we'll only play Riewoldt tall forward this year and have him surrounded by more mobile forwards?

Key forwards will always be a part of the game. Do you think Geelong would have won the flag without Mooney, Ablett and Ottens taking marks up forward? If key forwards are going out of fashion then key defenders must be useless as well...so why were 5 of the top 10 draft selections in the "super draft" used on key position players? Do they all have no future?

Every decent team will still have 2 strong marking forwards in their team at any time. West Coast are much better when they have Hansen as well as Lynch. Brisbane would be a wooden-spoon side without Brown. Collingwood have become a top 6 team because of Travis Cloke's rapid improvement.

Riewoldt and Kosi will be permanent forwards next year. Goddard, Gilbert and Allen will also probably spend a bit of time as a marking target, while we will probably recruit another tall forward in a draft this year.

Certainly the days of having 2 big, slow forwards and a resting ruckman inside 50 are over, but having multiple marking options in the forward line is still essential for any side.

[saintly]

I am not at all happy with the list changes we're made. We are short on true KPPs now, but we do have a few options. I wouldn't be surprised at all to see Gilbert or play a few games as our full forward.

The chances of Kosi lasting an entire season without injury, suspension or being desperately needed somehwre else are very slim.

I also wouldn't be surprised to see Whitnall play a few games as our full forward.

we might be short of KPP, but last year and the year before we rarely used wattts or brooks. what does that say about them?

not good enough. so if they wen't good enough then, why would the saints keep them on for another year? just becuase they are tall? they were not getting a gaem. there must be reasons why they were not getting a game.

another thing, if not them to delist, who would we delist?

[Dan Warna]

well lets hope that CJ can improve past his 50% effective disposal rate.

[elvis lives]

Last year we had Kossie, Reiwoldt, and Gherig play just about every game, along with Sam Fisher. We lost Maguire and Max for most of the season and that really cost us.

The suggestion that Allen, who is yet to play an AFL game and has done nothing in his first year to suggest he could play key forward, is a better option than Watts who kicked mutliple goals in the VFL on numerous occasions in his first season coming back from serious injury, is pretty optimistic. Not to say Allen wont be a gun, he may well be, but I know who I would rather have at FFWD in round 1 2008 should kosi not be available.

As for BJ and Gilbert, these guys are two of our best runners off the backline, with BJ being the best user of the ball in the team. Putting either of them at FFWd would rob the team of much needed run and carry and in BJ's case - exceptional delivery. Give me watts at FFWD anyday if it means i can play BJ as a ruckrover and Gilbert off halfback or wing.

our lack of KPP depth is glaring and anything I have seen on this post only reinforces this. Max, Maguire and Fish all start on the field so no point mentioning them when talking about delth. Who is there as back-up?

Gwilt - seems like our best option, don't mind him to be honest, but sorry if I'm not confident he will be a feaesible option for Lynch, Lucas, Lloyd, Brown, Mooney etc etc.

Ferguson - well I have long been wondering why he hasn't been given a decent crack but he is hardly as KPP optoin. 3rd tall defender at best.

Raph - yet to live up to anywhere near his potential but even if he does you would think it is as a running half back flanker. Neither the body strength or mental appplication for key back

Gram?? see comments on BJ/Gilbert

clearly if absolutely neccessary any of these guys could play as a key back, or BJ or Gibert or Allen at FFWD, but I would contend that playing Watts, slow as he is, one out in the goal square is a better option if kosi is out or required in the backline, that most of these or at least better if it means we can keep our basic structure - using guys like BJ to best effect.

[fonz_#15]

do players get paid for playing in the VFL?

yes

[mad saint guy]

we might be short of KPP, but last year and the year before we rarely used wattts or brooks. what does that say about them?

another thing, if not them to delist, who would we delist?

It says that a couple of young tall forwards couldn't get a game ahead of a dual coleman medallist. Hardly reason for delisting.

I would much rather have Brooks, Watts and Sweeney on the list ahead of Jones, C.Gardiner and Ferguson.

[saintly]

we might be short of KPP, but last year and the year before we rarely used wattts or brooks. what does that say about them?

another thing, if not them to delist, who would we delist?

It says that a couple of young tall forwards couldn't get a game ahead of a dual coleman medallist. Hardly reason for delisting.

I would much rather have Brooks, Watts and Sweeney on the list ahead of Jones, C.Gardiner and Ferguson.

yet when he was injured a couple of times over the last 3 years, we used makeshift fowards

[TimeToShineFellas]

I would much rather have Brooks, Watts and Sweeney on the list ahead of Jones, C.Gardiner and Ferguson.

No surprise there ................. !

[mad saint guy]

yet when he was injured a couple of times over the last 3 years, we used makeshift fowards

Like Kosi?

No young key forward in the competition would have gotten a regular game with Riewoldt, Gehrig and Koschitzke on the same list. If we drafted Westhoff last year he would have been lucky to play 8 games.

[sunsaint]

Yeah I think the decision on Watts is harsh and yes I would like to see him picked up again in the upcoming drafts and he may well be...but
in his own words he says he carries chronic OP, and his ankles are obviously not coping with his 198cm, 100kg frame. Maybe the medical staff had just as much say about this decision as the coach did.

[saintly]

Yeah I think the decision on Watts is harsh and yes I would like to see him picked up again in the upcoming drafts and he may well be...but
in his own words he says he carries chronic OP, and his ankles are obviously not coping with his 198cm, 100kg frame. Maybe the medical staff had just as much say about this decision as the coach did.

wheres that info from?

[stinger]

from today's age....guess that makes it kinda final......


■St Kilda yesterday announced the delistment of Barry Brooks, Phil Raymond, Justin Sweeney and Fergus Watts, with rookie James Wall also making an exit from Moorabbin. Jarryn Geary and Clinton Jones have been elevated to the senior list while Jayden Attard, Robert Eddy and ruckman Luke van Rheenen have been retained on the rookie list for 2008.

[sunsaint]

Yeah I think the decision on Watts is harsh and yes I would like to see him picked up again in the upcoming drafts and he may well be...but
in his own words he says he carries chronic OP, and his ankles are obviously not coping with his 198cm, 100kg frame. Maybe the medical staff had just as much say about this decision as the coach did.

wheres that info from?

GO back a page EvertonFC's post that links to http://www.saints.com.au/tabId/5315/def ... wsId=49608
Interview with Watts himself.

[plugger66]

do players get paid for playing in the VFL?

yes

Not AFL players only VFL players.

[woooosaints]

do players get paid for playing in the VFL?

yes

Not AFL players only VFL players.

alot or not much?

[plugger66]

do players get paid for playing in the VFL?

yes

Not AFL players only VFL players.

alot or not much?

Good players would probably get 15-20000 a year and a job.

[woooosaints]

how can the VFL afford that