Cats 2007.. Saints 2008?

[Animal Enclosure]

A lot has been written about Geelong's season of excellence and how they seem to have left St.Kilda in their wake. What Geelong's season has done is give teams such as St.Kilda a clear model showing how a team can struggle and underachieve one year & reach the holy grail the next.

We've heard how Geelong players challenged Gary Ablett to work his butt off & 'be the next Chris Judd'. We saw Ottens go from being a soft underachiever to be a big, physical ruckman/ forward who shone when it mattered most. You could go through just about every member of Geelong's premiership side & find blokes who have turned their careers around through hard work, self belief, team work &, of course, getting and staying fit.

Putting any trades that may land a ruckman, etc aside, our improvement must come from with... IMO the keys are

*Dal Santo having an 'Ablett like' break through season. We know that Dal is a super player but can he challenge himself to reach the highest of heights?

*Gram realising how good he can be & becoming our jet in the midfield. He has it all but I reckon he's either lacking the confidence to do it week in week out or is happy just being a flashy half back flanker. Gram could be in the top 5 of the 2001 draft when his career is over... could being the operative word.

*Kosi building on his solid 2007 & being the absolute superstar that he showed over that stretch of 5 games in 2005. With Fraser gone, Kosi will hoepfully be able to spend long periods at full forward and kick big bags.

*The development of Brooks. The biggest question mark. Written off by the majority, with good reason too. We've said it every post/pre season since he was acquired but Barry could be a massive piece of the puzzle. Can he finally gain a position? Can he share the ruck with Gardiner? Can he be the very good player that some believe that he can be?

*The fitness of #1-Gardiner, #2-Ball, #3- Hudgton #4- X.Clarke.
At full fitness these 4 will automatically improve our team by 20%. Gardiner is crucial (hopefully the reports of retirement are website BS), Bally getting his 2005 body and form back immediately gives our midfield a huge boost. Max is the backline's gel and X could still be anything.

*The coach. Can Ross mould the game plan into an accountable but highly attacking model? Neil Balme described the Cats' plan as a defensive, accountable model that looks quick due to quick ball movement, running to support each other and playing on at all opportunities. Can St.Kilda's 2007 plan evolve into this tough and exciting standard?

Personally, I think we have a hugely exciting few years ahead, especially now that the board challenge is over. Our 2004-2006 window may have shut with the retirements of Gehrig, Hamill, Thompson, Voss, etc. 2008 may see Ross & the boys decide to try the laundry window instead & make a few people eat their words.

Geelong were in a worse position to us last year ladder wise. They got their act together & have now achieved what we all want. I hope that Ross can get the support that he needs to get our boys hungry and believing that they can do this. The recruitment of Dave Misson is a huge coup. Combine this with added $$$ to injury prevention and rehabilitation and fingers crossed that the injury run can be minimised. Trade minimally, draft intelligently, get Armitage and Allen into the side & away we go.

We all saw the absolute joy that Geelong supporters are experiencing...we can only hope that our players have the same intestinal fortitude and commitment that Tom Harley's boys displayed over the past 12 months. Go Saints!

[GrumpyOne]

At this moment in time, there is no reason why 2008 can't be our year.

Get on board, it'll be a fun ride right to the top.

GO YOU MIGHTY SAINTS!

[Saints Premiers 2008]

it can be done...

we have the talent...

there is no use for comparisons to certain teams however this has happened before...

my expectations are at least one win in september...nothing more nothing less...

i guess time will tell

[Oh When the Saints]

Great post ... really well articulated.


Our list next year will be a lot younger and less experienced than Geelong's, so not only do our chances look good for 2008, but probably even better in 2009 and 2010.

[saintspremiers]

Brooks is a first rate hack and I really hope he is delisted firstly.

Sure, we should be able to go better in 08 than 07, but how much further will some of the other clubs improve also?

The big plays for the off season are pre-season fitness management and recruiting......the HUGE question is how much change/impact can be made through increased spending this season, or will there be a time lag effect?

Realistically, will new equipment be all in place in a month for the beginning of pre-season?

Will there be a soft refirb (ie. not massively expensive - given we are not yet committed to Moorabbin) of the training rooms/player facilities ASAP that could make a difference for THIS pre-season??

Re recruiting - this is ongoing and if we start to spend more ASAP on player scouting interstate/intrastate etc, are we likely to see any impact for this year's National Draft this year?

[Dal_Santos_Gal]

I honestly believe it could be OUR year if we can keep our injury list down.
Proven fact if you can keep your injury list down you are more than a good chance of winning the flag. IE: Geelong IE: Sydney.

I know injuries are not meant to be an excuse, but even when West Coast got a bucket load of injuries this season even they fell to bits.

Surely its our turn to have some luck and no matter how good the team is you always need a little bit of luck to win the flag IMO.

[plugger66]

I honestly believe it could be OUR year if we can keep our injury list down.
Proven fact if you can keep your injury list down you are more than a good chance of winning the flag. IE: Geelong IE: Sydney.

I know injuries are not meant to be an excuse, but even when West Coast got a bucket load of injuries this season even they fell to bits.

Surely its our turn to have some luck and no matter how good the team is you always need a little bit of luck to win the flag IMO.

Agree WCE fell to bits with their injuries and finished 3rd. We finished 9th.

[Dal_Santos_Gal]

I honestly believe it could be OUR year if we can keep our injury list down.
Proven fact if you can keep your injury list down you are more than a good chance of winning the flag. IE: Geelong IE: Sydney.

I know injuries are not meant to be an excuse, but even when West Coast got a bucket load of injuries this season even they fell to bits.

Surely its our turn to have some luck and no matter how good the team is you always need a little bit of luck to win the flag IMO.

Agree WCE fell to bits with their injuries and finished 3rd. We finished 9th.

They got their injuries later in the season, what happened in the finals is more to the point, out in straight sets.

[Saints Premiers 2008]

I honestly believe it could be OUR year if we can keep our injury list down.
Proven fact if you can keep your injury list down you are more than a good chance of winning the flag. IE: Geelong IE: Sydney.

I know injuries are not meant to be an excuse, but even when West Coast got a bucket load of injuries this season even they fell to bits.

Surely its our turn to have some luck and no matter how good the team is you always need a little bit of luck to win the flag IMO.

Agree WCE fell to bits with their injuries and finished 3rd. We finished 9th.

They got their injuries later in the season, what happened in the finals is more to the point, out in straight sets.

their second tier players are much more adapt at fitting straight in and doing a job

for instance jamie grayham would get a gig in most other clubs

[OneEyedSainter77]

I said this in a post ages ago but our problem isn't injuries, its depth. Our depth is deplorable. Of our best 22, you could just about guarantee that the bottom 6 of that 22 are no better than the next six players who have missed it. I'd even go as far to say bottom ten. For years, this has been a crucial issue.

We need to really address this problem if we want to remain - sorry - become a threat again. An example I give is trading. How many useless trades have we been part of the last few years - Ackland, Clarke, gardiner, birss (although he is improving and may be worth trying out)

The main problem is not just that we feel inclined to trade our way to success (and when has that ever worked for anyone, really?) but that we don't take any chances with the new blood we've got from the draft. I'm not talking (for instance) about playing James Gwilt at fullback for four weeks because of injuries and whatnot - I'm talking about actually giving our younger and less experienced players more time on the park - let them find their feet. Even for an entire season, just field a team of mainly rookies. (with all the recent retirements, we've got no choice now)

If we have to go through the horrors of 2001-02 again just to give them all some game time, so be it. That means by about 2011 the window is wide open again and we'll be ready to make a full assault on the flag.

There are plenty more problems that need to be addressed, namely fitness and accuracy (especially kicking for goal) but reality to me says that next year to even think about having a chance at the flag, we will need a vast improvement on this year.

We need to work harder and I can't see it happening in one year. (I know, the second most positive poster on saintsational doesn't think we can win the premiership next year ) I will happily admit I was wrong if we do win but there is simply too much work to do on the field next year to even really consider playing in a premiership.

I realise my argument may come crashing aorund my head as a healthy dose of luck will give us a chance. However, all St.Kilda supporters should know it does no good to dwell on luck.

[bigcarl]

i think we can win it in 2008 with some luck, but it will have to come from within the playing group.

the core of that group - riewoldt, kosi, ball, dal, bj, goose, the clarkes, montagna, gram, both fishers and others - need to commit now to the idea that they can win it.

these guys were boys in 2004-2005 and imo too much was expected of them in those years in terms of bringing home a premiership.

now they are men and it is time for them to show some of the leadership qualities and character drummed into them during the gt years.

if they are as good as i'd like to think then watching geelong lift the cup this year will have hurt them big time. we had the cats' measure until recently and I'd expect that seeing our young rivals taste ultimate success will be burning at them.

gt's axeing deprived them of a mentor and split the club. with rb now gone i believe we can march into 2008 with confidence and unity.

we need to hit the ground running and establish ourselves as premiership contenders from the very outset. but it has to come from the playing group ... right from its guts

[carn_sainter]

we need to hit the ground running and establish ourselves as premiership contenders from the very outset.

absolutely right

sick of 'pacing' ourselves or trying to get it right at the business end of the year...sick of coasting up until the mid-season break

sick of having no runs on the board for when we have a quarter like quarter 4 v collingwood

sick and tired of it

we need to go 100% from the start

take no game for easy and win em all

the idea of pacing yourself is stupid

treat every game like rd 22 and a spot in the 8 is on the line

be super fit and brutal throughout the entire season...coast for half the season you deserve to be about half way up the ladder...

and i'm sick of that too

[Oh When the Saints]

if they are as good as i'd like to think then watching geelong lift the cup this year will have hurt them big time. we had the cats' measure until recently and I'd expect that seeing our young rivals taste ultimate success will be burning at them.

I would hope it is burning in them.

However, we had Geelong's measure with 8 players who have now retired. Not sure (unless their replacements are just as good) how we are still supposed to have their measure.

We have a younger list than Geelong by about 2 years, and average about 20 less games per player.

[bigcarl]

if they are as good as i'd like to think then watching geelong lift the cup this year will have hurt them big time. we had the cats' measure until recently and I'd expect that seeing our young rivals taste ultimate success will be burning at them.

I would hope it is burning in them.

However, we had Geelong's measure with 8 players who have now retired. Not sure (unless their replacements are just as good) how we are still supposed to have their measure.

We have a younger list than Geelong by about 2 years, and average about 20 less games per player.

true, but you have to think positive. imo our core players are as talented as geelong's and the guys i mentioned - roo, kosi, dal, etc - are just about to enter their prime as footballers.

we showed in the second half of last season that we can pretty much match it with anyone and were seldomn beaten on talent alone.

fraser leaves a hole at ff but imo kosi will make a more than capable replacement. if only we could find a ruckman and another quick midfielder

[Oh When the Saints]

Oh I agree - I was being positive ... our list is a lot younger than Geelong's, so we have more room for improvement.

If the coaching staff can continue to develop the "bottom 6" and develop a few of the youngsters coming through then we will be in a great position to challenge for a flag in the next 2-3 years.