breen backs butterss board

[Oh When the Saints]

And To the Top, following your Norwood example.

Would it not be better, if the board are going to sack the club's second most successful coach, to clearly explain their reasons?

Instead of the President appearing on TV, spouting some crap about generation Y and making the whole football world laugh at St Kilda?


Fair enough to sack the coach, especially if it is in the best interests of the club.

BUT

1. To do so without making it clear WHY ... i.e. to carry on and hide behind a smokescreen ... is ridiculous and a recipie for instability and disaster.

2. To do so for what in hindsight were blatantly personal reasons reeks even more of instability and corruption at the top.

[kaos theory]

I responded to your post in the hope that I'd get a view as to why it's so "obvious" that GWs candidates would make such great AFL club board members - I even gave you my views on them. If I've offended you by not being impressed by GW and co. at this stage, either deal with it, or give me something to debate. The only reason I've fallen into the Butterss crew at this point is because the pro GW arguments are as poor as the above.

Why would I personnally care what you think of GW? Your comment about trouble making was stupid - that all I'm saying...Yet you claim arguements about SFF are poor....can't say I've read anything that gives me confidence from you, others or RB that want's me to stay with the incumbent.

- Comparisions about skills to buld & run organizations:
I've work a fair bit with tech industry guys & services guys during the dot com days. I know a few that have made it big (e.g $10m to $25m). Most I wouldn't trust to organize a you know what in a you know where... Yes there are some quality guys here, and some know how to sniff out deals, driven & hard workers, but not guys that could nuture & build a complex org with a diverse range of people. And you cannot ignore being in the right place at the right time...there was a lot of money being thrown around back then, and a lot of it was done so stupidly...

Know a couple of guys that ran head hunting frims.....hmmmm very capable guys, but they are handling a bunch of one-dimensional type of sale staff.

Also know a guy that built & runs a $100m manufacturing company...that's real talent. Why? because of the diverse types of people & processes you have to deal with and you have to get everyone working for you.

So you know what I think of a RB style guy vs. a GW style of guy.

Also, I have heard RB speak a lot during his time....And I have not been overly impressed. Look at the GT sacking. He was pathetic during his 'on the coach' performance. Also his style of business, e.g. sloppy proceses, such as signing up friends on big contracts (GT), and facing the consequences afterwards....(as we are now).... Are senoir busines people, admin people & footballers going to be inspired by him...? Becuase I'm a saints suppoter, I gave him my support & lot of latitude...but that has run out...

[To the top]

I recall that St Kilda wanted to deploy their newly generated profit to the formation of a Football Department so that the coach could coach, and not also attend player contract negotiations and the raft of other activities Thomas undertook.

He was advised of this change of direction, which replicated how other clubs went about their business.

He did not accept this and wanted to continue as a one man band, controlling the footy club - and distant from the Board because of the impasse.

I remember similarities to an EPL Manager were mentioned, and that this was Thomas's style.

If I can remember these as the reasons publicly given, where is this latest limp line coming from?

And in regards the SANFL, which remains the second strongest in Australia, it has changed significantly since the introduction of the AFL.

No longer do VFL teams try to pinch the Bradleys, the Kernahans, the Plattens etc.etc. and try to pinch the McIntosh's and the Robrans - they now take the Under 19 junior talent from SANFL clubs, kids who have not even played league footy in SA but find themselves in the AFL the next season- as great white hopes to bring a premiership to an AFL club.

There are over 20 players from Norwood's junior teams currently on AFL lists, including the captain of Geelong who played a couple of seconds games (from Under 19's) before being drafted, originally by Port Adelaide on their Rookie List.

So how strong is the AFL competition when a kid who can not even get a league guernsey in the SANFL, therefore plays at under age levels, plays AFL footy the very next season - as a great white hope?

There are exceptions, like Gibbs and Cooney who played League footy before being drafted, but they are few and far between.

The bulk come from the under age competition, and when you are losing your best juniors before they even appear at league level, well, it impacts on clubs and it impacts on the competition.

I note that someone was asking why St Kilda could not recruit a Westhoff.

Because last year he was playing for Central Districts Under 19's.

And this year he is a prime player in a Grand Final team

[bungiton]

one time at band camp......

[Teflon]

It's simply a case of a regime throwing $$$ around left, right and centre to try to survive. We see it in politics all the time. I just hope that the current Board hasn't given away the crown jewels (eg, in trade week) before the new mob take over.

That is just emotive bias rubbish mb .

Joffa thats all you get from Babble...emotional dribble peddled as "face facts" - where are YOUR facts oh great spiritual one?

Do enlighten us all? (i'll pop the kettle on...could be a while...)

[stinger]

I would suggest that you people read what Breen says, because I can assure you that, at this moment, St Kilda FC are being spoken of as a joke among the wider footballing community - and that any progress they have made over the past couple of years has been wiped clean - "typical St Kilda, what a rabble".

It is embarrassing to have to defend the club - and that is to power brokers at other clubs who are ringing and querying "What the hell is going on down there?".

My response is that, like everyone else, I am watching - in disbelief.

why would you be put in the position of having to defend the st kilda football club to....as you put it....


" power brokers at other clubs who are ringing and querying "What the hell is going on down there?".


...and just why would they be ringing you....ffs......




....care to give a truthful answer to that little question......

[Teflon]

i don't discount what butterss and his board have done for the club financially and certainly never want us to go into receivership again

Yes you do....thats just your disclaimer talking....

this board's one big mistake was meddling with a successful (by st kilda standards) onfield operation capably managed by GT

You have zero credibility with a weird view that somehow grant was still taking us into the "promise" land...FFS..WAKE UP.

sacking only the second coach (after jeans) to have us into the finals three years running for reasons other than football brings a hollow ring to the current board's protestations about stability.

Decision was ALL football - it was about changing the football model we operated with under Stalin Thomas.....but feel free to cast rumour/innuendo about the "real" reasons that you somehow have inside knowledge of....

so it should be judged on its good record? why wasn't GT?

GT had 5 years. Had NOT fixed our injury situation AND IS STILL TODAY being judged on his DEVELOPMENT and later years recruitment performance while in charge....and he aint coming up trumps........

[Teflon]

On Breeny
Surely Rod is just playing 'copycat' to the SKFF ticket by running around at the last minute looking for a respected ex-player to support him and offering AT and NB a spot on his board. Why not 'introduce an inspiring initiative'?

Together with the sponsorship advertising; it may have some credence with people who haven't made up their mind on who they intend to vote for - but to me it just seems like outrageously bad politics, even if both the ads and the Breeny ideas have merit in normal circumstances. The whole article smells of RB’s desperation.

It's getting to the stage where I am starting to feel sorry for the incumbent board. I hope they move on before some of us forget all the good work they have done for the club in the past.

Geez...spot the member group leader whose had 1 meeting with nathan...and still has the stars in his eyes to prove it.....why not listen to ALL the debate OBJECTIVELY and take of your patch FFS.

[bungiton]

Lets face it, Allowing Thomas the autonomy to run the whole Football department as was his want, was a decision ratified by the board.

Now for all the hoobaloo regarding this aspect of events, I don't care one way or the other regarding the sacking of Thomas, if it was done as said at the time to move the club forward, I was all for it.

butterss sowed the seeds for his own demise at the same time, coming out and using Thomas' own saying " we don't accept mediocrity" was probably amusing to him at the time, but sadly it's now been wrapped in some Karma and Karming back to bite him on his ass.

Mediocre is probably too flatterting a word to describe, this year, his last as the president of St kilda

[Rooy_coin]

i agree with breeny

[stinger]

B

And to attack "Cowboy" Neale as being on the "gravy train"?

Tell him that to his face.

I repeat, with supporters such as this, what hope has St Kilda got to build the stable environment which is a pre-requisite to on-field success?

Br.

i would tell that to cowboy in a second...i know him very well...he doesn't frighten me........and i have listened to him bitch and moan about the club and it's various coaches for years.....a very angry and disenfranchised former player until recently...as i previously stated.....


...and how dare you make that last comment about me......just because i can't stomach the current board...all you have done is attack me.,..not very bright are you.....and everyone one here knows that...surprised you showed up again after you little embarrassing quip about me and another poster being the same person......


..

[Teflon]

Lets face it, Allowing Thomas the autonomy to run the whole Football department as was his want, was a decision ratified by the board.

Now for all the hoobaloo regarding this aspect of events, I don't care one way or the other regarding the sacking of Thomas, if it was done as said at the time to move the club forward, I was all for it.

butterss sowed the seeds for his own demise at the same time, coming out and using Thomas' own saying " we don't accept mediocrity" was probably amusing to him at the time, but sadly it's now been wrapped in some Karma and Karming back to bite him on his ass.

Mediocre is probably too flatterting a word to describe, this year, his last as the president of St kilda

who givesa toss?

The Board gave Thomas his HEAD as is their want. He got us to 2 prelims and did help galvanise the club AFTER Blight. We stopped. The Board decided a new football direction was required and approached Grant for his input - he flatly rejected it and wanted to remain in his own kingdom (unlike Bomber Thompson who accepted this similar scenario from Cook and Co. at Girlong...) The Board made a decision to remove Thomas - as is their want.

How does that translate to - Thomas goes....so to should the entire Board?

[Teflon]

I recall that St Kilda wanted to deploy their newly generated profit to the formation of a Football Department so that the coach could coach, and not also attend player contract negotiations and the raft of other activities Thomas undertook.

He was advised of this change of direction, which replicated how other clubs went about their business.

He did not accept this and wanted to continue as a one man band, controlling the footy club - and distant from the Board because of the impasse.

I remember similarities to an EPL Manager were mentioned, and that this was Thomas's style.

If I can remember these as the reasons publicly given, where is this latest limp line coming from?

And in regards the SANFL, which remains the second strongest in Australia, it has changed significantly since the introduction of the AFL.

No longer do VFL teams try to pinch the Bradleys, the Kernahans, the Plattens etc.etc. and try to pinch the McIntosh's and the Robrans - they now take the Under 19 junior talent from SANFL clubs, kids who have not even played league footy in SA but find themselves in the AFL the next season- as great white hopes to bring a premiership to an AFL club.

There are over 20 players from Norwood's junior teams currently on AFL lists, including the captain of Geelong who played a couple of seconds games (from Under 19's) before being drafted, originally by Port Adelaide on their Rookie List.

So how strong is the AFL competition when a kid who can not even get a league guernsey in the SANFL, therefore plays at under age levels, plays AFL footy the very next season - as a great white hope?

There are exceptions, like Gibbs and Cooney who played League footy before being drafted, but they are few and far between.

The bulk come from the under age competition, and when you are losing your best juniors before they even appear at league level, well, it impacts on clubs and it impacts on the competition.

I note that someone was asking why St Kilda could not recruit a Westhoff.

Because last year he was playing for Central Districts Under 19's.

And this year he is a prime player in a Grand Final team

TTP - just wanted to say keep up the good work. i enjoy your posts...even if they go over the head of some........

[stinger]

[

And if TTT is correct and somebody has vilified Cowboy Neale, it just proves my point that the mob will go to any lengths to vilify and insult and put down past champoions.

First Frawley
then Breen
now Neale.


Sick making

i presume you are referring once more to me joffaboy......if you think saying that cowboy neale is on the gravy train is villafying him.....so be it......

...i stated that i know breen...i went to school with him....and that he was good mates with the cowboy...hence i can see why he has come out to support butterss.....


...but i can also inform you that i know cowboy pretty well.......he was trying to undermine thomas behind the scenes......for a couple of years in fact....just as he has done to a couple of other coaches in the past......


vilify and put down past champions....give me a break........but i will call a spade a spade...and cowboy might be a saint...but he ain't no angel..ffs.....





no ..the only ones getting vilified and put down around here are the pro sff posters..........as much as you try and deny it jb..........

[joffaboy]

As I have told you i the past stinger, i dont think about you when I post.

All I know is I have seen three past champions slagged off by the pro Westaway mob on here.

Frawley was the first.

Then people had the audacity to ask what experience barry Breen had to comment on a football board (amongst other insults)

Lastly I read that someone had told us that Cowboy Neale is on the gravy train. If that is not a slur on Cowboys character (someone who I see at the footy on L2 nearly every week as he host a coitrie group, and sends down an ex Saints player we sit with a party pie)

Now if anyone had attempted to denigrate either Burke or Thompson there would be hell to pay.

I couldn't care less if it was you or not. I have read enough of the greasy disgraceful low and shitty tactics of the pro Westaway baying mob.

they will stoop to abuse even our past great because they dont tow the mobs line.

Some may think abusing and insulting past greats of our club is fine, but i find it sickening.

And i couldn't give a stuff if you like that or not.

ANYONE WHO DENIGRATES THE PAST GREATS OF OUR CLUB FOR POLITICAL PURPOSES IS BEYOND CONTEMPT

I dont care who it is.

[rodgerfox]

I recall that St Kilda wanted to deploy their newly generated profit to the formation of a Football Department so that the coach could coach, and not also attend player contract negotiations and the raft of other activities Thomas undertook.

He was advised of this change of direction, which replicated how other clubs went about their business.

He did not accept this and wanted to continue as a one man band, controlling the footy club - and distant from the Board because of the impasse.

I remember similarities to an EPL Manager were mentioned, and that this was Thomas's style.

Now if any of the above was true, why didn't Butterss simply say it?

The above was never publicly stated as the reason for his sacking.

[Teflon]

I recall that St Kilda wanted to deploy their newly generated profit to the formation of a Football Department so that the coach could coach, and not also attend player contract negotiations and the raft of other activities Thomas undertook.

He was advised of this change of direction, which replicated how other clubs went about their business.

He did not accept this and wanted to continue as a one man band, controlling the footy club - and distant from the Board because of the impasse.

I remember similarities to an EPL Manager were mentioned, and that this was Thomas's style.

Now if any of the above was true, why didn't Butterss simply say it?

The above was never publicly stated as the reason for his sacking.

It was stated and was one of the main reasons why I supported the removal of Thomas. But if some choose an agenda....and went blind years ago due to juvenile activities.....well that cant be helped.

[Mr Magic]

I recall that St Kilda wanted to deploy their newly generated profit to the formation of a Football Department so that the coach could coach, and not also attend player contract negotiations and the raft of other activities Thomas undertook.

He was advised of this change of direction, which replicated how other clubs went about their business.

He did not accept this and wanted to continue as a one man band, controlling the footy club - and distant from the Board because of the impasse.

I remember similarities to an EPL Manager were mentioned, and that this was Thomas's style.

The above was never publicly stated as the reason for his sacking.

Rodger, I wasn't a member of this Forum back then but I definitely recall seeing'hearing reports/talk that the Board approached Gt and told him they wanted him to relinquish some of his power/responsibility to a new Footabll Committee and he refused. He was subsequently sacked.

[Oh When the Saints]

Exactly rodgerfox.

Ask most St Kilda members why Thomas was sacked and hardly any would give you that response - certainly none I've spoken to (outside SS).

The public explanations that were mooted were that we needed someone for us to take the next step and communicate with Generation Y.


If the board had stated only what To the Top wrote above that would have been fine, and more supporters would have accepted the decision IMO.


But they didn't, and to this day it remains a point of resentment with the supporter base.

[Teflon]

Exactly rodgerfox.

Ask most St Kilda members why Thomas was sacked and hardly any would give you that response - certainly none I've spoken to (outside SS).

The public explanations that were mooted were that we needed someone for us to take the next step and communicate with Generation Y.


If the board had stated only what To the Top wrote above that would have been fine, and more supporters would have accepted the decision IMO.


But they didn't, and to this day it remains a point of resentment with the supporter base.

Thats avsolute nonsens. I am yet to hear 1 person say Thomas was sacked cause of gen Y dribble. Nearly EVERYONE I speak to knows meglomaniac was sacked for just that.

I had already read numerous time the Board APPROACHED Thomas with a different model - a modelthey wanted his involvement with. He refused. He had to go. That was common knowledge and I acnt believe posters on this thing have been walking round in a bubble for a year now...

[barks4eva]

Would it not be better, if the board are going to sack the club's second most successful coach, to clearly explain their reasons?

Excuse me but THREE COACHES took St.Kilda to GRAND FINALS

Did Grant Thomas achieve that much?

Second most successful..........pffft

FAIR DINKUM

[barks4eva]

I recall that St Kilda wanted to deploy their newly generated profit to the formation of a Football Department so that the coach could coach, and not also attend player contract negotiations and the raft of other activities Thomas undertook.

He was advised of this change of direction, which replicated how other clubs went about their business.

He did not accept this and wanted to continue as a one man band, controlling the footy club - and distant from the Board because of the impasse.

EXACTLY, no disputing that, even though I'm sure there will be a few clowns on here who will

[Teflon]

I suspect grants waiting to be head hunted by Lindsay...once Lindsay ratifies himself as the Westaway "silent" sponsor.....

God help us all.....

[Oh When the Saints]

To the Top, that is out of line. You have no right to question stinger's family. Your post has been deleted.

This thread is fast becoming a quagmire.

Stay on topic and stay clean or it will be locked.

[bigcarl]

lets face it, allowing thomas the autonomy to run the football department as was his want was a decision ratified by the board ...

... butterss sowed the seeds for his own demise at the same time, coming out and using Thomas' own saying " we don't accept mediocrity" was probably amusing to him at the time, but sadly it's now been wrapped in some karma and karming back to bite him on his ass.

mediocre is probably too flatterting a word to describe, this year, his last as the president of St kilda

good post.

as you say, karma will always get you in the end. it's a real b*tch.

rb was a good president when he backed gt to run the football side of things. unfortunately he switched horses and the rest (like him) is history imo.

you had a good crack at it rod. now it's time to see whether someone else can take us the next step