Crab watch

[Killa]

BM hangs s*** on everything and anyone St Kilda

24/7

What a life!!!!

Just ignore and move on

Another debutant this week and we wish him well for a long and successful career at St Kilda

[Mr Magic]

How is paying Melbourne for Billing’s affecting any of our list payments this year?
Battle is under contract for this year at a contracted rate that is not affected by any other payment we make.
My understanding is that the payment to Melbourne will cease next year so it will have no effect on any negotiations with anybody, including Battle.
Besides, I thought the issue with Battle re-signing is one of length of contract rather than money?

Good intel, Philip (?)

Who’s Philip?

You remind me of someone I used to work with.

It was a Hail Mary.

All good, but I’m an Allan and not a Philip

[Nick DalSanto Claus]

I don’t think players get to AFL if they take short steps or consistently shirk contests

In fact I take umbrage at the thought any elite footballer is soft. There are degrees of hardness, that’s positional. But no one who’s got to the elite level is soft. Only people who haven’t played the game at any level would think such a thing.

Nearly everyone has occasionally has a look or pulled out but soft mean you wouldn’t win the footy. He does.

You don’t dominated TAC Cup to the point where you are an AA u18 play for Vic Metro and then get drafted as one of the best 3 juniors in the country if you’re soft.
You don’t get 54 possessions playing in the midfield at State League level if you’re soft
You certainly don’t play 165 AFL games if you’re soft
You don’t finish top 5 in a club B&F if you’re soft
You dont get 11 Brownlow votes in 2 separate seasons.

I think it is a ridiculous thought!

Jamie Cripps says hi Big Mart, Marto or what ever reincarnation you prefer.

Who dumped on an 18 year old kid, in his first season, miles away from home, learnt he had Type 2 diabetes a few weeks after he started pre-season training at the Saints? Who called him out for taking ‘short steps’ and soft, a skinny 18 year old kid? Reading such posts all those years ago, was the first time I’d heard the term ‘taking short steps’

And if I recollect correctly a ‘sook’ for wanting to return home to the West because of his medical condition. May not have been one of the above nomenclatures for word ‘sook’ but definitely lead the vigilante group on Jamie Crisp, without knowing the behind the scenes story of inept medical staff at the Saints at the time. Saints prepared to let him go for zilch or his parents were taking action.

IMHO even though I haven’t played AFL at a high level as is obviously a pre-requisite for having an opinion on a fan site, I think Jamie Crisp has turned out a more effective & skillful player for his team than Jack Billings has for the Saints over the years.

Just sayin…………..!!!!

And he's a 200 game, premiership player, two things Billings will never have on his resume.

We overlooked Jack Darling for him. Another masterstroke from our "recruiting guru", John Beveridge. We are still paying the price for his "expertise!"

[Yorkeys]

See Sidebottom's specy re Dees. JB rocks up just as it's taken. Was ready for the spill that never came. Was unable to assist team mate with a spoil. A metaphor for his career. Looks busy, but....

[skeptic]

Thought I’d dust off this gem…

Blake Acres - 27 touches v WB. Continuing to shape up as the worst decision of all time.

In that same game, Nick Coffield returned with 15 touches and an all round unspectacular but ok return from injury.

Over at Essendon…
Gresh had 15 touches and no goals whilst Hind I think started as sub and had a handful on touches on the second half in a bad loss to the under manned Dees.
Of note in that same game, Billings has remained banished from the team - AFL app doesn’t say he’s injured.

Ben Long had a more average day with 10 touches and 1.2 for GC in a team that got the job done. 3.0 would have made him the match winner

Cripps kicked a goal from 10 or so possessions and Joyce had 12 touches in a losing effort to Brisbane

[Vortex]

Thought I’d dust off this gem…

Blake Acres - 27 touches v WB. Continuing to shape up as the worst decision of all time.

In that same game, Nick Coffield returned with 15 touches and an all round unspectacular but ok return from injury.

Over at Essendon…
Gresh had 15 touches and no goals whilst Hind I think started as sub and had a handful on touches on the second half in a bad loss to the under manned Dees.
Of note in that same game, Billings has remained banished from the team - AFL app doesn’t say he’s injured.

Ben Long had a more average day with 10 touches and 1.2 for GC in a team that got the job done. 3.0 would have made him the match winner

Cripps kicked a goal from 10 or so possessions and Joyce had 12 touches in a losing effort to Brisbane

How lucky is Billings getting paid by two clubs to play VFL.

[Scollop]

Several posters (back in March) started mentioning ALL our recent departures and it's still happening

This thread was never meant to be about Acres or Ben Long

I'm offended that people have included these guys in the 'Crab watch' thread

There will only ever be 1 original crab as far as I'm concerned. He's the bloke who runs alongside where the footy is.....and not directly at it

Oh.... he's also getting paid by 2 clubs

[B.M]

Is he the same guy who dominated in the VFL today?

29 possessions
6 clearances
2 goals

For a guy who can’t play footy and is ‘scared’ I’m not sure how he can do that at state league level.

[SinCitySainter]

And is still doing more for his club than Paddy Dow.

[Vortex]

Is he the same guy who dominated in the VFL today?

29 possessions
6 clearances
2 goals

For a guy who can’t play footy and is ‘scared’ I’m not sure how he can do that at state league level.

What from a a guy who went at pick 3 in the national draft dominating at VFL level 10 years into an AFL career, that is impressive I must say, in actual fact I’ll go as far as to say and getting paid quite handsomely to-boot. I honestly mean this when I say that is very clever on Billing’s behalf, I’m guessing he is already planning his life after AFL and enjoying the ride in the mean time. Good luck to him because the AFL system is brutal but if Jack can exit with a bit of coin and some great mates then I call that great individual success.

[B.M]

Why did he go pick 3?

Why has he had a 10 year career?

Why does he average 20ppg as a hf/wing across 165 afl games?

Just because you wanted him to be better, doesn’t mean that he’s had a terrible AFL career or is indeed a poor footballer

He has twice picked up double figure Brownlow votes in a season, has finished top 5 in an AFL team B&F

I know you’d like him to be terrible, to justify your argument
But the fact is
He’s been a reasonable AFL player for a decade, his last few years cruelled by injury to his back

[skeptic]

The challenge for most is that he wasn’t recruited to be or paid as a reasonable footballer.

Few argue that he’s absolutely not/never has been AFL standard.

Most feel/felt that he was elite capability or at least A-Lister potential.

I’d have expected him to be better than Gresh and Higgins. I’d have expected him to be better than Mason Wood. All of them seem less talented but more productive.


Heck I’d take current whipping boy Riley Bonner over him in a heart beat. Works harder, gets to more contests and always gives the effort

Billings should have left all these guys in the dust

[B.M]

Why should he have been better?

Because you wanted him to be?

His draft number?

There are no guarantees in AFL footy

When you walk in the door, everyone starts from the same position day 1 of pre season.

Lachie Neale and Dane Swan were pick 58 in the draft
9 best and Fairests and 3 Brownlows between them

[skeptic]

Because he’s more talented
We all saw it and the club compensated him accordingly

[Laurie]

Is Billings the same guy who played well for Sandy but not quite up to AFL level now doing the same thing at Melbourne.
AlLWAYS was ALWAYS will be a good VFL player.
BOOM BOOM

[B.M]

More talented than who?

What the club paid him, was there issue not his… where he was drafted was the clubs doing, not his. If we swapped him and Sincs in the draft would you feel better about his 155 games?

He just trained and played footy. Are we actually saying he didn’t try?

He’s a very good VFL player - in the past has played very good AFL footy. That we know.

[B.M]

Marshall was a rookie
Wilkie was a rookie

Should they have played according to their draft position?

[skeptic]

More talented than who?

What the club paid him, was there issue not his… where he was drafted was the clubs doing, not his. If we swapped him and Sincs in the draft would you feel better about his 155 games?

He just trained and played footy. Are we actually saying he didn’t try?

He’s a very good VFL player - in the past has played very good AFL footy. That we know.

You’re asking and answering a lot of questions that really have nothing to do with this conversation. Who said he didn’t try.

So given this is such a mystery to you… see if you can figure this out.

Do you think Billings earned more money than Coffield or Butler? If so, then why?

[B.M]

If people are insinuating he should’ve been better than he was ipso facto are suggesting he didn’t maximise his ability

Therefore didn’t give 100%

Now, I know this not to be true, in fact it’s the opposite.

Given his position played, injury history

I think people expected midfielders numbers for a HF and wanted him to be more Christian Petracca then Jack Billings

Did we err in picking him at 3 - possibly- but he was rated there at 18yo - and he was far from a bust. Compare his career with that of Tom Scully - I think that is a good compare!

The only thing he got wrong during his career was accuracy if he kicked at 65% his numbers as a HF would be elite.

[skeptic]

You’re clearly back to having a conversation with yourself

Seems fun.

Are you seriously saying he is the greatest HFF of all time. What a ridiculous comment. Of course not.

To suggest that draft position doesn’t matter at all to how a player is initially viewed is just a lie. Don’t lie BM.

The idea that players are paid indiscriminately is laughable.

Billings was rated at a particular standard. Some of it actualised some of it on potential. Few feel that he met the standard for which he was compensated.

Do you feel that given Billings has been fully fit all year and has languished VFL level for quite a while, is worth the $500k he’s being paid?

Do you think Melbourne will pay the full $500k next year or increase their offer to him?

If you can answer me instead of asking 5 questions to yourself and answering those I would appreciate it

[B.M]

Aren’t I having a conversation with you? You are replying??

Not sure I suggested he was the ‘greatest HF of all time”?

He is not worth 500k playing VFL but reality is Melbourne are only paying him 250k to play a mixture of VFL/AFL which is about right. We are the stupid ones paying him 250k to play elsewhere- that’s our problem not his

I think he might be delisted or kept for depth next season? Not sure?

I’ll ask a few more questions- and answer them because you will not
Has he played good footy in the past, in order to get those contracts - obviously.
Has his body let him down - obviously.
Are all high end draft picks automatically supposed to be superstars- of course not

[Scollop]

If you're playing at this level you are expected to cop bruises and hits and hold the footy or try and break tackles instead of releasing the footy to green grass whenever there's heat.

He was allowed to get away with it for too long from his biggest backer in Alan Richardson. Who knows...if Cho wasn't at Melbourne, maybe they wouldn't have taken him.

We've seen now that Melbourne have decided he's a liability in the senior squad.

He's expected to execute under pressure and he's expected to make good decisions under pressure.
Not to handball blindly to green grass (which incidentally is what a kot of Saints players did in the wet on Saturday against Adelaide)

Whether JB was paid $150k or $600k isn't really the issue...but you can forgive Darcy Wilson or Shoey or other 1st or 2nd year players ... can't accept it from senior players who have been in the system more than 5-6 years

[skeptic]

He’s played ok football and been paid a lot on potential he didn’t reach

His body let him down for a few years but hardly derailed his career. Certainly hasn’t impacted him this year.

All high end picks of course aren’t guaranteed to be stars. Billings showed that he has the attributes to have been a very good player hence the club paid him to reach those levels. Had a few big games but his skills have consistently never been up to par and outside of you… many have questioned his work rate and dedication for a long time

[B.M]

That’s because they are disappointed he was not a superstar- which was their want!

And they are clueless about his work ethic, courage and ability.

I’ll repeat
You don’t get drafted if you can’t play or lack courage
You don’t dominate VFL footy if you can’t play or lack courage
You don’t kick 4 goals in an AFL game if you can’t play or lack courage
You don’t receive 3 Brownlow votes multiple times if you can’t play or lack courage
You don’t play 165 games if you can’t play or lack courage
You don’t average 20ppg if you can’t play or lack courage

Most of the supporters who insinuate as such, have no idea, have never played, generally because they actually lacked courage or ability - yet pass judgement on an elite athlete/footballer - it’s ridiculous

[takeaway]

If you're playing at this level you are expected to cop bruises and hits and hold the footy or try and break tackles instead of releasing the footy to green grass whenever there's heat.

He was allowed to get away with it for too long from his biggest backer in Alan Richardson. Who knows...if Cho wasn't at Melbourne, maybe they wouldn't have taken him.

We've seen now that Melbourne have decided he's a liability in the senior squad.

He's expected to execute under pressure and he's expected to make good decisions under pressure.
Not to handball blindly to green grass (which incidentally is what a kot of Saints players did in the wet on Saturday against Adelaide)

Whether JB was paid $150k or $600k isn't really the issue...but you can forgive Darcy Wilson or Shoey or other 1st or 2nd year players ... can't accept it from senior players who have been in the system more than 5-6 years

Yes, it's a developing skill hand balling to green grass when a player is surrounded and under high pressure. Used a lot more now in games to try to get the ball in the open and hopefully to a teammate. I have noticed that in particular Geelong do it very well, also Brisbane. Check it out Scolls, but you'll have to watch the whole the game, not just the bits where your perception bias kicks in.

JB is not only a good AFL footballer (160+ games) hampered lately by injuries, but is by your description, an innovator as well.