Umpire descent
Moderators: Saintsational Administrators, Saintsational Moderators
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 104
- Joined: Sun 09 Jun 2013 9:04pm
- Has thanked: 2 times
- Been thanked: 25 times
Umpire descent
I won't watch this rubbish anymore. I have no interest in watching a game where the outcome is arbitrarily determined by an umpire forming a view regarding dissent. If the AFL have trouble recruiting umpires at the local level because of poor public behaviour, then there are numerous option to address that situation. Simplify the rules; report threatening criminal behaviour to the police etc. This umpire dissent is causing a descent in the viewing quality of the game and is a misguided and ineffective exercise in social engineering.
Good night. I'm off to bed! Hope the Saints win.
Good night. I'm off to bed! Hope the Saints win.
- skeptic
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 16887
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 7:10pm
- Has thanked: 3580 times
- Been thanked: 2845 times
Re: Umpire descent
The McKenzie was was quite bad I thought but IMO the message is clear…
Don’t ever talk to an umpire
Don’t ever talk to an umpire
- WellardSaint
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 8256
- Joined: Sat 26 May 2012 11:25am
- Location: Perth- the best weather in Oz, but the worst rednecks.
- Has thanked: 1849 times
- Been thanked: 869 times
Re: Umpire descent
Dissent.
A 'descent' is moving downwards, like a hill, or an aircraft dropping altitude.
But I suppose 'descent' re umpiring might be the standards just plummeting lol
A 'descent' is moving downwards, like a hill, or an aircraft dropping altitude.
But I suppose 'descent' re umpiring might be the standards just plummeting lol
A real Sainter will pledge allegiance to the ❤![🤍](//cdn.jsdelivr.net/gh/twitter/twemoji@latest/assets/svg/1f90d.svg)
and despise the Pies, the Blues, and the Injectors.
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
- The_Dud
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 13781
- Joined: Sun 27 May 2007 9:53pm
- Location: Bendigo
- Has thanked: 1313 times
- Been thanked: 2051 times
Re: Umpire descent
18.8.2 Free Kicks - Umpires
A field Umpire shall award a Free Kick against a Player or Official who:
(d) disputes a decision of an Umpire;
Seems pretty straight forward.
Terrible rule, BUT very dumb from McKenzie, I’m sure it was drilled into them all week.
A field Umpire shall award a Free Kick against a Player or Official who:
(d) disputes a decision of an Umpire;
Seems pretty straight forward.
Terrible rule, BUT very dumb from McKenzie, I’m sure it was drilled into them all week.
All posters are equal, but some posters are more equal than others.
- perfectionist
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 9023
- Joined: Mon 30 Jul 2007 3:06pm
- Has thanked: 60 times
- Been thanked: 347 times
Re: Umpire descent
I might be wrong, but I think the poster meant to use "descent" as a play on words.WellardSaint wrote: ↑Fri 22 Apr 2022 10:56pm Dissent.
A 'descent' is moving downwards, like a hill, or an aircraft dropping altitude.
But I suppose 'descent' re umpiring might be the standards just plummeting lol
If a player claims that he touched the ball, is that dissent?
What if a player is kicked in the hand, but a free is missed and he shakes his hand because of the pain?
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 10120
- Joined: Fri 16 Feb 2007 3:24pm
- Location: WARBURTON
- Has thanked: 145 times
- Been thanked: 1299 times
Re: Umpire descent
Or touches the ball on the goal line. Does he stand there like Humphrey Bear.perfectionist wrote: ↑Fri 22 Apr 2022 11:36pmI might be wrong, but I think the poster meant to use "descent" as a play on words.WellardSaint wrote: ↑Fri 22 Apr 2022 10:56pm Dissent.
A 'descent' is moving downwards, like a hill, or an aircraft dropping altitude.
But I suppose 'descent' re umpiring might be the standards just plummeting lol
If a player claims that he touched the ball, is that dissent?
What if a player is kicked in the hand, but a free is missed and he shakes his hand because of the pain?
NO IFS OR BUTS HARVS IS KING OF THE AFL
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 10120
- Joined: Fri 16 Feb 2007 3:24pm
- Location: WARBURTON
- Has thanked: 145 times
- Been thanked: 1299 times
- The_Dud
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 13781
- Joined: Sun 27 May 2007 9:53pm
- Location: Bendigo
- Has thanked: 1313 times
- Been thanked: 2051 times
Re: Umpire descent
Well, not since Tuesday
All posters are equal, but some posters are more equal than others.
- CarlTaughtMeEnglish
- Club Player
- Posts: 58
- Joined: Mon 10 Oct 2016 8:54pm
- Has thanked: 13 times
- Been thanked: 11 times
Umpire descent
Watching it my first thought was D McK was trying to prevent the umpire from giving fifty by justifying why he on with the contest after the mark, by saying he thought it touched the ground and wasn’t expecting it to be paid. As it turned out the umpire didn’t care about that.The_Dud wrote:18.8.2 Free Kicks - Umpires
A field Umpire shall award a Free Kick against a Player or Official who:
(d) disputes a decision of an Umpire;
Seems pretty straight forward.
Terrible rule, BUT very dumb from McKenzie, I’m sure it was drilled into them all week.
- ace
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 10734
- Joined: Sun 16 Dec 2007 3:28pm
- Location: St Kilda
- Has thanked: 30 times
- Been thanked: 819 times
Re: Umpire descent
Never talk to umpires.
Never talk to police
Then you develop a them versus us mentality.
Then no one will want to become an umpire because they are shunned.
I think this is a stupid idea by a stupid administrator
The same stupid person who cleaned out the experienced players from North.
He didn't have sufficient brains to realise he needed senior players to teach his new recruits.
Maybe he suffers the after effects of concussion.
Whatever he is doomed to create a mess for the AFL at least as big as the mess he left behind at North.
The more you know, the more you know you don't know.
When I was a young child, I knew that I knew so much about so much.
Now that I am old and know so much more, I know that I know so much about so little, and so little about so much.
If you are not engaging AI actively and aggressively, you are doing it wrong.
You are not going to lose your job to AI.
You are going lose your job to somebody who uses AI.
Your company is not going to go out of business because of AI.
Your company is going to go out of business because another company used AI.
- Jensen Huang, CEO of NVIDIA
When I was a young child, I knew that I knew so much about so much.
Now that I am old and know so much more, I know that I know so much about so little, and so little about so much.
If you are not engaging AI actively and aggressively, you are doing it wrong.
You are not going to lose your job to AI.
You are going lose your job to somebody who uses AI.
Your company is not going to go out of business because of AI.
Your company is going to go out of business because another company used AI.
- Jensen Huang, CEO of NVIDIA
-
- SS Hall of Fame
- Posts: 2490
- Joined: Mon 19 Mar 2012 8:54pm
- Has thanked: 140 times
- Been thanked: 546 times
Re: Umpire descent
I personally hate it but hey it is here to stay & we just have suck it up & move on . The line in the sand has been drawn & we would fools if didn't take it seriously
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 23208
- Joined: Sat 13 Mar 2004 11:44pm
- Has thanked: 735 times
- Been thanked: 1776 times
Re: Umpire descent
Nanny state AFL crap
Unworkable but very pc and woke and “sounds good”
You’d think Penny Wong/Kevin Rudd came up with it
Be a massive shame if this starts to influence results or a GF
Unworkable but very pc and woke and “sounds good”
You’d think Penny Wong/Kevin Rudd came up with it
Be a massive shame if this starts to influence results or a GF
“Yeah….nah””
- The Fireman
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 13243
- Joined: Mon 08 Mar 2004 11:54pm
- Has thanked: 644 times
- Been thanked: 1907 times
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 23010
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 3:53pm
- Has thanked: 8902 times
- Been thanked: 3883 times
Re: Umpire descent
ace wrote: ↑Sat 23 Apr 2022 1:38amNever talk to umpires.
Never talk to police
Then you develop a them versus us mentality.
Then no one will want to become an umpire because they are shunned.
I think this is a stupid idea by a stupid administrator
The same stupid person who cleaned out the experienced players from North.
He didn't have sufficient brains to realise he needed senior players to teach his new recruits.
Maybe he suffers the after effects of concussion.
Whatever he is doomed to create a mess for the AFL at least as big as the mess he left behind at North.
![Wink :wink:](./images/smilies/icon_wink.gif)
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 23010
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 3:53pm
- Has thanked: 8902 times
- Been thanked: 3883 times
Re: Umpire descent
They need to work on their prior opportunity too. That free against McKenzie was pure bulls***. Second goal gifted to GWS by umpires trying to assist one of the AFL's love childs over the line
You can make players, clubs and coaches comply and also the media arselickers, but if you want the supporting public to jump on board, the umpiring needs to improve. IMHFO that is.
Nobody wins support with poor effort.
You can make players, clubs and coaches comply and also the media arselickers, but if you want the supporting public to jump on board, the umpiring needs to improve. IMHFO that is.
Nobody wins support with poor effort.
- perfectionist
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 9023
- Joined: Mon 30 Jul 2007 3:06pm
- Has thanked: 60 times
- Been thanked: 347 times
Re: Umpire descent
I'd be interested in why this was paid. If there was prior opportunity, then I didn't see it. The other reason could be no reasonable attempt to dispose of the ball, that is, the player has to try to get the ball out of the tackle, even if the ball is pinned by the tackle. Fake attempts can be pinged.
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 23010
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 3:53pm
- Has thanked: 8902 times
- Been thanked: 3883 times
Re: Umpire descent
Jimmy Bartel, a GWS board member has stated that the decision against McKenzie was wrong. I don't know which one he was referring to, the prior opportunity or the fifty metre penalty. Both disgusting decisions in my opinion.
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 104
- Joined: Sun 09 Jun 2013 9:04pm
- Has thanked: 2 times
- Been thanked: 25 times
Re: Umpire descent
Thank you, perfectionist. I did choose the word "descent" intentionally as a play on words. That is apparent if you read the OP.
What if the coach throws their arms in the air in the box in response to an umpiring decision. Will there be a penalty?
Imagine how boring sport would be if a tennis players was not able to question an umpire's call? A soccer players not being able to question a referee's decision? A cricketer unable to appeal to an umpire for an LBW and show disappointment when their appeal is declined. All these sports are capable of managing the issue why not AFL House for AFL Rules?
I can't help but think that this overreach is trying too hard to appeal to the big techs for broadcasting rights by sanitising the game. The rule as it is currently being administered is wrong and also highlights problems with the current Constitution.
What if the coach throws their arms in the air in the box in response to an umpiring decision. Will there be a penalty?
Imagine how boring sport would be if a tennis players was not able to question an umpire's call? A soccer players not being able to question a referee's decision? A cricketer unable to appeal to an umpire for an LBW and show disappointment when their appeal is declined. All these sports are capable of managing the issue why not AFL House for AFL Rules?
I can't help but think that this overreach is trying too hard to appeal to the big techs for broadcasting rights by sanitising the game. The rule as it is currently being administered is wrong and also highlights problems with the current Constitution.
- Mr Magic
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 12754
- Joined: Fri 04 May 2007 9:38am
- Has thanked: 762 times
- Been thanked: 423 times
- Wayne42
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 4911
- Joined: Mon 24 Jun 2013 10:27pm
- Has thanked: 619 times
- Been thanked: 558 times
Re: Umpire descent
The AFL are trying to eradicate Umpire dissent from the game in the hope dissent is removed or lessened at all levels of the game.
The game of football is struggling to attract umpires, umpiring is a real health hazard at lower levels, both physically and mentally, why
would anyone bother becoming an umpire just so they can endure an umpiring lifetime of abuse.
If there are no umpires at lower levels then there won't be any at AFL level, then what. The AFL is saying they are 6000 umpires short. That is
a huge vacancy to fill.
How do they word the Ad, they could start it with...do you have a thick skin, are you bothered by constant abuse ?
The game of football is struggling to attract umpires, umpiring is a real health hazard at lower levels, both physically and mentally, why
would anyone bother becoming an umpire just so they can endure an umpiring lifetime of abuse.
If there are no umpires at lower levels then there won't be any at AFL level, then what. The AFL is saying they are 6000 umpires short. That is
a huge vacancy to fill.
How do they word the Ad, they could start it with...do you have a thick skin, are you bothered by constant abuse ?
The Saints are under review, will it make any difference to the underachievers ?
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 10598
- Joined: Tue 14 Jun 2005 7:04pm
- Location: North
- Has thanked: 1011 times
- Been thanked: 1055 times
Re: Umpire descent
I think the rule is good.
Letter of the law DMac questioned the decision.
Harsh, but fair according to the new rules.
Just watched Ratts presser and the last question is about the DMac 50.
Ratts just bluntly says that the players clearly know the rules and they just need to focus on the play.
I can understand that it seems harsh, a decision like the DMac 50, but personally I like it heaps better without the players carrying on when they don't like the decision. Just get on with the game. Simple.
Another change I'd like to see brought in is something another poster has suggested (can't recall who right now) and that's for the umpires to stop calling the players by their names.
Just say the team and the number. For e.g. "Free kick St.Kilda number 26". Take the faux matey-ness out of it.
Letter of the law DMac questioned the decision.
Harsh, but fair according to the new rules.
Just watched Ratts presser and the last question is about the DMac 50.
Ratts just bluntly says that the players clearly know the rules and they just need to focus on the play.
I can understand that it seems harsh, a decision like the DMac 50, but personally I like it heaps better without the players carrying on when they don't like the decision. Just get on with the game. Simple.
Another change I'd like to see brought in is something another poster has suggested (can't recall who right now) and that's for the umpires to stop calling the players by their names.
Just say the team and the number. For e.g. "Free kick St.Kilda number 26". Take the faux matey-ness out of it.
- Mr Magic
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 12754
- Joined: Fri 04 May 2007 9:38am
- Has thanked: 762 times
- Been thanked: 423 times
Re: Umpire descent
meher Baba is the poster you're referring to.st.byron wrote: ↑Sat 23 Apr 2022 2:48pm I think the rule is good.
Letter of the law DMac questioned the decision.
Harsh, but fair according to the new rules.
Just watched Ratts presser and the last question is about the DMac 50.
Ratts just bluntly says that the players clearly know the rules and they just need to focus on the play.
I can understand that it seems harsh, a decision like the DMac 50, but personally I like it heaps better without the players carrying on when they don't like the decision. Just get on with the game. Simple.
Another change I'd like to see brought in is something another poster has suggested (can't recall who right now) and that's for the umpires to stop calling the players by their names.
Just say the team and the number. For e.g. "Free kick St.Kilda number 26". Take the faux matey-ness out of it.
My only issue is that the AFL Umpiring department needs to get all the umpires onto the same page with this rule.
Only some umpires are paying it - others are choosing to ignore it.
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 10598
- Joined: Tue 14 Jun 2005 7:04pm
- Location: North
- Has thanked: 1011 times
- Been thanked: 1055 times
Re: Umpire descent
Thanks Magic. Yes it's Baba who's been suggesting that. Good idea I reckon. Stopping dissent removes the element of personal interaction from the players towards the umpires. It should also be removed going the other way. Stop personal 'matey' interaction from the umpires to the players. They're there to apply the rules impersonally, no need to be calling the players by their first names like they're mates.Mr Magic wrote: ↑Sat 23 Apr 2022 2:55pmmeher Baba is the poster you're referring to.st.byron wrote: ↑Sat 23 Apr 2022 2:48pm I think the rule is good.
Letter of the law DMac questioned the decision.
Harsh, but fair according to the new rules.
Just watched Ratts presser and the last question is about the DMac 50.
Ratts just bluntly says that the players clearly know the rules and they just need to focus on the play.
I can understand that it seems harsh, a decision like the DMac 50, but personally I like it heaps better without the players carrying on when they don't like the decision. Just get on with the game. Simple.
Another change I'd like to see brought in is something another poster has suggested (can't recall who right now) and that's for the umpires to stop calling the players by their names.
Just say the team and the number. For e.g. "Free kick St.Kilda number 26". Take the faux matey-ness out of it.
My only issue is that the AFL Umpiring department needs to get all the umpires onto the same page with this rule.
Only some umpires are paying it - others are choosing to ignore it.
Completely agree that consistency is vital. There has to be for any rule to work. Especially when the penalty is so signficant - for e.g Ward getting a goal from DMac's 50 last night.
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 104
- Joined: Sun 09 Jun 2013 9:04pm
- Has thanked: 2 times
- Been thanked: 25 times
Re: Umpire descent
I would be grateful if someone would direct me to any substantive credible evidence that would support the claim that D'mac's conduct, i.e. advising the umpire that the ball had hit the ground, would dissuade people umpiring in the junior ranks? D'macs type of conduct would be totally acceptable in any other reputable sport. The way this rule is being administered does nothing for the reputation or promotion of the game.