Special Message to Curly
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- meher baba
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Re: Special Message to Curly
I have been reluctant to get involved in the debate about the free kick against Hayes last week.
However, as I saw it, the player was brought to ground with his arms completely pinned, which is always a dangerous tackle (albeit nothing bad happened on this occasion), and certainly should be against the rules. And indeed, I thought that umpires had been directed to stamp this sort of tackle out of the game.
Sure, the commentators thought it was a dud decision. So what: the commentators often get it wrong.
Anyway, I’ve said it now: anyone who wants can have a go at me.
However, as I saw it, the player was brought to ground with his arms completely pinned, which is always a dangerous tackle (albeit nothing bad happened on this occasion), and certainly should be against the rules. And indeed, I thought that umpires had been directed to stamp this sort of tackle out of the game.
Sure, the commentators thought it was a dud decision. So what: the commentators often get it wrong.
Anyway, I’ve said it now: anyone who wants can have a go at me.
"It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into."
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Re: Special Message to Curly
meher baba wrote: ↑Fri 01 Apr 2022 11:57am It’s all much easier to understand if, like me, you see the umpires as fundamentally unbiased, but inadequately trained and with a very poor culture.
- The_Dud
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Re: Special Message to Curly
I think you've got rose-coloured glasses on SD! The masses don't want to be educated, they want all the 50/50 free kicks to go their way! And I would imagine the umpires know exactly how 'frustrated' the masses are.Sainter_Dad wrote: ↑Fri 01 Apr 2022 2:13pm
Or by the umpires being more accountable - educates the masses and at the same time lets the umpires understand our frustrations
Telling people "that since the stat has been recorded St Kilda is one of the most 'favoured' teams by the umpires" is irrelevant - that is like saying there was steak delivered last week - but you still have to have sausages today
Umpires get things wrong - telling people to understand the rules that are technically correct is like issuing a fine for backing out of your driveway - technically it is a fine - but it is not 'seen' as being an infringement
Remove the concept of 'technically' there and pay what is actually there - was the Freo player actually slung/dangerously tackled - no - the elements were there for it to be considered but it did not happen
Does touching someone on the shoulder but not impacting the play affect the outcome (esp if the opposition is the one to move the hand there) - nope - but it gets paid (see Selwood)
Forget the rules - the umpires should umpire to the result - was the player impeded - yes - pay a free - I don't care if you call it holding the man/unfair tackle/potato peeling - that is irrelevant
Impede a player from having a fair attempt at doing an action - free kick against
Incorrectly dispose of the ball whilst being tackled - free kick against
Dangerous Action (and we all know what they are) - free kick against
Everything else - let the game play on
And regarding the education, you're proving my point yourself! It was a 'dangerous tackle', 100%, yet you've said 'no'! He pinned both the arms, then dumped/slammed/slung him to the ground. There's no debate. NOW you can debate the rule, which I agree isn't a good one, but the umpires don't have that option, they play to the rules!
I agree that football is better when the umps 'put the whistle away' and I wished footy was more like that. Though I don't think you Castle-esque "umpire to the vibe" method would be feasable! Adding more grey-area and interpretation is only going to upset supporters more.
Telling people "that since the stat has been recorded St Kilda is one of the most 'favoured' teams by the umpires" is irrelevant - that is like saying there was steak delivered last week - but you still have to have sausages today
The point of that, to stick with your analogy, is to refute the person when they claim "You never ever give me steak!" by showing them the receipt and saying "Look, you actually have steak 4 times a week, which is in fact more than any of your friends". They don't care though, they'd just rather be upset, there's nothing you can do to please them!
All posters are equal, but some posters are more equal than others.
- Sainter_Dad
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Re: Special Message to Curly
Not having a go Meher - and I agree that the action itself had the elements of the dangerous tackle - but how many - exactly the same - are not paid?meher baba wrote: ↑Fri 01 Apr 2022 2:40pm I have been reluctant to get involved in the debate about the free kick against Hayes last week.
However, as I saw it, the player was brought to ground with his arms completely pinned, which is always a dangerous tackle (albeit nothing bad happened on this occasion), and certainly should be against the rules. And indeed, I thought that umpires had been directed to stamp this sort of tackle out of the game.
Sure, the commentators thought it was a dud decision. So what: the commentators often get it wrong.
Anyway, I’ve said it now: anyone who wants can have a go at me.
I see slings, heads driven into the ground etc every week - no action taken
Protect the head - I ABSOLUTELY agree - but don't pay one and not the other - esp if it is a 2022 directive to stamp it out
How is that tackle any safer than what Acres did to King? It comes back to what one umpire considers is dangerous vs what another does
“Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever.”
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
- Sainter_Dad
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Re: Special Message to Curly
Actually - I totally agree the point that his arms were pinned - I disagree that he was slung or dumped - I don't believe his head ever touched the ground - which would have happened if there was anything dangerous about the tackleThe_Dud wrote: ↑Fri 01 Apr 2022 2:59pm
And regarding the education, you're proving my point yourself! It was a 'dangerous tackle', 100%, yet you've said 'no'! He pinned both the arms, then dumped/slammed/slung him to the ground. There's no debate. NOW you can debate the rule, which I agree isn't a good one, but the umpires don't have that option, they play to the rules!
Maybe I miscommunicated - the action - technically - had one element of the 'crime' but not the other - which meant that it was not completed as dangerous. Acres knock to Kings head was far more dangerous and whilst it is in the rules that he can bump - the fact that he hit head high should have drawn a free.
Oh - and I never claimed to be a St Kilda supporter means you are exempt from bias - or that you are in anyway sensible - in fact the supporting of our Rag Tag bunch of players by a Rag Tag bunch of lunatics is by definition the meaning of insanity
“Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever.”
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
- The_Dud
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Re: Special Message to Curly
I wouldn't have thought there was much debate that he was dumped to the ground, he certainly wasn't gently lowered! The action is what needs to be punished, not the outcome. They can't go around waiting for medical examination to declare whether a tackle was dangerous or not! Exact same tackle but with only one arm pinned, no problem, carry on.Sainter_Dad wrote: ↑Fri 01 Apr 2022 3:07pmActually - I totally agree the point that his arms were pinned - I disagree that he was slung or dumped - I don't believe his head ever touched the ground - which would have happened if there was anything dangerous about the tackleThe_Dud wrote: ↑Fri 01 Apr 2022 2:59pm
And regarding the education, you're proving my point yourself! It was a 'dangerous tackle', 100%, yet you've said 'no'! He pinned both the arms, then dumped/slammed/slung him to the ground. There's no debate. NOW you can debate the rule, which I agree isn't a good one, but the umpires don't have that option, they play to the rules!
Maybe I miscommunicated - the action - technically - had one element of the 'crime' but not the other - which meant that it was not completed as dangerous. Acres knock to Kings head was far more dangerous and whilst it is in the rules that he can bump - the fact that he hit head high should have drawn a free.
Oh - and I never claimed to be a St Kilda supporter means you are exempt from bias - or that you are in anyway sensible - in fact the supporting of our Rag Tag bunch of players by a Rag Tag bunch of lunatics is by definition the meaning of insanity
The Acres / King bump was definitely a free, and clearly a mistake. King did get a free from Acres later on for a much tamer incident. But umps can't go around doing 'square ups' or worried that they might have made an error earlier in the game. They have to try make the correct decision in every instance, even if that team already has 15 more free kicks than their opposition.
Someone on here even said the location on the ground and time on the clock should influence whether something is a free kick or not
The masses will never be happy!
All posters are equal, but some posters are more equal than others.
- Sainter_Dad
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Re: Special Message to Curly
Agree on the highlighted pointThe_Dud wrote: ↑Fri 01 Apr 2022 3:49pmI wouldn't have thought there was much debate that he was dumped to the ground, he certainly wasn't gently lowered! The action is what needs to be punished, not the outcome. They can't go around waiting for medical examination to declare whether a tackle was dangerous or not! Exact same tackle but with only one arm pinned, no problem, carry on.Sainter_Dad wrote: ↑Fri 01 Apr 2022 3:07pmActually - I totally agree the point that his arms were pinned - I disagree that he was slung or dumped - I don't believe his head ever touched the ground - which would have happened if there was anything dangerous about the tackleThe_Dud wrote: ↑Fri 01 Apr 2022 2:59pm
And regarding the education, you're proving my point yourself! It was a 'dangerous tackle', 100%, yet you've said 'no'! He pinned both the arms, then dumped/slammed/slung him to the ground. There's no debate. NOW you can debate the rule, which I agree isn't a good one, but the umpires don't have that option, they play to the rules!
Maybe I miscommunicated - the action - technically - had one element of the 'crime' but not the other - which meant that it was not completed as dangerous. Acres knock to Kings head was far more dangerous and whilst it is in the rules that he can bump - the fact that he hit head high should have drawn a free.
Oh - and I never claimed to be a St Kilda supporter means you are exempt from bias - or that you are in anyway sensible - in fact the supporting of our Rag Tag bunch of players by a Rag Tag bunch of lunatics is by definition the meaning of insanity
The Acres / King bump was definitely a free, and clearly a mistake. King did get a free from Acres later on for a much tamer incident. But umps can't go around doing 'square ups' or worried that they might have made an error earlier in the game. They have to try make the correct decision in every instance, even if that team already has 15 more free kicks than their opposition.
Someone on here even said the location on the ground and time on the clock should influence whether something is a free kick or not
The masses will never be happy!
And agree that there should not be square ups - can you point me to where the Umpires Advocate has said that the Acres Bump on King was an error - if so - you have my full apology - if not - this is what I am talking about as full disclosure - as I understand it - at this point the Umpires have said that they are happy with the umpiring. NO ACCOUNTABILITY - no satisfaction from the masses
“Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever.”
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
- Otiman
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Re: Special Message to Curly
This post on Reddit does a good job of assessing every free kick, paid and unpaid. It's a great insight and I recommend watching the plays back and trying to disagree with the outcome.
https://www.reddit.com/gallery/ttgk7x
https://www.reddit.com/gallery/ttgk7x
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Re: Special Message to Curly
You can parse different passages of play, can invoke intangibles like what the AFL wants, what might have happened, but it's what happens that matters.Hayes tackle was good. The ump anticipated a sling, but Hayes was too skillful for him. However intentioned it was wrong and cost us %.
I actually think the masses will be quite happy if umps get it right. To suggest otherwise is dismissive of supporters intelligence.
We have been on the end of some shockers. Its quality not quantity.
I thought that the way the team disciplined themselves after that free was terrific. We have been known to go to jelly under other coaches.
I actually think the masses will be quite happy if umps get it right. To suggest otherwise is dismissive of supporters intelligence.
We have been on the end of some shockers. Its quality not quantity.
I thought that the way the team disciplined themselves after that free was terrific. We have been known to go to jelly under other coaches.
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Re: Special Message to Curly
That will make for interesting readingOtiman wrote: ↑Fri 01 Apr 2022 5:33pm This post on Reddit does a good job of assessing every free kick, paid and unpaid. It's a great insight and I recommend watching the plays back and trying to disagree with the outcome.
https://www.reddit.com/gallery/ttgk7x
Is this an official AFL sanctioned reddit - or is it an umpire / ex umpire who is weighing in with his/her opinion?
Also - do they do every game?
“Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever.”
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
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Re: Special Message to Curly
Well then you explain why Dud - the stats are there.The_Dud wrote: ↑Fri 01 Apr 2022 10:56amThat's not giving a reason why the AFL have instigated this conspiracy against us?
Riewoldt, Montagna, Dal Santo, Ross Lyon, Michael Roberts, Mark Fine, plus many more ex-St Kilda people are active in footy media, plus the AFL CEO!!
Also the Dogs are an equally minor team (before 2016 especially) so why do they get targeted for the exact opposite treatment to us in this grand conspiracy??
You just can't dismiss it as nothing to see here because you were an ump and understands how hard a job it is
- Sainter_Dad
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Re: Special Message to Curly
Hey FreebirdFreebird wrote: ↑Fri 01 Apr 2022 6:54pmWell then you explain why Dud - the stats are there.The_Dud wrote: ↑Fri 01 Apr 2022 10:56amThat's not giving a reason why the AFL have instigated this conspiracy against us?
Riewoldt, Montagna, Dal Santo, Ross Lyon, Michael Roberts, Mark Fine, plus many more ex-St Kilda people are active in footy media, plus the AFL CEO!!
Also the Dogs are an equally minor team (before 2016 especially) so why do they get targeted for the exact opposite treatment to us in this grand conspiracy??
You just can't dismiss it as nothing to see here because you were an ump and understands how hard a job it is
I think The Dud was pointing out that since the stat has been recorded we have been on the winning end of the Free Kick count:
I may be wrong but I think that was the point.The_Dud wrote: ↑Fri 01 Apr 2022 2:59pm Telling people "that since the stat has been recorded St Kilda is one of the most 'favoured' teams by the umpires" is irrelevant - that is like saying there was steak delivered last week - but you still have to have sausages today
The point of that, to stick with your analogy, is to refute the person when they claim "You never ever give me steak!" by showing them the receipt and saying "Look, you actually have steak 4 times a week, which is in fact more than any of your friends". They don't care though, they'd just rather be upset, there's nothing you can do to please them!
And to give him his dues - from 1965 to 2022* the free kicks are
For | Against |
---|---|
33,946 | 33,109 |
However in the 2,000's (probably more relevant) - we are down 239
Year | For | Against |
---|---|---|
2022* | 42 | 52 |
2021 | 401 | 433 |
2020 | 292 | 299 |
2019 | 398 | 434 |
2018 | 410 | 464 |
2017 | 392 | 374 |
2016 | 370 | 392 |
2015 | 393 | 457 |
2014 | 341 | 369 |
2013 | 355 | 394 |
2012 | 404 | 396 |
2011 | 449 | 491 |
2010 | 450 | 504 |
2009 | 484 | 421 |
2008 | 501 | 523 |
2007 | 461 | 414 |
2006 | 382 | 397 |
2005 | 470 | 401 |
2004 | 372 | 359 |
2003 | 304 | 349 |
2002 | 353 | 309 |
2001 | 334 | 320 |
2000 | 375 | 420 |
Total | 8733 | 8972 |
“Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever.”
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
- Sainter_Dad
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Re: Special Message to Curly
In Fact (And you did open the door Dud)
Graphed it looks like this:
So since 2009 there has been a rapid and constant decrease in the differential - ie year on year we are on the wrong end of the count.
So Dud your point about have a receipt with Steak on it - is more realistically - my father had steak here and he told me about it - but I get sausages.
Year | For | Against | Differential |
---|---|---|---|
1965 | 584 | 617 | -33 |
1966 | 670 | 652 | -15 |
1967 | 563 | 545 | 3 |
1968 | 680 | 701 | -18 |
1969 | 781 | 800 | -37 |
1970 | 935 | 1000 | -102 |
1971 | 1066 | 1015 | -51 |
1972 | 1088 | 969 | 68 |
1973 | 952 | 957 | 63 |
1974 | 828 | 864 | 27 |
1975 | 842 | 819 | 50 |
1976 | 878 | 737 | 191 |
1977 | 889 | 708 | 372 |
1978 | 846 | 727 | 491 |
1979 | 954 | 827 | 618 |
1980 | 842 | 793 | 667 |
1981 | 804 | 873 | 598 |
1982 | 789 | 806 | 581 |
1983 | 925 | 888 | 618 |
1984 | 807 | 779 | 646 |
1985 | 771 | 737 | 680 |
1986 | 704 | 661 | 723 |
1987 | 644 | 647 | 720 |
1988 | 706 | 582 | 844 |
1989 | 690 | 578 | 956 |
1990 | 596 | 537 | 1015 |
1991 | 577 | 517 | 1075 |
1992 | 665 | 595 | 1145 |
1993 | 542 | 498 | 1189 |
1994 | 492 | 501 | 1180 |
1995 | 412 | 416 | 1176 |
1996 | 416 | 465 | 1127 |
1997 | 428 | 438 | 1117 |
1998 | 454 | 437 | 1134 |
1999 | 393 | 451 | 1076 |
2000 | 375 | 420 | 1031 |
2001 | 334 | 320 | 1045 |
2002 | 353 | 309 | 1089 |
2003 | 304 | 349 | 1044 |
2004 | 372 | 359 | 1057 |
2005 | 470 | 401 | 1126 |
2006 | 382 | 397 | 1111 |
2007 | 461 | 414 | 1158 |
2008 | 501 | 523 | 1136 |
2009 | 484 | 421 | 1199 |
2010 | 450 | 504 | 1145 |
2011 | 449 | 491 | 1103 |
2012 | 404 | 396 | 1111 |
2013 | 355 | 394 | 1072 |
2014 | 341 | 369 | 1044 |
2015 | 393 | 457 | 980 |
2016 | 370 | 392 | 958 |
2017 | 392 | 374 | 976 |
2018 | 410 | 464 | 922 |
2019 | 398 | 434 | 886 |
2020 | 292 | 299 | 879 |
2021 | 401 | 433 | 847 |
2022 | 42 | 52 | 837 |
So since 2009 there has been a rapid and constant decrease in the differential - ie year on year we are on the wrong end of the count.
So Dud your point about have a receipt with Steak on it - is more realistically - my father had steak here and he told me about it - but I get sausages.
“Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever.”
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
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Re: Special Message to Curly
Far out sd I'm more interested in why the dogs are favoured...could you do stats for them?
I recall Tony Shaw as coach remarked that all the coaches knew dogs were favoured by umps
I recall Tony Shaw as coach remarked that all the coaches knew dogs were favoured by umps
- Sainter_Dad
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Re: Special Message to Curly
Why the F@rk would you ask that of me? You deserve what you asked for - cry into your beer!
For | Against |
---|---|
34,661 | 32,525 |
However in the 2,000's (probably more relevant) - they are down 722
“Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever.”
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
- Ghost Like
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Re: Special Message to Curly
This is a rabbit hole of massive proportions. I tend to think it can only be looked at in eras (dynasties / umpire numbers / rule changes) or 5 or 10 year blocks.
We are bemoaning seemingly favoured teams now, this season, so overall or in our lifetimes don't really say too much. For the Bulldogs, their sweet spot has been from season 2016 onwards. The highlighted period being the finals period of 2016. We could only dream of a leg up or extra leg in 2009 & 2010.
What was that about the ox turning a wheel? The planets really need to align...Planet Players / Planet Injuries / Planet Umpires / Planet Form / Planet Opposition.
We are bemoaning seemingly favoured teams now, this season, so overall or in our lifetimes don't really say too much. For the Bulldogs, their sweet spot has been from season 2016 onwards. The highlighted period being the finals period of 2016. We could only dream of a leg up or extra leg in 2009 & 2010.
What was that about the ox turning a wheel? The planets really need to align...Planet Players / Planet Injuries / Planet Umpires / Planet Form / Planet Opposition.
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Re: Special Message to Curly
Free kicks are like wins, the better you get, the more you get.
So many players are slipping under arms with no intention of breaking away, they just absorb the tackle, they don't panic or raise their arms, they just expect the free.
Smart forwards lunge and raise their arms, the dont engage with stronger players groping them.
I believe we are also seeing, and we will see more of, players who are pinned and swung just going with the momentum and hoping they don't hit their head. Particularly in clutch situations.
We just need to develop our game play, not only our game plan.
Lonie did lots of it, I wasn't a fan of Lonie because of the many times he got these frees and fudged the kick and shook his head or punched the ground, has left me with a perception bias but he clearly thought about it, put himself in vulnerable positions and drew a free kick.
When it didn't work he was on his arse, and had to get up and slink off.
We are too desperate, too chaotic and not focussed on anything else, too often.
Maybe that's a bias too but too me, and possibly the umpires, it sticks and its supported by our dismil free kick trend in the last decade.
Thomas attacked with highly skilled players and won free kick, Lyon squeezed the game down to winnable positions and wasn't frightened to have his players infringe at favourable times and positions.
The umpires analyse things in order.
Did Butler dispose of the ball correctly or was he tripped, the result was a goal, either way and the rule and the spirit of the game was respected.
I didn't hear many arguments for the trip which happened as the player slipped down Butlers torso, but if Butlers grip on the ball wasn't impacted by the initial tackle, I'm a monkeys uncle. He motioned a quick swipe at the ball and it went forward, their is no doubt he was legged and it all happened very fast.
I believe most umpires analyse the game well but they are s*** scared of missing decisions which are scrutinised by several camera angles.
When asked they explained what they saw. If they can articulate that within the measure of the rules they are fine, of they can't, they are scrutinised. We just like to believe they can get away with turning games.
Cheating and incompetence are not the same thing.
So many players are slipping under arms with no intention of breaking away, they just absorb the tackle, they don't panic or raise their arms, they just expect the free.
Smart forwards lunge and raise their arms, the dont engage with stronger players groping them.
I believe we are also seeing, and we will see more of, players who are pinned and swung just going with the momentum and hoping they don't hit their head. Particularly in clutch situations.
We just need to develop our game play, not only our game plan.
Lonie did lots of it, I wasn't a fan of Lonie because of the many times he got these frees and fudged the kick and shook his head or punched the ground, has left me with a perception bias but he clearly thought about it, put himself in vulnerable positions and drew a free kick.
When it didn't work he was on his arse, and had to get up and slink off.
We are too desperate, too chaotic and not focussed on anything else, too often.
Maybe that's a bias too but too me, and possibly the umpires, it sticks and its supported by our dismil free kick trend in the last decade.
Thomas attacked with highly skilled players and won free kick, Lyon squeezed the game down to winnable positions and wasn't frightened to have his players infringe at favourable times and positions.
The umpires analyse things in order.
Did Butler dispose of the ball correctly or was he tripped, the result was a goal, either way and the rule and the spirit of the game was respected.
I didn't hear many arguments for the trip which happened as the player slipped down Butlers torso, but if Butlers grip on the ball wasn't impacted by the initial tackle, I'm a monkeys uncle. He motioned a quick swipe at the ball and it went forward, their is no doubt he was legged and it all happened very fast.
I believe most umpires analyse the game well but they are s*** scared of missing decisions which are scrutinised by several camera angles.
When asked they explained what they saw. If they can articulate that within the measure of the rules they are fine, of they can't, they are scrutinised. We just like to believe they can get away with turning games.
Cheating and incompetence are not the same thing.
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Re: Special Message to Curly
At no stage did I accuse them of cheating or a conspiracy - I agree with you that it is perception of the incident and of the player involved.
But COMPETENCE I kind of expect when you are being paid up to a purported $150K for a part time job!!!!!
https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/pay ... 2b0qg.html
There are less free kicks paid per year now with 3 umpires and more convoluted rules than 40 years ago but they still do not seem to be able to get it right - and guess on decisions. [Not sure that I prefer 3 umpires - but Occ Health and Safety can't have them running so far for their $5,000+ for 3 hours work]
“Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever.”
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
- Ghost Like
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Re: Special Message to Curly
I agree S_D, I think we can survive with one central umpire & allow for 4 boundary umpires who can intervene with decisions within their quadrant & boundary side of the ball.Sainter_Dad wrote: ↑Sat 02 Apr 2022 3:03amAt no stage did I accuse them of cheating or a conspiracy - I agree with you that it is perception of the incident and of the player involved.
But COMPETENCE I kind of expect when you are being paid up to a purported $150K for a part time job!!!!!
https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/pay ... 2b0qg.html
There are less free kicks paid per year now with 3 umpires and more convoluted rules than 40 years ago but they still do not seem to be able to get it right - and guess on decisions. [Not sure that I prefer 3 umpires - but Occ Health and Safety can't have them running so far for their $5,000+ for 3 hours work]
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Re: Special Message to Curly
My model goes:Ghost Like wrote: ↑Sat 02 Apr 2022 8:44amI agree S_D, I think we can survive with one central umpire & allow for 4 boundary umpires who can intervene with decisions within their quadrant & boundary side of the ball.Sainter_Dad wrote: ↑Sat 02 Apr 2022 3:03amAt no stage did I accuse them of cheating or a conspiracy - I agree with you that it is perception of the incident and of the player involved.
But COMPETENCE I kind of expect when you are being paid up to a purported $150K for a part time job!!!!!
https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/pay ... 2b0qg.html
There are less free kicks paid per year now with 3 umpires and more convoluted rules than 40 years ago but they still do not seem to be able to get it right - and guess on decisions. [Not sure that I prefer 3 umpires - but Occ Health and Safety can't have them running so far for their $5,000+ for 3 hours work]
1 central umpire - you will miss some free kicks - but the interpretation would be the same at all parts of the ground
4 boundary umps - only allowed to over-rule blatantly obvious free kicks - like a mark is called but the Boundary Ump clearly sees it hit the turf before (not allowed to actually call a decision)
1 Ump in the ARC to overrule the blatantly obvious that we see on TV - overuling decisions only again
An over ruled decision results in a ball up.
Boundary Umpires can be part time
Central Umpires and ARC Umpires full time (with coaching together for the interpretations)
Minimal fuss - Umpires become beige again
PS But Muggins has no chance of being listened to - lol
(Well maybe in 10 years like the proposal for the draw/draft) - http://saintsational.net/viewtopic.php? ... &p=1232095
“Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever.”
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
- Sainter_Dad
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Re: Special Message to Curly
Oh Curly - where for art thou?
“Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever.”
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
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Re: Special Message to Curly
Not often we appear,to get the rub of the green. What were the frees for and against stats?
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Re: Special Message to Curly
SD - yep the stats are right there for all to see. When the claim is “St Kilda has always been screwed by the umps/AFL” I feel the greatest sample size is the one to go to for most accuracy.
Also I think your one central ump idea would be a disaster, they’d be 100m away from the play half the time!
And the reaction to the umpiring tonight again just reinforces my earlier points. +8 is the most lobsided count we’ve had all year, but where’s the outrage? Supporters don’t want “fair/balanced” umpiring, they want it weighted well and truly in their teams favour!
Also I think your one central ump idea would be a disaster, they’d be 100m away from the play half the time!
And the reaction to the umpiring tonight again just reinforces my earlier points. +8 is the most lobsided count we’ve had all year, but where’s the outrage? Supporters don’t want “fair/balanced” umpiring, they want it weighted well and truly in their teams favour!
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