How far off are we?
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- bigred
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Re: How far off are we?
No kidding.
But we dont have picks 1 to 5 do we. We dont have anyone tradeable that would generate one of those picks either.
So you work with what you have and pick the best available.
And dont sook about what the last bloke did six years back.
But we dont have picks 1 to 5 do we. We dont have anyone tradeable that would generate one of those picks either.
So you work with what you have and pick the best available.
And dont sook about what the last bloke did six years back.
"Now the ball is loose, it gives St. Kilda a rough chance. Black. Good handpass. Voss. Schwarze now, the defender, can run and from a long way".....
- The Fireman
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Re: How far off are we?
Having a bad one in a GF is better than not getting there at all, our up and down shockers make that look unlikely.CQ SAINT wrote: ↑Mon 27 Sep 2021 4:15pmYep. The doggies still look a fair way off and they just played one.The Fireman wrote: ↑Mon 27 Sep 2021 3:08pmuntil these type of performances are eradicated we will always be a long way off.spert wrote: ↑Mon 27 Sep 2021 1:36pmThat was a terrible result in what was a very important and winnable match to help us get into finals. We also blew the Adelaide game where we were looking good for a win, then our midfield went missing in the third quarter and blew it again. We almost lost to Collingwood after being miles in front. Our midfield in games seems to have brain fades too often.The Fireman wrote: ↑Mon 27 Sep 2021 11:45am I think back to Carlton beating us easily when I gauge how far we are off.
The Doggies have always looked likely.
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Re: How far off are we?
So we need another elite midfielder to partner Steele.
Could it be Clark or Gresham?
Clark, well we already know he is a talent. The broken jaw and two concussions will have knocked his confidence around, but confidence can be rebuilt. He needs to get running now so he can hit 2022 running. I’m not saying it is make or break this season, but if he doesn’t cement a spot in the starting midfield he may be forever consigned to being a skilled and talented half back.
Gresham. Well he’s a bit on the small size to be a midfield beast like Petracca or Oliver, but he has other attributes like vision and breakaway speed that are quite rare.
Both these guys have X-factor. They are creative and they are playmakers.
Let’s hope they get some continuity next season and can really showcase what they’ve got.
Could it be Clark or Gresham?
Clark, well we already know he is a talent. The broken jaw and two concussions will have knocked his confidence around, but confidence can be rebuilt. He needs to get running now so he can hit 2022 running. I’m not saying it is make or break this season, but if he doesn’t cement a spot in the starting midfield he may be forever consigned to being a skilled and talented half back.
Gresham. Well he’s a bit on the small size to be a midfield beast like Petracca or Oliver, but he has other attributes like vision and breakaway speed that are quite rare.
Both these guys have X-factor. They are creative and they are playmakers.
Let’s hope they get some continuity next season and can really showcase what they’ve got.
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Re: How far off are we?
Isn’t crouch and or Jones any good?!
Add to that
Gresham
Clark
Bytel
Ross
Billings
Hannebery
Add to that
Gresham
Clark
Bytel
Ross
Billings
Hannebery
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Re: How far off are we?
No doubt they are both good players. Are they elite is the question. Look, I think our midfield depth - at full strength - is pretty good, to be honest. The problem has been getting them on the park
- shanegrambeau
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Re: How far off are we?
Boyoo…it is a tad depressing to compare us to Melbourne or the Bulldogs. Are we better off than in October 2020 prognosis wise?
The only reason we might be is because perhaps Collingwood have dropped out and West Coast are down.
Carlton, I hope, will remain perennial disappointments , ditto Essendon.
But Melbourne showed us it can be done.
And the Bulldogs are too. They lost but they achieved a remarkable last gasp clash with Melbourne running back to the wall.
They hit it mid third quarter.
I worry about our team spirit at times too, something that WB and Melbourne never seem to lack.
We need to fix that..
The only reason we might be is because perhaps Collingwood have dropped out and West Coast are down.
Carlton, I hope, will remain perennial disappointments , ditto Essendon.
But Melbourne showed us it can be done.
And the Bulldogs are too. They lost but they achieved a remarkable last gasp clash with Melbourne running back to the wall.
They hit it mid third quarter.
I worry about our team spirit at times too, something that WB and Melbourne never seem to lack.
We need to fix that..
You're quite brilliant Shane, yeah..terrific!
- The_Dud
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Re: How far off are we?
We’ve got a bunch of Cs and a few possible Bs in the midfield at the moment, with Steele the only genuine A grader. We need 1, but ideally 2, more ‘Steeles’ in the middle, and I don’t think they’re are any candidates knocking down the door on our list atm.
Gotta throw as many darts as we can on high-draft-capital mids in the next few years as we can!
Gotta throw as many darts as we can on high-draft-capital mids in the next few years as we can!
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Re: How far off are we?
Who the hell has three Jack Steeles in the midfield
Get real man
You want three top 5 in the Brownlow AA midfielders at Steel’s level?
Have we got an extra 2M in our salary cap???
Is there COLA for living Bayside Melbourne???
I think Crouch, Gresham and Jones would not consider themselves C Grade players
We actually have 4 B&F winners in the midfield
They just need to be injury free and perform at their best
And we need Clark to get serious about his footy and get Flint hard fit!!!
Get real man
You want three top 5 in the Brownlow AA midfielders at Steel’s level?
Have we got an extra 2M in our salary cap???
Is there COLA for living Bayside Melbourne???
I think Crouch, Gresham and Jones would not consider themselves C Grade players
We actually have 4 B&F winners in the midfield
They just need to be injury free and perform at their best
And we need Clark to get serious about his footy and get Flint hard fit!!!
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Re: How far off are we?
Well said. Things aren’t as bleak as some would like to believe.B.M wrote: ↑Mon 27 Sep 2021 10:29pm Who the hell has three Jack Steeles in the midfield
Get real man
You want three top 5 in the Brownlow AA midfielders at Steel’s level?
Have we got an extra 2M in our salary cap???
Is there COLA for living Bayside Melbourne???
I think Crouch, Gresham and Jones would not consider themselves C Grade players
We actually have 4 B&F winners in the midfield
They just need to be injury free and perform at their best
And we need Clark to get serious about his footy and get Flint hard fit!!!
- bigred
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Re: How far off are we?
The run of injuries... or the run without injuries that Melbourne had this year is quite impressive.
"Now the ball is loose, it gives St. Kilda a rough chance. Black. Good handpass. Voss. Schwarze now, the defender, can run and from a long way".....
- The_Dud
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Re: How far off are we?
Voss - Black - AckerB.M wrote: ↑Mon 27 Sep 2021 10:29pm Who the hell has three Jack Steeles in the midfield
Get real man
You want three top 5 in the Brownlow AA midfielders at Steel’s level?
Have we got an extra 2M in our salary cap???
Is there COLA for living Bayside Melbourne???
I think Crouch, Gresham and Jones would not consider themselves C Grade players
We actually have 4 B&F winners in the midfield
They just need to be injury free and perform at their best
And we need Clark to get serious about his footy and get Flint hard fit!!!
Cousins - Judd - Kerr
Ablett - Bartel - Selwood
Lenny - Goddard - Dal
etc.
Yes I would like 3 guns in the middle please.
I don't care how players consider themselves (I doubt Dunstan considers himself C grade either) but none of them are A grade, Crouch and Jones (if he can stay fit) maybe B, Gresh hasn't done much in the middle and disposal is bad (ironically).
Clark looked the most promising to take the next step after 2020 but seemed to stagnate for various reasons this year.
Interesting you're worried about the salary cap when it comes to the midfield but are happy to spend $1M+ each on a couple of KPFs!
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Re: How far off are we?
My wife has a theory we laugh about as it sounds like something out of faulty towers, but it is actually true. It came about when at a saints game she asked who was our person. She follows Richmond and explained Dusty is their person.
It expanded from there, that you have a person(s) and but also need people . We decided that to win a premiership you need at least 1 person and many people. If you have 2 persons and manny people that is better but only having people wont get it done.
Looking at Saturday Melbourne had 3 persons - Petracca , Oliver Gawn and some people - May, Level, Salem, Fritsch,
WB only had 1 person - Bont, but more people - McRae, Treloer, Naughton, Libba, Daniel, Hunter
We have 1 person - Steele, and a few people - Crouch, King, Membrey,
We need another person - King most likely , but more people.
The only team we could come up with since 2000 not to have a person and win the flag was WB 2016.
It expanded from there, that you have a person(s) and but also need people . We decided that to win a premiership you need at least 1 person and many people. If you have 2 persons and manny people that is better but only having people wont get it done.
Looking at Saturday Melbourne had 3 persons - Petracca , Oliver Gawn and some people - May, Level, Salem, Fritsch,
WB only had 1 person - Bont, but more people - McRae, Treloer, Naughton, Libba, Daniel, Hunter
We have 1 person - Steele, and a few people - Crouch, King, Membrey,
We need another person - King most likely , but more people.
The only team we could come up with since 2000 not to have a person and win the flag was WB 2016.
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Re: How far off are we?
Clint Jones was our third midfielder in 09/10
How do you rate the following premiership Mids?
Brad Sewell
Kane Lambert
Keiran Jack
Cameron Ling
Mark Hutchins
Luke Ball (Collingwood)
I agree, I think you need a good midfield
I think we have the best two way mid in the game
I really rate Crouch and Jones gives plenty of drive
I think you underrate what Gresham can do, his ground level clearance work is
Elite!
If Hannebery can play 16+ games it gives quality and depth
I also rate our wingers
They have a specific role to play.
And obviously I rate our rucks! It’s where we beat the WB in 2020
How do you rate the following premiership Mids?
Brad Sewell
Kane Lambert
Keiran Jack
Cameron Ling
Mark Hutchins
Luke Ball (Collingwood)
I agree, I think you need a good midfield
I think we have the best two way mid in the game
I really rate Crouch and Jones gives plenty of drive
I think you underrate what Gresham can do, his ground level clearance work is
Elite!
If Hannebery can play 16+ games it gives quality and depth
I also rate our wingers
They have a specific role to play.
And obviously I rate our rucks! It’s where we beat the WB in 2020
- The_Dud
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Re: How far off are we?
I think Gresh could be an A-grade small forward, but not in the middle. Too small and kicking is no good, kicks everything up in the air across his body.
Crouch is solid but not a game-breaker, Jones can be exciting but too inconsistent, maybe he can turn that around.
Hannerbry isn't much more than handy depth at this point.
Crouch is solid but not a game-breaker, Jones can be exciting but too inconsistent, maybe he can turn that around.
Hannerbry isn't much more than handy depth at this point.
All posters are equal, but some posters are more equal than others.
- The Fireman
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Re: How far off are we?
Jones really impressed me later in the seasonThe_Dud wrote: ↑Tue 28 Sep 2021 12:02pm I think Gresh could be an A-grade small forward, but not in the middle. Too small and kicking is no good, kicks everything up in the air across his body.
Crouch is solid but not a game-breaker, Jones can be exciting but too inconsistent, maybe he can turn that around.
Hannerbry isn't much more than handy depth at this point.
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Re: How far off are we?
The midfield proved this year that without Paddy they are a bottom 8 outfit. No Paddy = no finals in 2022.B.M wrote: ↑Tue 28 Sep 2021 11:30am Clint Jones was our third midfielder in 09/10
How do you rate the following premiership Mids?
Brad Sewell
Kane Lambert
Keiran Jack
Cameron Ling
Mark Hutchins
Luke Ball (Collingwood)
I agree, I think you need a good midfield
I think we have the best two way mid in the game
I really rate Crouch and Jones gives plenty of drive
I think you underrate what Gresham can do, his ground level clearance work is
Elite!
If Hannebery can play 16+ games it gives quality and depth
I also rate our wingers
They have a specific role to play.
And obviously I rate our rucks! It’s where we beat the WB in 2020
What may happen though is RoMa could go up a gear with his tap work so that could help if that happens.
And Gresh is 2 things, potentially an established midfielder and also a body as reliable as Hanners. Still hasn't proven himself yet as a bona fide midfielder, that's three things.
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Re: How far off are we?
Rohan had that foot problem all year. He gets over that then his form should be back to what it was in 2020.
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Re: How far off are we?
We had both Paddy and Rowan miss large chunks of the year
Jones missed 10
Gresham Season
Clark got injured
Crouch first 3
Hannebery almost the season
Billings last few and played half a dozen injured
Never at any stage did we have our full compliment
Melbourne did for most of the season
Better run with injury
Progression of Clark, Gresham, Bytel and Byrnes
Grab Sonsie with our first pick
I’m bullish
Jones missed 10
Gresham Season
Clark got injured
Crouch first 3
Hannebery almost the season
Billings last few and played half a dozen injured
Never at any stage did we have our full compliment
Melbourne did for most of the season
Better run with injury
Progression of Clark, Gresham, Bytel and Byrnes
Grab Sonsie with our first pick
I’m bullish
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Re: How far off are we?
Keeping a team mostly free of major injury for a season- especially gun players, is a big key. If Oliver, and/ or Petracca spent weeks on the sidelines, Melbourne would have been back in the pack for sure. Gresh will probably spend most of his time in the forward half when he returns as the nature of his injury means he will lose a little burst speed, but he's not that fast anyway. We need to get elite disposal by foot into the midfield, as although Steele is our top mid, his kicking doesn't penetrate, same for Crouch- Jones can have his days but needs more consistency, like so many of our list.
Looking at the finals, you could see the quality of foot disposal is a step above ours by the top 4 teams in overall field kicking to position- kick long, hit targets. I think these Saints have top level foot skills that can break lines(in no particular order): Sincs, Kent, Connolly, Bytel, Billings, maybe Byrnes, and I struggle after that to be honest.
Looking at the finals, you could see the quality of foot disposal is a step above ours by the top 4 teams in overall field kicking to position- kick long, hit targets. I think these Saints have top level foot skills that can break lines(in no particular order): Sincs, Kent, Connolly, Bytel, Billings, maybe Byrnes, and I struggle after that to be honest.
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Re: How far off are we?
Stop it BM, don't overcook me this far from round 1.B.M wrote: ↑Tue 28 Sep 2021 1:21pm We had both Paddy and Rowan miss large chunks of the year
Jones missed 10
Gresham Season
Clark got injured
Crouch first 3
Hannebery almost the season
Billings last few and played half a dozen injured
Never at any stage did we have our full compliment
Melbourne did for most of the season
Better run with injury
Progression of Clark, Gresham, Bytel and Byrnes
Grab Sonsie with our first pick
I’m bullish
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Re: How far off are we?
Gresham is a dead certainty to play in the midfield this season
And there will be a special role for him
And there will be a special role for him
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Re: How far off are we?
Inside extractor with a dual outside breakaway role. He and Jones will be integral in this space getting fast movement out to Hill, Billings, Sinclair and Connolly.
He and Steele will also be looking to increase their impact on the scoreboard.
Last edited by CQ SAINT on Tue 28 Sep 2021 2:29pm, edited 1 time in total.
- The Fireman
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Re: How far off are we?
stop it...
you're making me look forward to next season already.
- Sanctorum
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Re: How far off are we?
I'm with you bigcarl, when everyone is fully fit and they're at their peak St Kilda's midfield is not far off the pace - in addition to Steele, Crouch is close to elite and Jones is an absolute bull with plenty of dash. Develop Clark in the pre-season to play midfield, add Gresham to that mix and we have a bloody strong group to win a majority of clearances.
Sharman is a younger and taller version of Melbourne sharpshooter Fritsch capable of a 50 goals season which gives the opportunity for Membrey to play behind the ball at CHB if required.
Max Heath is the Joker in the pack, I expect him to be a fast developer like Melbourne's young Luke Jackson (already played 30 games at 19 in just his 2nd season), only bigger!
On this basis St Kilda is not far off at all......
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Re: How far off are we?
I’m with you. We need some luck as Melbourne had this year … and a good start to the season is crucial.Sanctorum wrote: ↑Tue 28 Sep 2021 5:01pmI'm with you bigcarl, when everyone is fully fit and they're at their peak St Kilda's midfield is not far off the pace - in addition to Steele, Crouch is close to elite and Jones is an absolute bull with plenty of dash. Develop Clark in the pre-season to play midfield, add Gresham to that mix and we have a bloody strong group to win a majority of clearances.
Sharman is a younger and taller version of Melbourne sharpshooter Fritsch capable of a 50 goals season which gives the opportunity for Membrey to play behind the ball at CHB if required.
Max Heath is the Joker in the pack, I expect him to be a fast developer like Melbourne's young Luke Jackson (already played 30 games at 19 in just his 2nd season), only bigger!
On this basis St Kilda is not far off at all......
Can we win one over the next few seasons? Well if a club in my lifetime as hopeless as Melbourne can, then of course we can!