How many players on our list fit the standard of a top four team?

[whiskers3614]

It's all about who can be depended on when the whips get cracking. You don't have to be an elite talent (Geary, for example), but it's about energy, effort at all times, the commitment to team first, and ball use/decision-making. An AFL standard player doing all those things is what the coaches are looking for. Jason Blake is a fine example. Never elite, but when it was hot in kitchen he never let his coach down.

So on that basis it would have to be a NO for Hill?

[CURLY]

It's all about who can be depended on when the whips get cracking. You don't have to be an elite talent (Geary, for example), but it's about energy, effort at all times, the commitment to team first, and ball use/decision-making. An AFL standard player doing all those things is what the coaches are looking for. Jason Blake is a fine example. Never elite, but when it was hot in kitchen he never let his coach down.

So on that basis it would have to be a NO for Hill?

Three premierships suggest otherwise.

[whiskers3614]

It's all about who can be depended on when the whips get cracking. You don't have to be an elite talent (Geary, for example), but it's about energy, effort at all times, the commitment to team first, and ball use/decision-making. An AFL standard player doing all those things is what the coaches are looking for. Jason Blake is a fine example. Never elite, but when it was hot in kitchen he never let his coach down.

So on that basis it would have to be a NO for Hill?

Three premierships suggest otherwise.

Yes and in 2015 I was 80kgs and now 125!
The first line in the post I was quoting said "who can depended on when the whips get cracking", if you think that has applied to Hill (at St kilda) you are delusional!

[shanegrambeau]

It's all about who can be depended on when the whips get cracking. You don't have to be an elite talent (Geary, for example), but it's about energy, effort at all times, the commitment to team first, and ball use/decision-making. An AFL standard player doing all those things is what the coaches are looking for. Jason Blake is a fine example. Never elite, but when it was hot in kitchen he never let his coach down.

So on that basis it would have to be a NO for Hill?

Three premierships suggest otherwise.

Yes, I think that is what is being suggested.

As if a Jason Daniels will be a 1.5 million dollar player and Hills fee wouldn’t buy you a house in Koo-Wee—Rup.

Matter of fact, if I’m serious, I’d say only Marshall and Hill would get a gig in a top four team right now, mid season, starting 22.

Steele might be a sub.

[CURLY]

It's all about who can be depended on when the whips get cracking. You don't have to be an elite talent (Geary, for example), but it's about energy, effort at all times, the commitment to team first, and ball use/decision-making. An AFL standard player doing all those things is what the coaches are looking for. Jason Blake is a fine example. Never elite, but when it was hot in kitchen he never let his coach down.

So on that basis it would have to be a NO for Hill?

Three premierships suggest otherwise.

Yes, I think that is what is being suggested.

As if a Jason Daniels will be a 1.5 million dollar player and Hills fee wouldn’t buy you a house in Koo-Wee—Rup.

Matter of fact, if I’m serious, I’d say only Marshall and Hill would get a gig in a top four team right now, mid season, starting 22.

Steele might be a sub.

[The_Dud]

Steele would start in every midfield in the comp, no question, ridiculous to think otherwise.

[Scollop]

It's all about who can be depended on when the whips get cracking. You don't have to be an elite talent (Geary, for example), but it's about energy, effort at all times, the commitment to team first, and ball use/decision-making. An AFL standard player doing all those things is what the coaches are looking for. Jason Blake is a fine example. Never elite, but when it was hot in kitchen he never let his coach down.

I don’t agree. I remember Jason doing a lot of good things, but in a critical moment when he had a job to defend or to spoil and punch the ball through for a point, he wasn’t as dependable as he should have been. His job in that first GF in 2010 was as a defender. We had Gardiner, King and Kossie rucking that day. Jason played predominantly on Chris Dawes.

If Blake smothered the pill in the goal square when Trav Cloke gave Collingwood the lead in the dying minutes (straight after BJ marked that beautiful speccie) I’d agree with you, but unfortunately he couldn’t stop Dawes from winning the loose ball, or stop him from hanballing it out, or stop Cloke from kicking the goal. After, that we controlled the ball but only managed to kick a point to make it a draw.

If my recollection of events is wrong, happy to be corrected and change my perception of that moment

[whiskers3614]

Don't reckon Blake ever dogged a contest!

[BadRossco]

Probably only Steele and Marshall would get a game in every other side with Billings, Hill and Clarke a big chance for most teams and King, Coffield , Horward, Membery and Crouch would slot in somewhere and if Paton recovers from such a serious injury he would also be in the mix the rest could struggle as they are injury prone, past it or ball butchers.

[B.M]

So you reckon our 10th best player is not as good as Jason Castagna? Or Jake Arts?!

Seriously!!!

On Blake, all players lose contests occasionally and their opponents get a kick... that’s football!... pretty sure he won more contests than he lost, even in the GFs
Really good honest player was Neill

[Teflon]

After this bewildering start to 2021, our minds start to wonder just what is the level of talent we have assembled in recent years. How many players, WHEN FIT, can we depend on to deliver against a top four team in a big game

I'll rank them in order of being able to deliver. See what you think

1. Steele
2. Ryder
3. Hannebery
4. Marshall
5. Howard
6. Membrey
7. Paton
8. Wilkie
9. Billings
10.Geary
11. Clark
12. Crouch
13. Jones
14. Butler
15. Gresham
16. Ross
17. King
18. Coffield
19. Higgins
29. Hill
21. Battle
22.. Carlisle
23. Sinclair
24. Long
24. Webster
25. Lonie

Without listing all I can say with confidence that when you need a player to step up and take the game by the neck when we are being pumped by ANY side the following are way down this list

Hill
Billings
Lonie
Butler
Ross
Sinclair

Ones who lift
Steele
Marshall

Tryers
Gears
Paton
Jones
Howard
Wilkie

Rest blow with the wind
We lack class and depth

[Scollop]

Teflon,

Pretty harsh on Clark. He's class imo. Maybe you forgot about him.

I have faith in Clark. I reckon he'll have the skill and the strength and the timing right in another 12 months.

The previous number 11 also took a few years didn't he?

Another uninterrupted preseason on the weights and he'll be ready to fulfil his potential

[takeaway]

It's all about who can be depended on when the whips get cracking. You don't have to be an elite talent (Geary, for example), but it's about energy, effort at all times, the commitment to team first, and ball use/decision-making. An AFL standard player doing all those things is what the coaches are looking for. Jason Blake is a fine example. Never elite, but when it was hot in kitchen he never let his coach down.

I don’t agree. I remember Jason doing a lot of good things, but in a critical moment when he had a job to defend or to spoil and punch the ball through for a point, he wasn’t as dependable as he should have been. His job in that first GF in 2010 was as a defender. We had Gardiner, King and Kossie rucking that day. Jason played predominantly on Chris Dawes.

If Blake smothered the pill in the goal square when Trav Cloke gave Collingwood the lead in the dying minutes (straight after BJ marked that beautiful speccie) I’d agree with you, but unfortunately he couldn’t stop Dawes from winning the loose ball, or stop him from hanballing it out, or stop Cloke from kicking the goal. After, that we controlled the ball but only managed to kick a point to make it a draw.

If my recollection of events is wrong, happy to be corrected and change my perception of that moment

I can't recall Blake ever losing a contest due to lack of effort. I was right near the Cloke goal in the 2010 GF, and Blake was not involved. As I recall quite a simple goal, bit of luck for Collingwood as the ball actually fell into Dawes' hands after a marking duel, and Gwilt was the wrong side of Cloke - non goal side. Couldn't have been smothered really. In the marking contest, the player manning Dawes at the time should have punched instead of trying to mark. The player was the bloke who had just kicked one of the great Saints goals - BJ.

[B.M]

Clarke doesn’t need weights

He needs to run!

He needs to lose weight IMO and become an elite runner to be an elite player

[saynta]

Clarke doesn’t need weights

He needs to run!

He needs to lose weight IMO and become an elite runner to be an elite player

Dropping the E off his name might help.

[B.M]

Yeah, that’s important

HTF would we know who I’m talking about?!

Perhaps I’m talking Jordan Clarke from Geelong on a Saints forum.

Perhaps he is just Clark too??

Not sure

[Scollop]

It's all about who can be depended on when the whips get cracking. You don't have to be an elite talent (Geary, for example), but it's about energy, effort at all times, the commitment to team first, and ball use/decision-making. An AFL standard player doing all those things is what the coaches are looking for. Jason Blake is a fine example. Never elite, but when it was hot in kitchen he never let his coach down.

I don’t agree. I remember Jason doing a lot of good things, but in a critical moment when he had a job to defend or to spoil and punch the ball through for a point, he wasn’t as dependable as he should have been. His job in that first GF in 2010 was as a defender. We had Gardiner, King and Kossie rucking that day. Jason played predominantly on Chris Dawes.

If Blake smothered the pill in the goal square when Trav Cloke gave Collingwood the lead in the dying minutes (straight after BJ marked that beautiful speccie) I’d agree with you, but unfortunately he couldn’t stop Dawes from winning the loose ball, or stop him from hanballing it out, or stop Cloke from kicking the goal. After, that we controlled the ball but only managed to kick a point to make it a draw.

If my recollection of events is wrong, happy to be corrected and change my perception of that moment

I can't recall Blake ever losing a contest due to lack of effort. I was right near the Cloke goal in the 2010 GF, and Blake was not involved. As I recall quite a simple goal, bit of luck for Collingwood as the ball actually fell into Dawes' hands after a marking duel, and Gwilt was the wrong side of Cloke - non goal side. Couldn't have been smothered really. In the marking contest, the player manning Dawes at the time should have punched instead of trying to mark. The player was the bloke who had just kicked one of the great Saints goals - BJ.

Oooooops

I was thinking of '09.
I didn't want to put myself through the pain again but ...

I just watched the replay (last few minutes) of both the 2010 and 2009.

Don't think it was effort from any one that was the issue ( for some reason I always thought it was Jason that could have done more, but I stand corrected)


We had Chips, Raf, Joe Blake, Lenny and Bakes in that goal square and none of them could stop Chappy.

[Vortex]

We have heaps of top four standard players. They just are all down on confidence at the moment.