Too short and too weak

[perfectionist]

With the exceptions of the captain and the full back, direct opponents were either taller or stronger in the contest last night. Melbourne still lack skills which accounted for the closeness of the scores at various stages. Had we been a bit smarter in the second half of the second quarter, we might have been ever closer, but probably not enough to change the outcome. And we don't have a lot of additional height and strength to bring in. The top two ruckman will replace two tall players, and both are more mobile around the ground, especially Roma. No doubt, two big pluses. Crouch has more strength and a bit more height. But that's about it. Our players looked tired right from the start, and a few looked like they were about to keel over in the last quarter. We laid a lot of tackles in the first quarter - which is good in one way, but it also means that the opposition are getting the ball first. And I think that was our major problem - at least against last night's opposition, who seem to be in the top 6 at the moment. We are probably in the next 6, but that's about where we were last year and the shorter quarters suited us.

I note that the Saints website has the final scores as:
ST KILDA 3.2 6.3 8.4 12.19 (91)
MELBOURNE 3.4 6.7 9.13 11.7 (73)
If only wins were that easy.

[ROLS-LEE]

our turn overs with the inability to hit a target is what hurt us. Melbourne scored against us due to this.

[Joffa Burns]

Agree, we were short in the back half as Highmore is clearly flanker size and strength not KPP and Hunter and McKernan are not AFL standard and therefore ineffective.

If our game plan was to bomb it to Gawn, May & Lever we executed brilliantly.

[longtimesaint]

Gawn had a picnic against our make shift rucks and it gave them a midfield dominance.
You rarely win games of football when the midfield are beaten.
It means the ball is constantly being pumped forward putting the defence under extreme pressure creating turnovers.
This was compounded by the players looking flat and lacking run which is probably due to last weeks slog on a wet ground.

[Teflon]

our turn overs with the inability to hit a target is what hurt us. Melbourne scored against us due to this.

Correct
We had the game on our terms early second and looked like we would run away with it - I agree we looked shorter and less physical inside but our run outside was hurting them but up to that point we actually managed to hit a target ! After that it was like a completely different team took the field, Benny Hill music playing in their ears, while they decided to go comical with decision making and disposal. The mistakes were putrid and Brad Hill (bennys bro) was the ringleader.

I noticed Gawn dropping back deep in our forward 50 which negated our ability to deliver the ball deep, 20-30 out for our smalls (Lonie Buttler etc) to get to work. That meant we couldn’t bomb and had to hit a target going inside 50 and proved we lack skill/smarts here.

Ryder and Marshall simply change our team structure and game style considerably but that also shows how reliant our style is on them.

But still that’s no excuse for AFL footballers at times under little pressure constantly turning it over and when the whole team surges you get burnt on the rebound.

We were right in that game 2nd quarter and blew it
Very disappointing on a big night for our club.

[Moods]

I agree with both sentiments. Against the good teams we seem undersized last year, ie Cats, West Coast in particular. I also think that playing three small forwards is a very risky game plan. Clearly our ruck stocks are not up to AFL standard at the moment. There is nothing we can do about that at the moment. My frustration as I expressed last week is why is highmore still playing ahead of Carlisle? Carlisle is 200 cm tall and is suited to playing on the big key position players. I know Highmore is far more mobile than Carlisle But the opposition key forwards are getting way too many set shots at goal.

King looked like he was about to take the game apart in the first quarter. Then inexplicably drifted out of the game. I’m hoping that it was just fatigue. In the last quarter we had several opportunities to score and kick the ball out on the full or like what Jones did just ran in and kicked a point showing zero composure.

We were undisciplined in giving away stupid free kicks particularly in marking contests which adds credence that we are undersized. Coffield pushing Mcdonald in the back in a marking contest comes to mind. We seemed slightly fatigued and slightly undersized, contributing to our poor skill on the night and our smashing in the ruck.

[bigcarl]

This deserves its own thread, but I will start it here.

Carlisle should be playing, even if he is selfish and has a poor attitude.

He’d be better in the ruck and add more up forward than what we put up last night.

Given Ryder’s unavailability and Marshall’s injury, surely we can find a spot for a talented big man.

If he is not prepared to play those roles, the club should stand him down.

[Sanctorum]

This deserves its own thread, but I will start it here.

Carlisle should be playing, even if he is selfish and has a poor attitude.

He’d be better in the ruck and add more up forward than what we put up last night.

Given Ryder’s unavailability and Marshall’s injury, surely we can find a spot for a talented big man.

If he is not prepared to play those roles, the club should stand him down.

It wouldn't surprise me if the hype pre-game around "Spud's Game", that would have prevailed throughout last week was a big factor in the lack of intensity and poor disposal skills in last night's loss to Melbourne. The expectations were sky high!

A significant stat from the game is that Higgins, Lonie and Butler polled 31, 27 and 26 respectively last night and so had zero impact when you'd expect them to feature in the top 12.

With St Kilda favoured to win, this to me was by far the worst loss under Brett Ratten's tenure and I expect will serve as a major wake-up call to the players.

I agree that while Ryder and Marshall are unavailable Carlisle must play because as many have mentioned, the St Kilda defence, despite the good work by Howard and Wilkie, was undersized and forced Coffield to play tall when in effect he is normally a major driving force from half-back.

[skeptic]

The Carlisle situation is fast turning into a joke

Not playing him is messing with our structure and his form was warranting selection

[Teflon]

The Carlisle situation is fast turning into a joke

Not playing him is messing with our structure and his form was warranting selection

Has there been anything from Ratten on why be won’t play him ??

[saynta]

The Carlisle situation is fast turning into a joke

Not playing him is messing with our structure and his form was warranting selection

Has there been anything from Ratten on why be won’t play him ??

Was named as an emergency in both games so far, so can't be that far off.

[bigcarl]

The Carlisle situation is fast turning into a joke

Not playing him is messing with our structure and his form was warranting selection

Has there been anything from Ratten on why be won’t play him ??

Was named as an emergency in both games so far, so can't be that far off.

So was Roberton last season. He played Rd 1 and was emergency thereafter. So it doesn’t necessarily ease my concerns

[B.M]

Don’t think Ratts sees him anymore than a back up for Howard.

[Moods]

Don’t think Ratts sees him anymore than a back up for Howard.

He’s quite clearly out of favour. Wasn’t getting a game in the practice games and a bloke that we brought in supposedly as a backup in case we got injuries was suddenly our first choice defender. There is something amiss but I guess it’s not his job to fill our supporters in on the ins and outs of what’s occurring in the inner sanctum. Bloody frustrating as a few years ago Carlise was our boom recruit, now he can’t get a game!

[sendmehomehappy]

Carlisle's situation needs sorting out this week. Surely he either plays and does what he is told for the team, or they f$#@ him off,

Getting Lonie out of the team adds 10 cm straight away.

It will be great to get Marshall and Ryder back, but we don't want to force the issue for the former's longevity and the latter is 33 and needs to be managed so we can get the best from him at the pointy end of the season, and please, please, 1-2 seasons more.

What the hell is Alabakis up to? Is he that far from it? Why not blood him against Essendon if fit and see what he can do and give him a taste. 211cm would help to solve some height issues.

Finally, we should have a few good picks in the mid-year draft.

[B.M]

Height is never an issue in footy

Ability is

To quote a sensible person
If you’re good enough, you’re tall enough!

[SaintPav]

Maybe Jake isn't quite ready yet though he has been named an emergency.

Sounds like Ratts is holding him back. Treat them mean, keep them keen.

We were into Keath big time remember. He’d be handy now.

[B.M]

Keath is almost exactly like Carlisle

A tall defender who doesn’t like an opponent

[Devilhead]

Lets just play Clavarino ...... either he is good enough or he is isnt ...... its time to find out!!!

[Otiman]

Height is never an issue in footy

Ability is

To quote a sensible person
If you’re good enough, you’re tall enough!

Tell that to all the Higgins vs May one on ones in the air.

[SaintPav]

Keath is almost exactly like Carlisle

A tall defender who doesn’t like an opponent

Sure but at least a he’s a bit more mobile.

[oboe]

I hope that it was a bit of both. We were undersized, yes, but after the GWS game, we looked incredibly flat.

Too easy to throw the baby out with the bathwater, but we need Marshall, and Ryder back in the team.

Crouch will help, but if you have two rucks like Hunter, and McKernan, you are up against it from the opening bounce.

Winning the ball at ground level against winning rucks from the other side means more effort and energy.

I thought that we would beat Melbourne, but we didn't. A game that got away.

But I'm not calling of 2021 for a long way yet.

[B.M]

Why would Higgins be opposed to May?

That’s just a mismatch that’s occurred in the game, they weren’t opponents. May was opposed to King.

On a May and Higgins one on one
What if the ball was kicked 20m in front of them or it was on the ground, who’s more dangerous in that situation?

That’s more a delivery method problem rather than match up issue.

[Scollop]

I think the thread title is describing one of our players. I'm pretty certain that " Too short and too weak " summarises Jack Lonie

[Crossy66]

Carlisle's situation needs sorting out this week. Surely he either plays and does what he is told for the team, or they f$#@ him off,

Getting Lonie out of the team adds 10 cm straight away.

It will be great to get Marshall and Ryder back, but we don't want to force the issue for the former's longevity and the latter is 33 and needs to be managed so we can get the best from him at the pointy end of the season, and please, please, 1-2 seasons more.

What the hell is Alabakis up to? Is he that far from it? Why not blood him against Essendon if fit and see what he can do and give him a taste. 211cm would help to solve some height issues.

Finally, we should have a few good picks in the mid-year draft.

I have arrived at the conclusion that Carlisle must be serving a club imposed ban. Nothing else makes sense. We are undersized down back and have 2 blokes in the ruck that shouldnt be playing and they still refuse to pick him.
Btw, I dont think Alabakis will ever be a footballer at vfl level . Forget Afl.