Paddy, fit and symptom free.
Moderators: Saintsational Administrators, Saintsational Moderators
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 1295
- Joined: Mon 17 Oct 2011 7:19pm
- Has thanked: 612 times
- Been thanked: 398 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
Meanwhile, back in the real world.
Paddy McCartin will never play AFL footy ever again. For any club.
Concussion is a very serious, life altering injury. People on this forum might not think it is but they are wrong.
Shaun Smith, who played for North Melbourne and Melbourne in the late 80s and 90s, was recently paid just over $1.4 million after his insurance company found he was "totally and permanently disabled" from the brain injuries acquired during his career.
In February, of this year, doctors confirmed the first case of chronic traumatic encephalopathy (CTE) in an AFL player, 64-year-old former Geelong champion Graham "Polly" Farmer.
Former St Kilda captain Danny Frawley was found to have been suffering from CTE when he died suddenly last year.
Now do you get it? Probably not. You’re welcome,
Paddy McCartin will never play AFL footy ever again. For any club.
Concussion is a very serious, life altering injury. People on this forum might not think it is but they are wrong.
Shaun Smith, who played for North Melbourne and Melbourne in the late 80s and 90s, was recently paid just over $1.4 million after his insurance company found he was "totally and permanently disabled" from the brain injuries acquired during his career.
In February, of this year, doctors confirmed the first case of chronic traumatic encephalopathy (CTE) in an AFL player, 64-year-old former Geelong champion Graham "Polly" Farmer.
Former St Kilda captain Danny Frawley was found to have been suffering from CTE when he died suddenly last year.
Now do you get it? Probably not. You’re welcome,
- kosifantutti
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 8581
- Joined: Fri 21 Jan 2005 9:06am
- Location: Back in town
- Has thanked: 526 times
- Been thanked: 1527 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/for ... 55z35.html
According to the article a panel of experts have cleared him to play but I’ll wait to hear what the resident doctors at Saintsational have got to say.
According to the article a panel of experts have cleared him to play but I’ll wait to hear what the resident doctors at Saintsational have got to say.
Macquarie Dictionary Word of the Year for 2023 "Kosi Lives"
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 4243
- Joined: Thu 25 Mar 2004 2:47pm
- Location: incarnate
- Has thanked: 286 times
- Been thanked: 694 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
Ok I'll kick off.kosifantutti wrote: ↑Fri 25 Sep 2020 5:44pm https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/for ... 55z35.html
According to the article a panel of experts have cleared him to play but I’ll wait to hear what the resident doctors at Saintsational have got to say.
It won't work. He won't have a footy career and it would endanger Paddy in the long term to put him back in the AFL .
Have a look at what the Danny Frawley story tells us about long term affects of concussion.
Nee!
- ace
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 10733
- Joined: Sun 16 Dec 2007 3:28pm
- Location: St Kilda
- Has thanked: 30 times
- Been thanked: 819 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
Pi55 off Paddy.
You might find that Bains still loves you go and list clog the Bulldogs
You might find that Bains still loves you go and list clog the Bulldogs
The more you know, the more you know you don't know.
When I was a young child, I knew that I knew so much about so much.
Now that I am old and know so much more, I know that I know so much about so little, and so little about so much.
If you are not engaging AI actively and aggressively, you are doing it wrong.
You are not going to lose your job to AI.
You are going lose your job to somebody who uses AI.
Your company is not going to go out of business because of AI.
Your company is going to go out of business because another company used AI.
- Jensen Huang, CEO of NVIDIA
When I was a young child, I knew that I knew so much about so much.
Now that I am old and know so much more, I know that I know so much about so little, and so little about so much.
If you are not engaging AI actively and aggressively, you are doing it wrong.
You are not going to lose your job to AI.
You are going lose your job to somebody who uses AI.
Your company is not going to go out of business because of AI.
Your company is going to go out of business because another company used AI.
- Jensen Huang, CEO of NVIDIA
- The_Dud
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 13781
- Joined: Sun 27 May 2007 9:53pm
- Location: Bendigo
- Has thanked: 1313 times
- Been thanked: 2051 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
I think the brain is a lot more complicated than black and white. Even the experts can't accurately say what will happen with something they know both so much yet so little about, including CTE. They're discovering more about it constantly.kosifantutti wrote: ↑Fri 25 Sep 2020 5:44pm https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/for ... 55z35.html
According to the article a panel of experts have cleared him to play but I’ll wait to hear what the resident doctors at Saintsational have got to say.
Anyone who watched Paddy play knows his body isn't up to it, no body's fault, move on with your life.
All posters are equal, but some posters are more equal than others.
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 526
- Joined: Wed 16 Sep 2020 8:23pm
- Has thanked: 23 times
- Been thanked: 55 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
Sorry to say kosi but this really is a stupid post from a Saintsational Legend IMHO. McCartin is one bad knock to the head away from permanent brain damage. If he ever plays AFL footy again he is an idiot. If we draft him again we are completely off our treekosifantutti wrote: ↑Fri 25 Sep 2020 5:44pm https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/for ... 55z35.html
According to the article a panel of experts have cleared him to play but I’ll wait to hear what the resident doctors at Saintsational have got to say.
- kosifantutti
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 8581
- Joined: Fri 21 Jan 2005 9:06am
- Location: Back in town
- Has thanked: 526 times
- Been thanked: 1527 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
Four doctors in 45 minutes. Not bad.
Now I don’t know who to believe.
“ But after an AFL panel of concussion experts gave him the all clear last November”
“ The clearance to keep the prospect of football alive came after an AFL panel of concussion experts assessed McCartin's situation.”
“ He estimates he's had 10 scans at the Florey Institute between 2016 and 2019 and his brain was declared fit after his most recent scan.”
"They [concussion experts] have said to me is that at the time it was a significant injury and significant in terms of symptoms and how I was feeling but they also said that with the right treatment and the right processes in place that it would all subside and that it would all go back to normal."
Now I don’t know who to believe.
“ But after an AFL panel of concussion experts gave him the all clear last November”
“ The clearance to keep the prospect of football alive came after an AFL panel of concussion experts assessed McCartin's situation.”
“ He estimates he's had 10 scans at the Florey Institute between 2016 and 2019 and his brain was declared fit after his most recent scan.”
"They [concussion experts] have said to me is that at the time it was a significant injury and significant in terms of symptoms and how I was feeling but they also said that with the right treatment and the right processes in place that it would all subside and that it would all go back to normal."
Macquarie Dictionary Word of the Year for 2023 "Kosi Lives"
- The_Dud
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 13781
- Joined: Sun 27 May 2007 9:53pm
- Location: Bendigo
- Has thanked: 1313 times
- Been thanked: 2051 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
Where can I find the expert’s iron-clad diagnosis on why he was so susceptible to concussions in the first place from even the slightest knock?kosifantutti wrote: ↑Fri 25 Sep 2020 6:37pm Four doctors in 45 minutes. Not bad.
Now I don’t know who to believe.
“ But after an AFL panel of concussion experts gave him the all clear last November”
“ The clearance to keep the prospect of football alive came after an AFL panel of concussion experts assessed McCartin's situation.”
“ He estimates he's had 10 scans at the Florey Institute between 2016 and 2019 and his brain was declared fit after his most recent scan.”
"They [concussion experts] have said to me is that at the time it was a significant injury and significant in terms of symptoms and how I was feeling but they also said that with the right treatment and the right processes in place that it would all subside and that it would all go back to normal."
All posters are equal, but some posters are more equal than others.
- Devilhead
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 8375
- Joined: Mon 08 Mar 2004 11:56pm
- Has thanked: 137 times
- Been thanked: 1169 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
Gillon McLachlan, Kevin Bartlett, Luke Darcy, Steve Hocking, Glen Jakovich, Chris Johnson, Cameron Ling, Matthew Richardson and Warren Tredrea.kosifantutti wrote: ↑Fri 25 Sep 2020 6:37pm “ The clearance to keep the prospect of football alive came after an AFL panel of concussion experts assessed McCartin's situation.”
Was his brain inside or outside of his body?kosifantutti wrote: ↑Fri 25 Sep 2020 6:37pm “ He estimates he's had 10 scans at the Florey Institute between 2016 and 2019 and his brain was declared fit after his most recent scan.”
Until the next hit on his headkosifantutti wrote: ↑Fri 25 Sep 2020 6:37pm "They [concussion experts] have said to me is that at the time it was a significant injury and significant in terms of symptoms and how I was feeling but they also said that with the right treatment and the right processes in place that it would all subside and that it would all go back to normal."
![Shocked :shock:](./images/smilies/icon_eek.gif)
The Devil makes work for idle hands!!!
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 536
- Joined: Wed 14 Sep 2011 8:33pm
- Location: not victoria
- Has thanked: 12 times
- Been thanked: 76 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
"Routine clinical imaging is typically not indicated in sports-related concussion.
Per the American Association of Neurology and the American Medical Society of Sports Medicine Guidelines, in concussion, imaging should only be performed if there are concerns regarding skull fracture, intracranial hemorrhage, or other intracranial pathology based on clinical exam.
There are many studies today that may lead to important diagnostic and prognostic neuroimaging biomarkers that will assist in the diagnosis of brain alterations associated with concussion and that indicate those who are most at risk for adverse outcomes. This information will become available clinically over the next decade.
Screening for clinical neuroimaging biomarkers will likely become important in ensuring adequate positive and negative predictive values and to maintain cost-effectiveness.
While some neuroimaging exams may be appropriate in the acute phase of injury, many will likely be more appropriate in the subacute or chronic phases, and timing of scan will depend on clinical presentation."
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/eut ... d=29157852
what this means?: there is no imaging modality at this time that can rule out early and permanent brain injury that will lead to a diagnosis of chronic traumatic encephalopathy
Per the American Association of Neurology and the American Medical Society of Sports Medicine Guidelines, in concussion, imaging should only be performed if there are concerns regarding skull fracture, intracranial hemorrhage, or other intracranial pathology based on clinical exam.
There are many studies today that may lead to important diagnostic and prognostic neuroimaging biomarkers that will assist in the diagnosis of brain alterations associated with concussion and that indicate those who are most at risk for adverse outcomes. This information will become available clinically over the next decade.
Screening for clinical neuroimaging biomarkers will likely become important in ensuring adequate positive and negative predictive values and to maintain cost-effectiveness.
While some neuroimaging exams may be appropriate in the acute phase of injury, many will likely be more appropriate in the subacute or chronic phases, and timing of scan will depend on clinical presentation."
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/eut ... d=29157852
what this means?: there is no imaging modality at this time that can rule out early and permanent brain injury that will lead to a diagnosis of chronic traumatic encephalopathy
the invisible and the non existent look very much alike
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 10598
- Joined: Tue 14 Jun 2005 7:04pm
- Location: North
- Has thanked: 1011 times
- Been thanked: 1055 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
Would just be monumentally stupid for him to return to AFL, both by him and the club. Hard to let go of a dream maybe..... then there’s the issue of even if he is fit and injury free, can he command a spot in the team. His output when he was fit was not inspiring.
- skeptic
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 16879
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 7:10pm
- Has thanked: 3579 times
- Been thanked: 2842 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
Has he even played at any level in the last 2 years?
The issue at hand is if he can get through games without getting more concussions which remains unanswered through no fault of his own.
It would be insane to recruit him if he went from getting injured frequently to being on the sidelines for two years not playing and hasn’t demonstrated that he can hit multiple contests and get through
The issue at hand is if he can get through games without getting more concussions which remains unanswered through no fault of his own.
It would be insane to recruit him if he went from getting injured frequently to being on the sidelines for two years not playing and hasn’t demonstrated that he can hit multiple contests and get through
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 6415
- Joined: Fri 18 Sep 2020 6:51am
- Has thanked: 854 times
- Been thanked: 1012 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
Bytel hadn't played at any level for 2 years and look how he came in and cemented his spot as an A grade midfielder from the get-go.
- Otiman
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 8584
- Joined: Thu 28 Jul 2005 11:09pm
- Location: Elsewhere
- Has thanked: 191 times
- Been thanked: 614 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
And that's the meat of the story. The sheer number of concussions and the ease at which they happened would need a huge change in behaviour and awareness to overcome.
The outcome is one of two things:
1. Too tentative
2. More concussions
- bigred
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 11463
- Joined: Tue 09 Mar 2004 7:39am
- Has thanked: 25 times
- Been thanked: 609 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
Not convinced.
"Now the ball is loose, it gives St. Kilda a rough chance. Black. Good handpass. Voss. Schwarze now, the defender, can run and from a long way".....
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 11546
- Joined: Sun 11 Sep 2011 2:26pm
- Has thanked: 3519 times
- Been thanked: 2464 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
Neither am I. This is what I'd like to know and ...
What's his 3km time trial numbers? His times for repeat 400m sprints?
What's his skin folds? Can he bench press more than Skunk or RoMa?
Get him to also sign some waivers re insurance/possible reoccurrence of concussion
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 6415
- Joined: Fri 18 Sep 2020 6:51am
- Has thanked: 854 times
- Been thanked: 1012 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
Ok Pollop let me have a go at this one...is it half serious?Scollop wrote: ↑Sat 26 Sep 2020 3:42amNeither am I. This is what I'd like to know and ...
What's his 3km time trial numbers? His times for repeat 400m sprints?
What's his skin folds? Can he bench press more than Skunk or RoMa?
Get him to also sign some waivers re insurance/possible reoccurrence of concussion
-
- SS Life Member
- Posts: 3119
- Joined: Sun 27 Mar 2005 8:29pm
- Has thanked: 9 times
- Been thanked: 66 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
‘...if they have given me the all clear to get back and play and they reckon I am at no greater risk then I'd be stupid not to," McCartin said...’
He’s been given the all clear by doctors and the AFL, he’s got the support of his family according to the article too, so I don’t blame him for wanting to play.
As someone mentioned above the main risk with getting Paddy on a list is whether he has a condition that makes him more susceptible to concussions, as he appeared to in the past. If he can get some doctors to give him that tick of approval and he can pass all the fitness stuff why not.
He could clearly play, he was held back by injury, playing in a below average team under a coach who encouraged him to crash packs and put his body on the line.
He’s been given the all clear by doctors and the AFL, he’s got the support of his family according to the article too, so I don’t blame him for wanting to play.
As someone mentioned above the main risk with getting Paddy on a list is whether he has a condition that makes him more susceptible to concussions, as he appeared to in the past. If he can get some doctors to give him that tick of approval and he can pass all the fitness stuff why not.
He could clearly play, he was held back by injury, playing in a below average team under a coach who encouraged him to crash packs and put his body on the line.
- Joffa Burns
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 7081
- Joined: Tue 09 Mar 2004 5:48pm
- Has thanked: 1871 times
- Been thanked: 1570 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
If Paddy considers the advice and chooses to play I hope he is given another shot at it, preferably not at St Kilda.
From what I saw I don’t think Paddy had the athleticism and endurance for the modern game and I don’t think he’d fit Ratten’s game style. A couple of years on the side lines is not going to assist his areas of deficiency.
Good luck to the lad but would prefer we don’t RE-draft him.
From what I saw I don’t think Paddy had the athleticism and endurance for the modern game and I don’t think he’d fit Ratten’s game style. A couple of years on the side lines is not going to assist his areas of deficiency.
Good luck to the lad but would prefer we don’t RE-draft him.
Proudly assuming the title of forum Oracle and serving as the inaugural Saintsational ‘weak as piss brigade’ President.
- asiu
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 10313
- Joined: Thu 08 Apr 2010 8:11pm
- Has thanked: 1327 times
- Been thanked: 932 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
park him in the square
prospect/rider from a pocket
the racehorse and battle work the half forward line
lonie ‘n that EX richmond dude can earn their keep
kent can run back ‘n forward on one side
whilst hill can work the other
why doesn’t that work
prospect/rider from a pocket
the racehorse and battle work the half forward line
lonie ‘n that EX richmond dude can earn their keep
kent can run back ‘n forward on one side
whilst hill can work the other
why doesn’t that work
![Image](http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_iUpoNBZyaBc/R0zVk-1LCZI/AAAAAAAAAg0/9eeT7D6cnaA/s320/compass-blu-265x220.gif)
.name the ways , thought manipulates the State of Presence away.
.tipara waranta kani nina-tu.
- asiu
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 10313
- Joined: Thu 08 Apr 2010 8:11pm
- Has thanked: 1327 times
- Been thanked: 932 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
actually
see ya later lonie
ta for the draft picks
i forgot members
see ya later lonie
ta for the draft picks
i forgot members
![Image](http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_iUpoNBZyaBc/R0zVk-1LCZI/AAAAAAAAAg0/9eeT7D6cnaA/s320/compass-blu-265x220.gif)
.name the ways , thought manipulates the State of Presence away.
.tipara waranta kani nina-tu.
-
- SS Life Member
- Posts: 3119
- Joined: Sun 27 Mar 2005 8:29pm
- Has thanked: 9 times
- Been thanked: 66 times
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
The above mentioned are fixable with hard work. And game plans change yearly as lists change. He’s older and despite what he’s been through still wants to play. So you’d reckon he’s willing to do whatever it takes.Joffa Burns wrote: ↑Sat 26 Sep 2020 9:51am ....From what I saw I don’t think Paddy had the athleticism and endurance for the modern game and I don’t think he’d fit Ratten’s game style. A couple of years on the side lines is not going to assist his areas of deficiency.
The Saints have invested a lot in Paddy... the question is do we give him an opportunity to repay what we’ve invested or do we cut our losses despite the possibility that he could be very valuable.
I’d not like to be making that decision.
- samoht
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 5817
- Joined: Sun 14 Mar 2004 10:45am
- Location: https://www.amazon.com.au/Fugitive-Sold ... B00EO1GCNK
- Has thanked: 598 times
- Been thanked: 447 times
- Contact:
Re: Paddy, fit and symptom free.
Bains and Elshaug should be putting him through his paces right now ... see if he comes through for them.