Jordans last dance & Jerry Krause some parallels to

[Vazelos]

I have a passion for list building & recruiting performed this in the round ball code.

I am watching the Jordan "Last Dance" series along with the rest of the world I found the relationships with the GM Jerry Krause riveting to watch.
The Player power & egos against the GM Jerry Krause and Jerry Reinsdorf.

Krause did well to build the teams in the 90s that won 6 Championships around the genius of Jordan and his double act Scottie Pippen.
Through his eventual hate of coach Phil Jackson & resentment towards the players he chose to break the team down after 1998 and rebuild to form a new era.
Ofcourse it never happened, they have never won before Jordan nor after & its been 22 years since the 6th and last champoiosnhip.
That team could have gone on to win another 1 or 2 championships maybe more.
Krause had some wins in the 90s started believing he had the ability to do it over and over again he was wrong.
He ended up leaving basketball and finished off a scout of baseball in his later years!!

This takes me back to our strategy under Watters & Pelchan era.
Pelchan had the reputation for building the hawks list but depends who you ask how much of that work was truly his & how much was others nevertheless he formed a part of that team that built the next great hawks team.

He comes to us and formulates a decision for us to trade out key football personnel & rebuild by falling down the ladder grabbing draft picks initially then topping up free agency to build a premiership list.
We traded out players like Ben Mc Evoy, Brendon Goddard, Nick Dal Santo etc
It didn't work, many of our draft picks were average or failures we ended up bottoming out and losing momentum so much in fact we are lucky to fill half of Marvel stadium these days at home games.
It took us years to finally luck out with a rookie in Marshall to replace him I wouldn't be trading out a young excellent ruckman again in hurry ever again.
We are very very lucky Riewoldt was a loyal person and didn't take the Magpies offer we would have lost our soul and brand if he walked out of the door.

I don't think you should ever trade out quality players or characters unless they are just past their prime and its a team/list balance balance decision & only 1 not multiple.
Bottoming out destroys the business this arrogance I have done it once i can do it again shows so many things have to go right to completely nail it when you have it keep it as long as you can because rebuilding is very very hard.

We are only now starting to see light at the end of the tunnel with our list & with a new Moorabbin & some finals appearances we can build our club back to a strong position.

[The_Dud]

Jordan is the ultimate winner. He bases his whole life and personality around it and backs it up.

Krause is/was overflowing with ‘small man syndrome’. Why get rid of the best players/coach (in this case, of all time for both) in the off chance of finding the next big thing?

Same how I never understood people happy to trade a top 5 draft talent for a 3rd or 4th rounder a couple of years later.

[Vazelos]

Krause got rid of them because he believed he could do it again in his little mind his arrogance got to a level he thought I can replace Jordan Pippen the coach and everyone he was deluded!!
We thought the same- we trade out an elite ruckman before his prime (because we are not in the premiership window we dont need him right now that is what they were thinking) trade out Goddard and Dal Santo and we go through the draft.
How many have we really nailed in the draft?
Last few years have been much better but for 5/6 years it was very bad.
8/9 years in footy without finals is a very long time we cant afford to miss out too much longer.

[ausfatcat]

I think Jordan was done anyway, and Pippen had half a foot out the door as well, but the Phil Jackson axing was just unbelievable why would you give a coach who (at that stage) had 5 of the last 7 Champions a one year extension announce it was his last for a new coach?

Would be interesting to hear Jerry's side of it thou.

[The_Dud]

I think Jordan was done anyway, and Pippen had half a foot out the door as well, but the Phil Jackson axing was just unbelievable why would you give a coach who (at that stage) had 5 of the last 7 Champions a one year extension announce it was his last for a new coach?

Would be interesting to hear Jerry's side of it thou.

Yep, and then went on and won what, another 5, with the Lakers.

Clearly could still coach!

[BarryGrogan]

How many have we really nailed in the draft?

That's the whole issue right there.

The strategy is Ok in theory. But it's a complete failure if you don't nail any A-Graders from the draft picks you collected.

And that's unfortunately what happened to us.

Loading up on draft picks in compromised drafts isn't ideal.

[BarryGrogan]

Krause got rid of them because he believed he could do it again in his little mind his arrogance got to a level he thought I can replace Jordan Pippen the coach and everyone he was deluded!!

It was pretty ironic wasn't it.

He was hell bent on making sure everyone knew that the Bulls' success wasn't down to any individual, and that it was due to the whole organisation. He was adamant that the egotistical players that claimed 100% of the credit were wrong.

Which to some degree, he was right.

But he took this narrative so far as to cut off his nose to spite his face. He was so desperate to prove that he was right, that his own ego took over, and the whole thing fell apart. His ego was what brought it undone.

Fascinating sports story.

[aaron82]

The McEvoy trade is an interesting one. I could be wrong but I believe he was one year away from being a restricted free agent when he was unwillingly traded.

In my opinion, at the time our salary cap was still at the absolute maximum due to poor governance around the 2007-2011 period. At this stage McEvoy was still slowly developing in a side that was on the way to the bottom part of the ladder. McEvoy had no top 10 finishes in the b&f so he held no currency should a club try and take him as a free agent. Hawthorn were desperate for a ruckman to replace Hale whilst being at the pointy end and no doubt would have been able to offer more $$$$ as well as the opportunity to play in a top side. Our only currency would be to offer the captaincy but less money than other clubs.

We cashed our chips in I believe taking Savage and a draft pick around 18-20 as it was better than what we would have received 12 months later. Hawks were desperate to land him at that time.

I don’t know if that is the case or if it were the right decision. Hopefully we continue developing Marshall into an elite ruckman

[ausfatcat]

I don't have a problem with the trades during that period (except maybe McEvoy), I have a problem with the drafting from those trades except maybe the factor it was compromised drafts changing the landscape.

Which is what also the bulls did first rounder for Kerr anther for Longley (strange he hasn't appeared in the doco considering he was their starter centre) and unbelievably a second rounder for Pippin but did nothing with those picks, If 2 of their 4 first round picks in 98 and 99 landed on good talent might have been a different story.


Oh I left out them releasing Rodman top rebounder for the previous year for nothing that was a pretty amazing.