GWS private ownership - article on afl.com.au

[saintspremiers]

https://www.afl.com.au/news/391084/priv ... ing-giants

Notice the website allowing this article to be published??

Maybe this is Gilligan’s hidden agenda pushed by his lovechild team??

How would this model work??

Would AB or a Saints consortium take control of us as well??

Finnis still loves China - but Chinese investment in Australia is now very strictly controlled by FIRB

[Secret Kiel]

I wouldn't have thought this possible before COVID-19, however could private ownership put the survival of weak Melbourne clubs at risk.

It's why this new model concerns me. Is it now possible under the new model for the AFL to close down or merge clubs without a vote from members.

I've listened to Matt Finniss talk about how there is great risk for our survival under the new model. That shouldn't be the case if all 18 clubs are under a shared risk, shared reward model. Does it means if the AFL gets in trouble it reserves the right to cut clubs at it's discretion. Aleast under the old socialist distribution model we had some control as the market was shared.

A private owner of GWS could be like the old pricks at Carlton back in the 80s and demand we be made extinct.

Time for Finniss to explain the new model in detail and explain the risks and benefits with respect to the old model.

I'm still not understanding two things, why we haven't tried to secure our own line of credit, and why the members haven't been invited into the process with a discussion and debate.

Finnis constantly claims the club is owned by the members but that can't be true if he is making a significant change to the control of the club without a vote.

[WellardSaint]

https://www.afl.com.au/news/391084/priv ... ing-giants

Notice the website allowing this article to be published??

Maybe this is Gilligan’s hidden agenda pushed by his lovechild team??

How would this model work??

Would AB or a Saints consortium take control of us as well??

Finnis still loves China - but Chinese investment in Australia is now very strictly controlled by FIRB

Oh please.
Strictly controlled?
A large Chinese company is buying the company that owns Pura Milk, Big M, and other brands.
It's a fait accompli.
Despite Christian Porter's statement that we'll be tougher on China, nothing changes.
The FIRB is as weak as p***.
They sign off on everything, just rubber stamp it.
I don't think they've ever knocked one back or asked for amendment, apart from last year- Japan's Asahi brewers paid $16bil for CUB, which was actually owned by US firm that owns Budweiser, Annheiser, etc

FIRB is a damn toothless tiger.

[saintspremiers]

I wouldn't have thought this possible before COVID-19, however could private ownership put the survival of weak Melbourne clubs at risk.

It's why this new model concerns me. Is it now possible under the new model for the AFL to close down or merge clubs without a vote from members.

I've listened to Matt Finniss talk about how there is great risk for our survival under the new model. That shouldn't be the case if all 18 clubs are under a shared risk, shared reward model. Does it means if the AFL gets in trouble it reserves the right to cut clubs at it's discretion. Aleast under the old socialist distribution model we had some control as the market was shared.

A private owner of GWS could be like the old pricks at Carlton back in the 80s and demand we be made extinct.

Time for Finniss to explain the new model in detail and explain the risks and benefits with respect to the old model.

I'm still not understanding two things, why we haven't tried to secure our own line of credit, and why the members haven't been invited into the process with a discussion and debate.

Finnis constantly claims the club is owned by the members but that can't be true if he is making a significant change to the control of the club without a vote.

How can we secure our own line of credit?

Do we put up RSEA Park as security??

That’s not going to go far, and I doubt we’d get a 3.3% interest loan if we did it ourselves either. We are the AFL’s little bitch now - if we weren’t already, we are totally their lap dog now.

[asiu]

if you were in my trench ,
i think i’d have you shot

every comment is straight to worst case scenario
or that person leading is a muppet

on second thoughts
i would

[BarryGrogan]

I wouldn't have thought this possible before COVID-19, however could private ownership put the survival of weak Melbourne clubs at risk.

I just don't know WTF would buy such a s*** product?

They bleed money and make losses year after year.

[Secret Kiel]

I wouldn't have thought this possible before COVID-19, however could private ownership put the survival of weak Melbourne clubs at risk.

I just don't know WTF would buy such a s*** product?

They bleed money and make losses year after year.

How many other businesses made $50 million net profit in 2019.

[BarryGrogan]

I wouldn't have thought this possible before COVID-19, however could private ownership put the survival of weak Melbourne clubs at risk.

I just don't know WTF would buy such a s*** product?

They bleed money and make losses year after year.

How many other businesses made $50 million net profit in 2019.

Who made $50m net profit?

[wally]

If some rich person came along and wanted to buy StKFC I wonder what the reaction from the supporter base would be?

[samuraisaint]

Anybody remember the 80s Brisbane Bears and Sydney Swans?

And that was when times were pretty good - right now we are probably headed for another Great Depression...

[Secret Kiel]

I wouldn't have thought this possible before COVID-19, however could private ownership put the survival of weak Melbourne clubs at risk.

I just don't know WTF would buy such a s*** product?

They bleed money and make losses year after year.

How many other businesses made $50 million net profit in 2019.

Who made $50m net profit?

I can post a link or you can just type 'AFL 2019 profit' into Google.

Let's just accept that's how much of a cash cow the AFL is and jump right back into the convo.

Bazza I'm perplexed over this one, I'm sure in time our over active brains might conclude what just the hell is going on but right now it's got me stuffed why all the panic and demand for complete contol of all 18 clubs if they are underwritten by a franchise that is one of the most profitable businesses in Oz.

Right now the NRL are getting slammed by their media partners for being poor business managers, I get the sense we aren't in any better shape if our CEO has gone on the record to say even with this new business model and loan arrangement our survival hangs in the balance.

[BarryGrogan]

I wouldn't have thought this possible before COVID-19, however could private ownership put the survival of weak Melbourne clubs at risk.

I just don't know WTF would buy such a s*** product?

They bleed money and make losses year after year.

How many other businesses made $50 million net profit in 2019.

Who made $50m net profit?

I can post a link or you can just type 'AFL 2019 profit' into Google.

Let's just accept that's how much of a cash cow the AFL is and jump right back into the convo.

Bazza I'm perplexed over this one, I'm sure in time our over active brains might conclude what just the hell is going on but right now it's got me stuffed why all the panic and demand for complete contol of all 18 clubs if they are underwritten by a franchise that is one of the most profitable businesses in Oz.

Right now the NRL are getting slammed by their media partners for being poor business managers, I get the sense we aren't in any better shape if our CEO has gone on the record to say even with this new business model and loan arrangement our survival hangs in the balance.

The AFL is a cash cow.

But aren't they spruiking private ownership of clubs? Clubs are money pits.

[Joffa Burns]

I wouldn't have thought this possible before COVID-19, however could private ownership put the survival of weak Melbourne clubs at risk.

I just don't know WTF would buy such a s*** product?

They bleed money and make losses year after year.

How many other businesses made $50 million net profit in 2019.

Who made $50m net profit?

I can post a link or you can just type 'AFL 2019 profit' into Google.

Let's just accept that's how much of a cash cow the AFL is and jump right back into the convo.

Bazza I'm perplexed over this one, I'm sure in time our over active brains might conclude what just the hell is going on but right now it's got me stuffed why all the panic and demand for complete contol of all 18 clubs if they are underwritten by a franchise that is one of the most profitable businesses in Oz.

Right now the NRL are getting slammed by their media partners for being poor business managers, I get the sense we aren't in any better shape if our CEO has gone on the record to say even with this new business model and loan arrangement our survival hangs in the balance.

The AFL is a cash cow.

But aren't they spruiking private ownership of clubs? Clubs are money pits.

I believe the AFL and clubs receive tax concession or are exempt.
Surely as a privately owned entity this would be revoked by the ATO.

Also AFL made 6% profit last year, hardly killing it on revenue of $800M with little or no competition in their field.

[asiu]

there’d be a lot of ‘killing’ going on to get that profit down to 6% from 800 big ones wouldn’t there !!!

money for old rope

[Secret Kiel]

I wouldn't have thought this possible before COVID-19, however could private ownership put the survival of weak Melbourne clubs at risk.

I just don't know WTF would buy such a s*** product?

They bleed money and make losses year after year.

How many other businesses made $50 million net profit in 2019.

Who made $50m net profit?

I can post a link or you can just type 'AFL 2019 profit' into Google.

Let's just accept that's how much of a cash cow the AFL is and jump right back into the convo.

Bazza I'm perplexed over this one, I'm sure in time our over active brains might conclude what just the hell is going on but right now it's got me stuffed why all the panic and demand for complete contol of all 18 clubs if they are underwritten by a franchise that is one of the most profitable businesses in Oz.

Right now the NRL are getting slammed by their media partners for being poor business managers, I get the sense we aren't in any better shape if our CEO has gone on the record to say even with this new business model and loan arrangement our survival hangs in the balance.

The AFL is a cash cow.

But aren't they spruiking private ownership of clubs? Clubs are money pits.

I believe the AFL and clubs receive tax concession or are exempt.
Surely as a privately owned entity this would be revoked by the ATO.

Also AFL made 6% profit last year, hardly killing it on revenue of $800M with little or no competition in their field.

I'm curious JB, against the backdrop of the recession/depression we have just commenced, what is your definition of a strong balance sheet.

Is the AFL recession/depression proof.

[samuraisaint]

https://www.afl.com.au/news/391084/priv ... ing-giants

Notice the website allowing this article to be published??

Maybe this is Gilligan’s hidden agenda pushed by his lovechild team??

How would this model work??

Would AB or a Saints consortium take control of us as well??

Finnis still loves China - but Chinese investment in Australia is now very strictly controlled by FIRB

Oh please.
Strictly controlled?
A large Chinese company is buying the company that owns Pura Milk, Big M, and other brands.
It's a fait accompli.
Despite Christian Porter's statement that we'll be tougher on China, nothing changes.
The FIRB is as weak as p***.
They sign off on everything, just rubber stamp it.
I don't think they've ever knocked one back or asked for amendment, apart from last year- Japan's Asahi brewers paid $16bil for CUB, which was actually owned by US firm that owns Budweiser, Annheiser, etc

FIRB is a damn toothless tiger.

Pura Milk is currently owned by Lion Nathan and has been for years - a huge Japanese multinational company which is also known as Kirin - the Japanese zaibatsu.

[WellardSaint]

https://www.afl.com.au/news/391084/priv ... ing-giants

Notice the website allowing this article to be published??

Maybe this is Gilligan’s hidden agenda pushed by his lovechild team??

How would this model work??

Would AB or a Saints consortium take control of us as well??

Finnis still loves China - but Chinese investment in Australia is now very strictly controlled by FIRB

Oh please.
Strictly controlled?
A large Chinese company is buying the company that owns Pura Milk, Big M, and other brands.
It's a fait accompli.
Despite Christian Porter's statement that we'll be tougher on China, nothing changes.
The FIRB is as weak as p***.
They sign off on everything, just rubber stamp it.
I don't think they've ever knocked one back or asked for amendment, apart from last year- Japan's Asahi brewers paid $16bil for CUB, which was actually owned by US firm that owns Budweiser, Annheiser, etc

FIRB is a damn toothless tiger.

Pura Milk is currently owned by Lion Nathan and has been for years - a huge Japanese multinational company which is also known as Kirin - the Japanese zaibatsu.

Ok, you're correct.
Chinese giant Mengniu now owns the products, paid $600mil to Kirin, I saw an article dated 21 Feb where the ACCC cleared the buy.

Back in Nov 2019, the FIRB rubber stamped it

[Joffa Burns]

I wouldn't have thought this possible before COVID-19, however could private ownership put the survival of weak Melbourne clubs at risk.

I just don't know WTF would buy such a s*** product?

They bleed money and make losses year after year.

How many other businesses made $50 million net profit in 2019.

Who made $50m net profit?

I can post a link or you can just type 'AFL 2019 profit' into Google.

Let's just accept that's how much of a cash cow the AFL is and jump right back into the convo.

Bazza I'm perplexed over this one, I'm sure in time our over active brains might conclude what just the hell is going on but right now it's got me stuffed why all the panic and demand for complete contol of all 18 clubs if they are underwritten by a franchise that is one of the most profitable businesses in Oz.

Right now the NRL are getting slammed by their media partners for being poor business managers, I get the sense we aren't in any better shape if our CEO has gone on the record to say even with this new business model and loan arrangement our survival hangs in the balance.

The AFL is a cash cow.

But aren't they spruiking private ownership of clubs? Clubs are money pits.

I believe the AFL and clubs receive tax concession or are exempt.
Surely as a privately owned entity this would be revoked by the ATO.

Also AFL made 6% profit last year, hardly killing it on revenue of $800M with little or no competition in their field.

I'm curious JB, against the backdrop of the recession/depression we have just commenced, what is your definition of a strong balance sheet.

Is the AFL recession/depression proof.

Good question to ask a bogan who dropped out of school at 15 after failing form 3.
My answer is I assume each industry is different but the principal of what debt can be leveraged against the balance sheet is the critical factor.

For me it is based around banking covenants and debt to equity and debt service ratios and retained earnings. I understand these ratios in my field but have no clue what they look like in a sporting environment or for any industry outside of my direct experience.

Is the AFL recession proof, well logic says not now as they have just borrowed a reported $600M against their principal asset, however I would suggest a Govt bailout would always be on the cards.

IMO there is a massive chance of clubs merging or relocating over the next few years, not through any knowledge, only my thoughts.

[samuraisaint]

https://www.afl.com.au/news/391084/priv ... ing-giants

Notice the website allowing this article to be published??

Maybe this is Gilligan’s hidden agenda pushed by his lovechild team??

How would this model work??

Would AB or a Saints consortium take control of us as well??

Finnis still loves China - but Chinese investment in Australia is now very strictly controlled by FIRB

Oh please.
Strictly controlled?
A large Chinese company is buying the company that owns Pura Milk, Big M, and other brands.
It's a fait accompli.
Despite Christian Porter's statement that we'll be tougher on China, nothing changes.
The FIRB is as weak as p***.
They sign off on everything, just rubber stamp it.
I don't think they've ever knocked one back or asked for amendment, apart from last year- Japan's Asahi brewers paid $16bil for CUB, which was actually owned by US firm that owns Budweiser, Annheiser, etc

FIRB is a damn toothless tiger.

Pura Milk is currently owned by Lion Nathan and has been for years - a huge Japanese multinational company which is also known as Kirin - the Japanese zaibatsu.

Ok, you're correct.
Chinese giant Mengniu now owns the products, paid $600mil to Kirin, I saw an article dated 21 Feb where the ACCC cleared the buy.

Back in Nov 2019, the FIRB rubber stamped it

I only knew because I worked at Pura Milk - back when they were the club sponsor - back then we used to play the St Kilda players in a Christmas Party cricket match! One of the guys I worked with was an ex-St Kilda player!

[Secret Kiel]

I wouldn't have thought this possible before COVID-19, however could private ownership put the survival of weak Melbourne clubs at risk.

I just don't know WTF would buy such a s*** product?

They bleed money and make losses year after year.

How many other businesses made $50 million net profit in 2019.

Who made $50m net profit?

I can post a link or you can just type 'AFL 2019 profit' into Google.

Let's just accept that's how much of a cash cow the AFL is and jump right back into the convo.

Bazza I'm perplexed over this one, I'm sure in time our over active brains might conclude what just the hell is going on but right now it's got me stuffed why all the panic and demand for complete contol of all 18 clubs if they are underwritten by a franchise that is one of the most profitable businesses in Oz.

Right now the NRL are getting slammed by their media partners for being poor business managers, I get the sense we aren't in any better shape if our CEO has gone on the record to say even with this new business model and loan arrangement our survival hangs in the balance.

The AFL is a cash cow.

But aren't they spruiking private ownership of clubs? Clubs are money pits.

I believe the AFL and clubs receive tax concession or are exempt.
Surely as a privately owned entity this would be revoked by the ATO.

Also AFL made 6% profit last year, hardly killing it on revenue of $800M with little or no competition in their field.

I'm curious JB, against the backdrop of the recession/depression we have just commenced, what is your definition of a strong balance sheet.

Is the AFL recession/depression proof.

Good question to ask a bogan who dropped out of school at 15 after failing form 3.
My answer is I assume each industry is different but the principal of what debt can be leveraged against the balance sheet is the critical factor.

For me it is based around banking covenants and debt to equity and debt service ratios and retained earnings. I understand these ratios in my field but have no clue what they look like in a sporting environment or for any industry outside of my direct experience.

Is the AFL recession proof, well logic says not now as they have just borrowed a reported $600M against their principal asset, however I would suggest a Govt bailout would always be on the cards.

IMO there is a massive chance of clubs merging or relocating over the next few years, not through any knowledge, only my thoughts.

I have a cousin like you, he was also an illiterate bogan that was encouraged to drop out of school early but then went on to be a trucking magnate. Not bad for someone that couldn't read or write.

My interpretation of a strong balance sheet in the context of the recession/depression we have just entered is one that has uninterrupted and/or continuous cash flow and collateral, but collateral will be useless if you lose your cashflow, so just cashflow.

So until restrictions are lifted the AFL still has continuous cash flow in the form of automatic monthly membership payments. However some cash flow has been interrupted due to the obvious revenue sources we know like loss of media rights, sponsorship and gate takings. So cashflow is still continuous with some interruption. This is against the backdrop of businesses that went to zero cashflow a few weeks ago.

So whilst the AFL has lost millions per week in cash flow, it is still receiving millions of dollars per week in cash flow. The interrupted cash flow has been offset by operational costs being significantly slashed with player payments being the biggest outgoing which will reduce by another 25% in 4 weeks time.

With the future funds, the line of credit from NAB and ANZ, as well as considerable government financial support, the AFL have got the funds to keep servicing player paymemts and other outgoings for the remainder of 2020.

Assuming all restrictions are lifted by the end of 2020, could you mount an argument the AFLs cash flow will be back normal by the start of 2021?

If the answer is the yes then come 2021 isnt the AFL still as profitable as it was in 2019 and shouldn't that then mean there is no need to merge or relocate clubs. I think you could be right JB, the AFL will use COVID-19 as an excuse to kill off a Melbourne club or merge or relocate and that is why I'd like to hear more from the club about why we can't remain independent. And JB why aren't members being asked to vote on what is significant issues facing our survival.