If ever you wanted to know what Riewoldt was ...

[Saintmatt]

... really thinking about our previous coaching regime, then read this - https://www.sen.com.au/news/2019/08/29/ ... -riewoldt/

Some salient points:-

“I loved Brett Ratten’s comments after the game on the weekend against Sydney,”

“He’s had enough of guys that can’t finish their work. So, skills and execution being an excuse has been an excuse down at the Saints for far too long and this is long overdue, someone coming out and saying it and hopefully having the courage to follow through on it."

Read between the lines and he was hating the constant skill errors as much as the fans and then the excuses put up for them (and the ongoing acceptance of mediocrity)

And the young players he makes particular mention of being the nucleus - "Hunter Clark, Nick Coffield and Rowan Marshall" and "Jack Billings, Jade Gresham, Max King". Note the first 3 were barely or rarely played by the previous regime

[Special]

Richo leaving and then hopefully helping the Dees flounder like us is a double bonus

[Special]

Richo leaving and then hopefully helping the Dees flounder like us is a double bonus

[Saintmatt]

Richo leaving and then hopefully helping the Dees flounder like us is a double bonus

"flounder" further ...

[outside66]

... really thinking about our previous coaching regime, then read this - https://www.sen.com.au/news/2019/08/29/ ... -riewoldt/

Some salient points:-

“I loved Brett Ratten’s comments after the game on the weekend against Sydney,”

“He’s had enough of guys that can’t finish their work. So, skills and execution being an excuse has been an excuse down at the Saints for far too long and this is long overdue, someone coming out and saying it and hopefully having the courage to follow through on it."

Read between the lines and he was hating the constant skill errors as much as the fans and then the excuses put up for them (and the ongoing acceptance of mediocrity)

And the young players he makes particular mention of being the nucleus - "Hunter Clark, Nick Coffield and Rowan Marshall" and "Jack Billings, Jade Gresham, Max King". Note the first 3 were barely or rarely played by the previous regime

I don't think that's really accurate or that fair tbh.

Clark played 15 last year and 14 this year (not a bad total for a 2nd year player)
Marshall played 1 game in his rookie year, 12 in his second, and 20 this year (most of the year under Richo)
Coffield played 10 last year and 8 this year (our backline wasn't our weakness this year and some players need to build up through the VFL, and when brought into the senior team he finally found his feet)

[Saintmatt]

... really thinking about our previous coaching regime, then read this - https://www.sen.com.au/news/2019/08/29/ ... -riewoldt/

Some salient points:-

“I loved Brett Ratten’s comments after the game on the weekend against Sydney,”

“He’s had enough of guys that can’t finish their work. So, skills and execution being an excuse has been an excuse down at the Saints for far too long and this is long overdue, someone coming out and saying it and hopefully having the courage to follow through on it."

Read between the lines and he was hating the constant skill errors as much as the fans and then the excuses put up for them (and the ongoing acceptance of mediocrity)

And the young players he makes particular mention of being the nucleus - "Hunter Clark, Nick Coffield and Rowan Marshall" and "Jack Billings, Jade Gresham, Max King". Note the first 3 were barely or rarely played by the previous regime

I don't think that's really accurate or that fair tbh.

Clark played 15 last year and 14 this year (not a bad total for a 2nd year player)
Marshall played 1 game in his rookie year, 12 in his second, and 20 this year (most of the year under Richo)
Coffield played 10 last year and 8 this year (our backline wasn't our weakness this year and some players need to build up through the VFL, and when brought into the senior team he finally found his feet)

Fair enough. But disagree. Coffield has been languishing at Sandy whilst Newnes played 125 in a row. Don't think he might've been worth a run in place of him (or Savage) just to get some games in or at least, find out whether he was up to it?

Marshall? Puhleeeez. Cho selected Pierce ahead of Marshall in R1 and it was only because of Lewis' concussion that Marshall got a run thereafter. Marshall is the ultimate accidental find of the year.

If you've watched much of Sandy - you'll know that the VFL team is utter shite and no one learns anything down there. It's abominable.

[BarryGrogan]

Cho was terrified of 'coach killing blowouts', so he picked senior guys who he trusted more to not let that happen.

It of course meant we couldn't win either - but at least the 100 point thrashings were restricted, right?

[Saintmatt]

Cho was terrified of 'coach killing blowouts', so he picked senior guys who he trusted more to not let that happen.

It of course meant we couldn't win either - but at least the 100 point thrashings were restricted, right?

It would be hard to refute that hypothesis.

To be fair to Cho - we probably couldn't win a whole heap with the lack of star power on our list but putting up with the same old; same old each week - and excusing or not addressing the absolutely woeful skill level - is what Roo is referring to.

We've clearly had a reticence to drop, trade, upskill the ball butchers we all know and 'love' and as a result - lulled ourselves into accepting what we've got re: W / L

[The Recruit]

... really thinking about our previous coaching regime, then read this - https://www.sen.com.au/news/2019/08/29/ ... -riewoldt/

Some salient points:-

“I loved Brett Ratten’s comments after the game on the weekend against Sydney,”

“He’s had enough of guys that can’t finish their work. So, skills and execution being an excuse has been an excuse down at the Saints for far too long and this is long overdue, someone coming out and saying it and hopefully having the courage to follow through on it."

Read between the lines and he was hating the constant skill errors as much as the fans and then the excuses put up for them (and the ongoing acceptance of mediocrity)

And the young players he makes particular mention of being the nucleus - "Hunter Clark, Nick Coffield and Rowan Marshall" and "Jack Billings, Jade Gresham, Max King". Note the first 3 were barely or rarely played by the previous regime

I don't think that's really accurate or that fair tbh.

Clark played 15 last year and 14 this year (not a bad total for a 2nd year player)
Marshall played 1 game in his rookie year, 12 in his second, and 20 this year (most of the year under Richo)
Coffield played 10 last year and 8 this year (our backline wasn't our weakness this year and some players need to build up through the VFL, and when brought into the senior team he finally found his feet)

Fair enough. But disagree. Coffield has been languishing at Sandy whilst Newnes played 125 in a row. Don't think he might've been worth a run in place of him (or Savage) just to get some games in or at least, find out whether he was up to it?

Marshall? Puhleeeez. Cho selected Pierce ahead of Marshall in R1 and it was only because of Lewis' concussion that Marshall got a run thereafter. Marshall is the ultimate accidental find of the year.

If you've watched much of Sandy - you'll know that the VFL team is utter shite and no one learns anything down there. It's abominable.

Agree

Marshall was an absolute Fluke...how many games did we have to watch Longer be terrible. It was only injury that gave Marshall a chance.
Coff was not even on the radar and Richo was playing Armitage int he HBF, JESUS!
Hunter Clark was disgruntled at his lack of time in the middle which was bin gifted to guys that were showing nothing. Hunter was played out of position which was stifling his development.

As i have stated many times. Richo was a safe coach who did not have the ability to take a risk or see beyond the obvious. He played like that and coached like that. To put it bluntly, he was boring.

We are lucky the change came when it did. Can only be good for the future.

[freely]

... really thinking about our previous coaching regime, then read this - https://www.sen.com.au/news/2019/08/29/ ... -riewoldt/

Some salient points:-

“I loved Brett Ratten’s comments after the game on the weekend against Sydney,”

“He’s had enough of guys that can’t finish their work. So, skills and execution being an excuse has been an excuse down at the Saints for far too long and this is long overdue, someone coming out and saying it and hopefully having the courage to follow through on it."

Read between the lines and he was hating the constant skill errors as much as the fans and then the excuses put up for them (and the ongoing acceptance of mediocrity)

And the young players he makes particular mention of being the nucleus - "Hunter Clark, Nick Coffield and Rowan Marshall" and "Jack Billings, Jade Gresham, Max King". Note the first 3 were barely or rarely played by the previous regime

I don't think that's really accurate or that fair tbh.

Clark played 15 last year and 14 this year (not a bad total for a 2nd year player)
Marshall played 1 game in his rookie year, 12 in his second, and 20 this year (most of the year under Richo)
Coffield played 10 last year and 8 this year (our backline wasn't our weakness this year and some players need to build up through the VFL, and when brought into the senior team he finally found his feet)

Fair enough. But disagree. Coffield has been languishing at Sandy whilst Newnes played 125 in a row. Don't think he might've been worth a run in place of him (or Savage) just to get some games in or at least, find out whether he was up to it?

Marshall? Puhleeeez. Cho selected Pierce ahead of Marshall in R1 and it was only because of Lewis' concussion that Marshall got a run thereafter. Marshall is the ultimate accidental find of the year.

If you've watched much of Sandy - you'll know that the VFL team is utter shite and no one learns anything down there. It's abominable.

I don't recall either Newnes or Savage being dropped to make way for Coffield and Clark under either regime.

[takeaway]

Smart statement from a caretaker coach after the top job. Hopefully he will carry through with it when/if appointed.

I think Clark/Coffield have been quite well managed, Sam Walsh & the like aside, it usually takes a couple of years for the young players to build their body and get used to AFL. Marshall was hardly knocking the door down to get in the 1sts.

Having said that, I agree Richo was too conservative, especially this year, when he was trying to keep his job.

[The Recruit]

Smart statement from a caretaker coach after the top job. Hopefully he will carry through with it when/if appointed.

I think Clark/Coffield have been quite well managed, Sam Walsh & the like aside, it usually takes a couple of years for the young players to build their body and get used to AFL. Marshall was hardly knocking the door down to get in the 1sts.

Having said that, I agree Richo was too conservative, especially this year, when he was trying to keep his job.

Conservative is a perfect word...he was way to conservative to make the 8 and play finals.

[WellardSaint]

Ball butchers...
Geary is the worst in terms of disposal, forget the raw numbers, they mean nothing.
He is allowed to get the ball, by oppo coaches, cos they gamble on him screwing up, which he usually does

[The Fireman]

... really thinking about our previous coaching regime, then read this - https://www.sen.com.au/news/2019/08/29/ ... -riewoldt/

Some salient points:-

“I loved Brett Ratten’s comments after the game on the weekend against Sydney,”

“He’s had enough of guys that can’t finish their work. So, skills and execution being an excuse has been an excuse down at the Saints for far too long and this is long overdue, someone coming out and saying it and hopefully having the courage to follow through on it."

Read between the lines and he was hating the constant skill errors as much as the fans and then the excuses put up for them (and the ongoing acceptance of mediocrity)

And the young players he makes particular mention of being the nucleus - "Hunter Clark, Nick Coffield and Rowan Marshall" and "Jack Billings, Jade Gresham, Max King". Note the first 3 were barely or rarely played by the previous regime

I don't think that's really accurate or that fair tbh.

Clark played 15 last year and 14 this year (not a bad total for a 2nd year player)
Marshall played 1 game in his rookie year, 12 in his second, and 20 this year (most of the year under Richo)
Coffield played 10 last year and 8 this year (our backline wasn't our weakness this year and some players need to build up through the VFL, and when brought into the senior team he finally found his feet)

Fair enough. But disagree. Coffield has been languishing at Sandy whilst Newnes played 125 in a row. Don't think he might've been worth a run in place of him (or Savage) just to get some games in or at least, find out whether he was up to it?

Marshall? Puhleeeez. Cho selected Pierce ahead of Marshall in R1 and it was only because of Lewis' concussion that Marshall got a run thereafter. Marshall is the ultimate accidental find of the year.

If you've watched much of Sandy - you'll know that the VFL team is utter shite and no one learns anything down there. It's abominable.

I don't recall either Newnes or Savage being dropped to make way for Coffield and Clark under either regime.

Newnes and Savage in the same sentence ??? one is a required player in my books

[spert]

Speaking of ball butchers, who in stats land can find who our worst turnover players are??

[freely]

footywire turnover stats 2019
So that's:
1. Gresh
2. Billings
3. Hannebery
4. Clark

[takeaway]

footywire turnover stats 2019
So that's:
1. Gresh
2. Billings
3. Hannebery
4. Clark

Among our best players. That's where these stats are very limited - those that get it more, usually have more turnovers. You have to combine it with other stats, ie effective disposals. I bet in the AFL overall, Dangerfield, Dusty, Bont, etc are all well up in the turnovers.

[Saintmatt]

footywire turnover stats 2019
So that's:
1. Gresh
2. Billings
3. Hannebery
4. Clark

Among our best players. That's where these stats are very limited - those that get it more, usually have more turnovers. You have to combine it with other stats, ie effective disposals. I bet in the AFL overall, Dangerfield, Dusty, Bont, etc are all well up in the turnovers.

Absolutely - what's also vitally important is (a) where on the ground the turnover occurs; and (b) how much pressure is on the kicker when it occurs (i.e. little pressure on our ball carrier means that the oppo's offence has still retained its shape to take advantage of our turnover)

[skeptic]

One thing I will say for...
Given his results over 5.5 years, he’s built up quite a passionate following/loyalty amongst the fan base. I’d say he’s as well liked (and hated) as GT which is saying something

[B.M]

I am sure AR and Ratts just picked the best players available at the time.

Of course he didn’t want blowouts, he probably wanted to win?!

Coffield has taken a little time, and he’s still not there

Clark was a little unfit year one, and still played

Billings and Gresham have hardly missed since they debuted

Marshall was a tall skinny Rookie pick
Should he have played straight away?! I would argue his development has been perfect?!

Wilkie, Parker were straight in.

Perhaps it’s ARs fault that Bytel and King didn’t play this Season

Perhaps it’s ARs fault we lost against Sydney???

BTW
Did Newnes play under Ratten?

[ace]

Cho was terrified of 'coach killing blowouts', so he picked senior guys who he trusted more to not let that happen.

It of course meant we couldn't win either - but at least the 100 point thrashings were restricted, right?

Spot on, where were all the 100 point thrashings - they didn't happen
Richardson was not coaching for the future, he was coaching to keep his job next week.

If you want to know how the board and CEO of a listed company will behave read their remuneration report.
They will work to achieve their incentives.
Richardson was working for his incentive - play finals or you are OUT.
Developing players was not a low priority it was a zero priority in his incentive scheme.

[CQ SAINT]

'Guys that can't finish their work'. Who doesn't that apply to in the last 53 years. Brave words.

[barneyboyz]

Ball butchers...
Geary is the worst in terms of disposal, forget the raw numbers, they mean nothing.
He is allowed to get the ball, by oppo coaches, cos they gamble on him screwing up, which he usually does

If Ratts gets the job, does that spell the end for Gears? Does his courage and desire cover and allow him some slack? or does simply being the captain?

I reckon he'll be hampered next season coming back from the injury anyway tbh

[WellardSaint]

Ball butchers...
Geary is the worst in terms of disposal, forget the raw numbers, they mean nothing.
He is allowed to get the ball, by oppo coaches, cos they gamble on him screwing up, which he usually does

If Ratts gets the job, does that spell the end for Gears? Does his courage and desire cover and allow him some slack? or does simply being the captain?

I reckon he'll be hampered next season coming back from the injury anyway tbh

Ratts flagged moving out players who had poor levels of skill, so I would assume Gears doesn't get picked and only plays for Sandy until his contract expires, then gets deiisted.
He has absolutely no trade value, and even GC wouldn't take him.
Just my opinion, he is as brave as anyone, but his lack of skill is far too costly.

[barneyboyz]

Ball butchers...
Geary is the worst in terms of disposal, forget the raw numbers, they mean nothing.
He is allowed to get the ball, by oppo coaches, cos they gamble on him screwing up, which he usually does

If Ratts gets the job, does that spell the end for Gears? Does his courage and desire cover and allow him some slack? or does simply being the captain?

I reckon he'll be hampered next season coming back from the injury anyway tbh

Ratts flagged moving out players who had poor levels of skill, so I would assume Gears doesn't get picked and only plays for Sandy until his contract expires, then gets deiisted.
He has absolutely no trade value, and even GC wouldn't take him.
Just my opinion, he is as brave as anyone, but his lack of skill is far too costly.

It is interesting that they seem to be spruiking 'the fill in captain' as a B&F possibility. Maybe he is worthy? but his kitchen has as much butchers paper as Geary's

My apologies for bagging players, especially these two, they both are every bit very good players, apart from kicking / decision making