Trout gone end of Year
Moderators: Saintsational Administrators, Saintsational Moderators
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 11557
- Joined: Sun 11 Sep 2011 2:26pm
- Has thanked: 3525 times
- Been thanked: 2465 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
McCartins progression is good and we all know the coaches let him know last year that if he didn't improve his fitness he would not be picked. In a way the research by Trout was inconclusive regarding McCartins diabetes and he dismissed the concern rather than factoring it into the equation
Billings has been woeful throughout his career, but at times it was more to do with coaching and development imo. The coach has compromised integrity of team selection to allow him to regain form at times and also in the hope that JB could potentially be the difference between winning and losing in games. When will we learn that you need a team playing well and not just 1 or 2 individuals.
Both have been given games compared to other youngsters where they perhaps would not have been if they weren't such a high draft pick. I don't disagree with that strategy because when you invest in a high draft pick you have an obligation to provide opportunities. Yes, they may keep improving and they may keep their spots on our list ( or on some other AFL list) but whether they prove to be worthy of their high draft pick is debatable.
Billings has been woeful throughout his career, but at times it was more to do with coaching and development imo. The coach has compromised integrity of team selection to allow him to regain form at times and also in the hope that JB could potentially be the difference between winning and losing in games. When will we learn that you need a team playing well and not just 1 or 2 individuals.
Both have been given games compared to other youngsters where they perhaps would not have been if they weren't such a high draft pick. I don't disagree with that strategy because when you invest in a high draft pick you have an obligation to provide opportunities. Yes, they may keep improving and they may keep their spots on our list ( or on some other AFL list) but whether they prove to be worthy of their high draft pick is debatable.
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 1825
- Joined: Thu 15 Sep 2011 5:54pm
- Has thanked: 119 times
- Been thanked: 382 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
Ok we disagree. I think Paddy would be aware if not fit he would not be picked. Trout mentioned his diabetes several times during and after draft night, so I'm pretty sure the concern was not dismissed. "Billings has been woeful throughout his career" - I mean, now you are losing credibility. Both given games compared to other youngsters because of the high pick - rubbish. McCartin has played quite a few games in the 2's when fit enough for firsts, and in my view Billings has always been best 22. He will improve further. We have different views, which will only be decided some years hence.Scollop wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 3:28pm McCartins progression is good and we all know the coaches let him know last year that if he didn't improve his fitness he would not be picked. In a way the research by Trout was inconclusive regarding McCartins diabetes and he dismissed the concern rather than factoring it into the equation
Billings has been woeful throughout his career, but at times it was more to do with coaching and development imo. The coach has compromised integrity of team selection to allow him to regain form at times and also in the hope that JB could potentially be the difference between winning and losing in games. When will we learn that you need a team playing well and not just 1 or 2 individuals.
Both have been given games compared to other youngsters where they perhaps would not have been if they weren't such a high draft pick. I don't disagree with that strategy because when you invest in a high draft pick you have an obligation to provide opportunities. Yes, they may keep improving and they may keep their spots on our list ( or on some other AFL list) but whether they prove to be worthy of their high draft pick is debatable.
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 25303
- Joined: Tue 01 Feb 2005 4:25pm
- Location: Trump Tower
- Has thanked: 142 times
- Been thanked: 284 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
Good news about Trout.
My mail is there will be changes - but that may involve significant player list changes (I’d call that Captain Obvious stuff!)
My mail is there will be changes - but that may involve significant player list changes (I’d call that Captain Obvious stuff!)
i am Melbourne Skies - sometimes Blue Skies, Grey Skies, even Partly Cloudy Skies.
- SaintPav
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 18838
- Joined: Wed 16 Jun 2010 9:24pm
- Location: Alma Road
- Has thanked: 1568 times
- Been thanked: 1962 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
Always wondered about the last bit. Lyon changed the game plan halfway in 2008 and refined it in 2009.rodgerfox wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 10:48am The Assistant coach thing is fascinating.
Kingsley has been there a while, and moved into a new role this season. 'Transition Coach' or something, that oversees the transition from defence, to mid to attack. He appears to be almost the main man in the box on game days this year.
Playfair is also new. I heard an interview with a player in the pre-season and he said that he'd brought a 'team defence' with him, instead of the 'pressure at the man' defensive strategy we had previously.
And these two are the ones that they're keeping.
It's really interesting, obviously not being on the inner sanctum, to understand how we can go from competitive to pathetic over one pre-season - and the two coaches that are responsible for the biggest factors in that are the only ones that are safe!
Obviously, something in the inner sanctum is going on that we don't understand. And I don't mean that to be a smart arse either. I mean clearly, the club sees something in what these two are bringing to the table that the outside world doesn't see.
Could it be that these tactical changes that these guys have introduced are simply taking time to get right? Could it be like when Lyon took over and we looked like rabble for 18 months whilst we learnt his style - then it clicked and we were a force?
It's very curious.
Freo clicked immediately under Lyon.
Holder of unacceptable views and other thought crimes.
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 23011
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 3:53pm
- Has thanked: 8909 times
- Been thanked: 3883 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
saintspremiers wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 4:07pm Good news about Trout.
My mail is there will be changes - but that may involve significant player list changes (I’d call that Captain Obvious stuff!)
Not with our scant /non existant lower draft picks.
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 11557
- Joined: Sun 11 Sep 2011 2:26pm
- Has thanked: 3525 times
- Been thanked: 2465 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
Sorry, my bad. I meant that Billings had been woeful at times 'throughout his career' and not that his whole career has been woeful.takeaway wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 4:07pm
Ok we disagree. I think Paddy would be aware if not fit he would not be picked. Trout mentioned his diabetes several times during and after draft night, so I'm pretty sure the concern was not dismissed. "Billings has been woeful throughout his career" - I mean, now you are losing credibility. Both given games compared to other youngsters because of the high pick - rubbish. McCartin has played quite a few games in the 2's when fit enough for firsts, and in my view Billings has always been best 22. He will improve further. We have different views, which will only be decided some years hence.
As far as selecting a player when you know that there is a pre existing medical condition, especially when it is an investment in a number 1 draft pick, imo you may as well be dismissing any concern around that condition. I'm not saying that they didn't do any research or didn't understand that there would be some different management protocols required, but I am saying that they dismissed the risk for that player not being able to perform at the highest level when they made their final decision to recruit him. Similar to Collingwood and their decision to select J Stevenson at pick 6 last year.
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 1825
- Joined: Thu 15 Sep 2011 5:54pm
- Has thanked: 119 times
- Been thanked: 382 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
Fair enough.Scollop wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 5:56pmSorry, my bad. I meant that Billings had been woeful at times 'throughout his career' and not that his whole career has been woeful.takeaway wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 4:07pm
Ok we disagree. I think Paddy would be aware if not fit he would not be picked. Trout mentioned his diabetes several times during and after draft night, so I'm pretty sure the concern was not dismissed. "Billings has been woeful throughout his career" - I mean, now you are losing credibility. Both given games compared to other youngsters because of the high pick - rubbish. McCartin has played quite a few games in the 2's when fit enough for firsts, and in my view Billings has always been best 22. He will improve further. We have different views, which will only be decided some years hence.
As far as selecting a player when you know that there is a pre existing medical condition, especially when it is an investment in a number 1 draft pick, imo you may as well be dismissing any concern around that condition. I'm not saying that they didn't do any research or didn't understand that there would be some different management protocols required, but I am saying that they dismissed the risk for that player not being able to perform at the highest level when they made their final decision to recruit him. Similar to Collingwood and their decision to select J Stevenson at pick 6 last year.
-
- SS Life Member
- Posts: 3465
- Joined: Fri 29 Oct 2004 1:01pm
- Has thanked: 91 times
- Been thanked: 162 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
Here's how I see this one working out: we sack Trout; he's unemployed for ten minutes before getting hired by a better run club; he continues to draft young talent; we continue to struggle. I don't believe that our struggles relate to an absence of young talent being brought to the club. I think we lack experienced leaders, particularly in the 26-30 age bracket. I think our development of our young players has been questionable. I think the current deployment of our young talent has been questionable. I do not, however, think it is reasonable to axe the recruiter while half your team is young players brought in by that person.
Yeah nah pleasing positive
- SaintPav
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 18838
- Joined: Wed 16 Jun 2010 9:24pm
- Location: Alma Road
- Has thanked: 1568 times
- Been thanked: 1962 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
Club needs to be ruthless. Cull a minimum of 20% of the list and coaching staff.
Mods need to do the same.
Cull all the dead s*** simpletons on here like WellardSaint, Con Gorozidis, Teflon, Parkeysainter etc etc.
Mods need to do the same.
Cull all the dead s*** simpletons on here like WellardSaint, Con Gorozidis, Teflon, Parkeysainter etc etc.
Last edited by SaintPav on Tue 05 Jun 2018 10:39pm, edited 1 time in total.
Holder of unacceptable views and other thought crimes.
- WellardSaint
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 8257
- Joined: Sat 26 May 2012 11:25am
- Location: Perth- the best weather in Oz, but the worst rednecks.
- Has thanked: 1853 times
- Been thanked: 869 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
While you're at the footy, your wife is bedding the gardener, or the postman, or a plumber,
or her mechanic, or the butcher...
and in some cases, she gets double-teamed like Paddy;
and you think she buys you a Social Club Membership for you each year, out of devotion?
More fool you
A real Sainter will pledge allegiance to the ❤ and despise the Pies, the Blues, and the Injectors.
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
- SaintPav
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 18838
- Joined: Wed 16 Jun 2010 9:24pm
- Location: Alma Road
- Has thanked: 1568 times
- Been thanked: 1962 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
You think that hurts me, eunuch!WellardSaint wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:25pmWhile you're at the footy, your wife is bedding the gardener, or the postman, or a plumber,
or her mechanic, or the butcher...
and in some cases, she gets double-teamed like Paddy;
and you think she buys you a Social Club Membership for you each year, out of devotion?
More fool you
How do you know I'm even married.
You're such a eunuch.
Banking executive.
GOLD!!!
Holder of unacceptable views and other thought crimes.
- parkeysainter
- SS Life Member
- Posts: 2696
- Joined: Thu 20 Jul 2017 2:59am
- Location: Brighton Beach Mansion
- Has thanked: 84 times
- Been thanked: 177 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
Lol. Even Bernie would have come up with something better and he's dead!
Says alot about the Pavalator.
Try to be a rainbow in someone's cloud
In this world nothing can be said to be certain, except death, taxes and the St Kilda FC
In this world nothing can be said to be certain, except death, taxes and the St Kilda FC
- parkeysainter
- SS Life Member
- Posts: 2696
- Joined: Thu 20 Jul 2017 2:59am
- Location: Brighton Beach Mansion
- Has thanked: 84 times
- Been thanked: 177 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
Nothing wrong with overhauls of any department at the Saints. Something needs to happen and it seems Lethlean is on it.
Try to be a rainbow in someone's cloud
In this world nothing can be said to be certain, except death, taxes and the St Kilda FC
In this world nothing can be said to be certain, except death, taxes and the St Kilda FC
- WellardSaint
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 8257
- Joined: Sat 26 May 2012 11:25am
- Location: Perth- the best weather in Oz, but the worst rednecks.
- Has thanked: 1853 times
- Been thanked: 869 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
Parkey, you've been thanked 17 times,parkeysainter wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:31pmLol. Even Bernie would have come up with something better and he's dead!
Says alot about the Pavalator.
but the deadbeat Pav got only 7-
I wonder who should be culled?
Not you...
Anyways, his 7 are
-the butcher, the mechanic, etc etc, who thanked him for staying at the footy so they could
each go a second time on his missus
A real Sainter will pledge allegiance to the ❤ and despise the Pies, the Blues, and the Injectors.
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 846
- Joined: Tue 30 Mar 2004 5:44pm
- Has thanked: 93 times
- Been thanked: 115 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
Obviously what's happening with Robbo is terrible for him and his family. but for us, not only could we lose a wonderful player at only 26 years of age but doesnt he also have a few children? Father/son..
He's currently on 91 games for us..
He's currently on 91 games for us..
- parkeysainter
- SS Life Member
- Posts: 2696
- Joined: Thu 20 Jul 2017 2:59am
- Location: Brighton Beach Mansion
- Has thanked: 84 times
- Been thanked: 177 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
Yep. The stats don't lie.WellardSaint wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:37pmParkey, you've been thanked 17 times,parkeysainter wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:31pmLol. Even Bernie would have come up with something better and he's dead!
Says alot about the Pavalator.
but the deadbeat Pav got only 7-
I wonder who should be culled?
Not you...
Anyways, his 7 are
-the butcher, the mechanic, etc etc, who thanked him for staying at the footy so they could
each go a second time on his missus
Try to be a rainbow in someone's cloud
In this world nothing can be said to be certain, except death, taxes and the St Kilda FC
In this world nothing can be said to be certain, except death, taxes and the St Kilda FC
- SaintPav
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 18838
- Joined: Wed 16 Jun 2010 9:24pm
- Location: Alma Road
- Has thanked: 1568 times
- Been thanked: 1962 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
So says the eunuch!
Thanked by the deadshit simpelton and resident bogan from Dandenong.
Choof, choof, choof
Priceless
Thanked by the deadshit simpelton and resident bogan from Dandenong.
Choof, choof, choof
Priceless
Holder of unacceptable views and other thought crimes.
- SaintPav
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 18838
- Joined: Wed 16 Jun 2010 9:24pm
- Location: Alma Road
- Has thanked: 1568 times
- Been thanked: 1962 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
That’s what you think, ignoramus.parkeysainter wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:45pmYep. The stats don't lie.WellardSaint wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:37pmParkey, you've been thanked 17 times,parkeysainter wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:31pmLol. Even Bernie would have come up with something better and he's dead!
Says alot about the Pavalator.
but the deadbeat Pav got only 7-
I wonder who should be culled?
Not you...
Anyways, his 7 are
-the butcher, the mechanic, etc etc, who thanked him for staying at the footy so they could
each go a second time on his missus
”We can still make the 8”!
Holder of unacceptable views and other thought crimes.
- parkeysainter
- SS Life Member
- Posts: 2696
- Joined: Thu 20 Jul 2017 2:59am
- Location: Brighton Beach Mansion
- Has thanked: 84 times
- Been thanked: 177 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
17 to 7. Pretty clear cut to me and that is without even trying. Told you before...you try tango with The Parkey and you will come off second best! Just ask Con G.SaintPav wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:57pmThat’s what you think.parkeysainter wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:45pmYep. The stats don't lie.WellardSaint wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:37pmParkey, you've been thanked 17 times,parkeysainter wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:31pmLol. Even Bernie would have come up with something better and he's dead!
Says alot about the Pavalator.
but the deadbeat Pav got only 7-
I wonder who should be culled?
Not you...
Anyways, his 7 are
-the butcher, the mechanic, etc etc, who thanked him for staying at the footy so they could
each go a second time on his missus
Try to be a rainbow in someone's cloud
In this world nothing can be said to be certain, except death, taxes and the St Kilda FC
In this world nothing can be said to be certain, except death, taxes and the St Kilda FC
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 988
- Joined: Fri 18 May 2018 10:06am
- Has thanked: 210 times
- Been thanked: 83 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
Only seen Hartung play once or twice, he is cutting a nice position at North Melbourne. Why didnt the saints take him last year, he is pretty quick? The other one is Miles from Richmond who was also going for free and is knocking the door down at Richmond, why didnt we pick him up? Any answers from any posters in the know ?
- SaintPav
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 18838
- Joined: Wed 16 Jun 2010 9:24pm
- Location: Alma Road
- Has thanked: 1568 times
- Been thanked: 1962 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
My enemies enemy is my friend, ha!parkeysainter wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 8:00pm17 to 7. Pretty clear cut to me and that is without even trying. Told you before...you try tango with The Parkey and you will come off second best! Just ask Con G.SaintPav wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:57pmThat’s what you think.parkeysainter wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:45pmYep. The stats don't lie.WellardSaint wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:37pmParkey, you've been thanked 17 times,parkeysainter wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:31pmLol. Even Bernie would have come up with something better and he's dead!
Says alot about the Pavalator.
but the deadbeat Pav got only 7-
I wonder who should be culled?
Not you...
Anyways, his 7 are
-the butcher, the mechanic, etc etc, who thanked him for staying at the footy so they could
each go a second time on his missus
Ooh, so scary.
Everyone is petrified of Parkeysainter.
Beyoncé has mass appeal than Rachmaninov. So what!
You post more than 50% amongst other sampling errors, not to mention the cognitive biases which I can’t be arsed explaining.
You pick and choose when you want to bag the club but no one else can.
Christ, you’re fkn deluded.
Holder of unacceptable views and other thought crimes.
- parkeysainter
- SS Life Member
- Posts: 2696
- Joined: Thu 20 Jul 2017 2:59am
- Location: Brighton Beach Mansion
- Has thanked: 84 times
- Been thanked: 177 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
17-7.SaintPav wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 9:38pmMy enemies enemy is my friend, ha!parkeysainter wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 8:00pm17 to 7. Pretty clear cut to me and that is without even trying. Told you before...you try tango with The Parkey and you will come off second best! Just ask Con G.SaintPav wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:57pmThat’s what you think.parkeysainter wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:45pmYep. The stats don't lie.WellardSaint wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:37pmParkey, you've been thanked 17 times,parkeysainter wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:31pmLol. Even Bernie would have come up with something better and he's dead!
Says alot about the Pavalator.
but the deadbeat Pav got only 7-
I wonder who should be culled?
Not you...
Anyways, his 7 are
-the butcher, the mechanic, etc etc, who thanked him for staying at the footy so they could
each go a second time on his missus
Ooh, so scary.
Everyone is petrified of Parkeysainter.
Beyoncé has mass appeal than Rachmaninov. So what!
You post more than 50% amongst other sampling errors, not to mention the cognitive biases which I can’t be arsed explaining.
You pick and choose when you want to bag the club but no one else can.
Christ, you’re fkn deluded.
Last edited by parkeysainter on Tue 05 Jun 2018 10:06pm, edited 1 time in total.
Try to be a rainbow in someone's cloud
In this world nothing can be said to be certain, except death, taxes and the St Kilda FC
In this world nothing can be said to be certain, except death, taxes and the St Kilda FC
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 988
- Joined: Fri 18 May 2018 10:06am
- Has thanked: 210 times
- Been thanked: 83 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
Roo was frustrated with the passes over his head and at his ankles 3/4 times a game, that is why he should have kicked at least 100 more goals in his career and maybe got a flag. I wont support AFL players who cant kick 30-40 metres with reasonable accuracy, one of the current mobs biggest issues and directly related to recruiting bar Goddard and Montagna and a couple of others over the years.
- Impatient Sainter
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 4089
- Joined: Tue 05 Apr 2016 3:30pm
- Has thanked: 2622 times
- Been thanked: 1077 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
Trout must be due to retire in any event.Vazelos wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 8:25am My mail is that Trout Elshaug is gone end of year. His contract wont be renewed.
Recruiting dept overhaul and possiblt coaching changes in football dept. Kingsley and Playfair to stay others are fair game for change.
In AFL medical circles Roberton condition potentially high risk to keep playing his career could be over. Would be a massive loss for us.
Kingsley has been at the club too long and is propping Richo up, I hope they all go!
- Con Gorozidis
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 23532
- Joined: Thu 19 Jun 2008 4:04pm
- Has thanked: 100 times
- Been thanked: 78 times
Re: Trout gone end of Year
Ask away.parkeysainter wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 8:00pm17 to 7. Pretty clear cut to me and that is without even trying. Told you before...you try tango with The Parkey and you will come off second best! Just ask Con G.SaintPav wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:57pmThat’s what you think.parkeysainter wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:45pmYep. The stats don't lie.WellardSaint wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:37pmParkey, you've been thanked 17 times,parkeysainter wrote: ↑Tue 05 Jun 2018 7:31pmLol. Even Bernie would have come up with something better and he's dead!
Says alot about the Pavalator.
but the deadbeat Pav got only 7-
I wonder who should be culled?
Not you...
Anyways, his 7 are
-the butcher, the mechanic, etc etc, who thanked him for staying at the footy so they could
each go a second time on his missus
Tangling with Parkey is like arguing about with a sack of potatoes. Pointless due to the plain stupidity of the opponent.
Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.