JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
Just a practice match, but the team was poorly prepared and Richo was outcoached tactically (the norm)- thank goodness Clark and Coffield showed excellent signs. We can't just rely on Steven to have a purple patch to get us back into games.
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
shrodes wrote:
Conditions were tough, as he says. Played golf in it yesterday and it was a strong, gusty wind. As he says, Carlton handled the conditions a lot better.
Frustrating to lose convincingly when we had 10 more forward 50 entries than them
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
Am thinking the coach was trying to lull us into a false sense of insecurity - seems to have worked.
Too many words sprang to mind with an "out" prefix:
- thought
- enthused
- ran
- played, etc
The Saints got themselves back into the game in the 3rd quarter and then fired blanks with the breeze in the last - very disappointing.
The kids showed some promise thankfully and one can only hope that the next match is far better.
Too many words sprang to mind with an "out" prefix:
- thought
- enthused
- ran
- played, etc
The Saints got themselves back into the game in the 3rd quarter and then fired blanks with the breeze in the last - very disappointing.
The kids showed some promise thankfully and one can only hope that the next match is far better.
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
Watched the replay. Same old St Kilda as last year.
I could not see anything to suggest our team has improved. We got bullied by a young Carlton list. They had speed we still look like a team of plodders.
Their talls back and forward looked far more effective than ours - and they were missing Weitering who is a very good player.
Our backline is stacked with b graders - with the exception of Carlisle. I’m hoping Robbo at least proves me wrong.
We need to play Membrey as a 3rd tall in the Gunston role not as a key target. Forward setup last night was ineffective. This is going to stir a few people up but Paddy is worst #1 pick since Jack Watts. Fits in well with our team of b graders
On the bright side , the 2 new boys looked good and Clark in particular made some good decisions. Unfortunately we’ve seen this before - our recruits show a bit in year 1 then get stifled by the innefective St Kilda Development Program. Desperately need Jack Billings class at high half forward. 11 wins at best this year. Unless there is a radical change , We are well and truely stuck in no mans land - another ladder finish a couple of wins outside the 8 beckons.
I could not see anything to suggest our team has improved. We got bullied by a young Carlton list. They had speed we still look like a team of plodders.
Their talls back and forward looked far more effective than ours - and they were missing Weitering who is a very good player.
Our backline is stacked with b graders - with the exception of Carlisle. I’m hoping Robbo at least proves me wrong.
We need to play Membrey as a 3rd tall in the Gunston role not as a key target. Forward setup last night was ineffective. This is going to stir a few people up but Paddy is worst #1 pick since Jack Watts. Fits in well with our team of b graders
On the bright side , the 2 new boys looked good and Clark in particular made some good decisions. Unfortunately we’ve seen this before - our recruits show a bit in year 1 then get stifled by the innefective St Kilda Development Program. Desperately need Jack Billings class at high half forward. 11 wins at best this year. Unless there is a radical change , We are well and truely stuck in no mans land - another ladder finish a couple of wins outside the 8 beckons.
“If you want the rainbow you gotta put up with rain” Dolly Parton
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
Docherty (season)
Petrevski-Seton
Weitering
All missing from that side.
Petrevski-Seton
Weitering
All missing from that side.
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
Our problem is our vanilla midfield, more so than our (supposed) vanilla coach.
Dal Santo made the comment that we have a lot of “inside” midfielders, but only one with a real point of difference, and some leg speed - Steven.
Our recruiters have overloaded us with inside midfielders. That’s our problem in a nutshell.
No coach can turn an overwhelmingly inside midfield into something that works - you can’t complement an inside midfielder with yet another inside midfielder. It doesn’t work that way - but our astute recruiters think otherwise.
Dal Santo made the comment that we have a lot of “inside” midfielders, but only one with a real point of difference, and some leg speed - Steven.
Our recruiters have overloaded us with inside midfielders. That’s our problem in a nutshell.
No coach can turn an overwhelmingly inside midfield into something that works - you can’t complement an inside midfielder with yet another inside midfielder. It doesn’t work that way - but our astute recruiters think otherwise.
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
Don't know about that. A full headlock on a saints player goes unnoticed yet a slight push in the back gets rewarded as long as the player being pushed is not a saint.samuraisaint wrote:I used to think it was the umpires' fault. I am beginning to think it is actually the way we play. If you play dumb reactive footy and the other team are first to the ball they are going to win the free kicks.Drake Huggins wrote:Following the pattern of the past few years. We seem to give away a lot more than we get. Same old same old.StPeter wrote:Free kick count would be extraordinary. I am not sure what the official count would be but on my reckoning at least around 10aainst us to our to 1 or 2 .
Also; we need our ruckman to be competitive. Not just at the throw ins but around the ground. Time to give Hickey another go. Getting smashed in the midfield, and Kreuzer is having a field day.
How does Pddy not get a free from a full wack on the nose from a swinging arm drapped over his shoulder?
I think the maggots grew up as blues supporters.
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
Yep and yep.CURLY wrote:Another goal from a free. Umpire misses McCartin getting belted in the nose pays soft frees there end.
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
Yeah I just don’t get it. The stats show we get shafted year after year. Surely this needs to be addressed?saynta wrote:Yep and yep.CURLY wrote:Another goal from a free. Umpire misses McCartin getting belted in the nose pays soft frees there end.
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
From the hun;
CARLTON came out of the blocks firing and held off St Kilda in Wednesday night’s JLT Series clash at Ikon Park.
And there was plenty of SuperCoach talent on display.
While the big names racked up their usual decent scores, SuperCoaches were equally keen to see how both teams’ potential cash cows fared.
No.3 draft pick Paddy Dow might have stolen the headlines from the Blues’ win but young Saint Hunter Clark showed he’s well worth watching before locking in teams for 2018.
CARLTON
Patrick Cripps 120
Matthew Kreuzer 119
Caleb Marchbank 111
Liam Jones94
Marc Murphy 85
Ed Curnow 83
Ciaran Byrne 76
Kade Simpson 74
Matthew Wright 73
Lachie Plowman 69
Charlie Curnow 68
Dale Thomas 68
Paddy Dow 66
Jack Silvagni 62
Matthew Kennedy 62
Zac Fisher 59
Aaron Mullett 57
Levi Casboult 52
David Cuningham 51
Jed Lamb 49
Jarrod Garlett 41
Harry McKay 40
Lochie O’Brien 29
Jarrod Pickett 20
ST KILDA
Shane Savage 145
David Armitage 129
Jack Steven 125
Paddy McCartin 91
Jade Gresham 86
Luke Dunstan 86
Jack Lonie 85
Hunter Clark 83
Sebastian Ross 79
Tim Membrey 77
Billy Longer 74
Jack Newnes 71
Jimmy Webster 71
Nick Coffield 63
Jack Steele 56
Blake Acres 54
Jack Sinclair 49
Jarryn Geary 49
Jake Carlisle 47
Nathan J. Brown 39
Ben Long 36
Dylan Roberton 28
Maverick Weller 17
Sam Gilbert 16
Rowan Marshall 12
Nathan Wright 6
CARLTON came out of the blocks firing and held off St Kilda in Wednesday night’s JLT Series clash at Ikon Park.
And there was plenty of SuperCoach talent on display.
While the big names racked up their usual decent scores, SuperCoaches were equally keen to see how both teams’ potential cash cows fared.
No.3 draft pick Paddy Dow might have stolen the headlines from the Blues’ win but young Saint Hunter Clark showed he’s well worth watching before locking in teams for 2018.
CARLTON
Patrick Cripps 120
Matthew Kreuzer 119
Caleb Marchbank 111
Liam Jones94
Marc Murphy 85
Ed Curnow 83
Ciaran Byrne 76
Kade Simpson 74
Matthew Wright 73
Lachie Plowman 69
Charlie Curnow 68
Dale Thomas 68
Paddy Dow 66
Jack Silvagni 62
Matthew Kennedy 62
Zac Fisher 59
Aaron Mullett 57
Levi Casboult 52
David Cuningham 51
Jed Lamb 49
Jarrod Garlett 41
Harry McKay 40
Lochie O’Brien 29
Jarrod Pickett 20
ST KILDA
Shane Savage 145
David Armitage 129
Jack Steven 125
Paddy McCartin 91
Jade Gresham 86
Luke Dunstan 86
Jack Lonie 85
Hunter Clark 83
Sebastian Ross 79
Tim Membrey 77
Billy Longer 74
Jack Newnes 71
Jimmy Webster 71
Nick Coffield 63
Jack Steele 56
Blake Acres 54
Jack Sinclair 49
Jarryn Geary 49
Jake Carlisle 47
Nathan J. Brown 39
Ben Long 36
Dylan Roberton 28
Maverick Weller 17
Sam Gilbert 16
Rowan Marshall 12
Nathan Wright 6
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
Players recovered pretty well. A few bruises and aches but can be expected after the first hit out. Coaches were pretty annoyed and disappointed but it’s important to stress they weren’t worried. They were really difficult conditions and obviously we butchered the ball going inside 50. Also it’s worth noting that we tried to play our game the whole time whilst Carlton put players back when we had control. They played to win, we played as in a practice match and to try different things. In the real season the tactics would have been different. You’ll see a different match on Thursday as I’m sure No one will try to close the game down.
Have faith Sainters.
Have faith Sainters.
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
Thanks tony74. Important that Armo pulls up OK.tony74 wrote:Players recovered pretty well. A few bruises and aches but can be expected after the first hit out. Coaches were pretty annoyed and disappointed but it’s important to stress they weren’t worried. They were really difficult conditions and obviously we butchered the ball going inside 50. Also it’s worth noting that we tried to play our game the whole time whilst Carlton put players back when we had control. They played to win, we played as in a practice match and to try different things. In the real season the tactics would have been different. You’ll see a different match on Thursday as I’m sure No one will try to close the game down.
Have faith Sainters.
summertime and the living is easy ........
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
And washes that eye makeup off!!! (Was it friendly fire??)Gershwin wrote: Thanks tony74. Important that Armo pulls up OK.
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If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
Pretty much exactly what I observed Tony. Carlton know internally that they are not Finals contenders and are going for early wins to enthuse members.tony74 wrote:Players recovered pretty well. A few bruises and aches but can be expected after the first hit out. Coaches were pretty annoyed and disappointed but it’s important to stress they weren’t worried. They were really difficult conditions and obviously we butchered the ball going inside 50. Also it’s worth noting that we tried to play our game the whole time whilst Carlton put players back when we had control. They played to win, we played as in a practice match and to try different things. In the real season the tactics would have been different. You’ll see a different match on Thursday as I’m sure No one will try to close the game down.
Have faith Sainters.
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
The negative nancies should also cast their mind back to our pre season in 2009saintspremiers wrote:All you negative nancies remember this - we were missing one of the best players in the AFL - Mr Jack Billings. He’ll be dynamite this year running along side Stuv who can finally run again. Add to that the brute mongrel force of Armo when he’s match conditioned and the midfield becomes serious. And I haven’t even factored in Ross.
It’s all good children.
![Rolling Eyes :roll:](./images/smilies/icon_rolleyes.gif)
To refresh memories, we lost to Brisbane in our first match and failed to score in the second half. Then in our Final match, Port Adelaide (who would win 9 games that season) touched us up by 80 odd points. After that, we won our first 20.
Practice match form/results are completely irrelevant, participating teams have different objectives and are at variable levels of conditioning.
By the way, I seem to recall that Collingwood's form last pre season was sensational, even getting them touted as Premiership fancies. Aah the folly of attaching any weight to preseason results. I won't even bother talking about Sydney's pre season record under Paul Roos.
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
ThenLinton Lodger wrote:The negative nancies should also cast their mind back to our pre season in 2009saintspremiers wrote:All you negative nancies remember this - we were missing one of the best players in the AFL - Mr Jack Billings. He’ll be dynamite this year running along side Stuv who can finally run again. Add to that the brute mongrel force of Armo when he’s match conditioned and the midfield becomes serious. And I haven’t even factored in Ross.
It’s all good children.![]()
To refresh memories, we lost to Brisbane in our first match and failed to score in the second half. Then in our Final match, Port Adelaide (who would win 9 games that season) touched us up by 80 odd points. After that, we won our first 20.
Practice match form/results are completely irrelevant, participating teams have different objectives and are at variable levels of conditioning.
By the way, I seem to recall that Collingwood's form last pre season was sensational, even getting them touted as Premiership fancies. Aah the folly of attaching any weight to preseason results. I won't even bother talking about Sydney's pre season record under Paul Roos.
We finished 4th in 2008.
We had 12 AA on our list.
Lyon used to tank pre season back then.
Now
We finished 11th in 2017.
No AA players on list.
We're trying our guts out.
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
What precisely is your point?Con Gorozidis wrote:ThenLinton Lodger wrote:The negative nancies should also cast their mind back to our pre season in 2009saintspremiers wrote:All you negative nancies remember this - we were missing one of the best players in the AFL - Mr Jack Billings. He’ll be dynamite this year running along side Stuv who can finally run again. Add to that the brute mongrel force of Armo when he’s match conditioned and the midfield becomes serious. And I haven’t even factored in Ross.
It’s all good children.![]()
To refresh memories, we lost to Brisbane in our first match and failed to score in the second half. Then in our Final match, Port Adelaide (who would win 9 games that season) touched us up by 80 odd points. After that, we won our first 20.
Practice match form/results are completely irrelevant, participating teams have different objectives and are at variable levels of conditioning.
By the way, I seem to recall that Collingwood's form last pre season was sensational, even getting them touted as Premiership fancies. Aah the folly of attaching any weight to preseason results. I won't even bother talking about Sydney's pre season record under Paul Roos.
We finished 4th in 2008.
We had 12 AA on our list.
Lyon used to tank pre season back then.
Now
We finished 11th in 2017.
No AA players on list.
We're trying our guts out.
We won the pre season comp in 2008 and made the Final in 2010. So did that accidently happen when we intended to tank?
When we finished 4th in 2008 (with 13 wins), we were further behind the top 2 (Hawthorn & Geelong) than we are now.
Whether or not players are AA is subjective. We may have had 12 AAs in 2008, but we also had anywhere up to six players in our best 22 that wouldn't have got a game at many other Clubs and we were light on depth.
Why would we bother to counter Carlton's defensive tactics in a Practice game? The point of the games is conditioning and practicing certain things.
"Trying our guts out" don't know who said that, but get serious! We only occasionally got out of second gear and our defensive pressure was, shall we say relaxed. It was what it was, a glorified training run.
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
You think we are just taking it easy in Feb with our mind on a top 4 in deep September?Linton Lodger wrote:What precisely is your point?Con Gorozidis wrote:ThenLinton Lodger wrote:The negative nancies should also cast their mind back to our pre season in 2009saintspremiers wrote:All you negative nancies remember this - we were missing one of the best players in the AFL - Mr Jack Billings. He’ll be dynamite this year running along side Stuv who can finally run again. Add to that the brute mongrel force of Armo when he’s match conditioned and the midfield becomes serious. And I haven’t even factored in Ross.
It’s all good children.![]()
To refresh memories, we lost to Brisbane in our first match and failed to score in the second half. Then in our Final match, Port Adelaide (who would win 9 games that season) touched us up by 80 odd points. After that, we won our first 20.
Practice match form/results are completely irrelevant, participating teams have different objectives and are at variable levels of conditioning.
By the way, I seem to recall that Collingwood's form last pre season was sensational, even getting them touted as Premiership fancies. Aah the folly of attaching any weight to preseason results. I won't even bother talking about Sydney's pre season record under Paul Roos.
We finished 4th in 2008.
We had 12 AA on our list.
Lyon used to tank pre season back then.
Now
We finished 11th in 2017.
No AA players on list.
We're trying our guts out.
We won the pre season comp in 2008 and made the Final in 2010. So did that accidently happen when we intended to tank?
When we finished 4th in 2008 (with 13 wins), we were further behind the top 2 (Hawthorn & Geelong) than we are now.
Whether or not players are AA is subjective. We may have had 12 AAs in 2008, but we also had anywhere up to six players in our best 22 that wouldn't have got a game at many other Clubs and we were light on depth.
Why would we bother to counter Carlton's defensive tactics in a Practice game? The point of the games is conditioning and practicing certain things.
"Trying our guts out" don't know who said that, but get serious! We only occasionally got out of second gear and our defensive pressure was, shall we say relaxed. It was what it was, a glorified training run.
Delusional.
We lost to Carlton because we just aren't very good and our current list isn't that good.
Same reason we ended 2017 in 11th spot.
How is AA 'subjective'? It is entirely objective.
It is an actual thing written on paper.
It is a fact that back then we had 12 actual AA players on our list.
Currently we have zero.
It couldn't be more objective.
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
tony74 wrote:Players recovered pretty well. A few bruises and aches but can be expected after the first hit out. Coaches were pretty annoyed and disappointed but it’s important to stress they weren’t worried. They were really difficult conditions and obviously we butchered the ball going inside 50. Also it’s worth noting that we tried to play our game the whole time whilst Carlton put players back when we had control. They played to win, we played as in a practice match and to try different things. In the real season the tactics would have been different. You’ll see a different match on Thursday as I’m sure No one will try to close the game down.
Have faith Sainters.
Thanks for the info mate.
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
I tried to look for something different to last year.
I failed.
No finals this year.
Yeah it’s one practice game but the holes are too obvious.
I failed.
No finals this year.
Yeah it’s one practice game but the holes are too obvious.
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
Delusional? Teams are generally conditioned for a season and to peak at about Finals time. That's why you get training loads increased about mid season, then a tapering off. It's got nothing to do with taking it easy.Con Gorozidis wrote:You think we are just taking it easy in Feb with our mind on a top 4 in deep September?Linton Lodger wrote:What precisely is your point?Con Gorozidis wrote:ThenLinton Lodger wrote:The negative nancies should also cast their mind back to our pre season in 2009saintspremiers wrote:All you negative nancies remember this - we were missing one of the best players in the AFL - Mr Jack Billings. He’ll be dynamite this year running along side Stuv who can finally run again. Add to that the brute mongrel force of Armo when he’s match conditioned and the midfield becomes serious. And I haven’t even factored in Ross.
It’s all good children.![]()
To refresh memories, we lost to Brisbane in our first match and failed to score in the second half. Then in our Final match, Port Adelaide (who would win 9 games that season) touched us up by 80 odd points. After that, we won our first 20.
Practice match form/results are completely irrelevant, participating teams have different objectives and are at variable levels of conditioning.
By the way, I seem to recall that Collingwood's form last pre season was sensational, even getting them touted as Premiership fancies. Aah the folly of attaching any weight to preseason results. I won't even bother talking about Sydney's pre season record under Paul Roos.
We finished 4th in 2008.
We had 12 AA on our list.
Lyon used to tank pre season back then.
Now
We finished 11th in 2017.
No AA players on list.
We're trying our guts out.
We won the pre season comp in 2008 and made the Final in 2010. So did that accidently happen when we intended to tank?
When we finished 4th in 2008 (with 13 wins), we were further behind the top 2 (Hawthorn & Geelong) than we are now.
Whether or not players are AA is subjective. We may have had 12 AAs in 2008, but we also had anywhere up to six players in our best 22 that wouldn't have got a game at many other Clubs and we were light on depth.
Why would we bother to counter Carlton's defensive tactics in a Practice game? The point of the games is conditioning and practicing certain things.
"Trying our guts out" don't know who said that, but get serious! We only occasionally got out of second gear and our defensive pressure was, shall we say relaxed. It was what it was, a glorified training run.
Delusional.
We lost to Carlton because we just aren't very good and our current list isn't that good.
Same reason we ended 2017 in 11th spot.
How is AA 'subjective'? It is entirely objective.
It is an actual thing written on paper.
It is a fact that back then we had 12 actual AA players on our list.
Currently we have zero.
It couldn't be more objective.
Many teams in development that know they won't be playing Finals and needing to sell memberships and give their supporters something, will prepare the teams to be at optimum early in the season or pre season so they can steal a few wins. They will also play pre season games to win, rather than practice. As Carlton did last night.
Denis Pagan admitted he did this in his tenure at Carlton. Didn't they win back to back pre season comps in seasons of back to back wooden spoons? How do you reckon that happened? Pagan admitted that they prepared their team to win the pre season comp and sell Memberships in seasons they expected to struggle to be competitive.
Why do you reckon Boulton was dropping extra men back in a February practice game?
AA an objective notion? Look up objective in the dictionary. A panel of people select the AA based on their subjective opinions, opinions whether spoken, written down or carved in stone are subjective. Richmond, the Premiers only had 2 AAs last year. One of them Rance, a really good key defender, but not a patch on big Jake Carlisle. Would you bet against Carlisle, Billings, Steven, Roberton or Ross making AA this year? You'd be brave (or foolish) with your money if you did.
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Re: JLT Match Thread Saints v Blues 2018
Looking forward to the "tactics" for a real game that tony74 is mentioning- looked to me last night that we played exactly like the Saints of 2017 when losing games...nothing out of the ordinary or different last night.saynta wrote:tony74 wrote:Players recovered pretty well. A few bruises and aches but can be expected after the first hit out. Coaches were pretty annoyed and disappointed but it’s important to stress they weren’t worried. They were really difficult conditions and obviously we butchered the ball going inside 50. Also it’s worth noting that we tried to play our game the whole time whilst Carlton put players back when we had control. They played to win, we played as in a practice match and to try different things. In the real season the tactics would have been different. You’ll see a different match on Thursday as I’m sure No one will try to close the game down.
Have faith Sainters.
Thanks for the info mate.