time to try Longer?
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time to try Longer?
Hickey pretty poor today, Grundy arguably BOG.
I know Hickey gets a few more possessions around the ground but there weren't too many that went clearly to our advantage.The less hit-outs Bruce contests the happier I will be.
I know Hickey gets a few more possessions around the ground but there weren't too many that went clearly to our advantage.The less hit-outs Bruce contests the happier I will be.
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Re: time to try Longer?
No.whiskers3614 wrote:Hickey pretty poor today, Grundy arguably BOG.
I know Hickey gets a few more possessions around the ground but there weren't too many that went clearly to our advantage.The less hit-outs Bruce contests the happier I will be.
Hickey kept battling and had some important tackles marks and posessions... Grundy won the day but Hickey had some influence himself
Re: time to try Longer?
Thought hickey was serviceable. We know grundy is a better player, the whole comp knows it. Longer would have done no better in the ruck and less around the ground. By reports at sandy bellchambers had our ruck division well covered.
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Re: time to try Longer?
Hickey could be a top 3 ruckman in the comp.
Longer is a back up ruckman, should only play when Hickey is unavailable.
Longer is a back up ruckman, should only play when Hickey is unavailable.
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Re: time to try Longer?
No offense to either of them, but I don't see Longer or Holmesy as the future of this side. I'd rather give Marshall a go and let him rotate with Hickey and give Hickey more of a rest, hopefully that can take his work around the ground up another level.
Re: time to try Longer?
Hickey has been clearly beaten 3 out of the 4 games.
Top 3 ruckman in the comp?
He hasn't even faced
Sandi, Goldstein, Jacobs, Mumford
Top 3 ruckman in the comp?
He hasn't even faced
Sandi, Goldstein, Jacobs, Mumford
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Re: time to try Longer?
is Tom missing Jack?
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Re: time to try Longer?
Hickey not going awesome but he is still our best by a mile.BigMart wrote:Hickey has been clearly beaten 3 out of the 4 games.
Top 3 ruckman in the comp?
He hasn't even faced
Sandi, Goldstein, Jacobs, Mumford
Longer unable to even get a kick in the VFL.
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Re: time to try Longer?
In the five senior games Holmes has had he has been okay. How is he doing in the VFL. and is he getting much of a go?
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Re: time to try Longer?
In the five senior games Holmes has had he has been okay. How is he doing in the VFL. and is he getting much of a go?
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Re: time to try Longer?
Milne wrote:Longer is a liability around the ground IMO. Hickey was beaten today but is definitely our no.1 ruckman.
Because Hickey was so dominant today around the ground. Got smashed by Grundy...
Longer would be a monster in the ruck. Ten times more important.
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Re: time to try Longer?
Vazelos wrote:Longer toiled at Sandringham yesterday he is not the answer...
Lewis has a bigger future...
Wasn't from where I was standing. Up against experience AFL players too.
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Re: time to try Longer?
I've been backing Hickey since he arrived and I still think he can be one of the competitions top rucks.
But, he's getting beaten at the moment. Whether it's a form slump, injury, confidence or fatigue, I think Hickey may need a spell in the VFL and Longer may warrant a recall.
But, he's getting beaten at the moment. Whether it's a form slump, injury, confidence or fatigue, I think Hickey may need a spell in the VFL and Longer may warrant a recall.
Bad management is bad management
Re: time to try Longer?
Maybe give Hickey a week off to regroup. By week off I mean no footy at all. Give either Longer or Holmes a game and see how they go. It can't hurt.
Re: time to try Longer?
Hickey has one major weakness - he is a good footballer, as I underestimated initially because I was judging him as a ruckman
But the reasons I didn't rate him initially are starting to show
It's nothing about his talent, he's got a fair bit
It's to do with his strength and size - he's rake thin
He just gets belted one on one in Ruck duels which makes our mids reactive rather than proactive and we get belted at stoppage
I made my controversial call after Spencer and Mumford well over double hit outs against him 3 year back. Longer was bought in and bought it back to 50/50
I have a new idea/theory wrt Hickey for 2017
But the reasons I didn't rate him initially are starting to show
It's nothing about his talent, he's got a fair bit
It's to do with his strength and size - he's rake thin
He just gets belted one on one in Ruck duels which makes our mids reactive rather than proactive and we get belted at stoppage
I made my controversial call after Spencer and Mumford well over double hit outs against him 3 year back. Longer was bought in and bought it back to 50/50
I have a new idea/theory wrt Hickey for 2017
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Re: time to try Longer?
I guess if we're not going to play Paddy it makes playing two rucks a possibility.
Re: time to try Longer?
It's completely against my initial philosophy but I have reconsidered due to Paddy
I think Paddy needs to play close to an entire year in the vfl and be made to earn his spot... also Dunstan and Lonie
They need to get fitter
I think out Ruck should become our strength
We have a lot on inside mids who would benefit from 28mins of effective Ruck work
Currently we have
23 mins of Hickey (about 10 mins of Hickey exhausted, which increases every Q)
5 mins of Bruce
Per Quarter
We are lucky enough to have Nick Riewoldt... so lets utilise that strength
What I think is this
16mins of Longer
12 mins of Hickey
Hickey deep forward for 8 mins
Longer deep forward for 4 mins
Riewoldt Forward for 12 mins Wing for 12 mins 4mins rest
Mobile forward Line for 4 mins with Acres as the 3rd
This way
Longer can crash and bash the opposition #1 ruckman for two spells of 8 mins
Hickey can then either take full advantage of a tired ruckman or smash a part timer and really give our mids something...
Few clubs go with two ruckman, why copy them... use the fact we have a good #2 to our advantage. It will compensated the loss of the mobile player.
I think our front half should look like this
Membrey/Weller (Stevens/Acres)
Long/Minchington (Gresham)
Bruce
Hickey (Longer/Riewoldt)
In this set up The lowest tall forward becomes the anchor, Weller looks after the dangerous HB, The two smalls have obvious roles, Bruce gets a bit more room as he plays a touch higher, Membrey plays as the link
Spitter can be
Mav, Long, Minch, Joey, even Jack Steven
Hickey has sticky hands and is more mobile than Paddy anyway
Longer is slow, but will contest and bring it to ground,
Roo is a star
McCartin plays if Bruce is injured and/or the opposition don't have a decent ruckman... and Hickey can handle them
If Longer cannot fulfill this role
Marshall forward
And
Hickey back to #1
I think Paddy needs to play close to an entire year in the vfl and be made to earn his spot... also Dunstan and Lonie
They need to get fitter
I think out Ruck should become our strength
We have a lot on inside mids who would benefit from 28mins of effective Ruck work
Currently we have
23 mins of Hickey (about 10 mins of Hickey exhausted, which increases every Q)
5 mins of Bruce
Per Quarter
We are lucky enough to have Nick Riewoldt... so lets utilise that strength
What I think is this
16mins of Longer
12 mins of Hickey
Hickey deep forward for 8 mins
Longer deep forward for 4 mins
Riewoldt Forward for 12 mins Wing for 12 mins 4mins rest
Mobile forward Line for 4 mins with Acres as the 3rd
This way
Longer can crash and bash the opposition #1 ruckman for two spells of 8 mins
Hickey can then either take full advantage of a tired ruckman or smash a part timer and really give our mids something...
Few clubs go with two ruckman, why copy them... use the fact we have a good #2 to our advantage. It will compensated the loss of the mobile player.
I think our front half should look like this
Membrey/Weller (Stevens/Acres)
Long/Minchington (Gresham)
Bruce
Hickey (Longer/Riewoldt)
In this set up The lowest tall forward becomes the anchor, Weller looks after the dangerous HB, The two smalls have obvious roles, Bruce gets a bit more room as he plays a touch higher, Membrey plays as the link
Spitter can be
Mav, Long, Minch, Joey, even Jack Steven
Hickey has sticky hands and is more mobile than Paddy anyway
Longer is slow, but will contest and bring it to ground,
Roo is a star
McCartin plays if Bruce is injured and/or the opposition don't have a decent ruckman... and Hickey can handle them
If Longer cannot fulfill this role
Marshall forward
And
Hickey back to #1
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Re: time to try Longer?
A lot to like in that very in depth analysis Mart. My only problem is, Billy.BigMart wrote:... Longer can crash and bash the opposition #1 ruckman for two spells of 8 mins
Hickey can then either take full advantage of a tired ruckman or smash a part timer and really give our mids something...
Few clubs go with two ruckman, why copy them... use the fact we have a good #2 to our advantage. It will compensate the loss of the mobile player...
If Longer cannot fulfill this role Marshall forward Hickey back to #1
I'd be playing anyone, yes, anyone, on our list ahead of Billy. Can't mark. Not much of a kick. (I don't know if he can handball? So no comment there.) Sure, competes in the ruck, but doesn't actually win many taps. Holmesy would get at least as many possessions as Billy, whilst winning more and better tap outs. Basically, we're pretty much playing one man short. Sorry Billy, but I'd rate you as the worst player on our list.
I was disappointed when we failed to trade him out last season - as now the rest of the league will doubtless cotton-on soon.
I'm also aware however that some astute Saintsational observers have said the Billy is now over his injuries, and is ready to surprise. I'm hoping to be surprised.
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