What I learned from the Port game
Moderators: Saintsational Administrators, Saintsational Moderators
- Winmar7
- Club Player
- Posts: 230
- Joined: Fri 23 Apr 2004 5:42pm
- Location: Melbourne
- Has thanked: 13 times
- Been thanked: 40 times
What I learned from the Port game
Because you can't write an article these days unless it's about something you learned...
Our first goal was one of the plays of the year!
The umps still have no feel for the game (especially no. 21 - Geary deliberate out of bounds?!)
Westoff's beard is still ridiculous, someone buy that man a razor blade an mirror
Lonie tried hard, but the jury is out...
Bruce can mark the ball - if the delivery is good
Paddy McCartin is the new Lenny, as far as supporter love (and goodwill) goes
Docklands is much better with the roof open
Anyone who paid $20 admission deserves a refund
Krakouer needs lesson on going in for the hard ball
The new jumper looks ok, especially no.2
Nobody knows (or cares) what JLT do & NAB cup is easier to say
I'm not KB, but that's my take
Our first goal was one of the plays of the year!
The umps still have no feel for the game (especially no. 21 - Geary deliberate out of bounds?!)
Westoff's beard is still ridiculous, someone buy that man a razor blade an mirror
Lonie tried hard, but the jury is out...
Bruce can mark the ball - if the delivery is good
Paddy McCartin is the new Lenny, as far as supporter love (and goodwill) goes
Docklands is much better with the roof open
Anyone who paid $20 admission deserves a refund
Krakouer needs lesson on going in for the hard ball
The new jumper looks ok, especially no.2
Nobody knows (or cares) what JLT do & NAB cup is easier to say
I'm not KB, but that's my take
- Life Long Saint
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 5533
- Joined: Tue 09 Mar 2004 12:54pm
- Has thanked: 62 times
- Been thanked: 483 times
- Contact:
Re: What I learned from the Port game
If this is the standard the umps are going to set then the game has gone to the dogs.Winmar7 wrote:The umps still have no feel for the game (especially no. 21 - Geary deliberate out of bounds?!)
That deliberate OOB decision was the worst I've seen since the Montagna one in Brisbane a number of years ago.
Re: What I learned from the Port game
1. Delivery into forward line was poor.
2. Carlisle needs to actually hold tackles and marks (but okfor first game back) .
3. Lonie will be fine, you're expecting way to much.
4. Ryders beard is 100 times worse than Westoff.
5. Rapid movement / game in the first half.
2. Carlisle needs to actually hold tackles and marks (but okfor first game back) .
3. Lonie will be fine, you're expecting way to much.
4. Ryders beard is 100 times worse than Westoff.
5. Rapid movement / game in the first half.
- skeptic
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 17024
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 7:10pm
- Has thanked: 3645 times
- Been thanked: 2916 times
Re: What I learned from the Port game
1. Shane Savage is a serious worry in my opinion.
He's in the team to be a play maker and he seems to lack composure and smarts... very concerning when you consider that we know he's weaker than others in the backline at the defensive aspect of his game.
He's my official under the microscope player for 2017
He's in the team to be a play maker and he seems to lack composure and smarts... very concerning when you consider that we know he's weaker than others in the backline at the defensive aspect of his game.
He's my official under the microscope player for 2017
- White Winmar
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 5014
- Joined: Tue 02 Jun 2009 10:02pm
Re: What I learned from the Port game
Plus one, Skeptic. He faces some strong competition for his spot.
I started with nothing and I've got most of it left!
- WellardSaint
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 8371
- Joined: Sat 26 May 2012 11:25am
- Location: Perth- the best weather in Oz, but the worst rednecks.
- Has thanked: 1906 times
- Been thanked: 883 times
Re: What I learned from the Port game
There have been times when Gears used to quite often kick poorly out of defence, and caused the ball to come back with interest, or he would hold the ball for 2 seconds too long, and get caught;skeptic wrote:1. Shane Savage is a serious worry in my opinion.
He's in the team to be a play maker and he seems to lack composure and smarts... very concerning when you consider that we know he's weaker than others in the backline at the defensive aspect of his game.
He's my official under the microscope player for 2017
those habit seems to have dissipated last year.
His many supporters say it was not usually his fault, as team-mates had not run to position correctly, and not supporting him, thus putting undue pressure on him;
and an improved understanding and/or different gameplan/tactics from the team in 2016 are the reasons for the purple patch.
I don't believe (and I could be wrong) that Savage can be excused in a similar way.
Just in my own memory, his fumbles and turnovers appear to be an ongoing issue, and have not improved at all.
Gears seems to perform helicopter kicks, but Shane can kick much better and further, therefore increasing the number of potential targets.
Shane doesn't appear to think quickly and is easily pressured. A defender needs to be composed under pressure or he is a liability, no matter how nicely he kicks the Sherrin.
A real Sainter will pledge allegiance to the ❤ and despise the Pies, the Blues, and the Injectors.
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
- White Winmar
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 5014
- Joined: Tue 02 Jun 2009 10:02pm
Re: What I learned from the Port game
No doubt, they're good stats, dragit. A bit the same as Gears was accused of being. The gap between best and worst is very wide. If he's on, he's very important. It'll be interesting to see what role they settle him into. I don't think he's a lock for round 1 by any means.dragit wrote:Was Savage no good last night?
14 kicks
4 HB
94 % eff
9 marks
4 i50
I started with nothing and I've got most of it left!
- skeptic
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 17024
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 7:10pm
- Has thanked: 3645 times
- Been thanked: 2916 times
Re: What I learned from the Port game
To add to this, Geary is not in the team as a playmaker.WellardSaint wrote:There have been times when Gears used to quite often kick poorly out of defence, and caused the ball to come back with interest, or he would hold the ball for 2 seconds too long, and get caught;skeptic wrote:1. Shane Savage is a serious worry in my opinion.
He's in the team to be a play maker and he seems to lack composure and smarts... very concerning when you consider that we know he's weaker than others in the backline at the defensive aspect of his game.
He's my official under the microscope player for 2017
those habit seems to have dissipated last year.
His many supporters say it was not usually his fault, as team-mates had not run to position correctly, and not supporting him, thus putting undue pressure on him;
and an improved understanding and/or different gameplan/tactics from the team in 2016 are the reasons for the purple patch.
I don't believe (and I could be wrong) that Savage can be excused in a similar way.
Just in my own memory, his fumbles and turnovers appear to be an ongoing issue, and have not improved at all.
Gears seems to perform helicopter kicks, but Shane can kick much better and further, therefore increasing the number of potential targets.
Shane doesn't appear to think quickly and is easily pressured. A defender needs to be composed under pressure or he is a liability, no matter how nicely he kicks the Sherrin.
Whilst Geary's disposal comes into the spot light at times, his defenders often point out that regardless of the odd clanger, he almost always beat his man.
Add to that that in the second half of the season, at least to some degree, instances of bad turnovers from Geary reduced substantially.
I think a good prototype model player for Savage is Aussie Jones or perhaps a Leon Davis (when he was a half back)... with those players, you were never expecting that their opponents wouldn't on occasion exploit their lack of accountability. Rather, you back them into to do more damage to them then their opponents did to your own team.
My real worry here is that Savage is simply not damaging enough and it's costing us run.
HBF to me is an area of real concern. You're looking for players that are either really good defenders or provide heaps of run... I feel like we have too many types that don't excel at either.
Savage
Webster
Gilbert
Not loving these guys.
Lonie tried last night and by all accounts wasn't great.
Roberton seems to have stepped up.
Newnes improving all the time
Lot of buzz about Dmac at the moment.
Am very keen to start getting more of a look at guys like White, Rice, Sinclair (on a HBF), and Ben Long too
Last edited by skeptic on Fri 24 Feb 2017 4:58pm, edited 1 time in total.
- WellardSaint
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 8371
- Joined: Sat 26 May 2012 11:25am
- Location: Perth- the best weather in Oz, but the worst rednecks.
- Has thanked: 1906 times
- Been thanked: 883 times
Re: What I learned from the Port game
Adam Kingsley's member exclusive email
Ahhh he is hard-wired to speak a dialect of English- Richospeak.
Pleasing, positive, strong, yadayadayada
Good to see the coaches singing from the same hymn-book.
Ahhh he is hard-wired to speak a dialect of English- Richospeak.
Pleasing, positive, strong, yadayadayada
Good to see the coaches singing from the same hymn-book.
A real Sainter will pledge allegiance to the ❤ and despise the Pies, the Blues, and the Injectors.
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
-
- SS Life Member
- Posts: 3266
- Joined: Fri 16 Mar 2007 4:05pm
- Been thanked: 390 times
Re: What I learned from the Port game
A few observations, recognizing it was the first practice match of the season against an opponent.
A class above - Jack Steven
Will be a class above - Carlisle
Cemented his spot just in case there was ever any doubt - Dunstan
McCartin, Bruce and Membrey took some marks early but post the early going disposal was not to their advantage and PA were too easily able to mark in defence. Generally disposal into the F50 was errant and straight to PA players whilst field disposal fell away to poor.
Gresham had an impact in the mid-field against an increasing domination by PA, with only Dunstan and Gresham impacting after Steven left the contest.
The rucks generally competed but, as the match wore on, not to the advantage of our support.
Dempster took a good mark, setting himself but only having a right foot told against him.
Lonie, Savage and McKenzie are under immediate pressure.
Wright is ultra quick - and fierce at it.
There were a few who were honest.
Geary had a nice one-two in the first quarter and after that touched the ball in the last. To let your opponent come off the Inter-change, look at him whilst on your Pat Malone 100 metres from anyone and then see the PA player run to a forward pocket, mark with no opponent and goal was perplexing. Needs to do what he is reputed to do. Captain or not.
Gilbert was at full back on a shorter opponent, got forward for a shot on goal and crashed some packs to spoil. A good floating defensive mark aka Dempster's effort.
Roberton performed well.
No 9 was seen in the first half because he was wearing No 9 (ie looking for him to make an impact). Similarly No 25 who did not excel on a forward flank.
Brown looked smaller than his stats (perhaps because of Carlisle) and was honest.
Roo had a run around.
Billings best is there abouts but he appeared to tire.
Armo - ditto Roo
Was there a change of focus after the first quarter to see how we respond defensively when there is a run on against us?
These are practice matches after all.
A while since we have beaten PA - anywhere!
One of the sides we have to beat in the regular season.
A class above - Jack Steven
Will be a class above - Carlisle
Cemented his spot just in case there was ever any doubt - Dunstan
McCartin, Bruce and Membrey took some marks early but post the early going disposal was not to their advantage and PA were too easily able to mark in defence. Generally disposal into the F50 was errant and straight to PA players whilst field disposal fell away to poor.
Gresham had an impact in the mid-field against an increasing domination by PA, with only Dunstan and Gresham impacting after Steven left the contest.
The rucks generally competed but, as the match wore on, not to the advantage of our support.
Dempster took a good mark, setting himself but only having a right foot told against him.
Lonie, Savage and McKenzie are under immediate pressure.
Wright is ultra quick - and fierce at it.
There were a few who were honest.
Geary had a nice one-two in the first quarter and after that touched the ball in the last. To let your opponent come off the Inter-change, look at him whilst on your Pat Malone 100 metres from anyone and then see the PA player run to a forward pocket, mark with no opponent and goal was perplexing. Needs to do what he is reputed to do. Captain or not.
Gilbert was at full back on a shorter opponent, got forward for a shot on goal and crashed some packs to spoil. A good floating defensive mark aka Dempster's effort.
Roberton performed well.
No 9 was seen in the first half because he was wearing No 9 (ie looking for him to make an impact). Similarly No 25 who did not excel on a forward flank.
Brown looked smaller than his stats (perhaps because of Carlisle) and was honest.
Roo had a run around.
Billings best is there abouts but he appeared to tire.
Armo - ditto Roo
Was there a change of focus after the first quarter to see how we respond defensively when there is a run on against us?
These are practice matches after all.
A while since we have beaten PA - anywhere!
One of the sides we have to beat in the regular season.
-
- SS Life Member
- Posts: 3266
- Joined: Fri 16 Mar 2007 4:05pm
- Been thanked: 390 times
Re: What I learned from the Port game
Just on Carlisle - a mistake not punching when the player is in front of you but he backed himself to out mark, but the opponent had hands on it first.
But what did impress me was his "nouse" and ability to spread and hem a smaller, quicker player into the boundary line a couple of times.
He knows what he is about.
But what did impress me was his "nouse" and ability to spread and hem a smaller, quicker player into the boundary line a couple of times.
He knows what he is about.
- WellardSaint
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 8371
- Joined: Sat 26 May 2012 11:25am
- Location: Perth- the best weather in Oz, but the worst rednecks.
- Has thanked: 1906 times
- Been thanked: 883 times
Re: What I learned from the Port game
disagree. You have to go for your marks. He has damn good hands, and has to trust his own judgement.To the top wrote:Just on Carlisle - a mistake not punching when the player is in front of you but he backed himself to out mark, but the opponent had hands on it first.
But what did impress me was his "nouse" and ability to spread and hem a smaller, quicker player into the boundary line a couple of times.
He knows what he is about.
First practice game, no big deal.
Agree on pushing a player to the line, it's great how he could do that, even after a year out and with some sort of hip problem; hope this shows he's physically tip-top
A real Sainter will pledge allegiance to the ❤ and despise the Pies, the Blues, and the Injectors.
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
-
- SS Life Member
- Posts: 3266
- Joined: Fri 16 Mar 2007 4:05pm
- Been thanked: 390 times
Re: What I learned from the Port game
And on Savage, 9 marks when the ball was chipped to him. PA put front on pressure on him as a recognized "rebounder" hence the reviews of his performance.
You have to be careful about statistics in this nonsense statistic age fueled by the "fantasy" crap.
"Fantasy" does not win footy games.
You have to be careful about statistics in this nonsense statistic age fueled by the "fantasy" crap.
"Fantasy" does not win footy games.
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 4564
- Joined: Thu 20 May 2010 11:49pm
- Has thanked: 120 times
- Been thanked: 314 times
Re: What I learned from the Port game
McCartin - this will be shooting Bambi
Slow and runs out of puff ... three occasions his opponent ran straight past him. Could not get separation after q time
The supposed body transformation hasn't really occurred.. some are just hopeful. He is still a lump, he's heavy set with a lot of puppy fat still.
Not condemning him, he has obvious ability, will make inroads and end up a player imo
But this leaner and fitter Paddy was not on show last night.
His body compared to Bruce, Nick, Membrey and most AFL players is completely different. Very little definition, very little in the way of second efforts as yet.
Slow and runs out of puff ... three occasions his opponent ran straight past him. Could not get separation after q time
The supposed body transformation hasn't really occurred.. some are just hopeful. He is still a lump, he's heavy set with a lot of puppy fat still.
Not condemning him, he has obvious ability, will make inroads and end up a player imo
But this leaner and fitter Paddy was not on show last night.
His body compared to Bruce, Nick, Membrey and most AFL players is completely different. Very little definition, very little in the way of second efforts as yet.
- Impatient Sainter
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 4089
- Joined: Tue 05 Apr 2016 3:30pm
- Has thanked: 2622 times
- Been thanked: 1078 times
Re: What I learned from the Port game
1. We supporters have over rated our list - we still have a very slow and poor midfield.
2. Too many unskilled players in defence.
3. Still cant deliver to our forwards.
4. Paddy McCartin has never heard of forward pressure let alone applying it.
5. We are still a long way off being a highly skilled and sucessful team.
2. Too many unskilled players in defence.
3. Still cant deliver to our forwards.
4. Paddy McCartin has never heard of forward pressure let alone applying it.
5. We are still a long way off being a highly skilled and sucessful team.
Re: What I learned from the Port game
Harsh but probably fair
We are very 'North Melbourne' of recent times
A very solid team/list with a lot of good players. We bat deep with goodish players...we are a blue collar team
We are very 'North Melbourne' of recent times
A very solid team/list with a lot of good players. We bat deep with goodish players...we are a blue collar team
-
- SS Hall of Fame
- Posts: 2203
- Joined: Wed 19 Aug 2009 10:32pm
- Location: Del Mar, California
- Has thanked: 34 times
- Been thanked: 237 times
Re: What I learned from the Port game
Agree with all of this, however I reckon we're not using him properly. Paddy is the closest St Kilda player I've seen in the mould of the great Tony Locket. He's a similar size and body shape, has strong hands, is a good kick at goal and a smart footballer.BigMart wrote:McCartin - this will be shooting Bambi
Slow and runs out of puff ... three occasions his opponent ran straight past him. Could not get separation after q time
The supposed body transformation hasn't really occurred.. some are just hopeful. He is still a lump, he's heavy set with a lot of puppy fat still.
Not condemning him, he has obvious ability, will make inroads and end up a player imo
But this leaner and fitter Paddy was not on show last night.
His body compared to Bruce, Nick, Membrey and most AFL players is completely different. Very little definition, very little in the way of second efforts as yet.
Granted it was a different era, but Plugger lived in the goal square. Paddy, on the other hand spends a significant portion of time up on the wing or back flank. I just reckon if we kept him forward, one out against an opposition defender, he would be way more potent. As an added benefit he'd straighten up our forward entries.
If I close my eyes I can still see Plugger on the lead, and if I squint a little I can see Paddy in the same role. Perhaps I'm dreaming.
- saintsRrising
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 30094
- Joined: Mon 15 Mar 2004 11:07am
- Location: Melbourne
- Has thanked: 711 times
- Been thanked: 1234 times
Re: What I learned from the Port game
No one said that his "body transformation" was complete. However he is in better shape than he was when he joined us.BigMart wrote:McCartin - this will be shooting Bambi
Slow and runs out of puff ... three occasions his opponent ran straight past him. Could not get separation after q time
The supposed body transformation hasn't really occurred.. some are just hopeful. He is still a lump, he's heavy set with a lot of puppy fat still.
.
Flying the World in comfort thanks to FF Points....
- magnifisaint
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 8134
- Joined: Sun 02 May 2004 2:52am
- Has thanked: 227 times
- Been thanked: 608 times
Re: What I learned from the Port game
You're right. He's a full forward so he shouldn't be running up to the wings taking marks. He should be a deep target.Toy Saint wrote:Agree with all of this, however I reckon we're not using him properly. Paddy is the closest St Kilda player I've seen in the mould of the great Tony Locket. He's a similar size and body shape, has strong hands, is a good kick at goal and a smart footballer.BigMart wrote:McCartin - this will be shooting Bambi
Slow and runs out of puff ... three occasions his opponent ran straight past him. Could not get separation after q time
The supposed body transformation hasn't really occurred.. some are just hopeful. He is still a lump, he's heavy set with a lot of puppy fat still.
Not condemning him, he has obvious ability, will make inroads and end up a player imo
But this leaner and fitter Paddy was not on show last night.
His body compared to Bruce, Nick, Membrey and most AFL players is completely different. Very little definition, very little in the way of second efforts as yet.
Granted it was a different era, but Plugger lived in the goal square. Paddy, on the other hand spends a significant portion of time up on the wing or back flank. I just reckon if we kept him forward, one out against an opposition defender, he would be way more potent. As an added benefit he'd straighten up our forward entries.
If I close my eyes I can still see Plugger on the lead, and if I squint a little I can see Paddy in the same role. Perhaps I'm dreaming.
Posting 20 years of holey crap!
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 1429
- Joined: Tue 22 Sep 2009 8:23am
- Has thanked: 10 times
- Been thanked: 94 times
Re: What I learned from the Port game
Sorry to say after the Dmac buzz I thought he was very disappointing last night - first game of the season so that's ok but wasn't good IMOskeptic wrote:To add to this, Geary is not in the team as a playmaker.WellardSaint wrote:There have been times when Gears used to quite often kick poorly out of defence, and caused the ball to come back with interest, or he would hold the ball for 2 seconds too long, and get caught;skeptic wrote:1. Shane Savage is a serious worry in my opinion.
He's in the team to be a play maker and he seems to lack composure and smarts... very concerning when you consider that we know he's weaker than others in the backline at the defensive aspect of his game.
He's my official under the microscope player for 2017
those habit seems to have dissipated last year.
His many supporters say it was not usually his fault, as team-mates had not run to position correctly, and not supporting him, thus putting undue pressure on him;
and an improved understanding and/or different gameplan/tactics from the team in 2016 are the reasons for the purple patch.
I don't believe (and I could be wrong) that Savage can be excused in a similar way.
Just in my own memory, his fumbles and turnovers appear to be an ongoing issue, and have not improved at all.
Gears seems to perform helicopter kicks, but Shane can kick much better and further, therefore increasing the number of potential targets.
Shane doesn't appear to think quickly and is easily pressured. A defender needs to be composed under pressure or he is a liability, no matter how nicely he kicks the Sherrin.
Whilst Geary's disposal comes into the spot light at times, his defenders often point out that regardless of the odd clanger, he almost always beat his man.
Add to that that in the second half of the season, at least to some degree, instances of bad turnovers from Geary reduced substantially.
I think a good prototype model player for Savage is Aussie Jones or perhaps a Leon Davis (when he was a half back)... with those players, you were never expecting that their opponents wouldn't on occasion exploit their lack of accountability. Rather, you back them into to do more damage to them then their opponents did to your own team.
My real worry here is that Savage is simply not damaging enough and it's costing us run.
HBF to me is an area of real concern. You're looking for players that are either really good defenders or provide heaps of run... I feel like we have too many types that don't excel at either.
Savage
Webster
Gilbert
Not loving these guys.
Lonie tried last night and by all accounts wasn't great.
Roberton seems to have stepped up.
Newnes improving all the time
Lot of buzz about Dmac at the moment.
Am very keen to start getting more of a look at guys like White, Rice, Sinclair (on a HBF), and Ben Long too
Newnes kicking was terrible last night also - same thing first game back so no panic - would have had a great game if his kicking was top notch
Roberton I think has been underrated and was again very good
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 6607
- Joined: Sat 11 Jun 2011 4:52pm
- Location: Here
- Has thanked: 1323 times
- Been thanked: 467 times
Re: What I learned from the Port game
We're actually wearing white collars this year.BigMart wrote:Harsh but probably fair
We are very 'North Melbourne' of recent times
A very solid team/list with a lot of good players. We bat deep with goodish players...we are a blue collar team
As ex-president Peter Summers said:
“If we are going to be a contender, we may as well plan to win the bloody thing.”
St Kilda - At least we have a Crest!
“If we are going to be a contender, we may as well plan to win the bloody thing.”
St Kilda - At least we have a Crest!
- saintsRrising
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 30094
- Joined: Mon 15 Mar 2004 11:07am
- Location: Melbourne
- Has thanked: 711 times
- Been thanked: 1234 times
Re: What I learned from the Port game
While yes he will be a key forward target, these days ALL players have to be able to run. Both for attack and defense.magnifisaint wrote: You're right. He's a full forward so he shouldn't be running up to the wings taking marks. He should be a deep target.
Flying the World in comfort thanks to FF Points....
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 882
- Joined: Tue 04 Oct 2011 10:58pm
- Location: qld
- Has thanked: 17 times
- Been thanked: 48 times
Re: What I learned from the Port game
Geary is a very ordinary player. ..always has been. ..always will be .
nothing to say