Saad - was it all PR?

[dragit]

Have we really got great PR from it? Fair price to pay if that was the reason, I don't think that was why we took him.

He has played some very good football at AFL level, which is more than most rookies or even draftees can ever say.

While I was one of the keen ones to get him back, like everyone else, this was prior to upgrading Minchingotn, Templeton, drafting Lonie and rookying Sinclair & Schneider.

While Saad isn't looking great right now, I still have no problem him being rookied… but we really have brought in way too many of a similar type of player. In hindsight Saad looks like a mistake because he won't get a game ahead of Lonie & Sinclair and he's older.

I think the worst thing for Saad was playing seniors so early... after missing 18 months he really needed to build up both match fitness and a feel for the game again at VFL level. I reckon if we hadn't of seen him yet at AFL level yet and he was kicking bags of 4 goals consistently, a lot of people would be calling for him to be picked.

I'm not writing off Saad yet, he has a few elite weapons but clearly needs to work on a few glaring deficiencies in his game too, tackles and disposals have to come up.

I think a bigger mistake will be upgrading Minchington if they aren't going to actually play him when he has solid VFL form and can't get past 3 rookies for a game. Shenton too, while he going okay, he's probably not a player of the future and we already have a bunch of guys to play that medium defensive role.

[Con Gorozidis]

Isnt Minch on the list already?
How is he emergency.
Also Shents as well?
I thought our rookies were S S S plus Holmes and Payne?

[gringo]

Have we really got great PR from it? Fair price to pay if that was the reason, I don't think that was why we took him.

He has played some very good football at AFL level, which is more than most rookies or even draftees can ever say.

While I was one of the keen ones to get him back, like everyone else, this was prior to upgrading Minchingotn, Templeton, drafting Lonie and rookying Sinclair & Schneider.

While Saad isn't looking great right now, I still have no problem him being rookied… but we really have brought in way too many of a similar type of player. In hindsight Saad looks like a mistake because he won't get a game ahead of Lonie & Sinclair and he's older.

I think the worst thing for Saad was playing seniors so early... after missing 18 months he really needed to build up both match fitness and a feel for the game again at VFL level. I reckon if we hadn't of seen him yet at AFL level yet and he was kicking bags of 4 goals consistently, a lot of people would be calling for him to be picked.

I'm not writing off Saad yet, he has a few elite weapons but clearly needs to work on a few glaring deficiencies in his game too, tackles and disposals have to come up.

I think a bigger mistake will be upgrading Minchington if they aren't going to actually play him when he has solid VFL form and can't get past 3 rookies for a game. Shenton too, while he going okay, he's probably not a player of the future and we already have a bunch of guys to play that medium defensive role.

I'm not sure on Shenton, I think he will keep getting games as he offers something different to a lot of the others like Webster, Dempster etc. He takes the game on a lot more than Dempster and his output is higher than Webster ATM. He stuffs some things up but he also adds a lot of drive to the team. It is a strange hysteria that takes over for players to become a whipping boy. It was really one game this year where he turned over a couple of kicks trying to break the lines and the ball came back in quickly for opposition goals. His decision making needs some work but he does some really good things too. The reason guys like him keep getting games despite internet experts rushing to send him away is that they review every bit of footage and data and rate the players on actual performance not the "vibe" fans get. I wrote off Jason Blake as being not up to it for the first 5 years and still got a lump in my throat every time he had the ball down back but he proved me wrong. Acres, Mc kenzie and Webster are probably hot on his heels but there is also some chance they will end up elsewhere on the ground. Shenton is very good at providing an option so is often the guy who gets the ball from Dempster or Delaney, it's usually the next link where it falls down when no one finds space so he is forced to have a searching run then bomb over the midfield. It often gets turned over at that point.

[plugger66]

Have we really got great PR from it? Fair price to pay if that was the reason, I don't think that was why we took him.

He has played some very good football at AFL level, which is more than most rookies or even draftees can ever say.

While I was one of the keen ones to get him back, like everyone else, this was prior to upgrading Minchingotn, Templeton, drafting Lonie and rookying Sinclair & Schneider.

While Saad isn't looking great right now, I still have no problem him being rookied… but we really have brought in way too many of a similar type of player. In hindsight Saad looks like a mistake because he won't get a game ahead of Lonie & Sinclair and he's older.

I think the worst thing for Saad was playing seniors so early... after missing 18 months he really needed to build up both match fitness and a feel for the game again at VFL level. I reckon if we hadn't of seen him yet at AFL level yet and he was kicking bags of 4 goals consistently, a lot of people would be calling for him to be picked.

I'm not writing off Saad yet, he has a few elite weapons but clearly needs to work on a few glaring deficiencies in his game too, tackles and disposals have to come up.

I think a bigger mistake will be upgrading Minchington if they aren't going to actually play him when he has solid VFL form and can't get past 3 rookies for a game. Shenton too, while he going okay, he's probably not a player of the future and we already have a bunch of guys to play that medium defensive role.

I'm not sure on Shenton, I think he will keep getting games as he offers something different to a lot of the others like Webster, Dempster etc. He takes the game on a lot more than Dempster and his output is higher than Webster ATM. He stuffs some things up but he also adds a lot of drive to the team. It is a strange hysteria that takes over for players to become a whipping boy. It was really one game this year where he turned over a couple of kicks trying to break the lines and the ball came back in quickly for opposition goals. His decision making needs some work but he does some really good things too. The reason guys like him keep getting games despite internet experts rushing to send him away is that they review every bit of footage and data and rate the players on actual performance not the "vibe" fans get. I wrote off Jason Blake as being not up to it for the first 5 years and still got a lump in my throat every time he had the ball down back but he proved me wrong. Acres, Mc kenzie and Webster are probably hot on his heels but there is also some chance they will end up elsewhere on the ground. Shenton is very good at providing an option so is often the guy who gets the ball from Dempster or Delaney, it's usually the next link where it falls down when no one finds space so he is forced to have a searching run then bomb over the midfield. It often gets turned over at that point.

The one thing I will say about you gringo is you are loyal to every saints player and only see good instead of bad. The problem with that is we will never improve if you think we should keep players like Saad and Shenton. Apart from Weller I think we played far to safe with the rookie upgrades last year and even the rookies we took last year. Yep you know what you get but you aren't getting players that will take you up the ladder. I would rather take a punt and fail than take no punt at all. I suppose that's why I love gambling.

[dragit]

Isnt Minch on the list already?
How is he emergency.
Also Shents as well?
I thought our rookies were S S S plus Holmes and Payne?

Sorry mate, I'm not sure what you're asking here?

I'm just putting the Saad "mistake" in context to other list moves…

Minch was upgraded, is playing well in the two's but we are preferring 3 small forwards from the rookie list over him, if they don't intend on playing him then he was a waste of a spot on the main list.

I think Saad was strange choice after upgrading Minch & Templeton, then drafting Lonie & Sinclair, while planning to also rookie Schneider.

[gringo]

Have we really got great PR from it? Fair price to pay if that was the reason, I don't think that was why we took him.

He has played some very good football at AFL level, which is more than most rookies or even draftees can ever say.

While I was one of the keen ones to get him back, like everyone else, this was prior to upgrading Minchingotn, Templeton, drafting Lonie and rookying Sinclair & Schneider.

While Saad isn't looking great right now, I still have no problem him being rookied… but we really have brought in way too many of a similar type of player. In hindsight Saad looks like a mistake because he won't get a game ahead of Lonie & Sinclair and he's older.

I think the worst thing for Saad was playing seniors so early... after missing 18 months he really needed to build up both match fitness and a feel for the game again at VFL level. I reckon if we hadn't of seen him yet at AFL level yet and he was kicking bags of 4 goals consistently, a lot of people would be calling for him to be picked.

I'm not writing off Saad yet, he has a few elite weapons but clearly needs to work on a few glaring deficiencies in his game too, tackles and disposals have to come up.

I think a bigger mistake will be upgrading Minchington if they aren't going to actually play him when he has solid VFL form and can't get past 3 rookies for a game. Shenton too, while he going okay, he's probably not a player of the future and we already have a bunch of guys to play that medium defensive role.

I'm not sure on Shenton, I think he will keep getting games as he offers something different to a lot of the others like Webster, Dempster etc. He takes the game on a lot more than Dempster and his output is higher than Webster ATM. He stuffs some things up but he also adds a lot of drive to the team. It is a strange hysteria that takes over for players to become a whipping boy. It was really one game this year where he turned over a couple of kicks trying to break the lines and the ball came back in quickly for opposition goals. His decision making needs some work but he does some really good things too. The reason guys like him keep getting games despite internet experts rushing to send him away is that they review every bit of footage and data and rate the players on actual performance not the "vibe" fans get. I wrote off Jason Blake as being not up to it for the first 5 years and still got a lump in my throat every time he had the ball down back but he proved me wrong. Acres, Mc kenzie and Webster are probably hot on his heels but there is also some chance they will end up elsewhere on the ground. Shenton is very good at providing an option so is often the guy who gets the ball from Dempster or Delaney, it's usually the next link where it falls down when no one finds space so he is forced to have a searching run then bomb over the midfield. It often gets turned over at that point.

The one thing I will say about you gringo is you are loyal to every saints player and only see good instead of bad. The problem with that is we will never improve if you think we should keep players like Saad and Shenton. Apart from Weller I think we played far to safe with the rookie upgrades last year and even the rookies we took last year. Yep you know what you get but you aren't getting players that will take you up the ladder. I would rather take a punt and fail than take no punt at all. I suppose that's why I love gambling.

I don't think we should keep them but right now shenton is getting picked for a reason and while any player is still on the list they deserve a chance to prove they deserve their place. Shenton is getting s*** canned for doing his job. The people who benefit if he has a good game seem to think abusing him will get him to leave himself out of the team. Saad is picked as a rookie, he is still on our list he can still make it, if the list management decides there isn't a spot moving forward I'm happy to accept the call and it was based on a reasonable go at AFL level. I like Saad and hope he gets another crack because he has good qualities, if he doesn't that's footy.

i find it embarrassing when people who have very little knowledge about anything make ridiculously over the top statements like he's not AFL standard or isn't going to make it after a couple of games. They did it with Goddard, Billings, Cripps, Lynch, Rhys and I could go on and on. Anyway, these guys are our players and should be given respect and let play with out ridiculous tantrum throwing. we are already lining Paddy up for failure, it usually starts with this kind of questioning then gathers a slow momentum to whipping boy status.

this season we are well ahead of most people's expectation of what the season held yet there seems to be this petulant anxious carry on about half our list. If we want to attract good free agents we have to remain competitive, right now that's happening because of the picked teams. I know everyone hates Schnieder and Shenton but it's tiresome and stupid to keep going on about it IMO because the match committee isn't listening.

[dragit]

It is a strange hysteria that takes over for players to become a whipping boy.

I'm not whipping him at all. I just have Shenton competing with a lot of younger players for a spot who I think have more upside, so I'd prefer to see games into them.

We have Newnes, Savage, Wright, Acres, Roberton, Webster, plus older guys of Geary, Ray, Gilbert… most of which I would choose over Shents - nothing against him, he's doing a pretty good job. I'm not sure how many games he would have played if Geary, Ray & Gilbert were available.

I'm not gunning against him at all, I hope he surpasses my predictions and becomes a really solid AFL player.

We've got to be able to talk about players and make assessments and guesses as to which are going to make it surely?

[plugger66]

Have we really got great PR from it? Fair price to pay if that was the reason, I don't think that was why we took him.

He has played some very good football at AFL level, which is more than most rookies or even draftees can ever say.

While I was one of the keen ones to get him back, like everyone else, this was prior to upgrading Minchingotn, Templeton, drafting Lonie and rookying Sinclair & Schneider.

While Saad isn't looking great right now, I still have no problem him being rookied… but we really have brought in way too many of a similar type of player. In hindsight Saad looks like a mistake because he won't get a game ahead of Lonie & Sinclair and he's older.

I think the worst thing for Saad was playing seniors so early... after missing 18 months he really needed to build up both match fitness and a feel for the game again at VFL level. I reckon if we hadn't of seen him yet at AFL level yet and he was kicking bags of 4 goals consistently, a lot of people would be calling for him to be picked.

I'm not writing off Saad yet, he has a few elite weapons but clearly needs to work on a few glaring deficiencies in his game too, tackles and disposals have to come up.

I think a bigger mistake will be upgrading Minchington if they aren't going to actually play him when he has solid VFL form and can't get past 3 rookies for a game. Shenton too, while he going okay, he's probably not a player of the future and we already have a bunch of guys to play that medium defensive role.

I'm not sure on Shenton, I think he will keep getting games as he offers something different to a lot of the others like Webster, Dempster etc. He takes the game on a lot more than Dempster and his output is higher than Webster ATM. He stuffs some things up but he also adds a lot of drive to the team. It is a strange hysteria that takes over for players to become a whipping boy. It was really one game this year where he turned over a couple of kicks trying to break the lines and the ball came back in quickly for opposition goals. His decision making needs some work but he does some really good things too. The reason guys like him keep getting games despite internet experts rushing to send him away is that they review every bit of footage and data and rate the players on actual performance not the "vibe" fans get. I wrote off Jason Blake as being not up to it for the first 5 years and still got a lump in my throat every time he had the ball down back but he proved me wrong. Acres, Mc kenzie and Webster are probably hot on his heels but there is also some chance they will end up elsewhere on the ground. Shenton is very good at providing an option so is often the guy who gets the ball from Dempster or Delaney, it's usually the next link where it falls down when no one finds space so he is forced to have a searching run then bomb over the midfield. It often gets turned over at that point.

The one thing I will say about you gringo is you are loyal to every saints player and only see good instead of bad. The problem with that is we will never improve if you think we should keep players like Saad and Shenton. Apart from Weller I think we played far to safe with the rookie upgrades last year and even the rookies we took last year. Yep you know what you get but you aren't getting players that will take you up the ladder. I would rather take a punt and fail than take no punt at all. I suppose that's why I love gambling.

I don't think we should keep them but right now shenton is getting picked for a reason and while any player is still on the list they deserve a chance to prove they deserve their place. Shenton is getting s*** canned for doing his job. The people who benefit if he has a good game seem to think abusing him will get him to leave himself out of the team. Saad is picked as a rookie, he is still on our list he can still make it, if the list management decides there isn't a spot moving forward I'm happy to accept the call and it was based on a reasonable go at AFL level. I like Saad and hope he gets another crack because he has good qualities, if he doesn't that's footy.

i find it embarrassing when people who have very little knowledge about anything make ridiculously over the top statements like he's not AFL standard or isn't going to make it after a couple of games. They did it with Goddard, Billings, Cripps, Lynch, Rhys and I could go on and on. Anyway, these guys are our players and should be given respect and let play with out ridiculous tantrum throwing. we are already lining Paddy up for failure, it usually starts with this kind of questioning then gathers a slow momentum to whipping boy status.

this season we are well ahead of most people's expectation of what the season held yet there seems to be this petulant anxious carry on about half our list. If we want to attract good free agents we have to remain competitive, right now that's happening because of the picked teams. I know everyone hates Schnieder and Shenton but it's tiresome and stupid to keep going on about it IMO because the match committee isn't listening.

I think you are getting over emotional. Apart from one two on here, and those types bag anyone, bugger all are hanging s*** on Shenton or Saad as footballers or people. Just because I don't think they are AFL standard to a level that will improve our side doesn't mean im hanging s*** on them because if they don't play then another saints player replaces them. it isn't as if a player from another side replaces them. I think we have better players on our list than Shenton and Saad and I think it was lazy to keep either of them this season. I think it was also lazy to keep Schneider but I will stick up for him when people want him dropped because his form says he must play. Unlike some here im happy to be proven wrong and if Shenton plays well whilst he has this chance I will be calling those wanting him dropped fools. I must say I cant possible see how Saad stays on our list next season baring a LTI because the rest of the year in the seconds must mean goodbye or again I will be calling it lazy recruiting.

[gringo]

Have we really got great PR from it? Fair price to pay if that was the reason, I don't think that was why we took him.

He has played some very good football at AFL level, which is more than most rookies or even draftees can ever say.

While I was one of the keen ones to get him back, like everyone else, this was prior to upgrading Minchingotn, Templeton, drafting Lonie and rookying Sinclair & Schneider.

While Saad isn't looking great right now, I still have no problem him being rookied… but we really have brought in way too many of a similar type of player. In hindsight Saad looks like a mistake because he won't get a game ahead of Lonie & Sinclair and he's older.

I think the worst thing for Saad was playing seniors so early... after missing 18 months he really needed to build up both match fitness and a feel for the game again at VFL level. I reckon if we hadn't of seen him yet at AFL level yet and he was kicking bags of 4 goals consistently, a lot of people would be calling for him to be picked.

I'm not writing off Saad yet, he has a few elite weapons but clearly needs to work on a few glaring deficiencies in his game too, tackles and disposals have to come up.

I think a bigger mistake will be upgrading Minchington if they aren't going to actually play him when he has solid VFL form and can't get past 3 rookies for a game. Shenton too, while he going okay, he's probably not a player of the future and we already have a bunch of guys to play that medium defensive role.

I'm not sure on Shenton, I think he will keep getting games as he offers something different to a lot of the others like Webster, Dempster etc. He takes the game on a lot more than Dempster and his output is higher than Webster ATM. He stuffs some things up but he also adds a lot of drive to the team. It is a strange hysteria that takes over for players to become a whipping boy. It was really one game this year where he turned over a couple of kicks trying to break the lines and the ball came back in quickly for opposition goals. His decision making needs some work but he does some really good things too. The reason guys like him keep getting games despite internet experts rushing to send him away is that they review every bit of footage and data and rate the players on actual performance not the "vibe" fans get. I wrote off Jason Blake as being not up to it for the first 5 years and still got a lump in my throat every time he had the ball down back but he proved me wrong. Acres, Mc kenzie and Webster are probably hot on his heels but there is also some chance they will end up elsewhere on the ground. Shenton is very good at providing an option so is often the guy who gets the ball from Dempster or Delaney, it's usually the next link where it falls down when no one finds space so he is forced to have a searching run then bomb over the midfield. It often gets turned over at that point.

The one thing I will say about you gringo is you are loyal to every saints player and only see good instead of bad. The problem with that is we will never improve if you think we should keep players like Saad and Shenton. Apart from Weller I think we played far to safe with the rookie upgrades last year and even the rookies we took last year. Yep you know what you get but you aren't getting players that will take you up the ladder. I would rather take a punt and fail than take no punt at all. I suppose that's why I love gambling.

I don't think we should keep them but right now shenton is getting picked for a reason and while any player is still on the list they deserve a chance to prove they deserve their place. Shenton is getting s*** canned for doing his job. The people who benefit if he has a good game seem to think abusing him will get him to leave himself out of the team. Saad is picked as a rookie, he is still on our list he can still make it, if the list management decides there isn't a spot moving forward I'm happy to accept the call and it was based on a reasonable go at AFL level. I like Saad and hope he gets another crack because he has good qualities, if he doesn't that's footy.

i find it embarrassing when people who have very little knowledge about anything make ridiculously over the top statements like he's not AFL standard or isn't going to make it after a couple of games. They did it with Goddard, Billings, Cripps, Lynch, Rhys and I could go on and on. Anyway, these guys are our players and should be given respect and let play with out ridiculous tantrum throwing. we are already lining Paddy up for failure, it usually starts with this kind of questioning then gathers a slow momentum to whipping boy status.

this season we are well ahead of most people's expectation of what the season held yet there seems to be this petulant anxious carry on about half our list. If we want to attract good free agents we have to remain competitive, right now that's happening because of the picked teams. I know everyone hates Schnieder and Shenton but it's tiresome and stupid to keep going on about it IMO because the match committee isn't listening.

I think you are getting over emotional. Apart from one two on here, and those types bag anyone, bugger all are hanging s*** on Shenton or Saad as footballers or people. Just because I don't think they are AFL standard to a level that will improve our side doesn't mean im hanging s*** on them because if they don't play then another saints player replaces them. it isn't as if a player from another side replaces them. I think we have better players on our list than Shenton and Saad and I think it was lazy to keep either of them this season. I think it was also lazy to keep Schneider but I will stick up for him when people want him dropped because his form says he must play. Unlike some here im happy to be proven wrong and if Shenton plays well whilst he has this chance I will be calling those wanting him dropped fools. I must say I cant possible see how Saad stays on our list next season baring a LTI because the rest of the year in the seconds must mean goodbye or again I will be calling it lazy recruiting.

I don't think they make decisions on a whim like you. If they rate a potential rookie higher they will cut him quicker than you could blink. If they think we have a enough players to delist or trade to open spots up they will do that. As you yourself have said it doesn't look good for guys like Siposs and Simpkin ATM. There will be a few unloaded and if he isn't in their planning he will be gone. I think we have actually used the draft and rookie list exceptionally well the last 2 years.

[plugger66]

Have we really got great PR from it? Fair price to pay if that was the reason, I don't think that was why we took him.

He has played some very good football at AFL level, which is more than most rookies or even draftees can ever say.

While I was one of the keen ones to get him back, like everyone else, this was prior to upgrading Minchingotn, Templeton, drafting Lonie and rookying Sinclair & Schneider.

While Saad isn't looking great right now, I still have no problem him being rookied… but we really have brought in way too many of a similar type of player. In hindsight Saad looks like a mistake because he won't get a game ahead of Lonie & Sinclair and he's older.

I think the worst thing for Saad was playing seniors so early... after missing 18 months he really needed to build up both match fitness and a feel for the game again at VFL level. I reckon if we hadn't of seen him yet at AFL level yet and he was kicking bags of 4 goals consistently, a lot of people would be calling for him to be picked.

I'm not writing off Saad yet, he has a few elite weapons but clearly needs to work on a few glaring deficiencies in his game too, tackles and disposals have to come up.

I think a bigger mistake will be upgrading Minchington if they aren't going to actually play him when he has solid VFL form and can't get past 3 rookies for a game. Shenton too, while he going okay, he's probably not a player of the future and we already have a bunch of guys to play that medium defensive role.

I'm not sure on Shenton, I think he will keep getting games as he offers something different to a lot of the others like Webster, Dempster etc. He takes the game on a lot more than Dempster and his output is higher than Webster ATM. He stuffs some things up but he also adds a lot of drive to the team. It is a strange hysteria that takes over for players to become a whipping boy. It was really one game this year where he turned over a couple of kicks trying to break the lines and the ball came back in quickly for opposition goals. His decision making needs some work but he does some really good things too. The reason guys like him keep getting games despite internet experts rushing to send him away is that they review every bit of footage and data and rate the players on actual performance not the "vibe" fans get. I wrote off Jason Blake as being not up to it for the first 5 years and still got a lump in my throat every time he had the ball down back but he proved me wrong. Acres, Mc kenzie and Webster are probably hot on his heels but there is also some chance they will end up elsewhere on the ground. Shenton is very good at providing an option so is often the guy who gets the ball from Dempster or Delaney, it's usually the next link where it falls down when no one finds space so he is forced to have a searching run then bomb over the midfield. It often gets turned over at that point.

The one thing I will say about you gringo is you are loyal to every saints player and only see good instead of bad. The problem with that is we will never improve if you think we should keep players like Saad and Shenton. Apart from Weller I think we played far to safe with the rookie upgrades last year and even the rookies we took last year. Yep you know what you get but you aren't getting players that will take you up the ladder. I would rather take a punt and fail than take no punt at all. I suppose that's why I love gambling.

I don't think we should keep them but right now shenton is getting picked for a reason and while any player is still on the list they deserve a chance to prove they deserve their place. Shenton is getting s*** canned for doing his job. The people who benefit if he has a good game seem to think abusing him will get him to leave himself out of the team. Saad is picked as a rookie, he is still on our list he can still make it, if the list management decides there isn't a spot moving forward I'm happy to accept the call and it was based on a reasonable go at AFL level. I like Saad and hope he gets another crack because he has good qualities, if he doesn't that's footy.

i find it embarrassing when people who have very little knowledge about anything make ridiculously over the top statements like he's not AFL standard or isn't going to make it after a couple of games. They did it with Goddard, Billings, Cripps, Lynch, Rhys and I could go on and on. Anyway, these guys are our players and should be given respect and let play with out ridiculous tantrum throwing. we are already lining Paddy up for failure, it usually starts with this kind of questioning then gathers a slow momentum to whipping boy status.

this season we are well ahead of most people's expectation of what the season held yet there seems to be this petulant anxious carry on about half our list. If we want to attract good free agents we have to remain competitive, right now that's happening because of the picked teams. I know everyone hates Schnieder and Shenton but it's tiresome and stupid to keep going on about it IMO because the match committee isn't listening.

I think you are getting over emotional. Apart from one two on here, and those types bag anyone, bugger all are hanging s*** on Shenton or Saad as footballers or people. Just because I don't think they are AFL standard to a level that will improve our side doesn't mean im hanging s*** on them because if they don't play then another saints player replaces them. it isn't as if a player from another side replaces them. I think we have better players on our list than Shenton and Saad and I think it was lazy to keep either of them this season. I think it was also lazy to keep Schneider but I will stick up for him when people want him dropped because his form says he must play. Unlike some here im happy to be proven wrong and if Shenton plays well whilst he has this chance I will be calling those wanting him dropped fools. I must say I cant possible see how Saad stays on our list next season baring a LTI because the rest of the year in the seconds must mean goodbye or again I will be calling it lazy recruiting.

I don't think they make decisions on a whim like you. If they rate a potential rookie higher they will cut him quicker than you could blink. If they think we have a enough players to delist or trade to open spots up they will do that. As you yourself have said it doesn't look good for guys like Siposs and Simpkin ATM. There will be a few unloaded and if he isn't in their planning he will be gone. I think we have actually used the draft and rookie list exceptionally well the last 2 years.

Yes im sorry I am talking about something that I don't know as much as the recruiters do. I hope no one ever has a go at our recruiting or if they do I hope you also have a go at them. This is a fan forum and of course I know bugger all compared to the recruiters but we can criticize them if we want especially as Im accused of just agreeing all the time with the club. And I think they have done well with the recruiting and the rookie list. I still say last year was lazy recruiting late in the draft and also on the rookie list. Hopefully Sinclair ends up a player because the others were lazy picks even though they probably didn't have a choice with Holmes.

[gringo]

Have we really got great PR from it? Fair price to pay if that was the reason, I don't think that was why we took him.

He has played some very good football at AFL level, which is more than most rookies or even draftees can ever say.

While I was one of the keen ones to get him back, like everyone else, this was prior to upgrading Minchingotn, Templeton, drafting Lonie and rookying Sinclair & Schneider.

While Saad isn't looking great right now, I still have no problem him being rookied… but we really have brought in way too many of a similar type of player. In hindsight Saad looks like a mistake because he won't get a game ahead of Lonie & Sinclair and he's older.

I think the worst thing for Saad was playing seniors so early... after missing 18 months he really needed to build up both match fitness and a feel for the game again at VFL level. I reckon if we hadn't of seen him yet at AFL level yet and he was kicking bags of 4 goals consistently, a lot of people would be calling for him to be picked.

I'm not writing off Saad yet, he has a few elite weapons but clearly needs to work on a few glaring deficiencies in his game too, tackles and disposals have to come up.

I think a bigger mistake will be upgrading Minchington if they aren't going to actually play him when he has solid VFL form and can't get past 3 rookies for a game. Shenton too, while he going okay, he's probably not a player of the future and we already have a bunch of guys to play that medium defensive role.

I'm not sure on Shenton, I think he will keep getting games as he offers something different to a lot of the others like Webster, Dempster etc. He takes the game on a lot more than Dempster and his output is higher than Webster ATM. He stuffs some things up but he also adds a lot of drive to the team. It is a strange hysteria that takes over for players to become a whipping boy. It was really one game this year where he turned over a couple of kicks trying to break the lines and the ball came back in quickly for opposition goals. His decision making needs some work but he does some really good things too. The reason guys like him keep getting games despite internet experts rushing to send him away is that they review every bit of footage and data and rate the players on actual performance not the "vibe" fans get. I wrote off Jason Blake as being not up to it for the first 5 years and still got a lump in my throat every time he had the ball down back but he proved me wrong. Acres, Mc kenzie and Webster are probably hot on his heels but there is also some chance they will end up elsewhere on the ground. Shenton is very good at providing an option so is often the guy who gets the ball from Dempster or Delaney, it's usually the next link where it falls down when no one finds space so he is forced to have a searching run then bomb over the midfield. It often gets turned over at that point.

The one thing I will say about you gringo is you are loyal to every saints player and only see good instead of bad. The problem with that is we will never improve if you think we should keep players like Saad and Shenton. Apart from Weller I think we played far to safe with the rookie upgrades last year and even the rookies we took last year. Yep you know what you get but you aren't getting players that will take you up the ladder. I would rather take a punt and fail than take no punt at all. I suppose that's why I love gambling.

I don't think we should keep them but right now shenton is getting picked for a reason and while any player is still on the list they deserve a chance to prove they deserve their place. Shenton is getting s*** canned for doing his job. The people who benefit if he has a good game seem to think abusing him will get him to leave himself out of the team. Saad is picked as a rookie, he is still on our list he can still make it, if the list management decides there isn't a spot moving forward I'm happy to accept the call and it was based on a reasonable go at AFL level. I like Saad and hope he gets another crack because he has good qualities, if he doesn't that's footy.

i find it embarrassing when people who have very little knowledge about anything make ridiculously over the top statements like he's not AFL standard or isn't going to make it after a couple of games. They did it with Goddard, Billings, Cripps, Lynch, Rhys and I could go on and on. Anyway, these guys are our players and should be given respect and let play with out ridiculous tantrum throwing. we are already lining Paddy up for failure, it usually starts with this kind of questioning then gathers a slow momentum to whipping boy status.

this season we are well ahead of most people's expectation of what the season held yet there seems to be this petulant anxious carry on about half our list. If we want to attract good free agents we have to remain competitive, right now that's happening because of the picked teams. I know everyone hates Schnieder and Shenton but it's tiresome and stupid to keep going on about it IMO because the match committee isn't listening.

I think you are getting over emotional. Apart from one two on here, and those types bag anyone, bugger all are hanging s*** on Shenton or Saad as footballers or people. Just because I don't think they are AFL standard to a level that will improve our side doesn't mean im hanging s*** on them because if they don't play then another saints player replaces them. it isn't as if a player from another side replaces them. I think we have better players on our list than Shenton and Saad and I think it was lazy to keep either of them this season. I think it was also lazy to keep Schneider but I will stick up for him when people want him dropped because his form says he must play. Unlike some here im happy to be proven wrong and if Shenton plays well whilst he has this chance I will be calling those wanting him dropped fools. I must say I cant possible see how Saad stays on our list next season baring a LTI because the rest of the year in the seconds must mean goodbye or again I will be calling it lazy recruiting.

I don't think they make decisions on a whim like you. If they rate a potential rookie higher they will cut him quicker than you could blink. If they think we have a enough players to delist or trade to open spots up they will do that. As you yourself have said it doesn't look good for guys like Siposs and Simpkin ATM. There will be a few unloaded and if he isn't in their planning he will be gone. I think we have actually used the draft and rookie list exceptionally well the last 2 years.

Yes im sorry I am talking about something that I don't know as much as the recruiters do. I hope no one ever has a go at our recruiting or if they do I hope you also have a go at them. This is a fan forum and of course I know bugger all compared to the recruiters but we can criticize them if we want especially as Im accused of just agreeing all the time with the club. And I think they have done well with the recruiting and the rookie list. I still say last year was lazy recruiting late in the draft and also on the rookie list. Hopefully Sinclair ends up a player because the others were lazy picks even though they probably didn't have a choice with Holmes.

I just don't get what you are on about. Late in the draft we got Lonie....he's a gun so far. He was the wrong choice when we got him to me but he has exceeded my expectation by so far it's not funny. We also got Payne as a rookie who looks alright too. Mc Kenzie looks like a very astute pick, Goddard looks good on potential and then we also have Mc Cartin. I can't see anything that is wrong with that drafting. Saad and Schnieder were back up and Schnieder has played most games. Holmes was around the year before and is showing a lot of potential at VFL level.

[plugger66]

I just don't get what you are on about. Late in the draft we got Lonie....he's a gun so far. He was the wrong choice when we got him to me but he has exceeded my expectation by so far it's not funny. We also got Payne as a rookie who looks alright too. Mc Kenzie looks like a very astute pick, Goddard looks good on potential and then we also have Mc Cartin. I can't see anything that is wrong with that drafting. Saad and Schnieder were back up and Schnieder has played most games. Holmes was around the year before and is showing a lot of potential at VFL level.

Im on about the upgrades, not the players who haven't been proven at this level. Lonie probably helps my point. No idea what the rest of your stuff even means.

[Sainternist]

He looked dreadful in 2013. I honestly thought there was no future for him in AFL. I was willing to give him another chance, as I think he is quite skillful in some areas. Unfortunately he's not cutting the mustard right now. He'll have to pull it together soon, or otherwise he'll be headed for delisting come end of season.

[magnifisaint]

seen enough of Saad to know that he won't make it. No left side and no footy smarts. Not sure I've seen him take an overhead mark.

[seano1]

seen enough of Saad to know that he won't make it. No left side and no footy smarts. Not sure I've seen him take an overhead mark.

I think we have some guys who don't have a right side...........and guys who will kick it passed or overhead of leading players, who handball instead of kicking it or kicking it when they should handball so he fits in well.

[SMS]

Was it PR? 90% yes. He has shown amazing talent. Wirth a punt but yes it was more for PR and showing faith in all our players saying hey we will have your back if BS comes at you.

Great decision by the club. Sets a great culture.

[evertonfc]

Good opening post.

I remember the club made a huge song and dance and re-drafting the "popular" Saint, continually referencing it in emails and official club communication. I was a little bit surprised at that; it was very condescending. He was no more or "less popular" than anyone else.

Anyhow, good a player though he was, I'm not convinced he's part of our future and probably will be expected to be delisted at year's end.

It's very arguable he deserved another crack based on what he'd shown, so I'm not too upset at that. We move on with our three Jack's, who look to be a marvellous forward trio.

[#gosaintas]

The sooner Saad, Shenton and Schneider are delisted the better.

[Bunk_Moreland]

The sooner Saad, Shenton and Schneider are delisted the better.

Can I ask if you really are a Saints supporter? What has Shenton and Schneider got to do with this thread.

It is about Saad. Have your usual moan about Saad, as that is the OP, but you are way out of order on Shenton and Schneider.

Oh how many AFL games have you played champ?

[plugger66]

The sooner Saad, Shenton and Schneider are delisted the better.

Can we delist posters? Why do people who claim to be supporters bag our players? Its ok at the end of the year to say this and that player should go but comments like the sooner the better suggest lack intelligence at the very least.

[Con Gorozidis]

I think the last two weeks sum him up.
Kicked 4 against a weak VFL side when we were ten goals up.
Nowhere to be seen against a good quality VFL side in a tighter match.
Hes 26 and cant get near it against good VFL opposition. Paul Hudson says " Things didn’t quite fall his way which can happen sometimes as a small forward." The reality he is he waits for the ball to spill out to him so he can snag a goal fwd of the pack. Very rarely capable of winning his own ball.

[magnifisaint]

I think the last two weeks sum him up.
Kicked 4 against a weak VFL side when we were ten goals up.
Nowhere to be seen against a good quality VFL side in a tighter match.
Hes 26 and cant get near it against good VFL opposition. Paul Hudson says " Things didn’t quite fall his way which can happen sometimes as a small forward." The reality he is he waits for the ball to spill out to him so he can snag a goal fwd of the pack. Very rarely capable of winning his own ball.

+1

[Toy Saint]

As I recall, there was talk that Carlton would draft Saad.

Incidentally, is he related to the Brisbane Saad?

[gringo]

As I recall, there was talk that Carlton would draft Saad.

Incidentally, is he related to the Brisbane Saad?

No apparently not. I watched Adam play with Richmonds alignment last year or the year before and thought he looked a beauty. He is bigger than Ahmed and still lightening quick. There was some talk he was going into the national draft in that game as I think he was an underager allowed to play VFL how ever that works.