Billy Longer

[Bluthy]

You have very set views Mr Plugger. Try a little flexibility in your thought processes good sir. Our next grand final will be 6 or 7 years away. That's a LOT of water to go under the bridge. Lets try a few different things in the meantime to explore our options and be part of the vanguard (vanguard is ahead of things right?). If you haven't noticed we don't have a lot to lose at the moment by being experimental. Stanley may not make it all and be delisted. Once Longer builds a tank he might be a lot better mark. Pierce might prove to a brilliant and push his way in. Holmes might become the next Nic Nat - or the next Majak Pierce needs some encouragement if he's playing well in the VFL and I see this as way of giving him a taste without us risking much. You seem to love shooting ideas down without offering a lot of creative ideas yourself.

If you keep on doing what you've always done, you'll keep on getting what you've always got. And for us that's a pretty bare trophy cabinet.

Yep i have very set views based on 40 years of watching footy. Yep people want to try things but it just never really works. its not a game anymore, its a business and clubs know what works and doesnt work. A second ruckman being just a spoiler wont work and playing 2 ruck man when neither can really mark the ball wont work. I doubt Stanley will make it but if he does he is now the ideal player as a second ruck. Why we need to try things that just cant work makes no sense. I know we arent any good and it doesnt matter how we really play but why hasnt things you suggest been tried than. probably because AR has to justify stupid ideas to the public. As it is there people on here bagging him already. Imagine if he tried other crap that has no hope of working. There would be even more baggers on here.

I want the club to practice things that can work in AFL footy this day and age and not things that worked in the past.

I don't know what the hell I was thinking suggesting we experiment playing two specialist rucks like Hawthorn, the current premiers do and most other top teams which gives our developing ruck stocks some exposure and Longer a bit of rest from the heavy load he is carrying without Hickey. What if Longer gets injured and Pierce is thrown in the deep end without ANY experience - hang on that's crazy thinking!! I must have gone completely bonkers. I've booked myself into an asylum for tomorrow what with my bizzare thinking and all. I just hope they have foxtel. What would we do without your old school thinking Plugger. I shiver to think.

Yep you are right. the Hawks did it for one week and then dropped Ceglar for hale who plays mainly forward. What were they thinking doing that? I have no idea why you are getting angry with me. Do you think I pick the side. Im telling you why I think the club isnt doing what you are suggesting. Maybe your angur should be at AR and the selection committee. They have a little more sway than some random on a keyboard. And who are these top sides playing 2 genuine ruckman?

Oh Plugger - your arguments are all confused now and you're the one carrying on like a pork chop because I kicked back on your criticisms. Hale and McEvoy ARE dedicated ruckman who then rest forward. And of course ruckman don't help out down back. I never saw McEvoy taking any grabs back there for us??. I thought we played Longer and Hickey together early in the season. Take a breath plugger - playing Pierce and Longer together in a game would not result in a 200 point blow out. Its no different than playing Acres in his first game against a brutal Hawthorn team - there is an understanding at our development stage that we need to blood players to see what they can do and give us options. Rhys is doing ok but is probably being shaded in the ruck. The poor guy gets used as a hole filler his whole career no wonder he looks lost. Jeez if its not working you can sub Pierce out. MY idea has merit and your ridiculous hyperbole (AR would be a laughing stock for playing two rucks!) shows you lost the argument. I like your pragmatism Plugger but you need to stop being so damn defensive and locking down on your ideas like they are the ten commandments.

[SainterK]

Ben pushed back a lot Bluthy.

I was critical of it though, cause I felt like he was cleaning up his own mess a bit. Would rather he was needed forward because of his ascendancy in the middle.

I see that potential in hickey, to push forward, once he's impacted in the centre.

[Bluthy]

Ben pushed back a lot Bluthy.

I was critical of it though, cause I felt like he was cleaning up his own mess a bit. Would rather he was needed forward because of his ascendancy in the middle.

I see that potential in hickey, to push forward, once he's impacted in the centre.

I know McEvoy did a lot of marking in our backline K. I was being sarcastic towards Pluggers dismissive comments that ruckman don't spoil in the backline re: my comments that playing two rucks so one of them could be used as extra defensive cover when we visit the land of the giants against the Swans (Buddy, Tippet, Goodes, Reid - how the hell do we cover those??). Good point about Macca. I like what I've seen of Hickey too - by all accounts he got his fitness up another level when he took over from Macca and that meant he could get around the ground more and become a forward threat. I think Longer needs another good preseason and I think he will become better around the ground. These big guys struggle with fitness which is why they take longer to mature.

[stinger]

We should never have let go of Pattinson

the one we really miss is rix...he rocked....

[FQF]

I believe that marking is predominantly a confidence issue - you really need to believe that you are going to take the mark in order to do so.

Just so happens that confidence is not something that can be flicked like a switch, and the longer this trend goes on the harder it will be to reverse.

On our ruck stocks in general, I think it's optimistic. (Which makes you wonder how the hell Tony Shaw can be considered a respectable commentator when he said last night that on our of drafting priorities must be to replace McEvoy.) Hickey's interrupted season was exactly was Longer needed to find his feet and get a good run of games. I think we'll find that by 2015, Hickey and Longer will be evenly placed more or less. Pierce is hitting some form and apparently moves extremely well. Then there's Holmes who is tracking along very nicely for someone at his stage of development.

You dont think he actually reads this crap do you? By the way if they are evenly place in 2015 then how do both play. Forget Pierce and Holmes. They cant all play.

Not sure why it is relevant if Longer reads this stuff? Please explain.

[plugger66]

I believe that marking is predominantly a confidence issue - you really need to believe that you are going to take the mark in order to do so.

Just so happens that confidence is not something that can be flicked like a switch, and the longer this trend goes on the harder it will be to reverse.

On our ruck stocks in general, I think it's optimistic. (Which makes you wonder how the hell Tony Shaw can be considered a respectable commentator when he said last night that on our of drafting priorities must be to replace McEvoy.) Hickey's interrupted season was exactly was Longer needed to find his feet and get a good run of games. I think we'll find that by 2015, Hickey and Longer will be evenly placed more or less. Pierce is hitting some form and apparently moves extremely well. Then there's Holmes who is tracking along very nicely for someone at his stage of development.

You dont think he actually reads this crap do you? By the way if they are evenly place in 2015 then how do both play. Forget Pierce and Holmes. They cant all play.

Not sure why it is relevant if Longer reads this stuff? Please explain.

I need to say sorry. I have no idea what I even meant by that. Must have read the thread completely wrong. Sorry again.

[plugger66]

You have very set views Mr Plugger. Try a little flexibility in your thought processes good sir. Our next grand final will be 6 or 7 years away. That's a LOT of water to go under the bridge. Lets try a few different things in the meantime to explore our options and be part of the vanguard (vanguard is ahead of things right?). If you haven't noticed we don't have a lot to lose at the moment by being experimental. Stanley may not make it all and be delisted. Once Longer builds a tank he might be a lot better mark. Pierce might prove to a brilliant and push his way in. Holmes might become the next Nic Nat - or the next Majak Pierce needs some encouragement if he's playing well in the VFL and I see this as way of giving him a taste without us risking much. You seem to love shooting ideas down without offering a lot of creative ideas yourself.

If you keep on doing what you've always done, you'll keep on getting what you've always got. And for us that's a pretty bare trophy cabinet.

Yep i have very set views based on 40 years of watching footy. Yep people want to try things but it just never really works. its not a game anymore, its a business and clubs know what works and doesnt work. A second ruckman being just a spoiler wont work and playing 2 ruck man when neither can really mark the ball wont work. I doubt Stanley will make it but if he does he is now the ideal player as a second ruck. Why we need to try things that just cant work makes no sense. I know we arent any good and it doesnt matter how we really play but why hasnt things you suggest been tried than. probably because AR has to justify stupid ideas to the public. As it is there people on here bagging him already. Imagine if he tried other crap that has no hope of working. There would be even more baggers on here.

I want the club to practice things that can work in AFL footy this day and age and not things that worked in the past.

I don't know what the hell I was thinking suggesting we experiment playing two specialist rucks like Hawthorn, the current premiers do and most other top teams which gives our developing ruck stocks some exposure and Longer a bit of rest from the heavy load he is carrying without Hickey. What if Longer gets injured and Pierce is thrown in the deep end without ANY experience - hang on that's crazy thinking!! I must have gone completely bonkers. I've booked myself into an asylum for tomorrow what with my bizzare thinking and all. I just hope they have foxtel. What would we do without your old school thinking Plugger. I shiver to think.

Yep you are right. the Hawks did it for one week and then dropped Ceglar for hale who plays mainly forward. What were they thinking doing that? I have no idea why you are getting angry with me. Do you think I pick the side. Im telling you why I think the club isnt doing what you are suggesting. Maybe your angur should be at AR and the selection committee. They have a little more sway than some random on a keyboard. And who are these top sides playing 2 genuine ruckman?

Oh Plugger - your arguments are all confused now and you're the one carrying on like a pork chop because I kicked back on your criticisms. Hale and McEvoy ARE dedicated ruckman who then rest forward. And of course ruckman don't help out down back. I never saw McEvoy taking any grabs back there for us??. I thought we played Longer and Hickey together early in the season. Take a breath plugger - playing Pierce and Longer together in a game would not result in a 200 point blow out. Its no different than playing Acres in his first game against a brutal Hawthorn team - there is an understanding at our development stage that we need to blood players to see what they can do and give us options. Rhys is doing ok but is probably being shaded in the ruck. The poor guy gets used as a hole filler his whole career no wonder he looks lost. Jeez if its not working you can sub Pierce out. MY idea has merit and your ridiculous hyperbole (AR would be a laughing stock for playing two rucks!) shows you lost the argument. I like your pragmatism Plugger but you need to stop being so damn defensive and locking down on your ideas like they are the ten commandments.

Why is it im carrying on like a pork chop and you arent. Its seems that you are getting upset with me because they arent playing two ruckman and for some reason you think that has something to do with me. I will try to go through some points you raised though. Hale and Ben arent dedicated ruckman who rest forward. Hale particually could play a whole game as a forward if need be. never seen any proof that Longer, Hickey or Pierce could do anythink like that. And playing them together has nothing to do with what we lose by. Why dont we try Delaney at FF. It doesnt matter. The problem is it does. The credibilty of our coaching stocks is at stake. As it is there are morons on here who would sack AR tomorrow if it was up to them. No idea about Ben taking marks for us in the backline but when he did he was still the ruckman on the ground. He just drfted back. Its a simple question but still hasnt been answered by you. Why havent we played 2 ruckman this year in any game. We have so many. I think it is because a Stanley type is the perfect second ruckman.

[saintsRrising]

Anyway...back on Longer.

His tapwork is progressing nicely. Not just how many he wins, but he has some deft palming. This is the most promising aspect of his game so far.

But his around the ground work, and marking needs to improve and has been a tad disappointing IMO. He is only very young yet and so there is plenty of time to improve.

[Saint wagga]

Why is it im carrying on like a pork chop and you arent. Its seems that you are getting upset with me because they arent playing two ruckman and for some reason you think that has something to do with me. I will try to go through some points you raised though. Hale and Ben arent dedicated ruckman who rest forward. Hale particually could play a whole game as a forward if need be. never seen any proof that Longer, Hickey or Pierce could do anythink like that. And playing them together has nothing to do with what we lose by. Why dont we try Delaney at FF. It doesnt matter. The problem is it does. The credibilty of our coaching stocks is at stake. As it is there are morons on here who would sack AR tomorrow if it was up to them. No idea about Ben taking marks for us in the backline but when he did he was still the ruckman on the ground. He just drfted back. Its a simple question but still hasnt been answered by you. Why havent we played 2 ruckman this year in any game. We have so many. I think it is because a Stanley type is the perfect second ruckman.[/quote]

Don't want to get involved in the slanging match but Plugger to answer a few of your questions..."Why havent we played 2 ruckman this year in any game. We have so many. I think it is because a Stanley type is the perfect second ruckman" with my opinion...

We have 4 ruckmen on our list and Stanley is the only legitimate Forward/backup ruck -
Holmes is green as and barring catastrophe would never play AFL this year full stop.

Pierce missed 1/2 the season and most of the pre season with back stressies, so his development has been significantly stalled, again, unless he exploded in the
VFL, not likely to be used as anything more than fill in ruckman due to injury to all of hickey, Longer and Stanley...

Hickey and Longer, both seen as AFL ready but still green. Hickey no 1 Longer no 2: Neither has had a chance to nail down being a no 1 AFL ruckman, they are both young and lacking in AFL games, let alone affored the opportunity to spend time forward as resting ruck. There was 5 weeks at the start of the year and about 2 weeks mid year when they were both fit and deemed available for 1sts selection. Thats not a lot of overlap.

As you've previoudly mentioned you believe they need to be playing together cohesively by end of next year or trade one out...i've expressed my alternate view that more time and experience wont affect the end result either way...But I think saying we haven't played two genuine ruckmen this year as proof that it wont work with the current list is jumping the gun...IMO

[plugger66]

Why is it im carrying on like a pork chop and you arent. Its seems that you are getting upset with me because they arent playing two ruckman and for some reason you think that has something to do with me. I will try to go through some points you raised though. Hale and Ben arent dedicated ruckman who rest forward. Hale particually could play a whole game as a forward if need be. never seen any proof that Longer, Hickey or Pierce could do anythink like that. And playing them together has nothing to do with what we lose by. Why dont we try Delaney at FF. It doesnt matter. The problem is it does. The credibilty of our coaching stocks is at stake. As it is there are morons on here who would sack AR tomorrow if it was up to them. No idea about Ben taking marks for us in the backline but when he did he was still the ruckman on the ground. He just drfted back. Its a simple question but still hasnt been answered by you. Why havent we played 2 ruckman this year in any game. We have so many. I think it is because a Stanley type is the perfect second ruckman.

Don't want to get involved in the slanging match but Plugger to answer a few of your questions..."Why havent we played 2 ruckman this year in any game. We have so many. I think it is because a Stanley type is the perfect second ruckman" with my opinion...

We have 4 ruckmen on our list and Stanley is the only legitimate Forward/backup ruck -
Holmes is green as and barring catastrophe would never play AFL this year full stop.

Pierce missed 1/2 the season and most of the pre season with back stressies, so his development has been significantly stalled, again, unless he exploded in the
VFL, not likely to be used as anything more than fill in ruckman due to injury to all of hickey, Longer and Stanley...

Hickey and Longer, both seen as AFL ready but still green. Hickey no 1 Longer no 2: Neither has had a chance to nail down being a no 1 AFL ruckman, they are both young and lacking in AFL games, let alone affored the opportunity to spend time forward as resting ruck. There was 5 weeks at the start of the year and about 2 weeks mid year when they were both fit and deemed available for 1sts selection. Thats not a lot of overlap.

As you've previoudly mentioned you believe they need to be playing together cohesively by end of next year or trade one out...i've expressed my alternate view that more time and experience wont affect the end result either way...But I think saying we haven't played two genuine ruckmen this year as proof that it wont work with the current list is jumping the gun...IMO[/quote]


Can you tell us how our forward line looks next season if we play 2 rucks. And the reason i say one will go in 2016 is that I dont think it will work but if it does then we should be able to keep both but if it doesnt we may not want to lose one of the rucks but one will certainly want to leave. I would say it has to work or we will lose one of Hickey or Longer at the end of next season.

[Saint wagga]

Why is it im carrying on like a pork chop and you arent. Its seems that you are getting upset with me because they arent playing two ruckman and for some reason you think that has something to do with me. I will try to go through some points you raised though. Hale and Ben arent dedicated ruckman who rest forward. Hale particually could play a whole game as a forward if need be. never seen any proof that Longer, Hickey or Pierce could do anythink like that. And playing them together has nothing to do with what we lose by. Why dont we try Delaney at FF. It doesnt matter. The problem is it does. The credibilty of our coaching stocks is at stake. As it is there are morons on here who would sack AR tomorrow if it was up to them. No idea about Ben taking marks for us in the backline but when he did he was still the ruckman on the ground. He just drfted back. Its a simple question but still hasnt been answered by you. Why havent we played 2 ruckman this year in any game. We have so many. I think it is because a Stanley type is the perfect second ruckman.

Don't want to get involved in the slanging match but Plugger to answer a few of your questions..."Why havent we played 2 ruckman this year in any game. We have so many. I think it is because a Stanley type is the perfect second ruckman" with my opinion...

We have 4 ruckmen on our list and Stanley is the only legitimate Forward/backup ruck -
Holmes is green as and barring catastrophe would never play AFL this year full stop.

Pierce missed 1/2 the season and most of the pre season with back stressies, so his development has been significantly stalled, again, unless he exploded in the
VFL, not likely to be used as anything more than fill in ruckman due to injury to all of hickey, Longer and Stanley...

Hickey and Longer, both seen as AFL ready but still green. Hickey no 1 Longer no 2: Neither has had a chance to nail down being a no 1 AFL ruckman, they are both young and lacking in AFL games, let alone affored the opportunity to spend time forward as resting ruck. There was 5 weeks at the start of the year and about 2 weeks mid year when they were both fit and deemed available for 1sts selection. Thats not a lot of overlap.

As you've previoudly mentioned you believe they need to be playing together cohesively by end of next year or trade one out...i've expressed my alternate view that more time and experience wont affect the end result either way...But I think saying we haven't played two genuine ruckmen this year as proof that it wont work with the current list is jumping the gun...IMO

Can you tell us how our forward line looks next season if we play 2 rucks. And the reason i say one will go in 2016 is that I dont think it will work but if it does then we should be able to keep both but if it doesnt we may not want to lose one of the rucks but one will certainly want to leave. I would say it has to work or we will lose one of Hickey or Longer at the end of next season.[/quote]

There are so many options that i could list for our potential forward line next year, which have one of Hickey or Longer in it. Do I think right now based on what i've seen it would be the most effective setup right here and now...no. But you have to admit Plugger, there are so many possibilities surrounding our forward setup both with Rooey, once Rooey's gone, that it's almost pie in the sky stuff trying to look into that chrystal ball...sure I can put names on paper, but thats not my point.

What i'm more confident in predicting though, is improvement from all our ruckmen, injuries to one or more key forwards throughout the season providing opportunity, fluctauting form throughout the season providing opportunity...it's the youth of these ruckmen that has me asking for more patience and time.

I haven't seen or heard anything that says either Hickey, Longer or the two VFL boys are frustrated with lack of opporunity...if you know different that would certainly change my thinking, but with there age and the fact they've both already moved clubs once makes me think they wont be knocking on the pelicans door demanding a trade out by the end of next year...FWIW

[plugger66]

Why is it im carrying on like a pork chop and you arent. Its seems that you are getting upset with me because they arent playing two ruckman and for some reason you think that has something to do with me. I will try to go through some points you raised though. Hale and Ben arent dedicated ruckman who rest forward. Hale particually could play a whole game as a forward if need be. never seen any proof that Longer, Hickey or Pierce could do anythink like that. And playing them together has nothing to do with what we lose by. Why dont we try Delaney at FF. It doesnt matter. The problem is it does. The credibilty of our coaching stocks is at stake. As it is there are morons on here who would sack AR tomorrow if it was up to them. No idea about Ben taking marks for us in the backline but when he did he was still the ruckman on the ground. He just drfted back. Its a simple question but still hasnt been answered by you. Why havent we played 2 ruckman this year in any game. We have so many. I think it is because a Stanley type is the perfect second ruckman.

Don't want to get involved in the slanging match but Plugger to answer a few of your questions..."Why havent we played 2 ruckman this year in any game. We have so many. I think it is because a Stanley type is the perfect second ruckman" with my opinion...

We have 4 ruckmen on our list and Stanley is the only legitimate Forward/backup ruck -
Holmes is green as and barring catastrophe would never play AFL this year full stop.

Pierce missed 1/2 the season and most of the pre season with back stressies, so his development has been significantly stalled, again, unless he exploded in the
VFL, not likely to be used as anything more than fill in ruckman due to injury to all of hickey, Longer and Stanley...

Hickey and Longer, both seen as AFL ready but still green. Hickey no 1 Longer no 2: Neither has had a chance to nail down being a no 1 AFL ruckman, they are both young and lacking in AFL games, let alone affored the opportunity to spend time forward as resting ruck. There was 5 weeks at the start of the year and about 2 weeks mid year when they were both fit and deemed available for 1sts selection. Thats not a lot of overlap.

As you've previoudly mentioned you believe they need to be playing together cohesively by end of next year or trade one out...i've expressed my alternate view that more time and experience wont affect the end result either way...But I think saying we haven't played two genuine ruckmen this year as proof that it wont work with the current list is jumping the gun...IMO

Can you tell us how our forward line looks next season if we play 2 rucks. And the reason i say one will go in 2016 is that I dont think it will work but if it does then we should be able to keep both but if it doesnt we may not want to lose one of the rucks but one will certainly want to leave. I would say it has to work or we will lose one of Hickey or Longer at the end of next season.

There are so many options that i could list for our potential forward line next year, which have one of Hickey or Longer in it. Do I think right now based on what i've seen it would be the most effective setup right here and now...no. But you have to admit Plugger, there are so many possibilities surrounding our forward setup both with Rooey, once Rooey's gone, that it's almost pie in the sky stuff trying to look into that chrystal ball...sure I can put names on paper, but thats not my point.

What i'm more confident in predicting though, is improvement from all our ruckmen, injuries to one or more key forwards throughout the season providing opportunity, fluctauting form throughout the season providing opportunity...it's the youth of these ruckmen that has me asking for more patience and time.

I haven't seen or heard anything that says either Hickey, Longer or the two VFL boys are frustrated with lack of opporunity...if you know different that would certainly change my thinking, but with there age and the fact they've both already moved clubs once makes me think they wont be knocking on the pelicans door demanding a trade out by the end of next year...FWIW[/quote]


Wouldnt the fact that have moved once suggest that they maybe happy to move again. I certainly havent heard a thing about them being unhaoppy. matter of fact common sense would suggest both are happy at this time. Im sure they also both improve but it doesnt matter how good either aare in the ruck unless they can both take a mark as a forward. I hope they can and IMO they have a year to prove it.

[Saint wagga]

Well get to work Mr A Hamill!! Your time starts now I see ya point mate - either way if we can make it work for us, on the paddock or at the trade table, as long as we're there winners, I'll rest easy! deal...

[spot on]

Notice he was given a vote from
The coaches. Has been very good in the tap outs. Needs to find more of the ball and improve his marking. Possible rising star nom ??

[Toy Saint]

I doubt Stanley will make it but if he does he is now the ideal player as a second ruck.

Hey P66, I'm really hopefull that Stanley will make it, BUT what do you reckon we could get for him in a trade?

Just imagine the Hawks with Stanley at Full Forward, tall, fast, strong overhead mark, and long straight kick.....and with +5 pre-seasons....and excellent delivery........

[MC Gusto]

This thread is ridiculous! Longer and hickey will either work together or the won't ! Only time will tell trying to predict the future is a fruitless endeavour. I for one hope they do work together because having 2 dominant ruckmen would be a huge benefit to any team.

[Toy Saint]

I doubt Stanley will make it but if he does he is now the ideal player as a second ruck.

Hey P66, I'm really hopefull that Stanley will make it, BUT what do you reckon we could get for him in a trade?

Just imagine the Hawks with Stanley at Full Forward, tall, fast, strong overhead mark, and long straight kick.....and with +5 pre-seasons....and excellent delivery........

The "I doubt Stanley will make it..." was a P66 quote.....from earlier in this thread...

[plugger66]

I doubt Stanley will make it but if he does he is now the ideal player as a second ruck.

Hey P66, I'm really hopefull that Stanley will make it, BUT what do you reckon we could get for him in a trade?

Just imagine the Hawks with Stanley at Full Forward, tall, fast, strong overhead mark, and long straight kick.....and with +5 pre-seasons....and excellent delivery........

About a third rounder. Not worth losing for that.

[Toy Saint]

I doubt Stanley will make it but if he does he is now the ideal player as a second ruck.

Hey P66, I'm really hopefull that Stanley will make it, BUT what do you reckon we could get for him in a trade?

Just imagine the Hawks with Stanley at Full Forward, tall, fast, strong overhead mark, and long straight kick.....and with +5 pre-seasons....and excellent delivery........

About a third rounder. Not worth losing for that.

Certainly not worth losing for a 3rd round pick, I wonder how many here would trade Stanley for a 1st round pick (selection 1-18)?

[plugger66]

I doubt Stanley will make it but if he does he is now the ideal player as a second ruck.

Hey P66, I'm really hopefull that Stanley will make it, BUT what do you reckon we could get for him in a trade?

Just imagine the Hawks with Stanley at Full Forward, tall, fast, strong overhead mark, and long straight kick.....and with +5 pre-seasons....and excellent delivery........

About a third rounder. Not worth losing for that.

Certainly not worth losing for a 3rd round pick, I wonder how many here would trade Stanley for a 1st round pick (selection 1-18)?

Everyone should.

[StJimmy]

The key to the success of our young ruckman is one on one coaching from a genuine retired AFL ruckman and for me that man is Dean Cox. He's just retired, wants to pursue coaching and transformed himself from not a great young ruckman to an all time great. Imagine what he could do with Hickey, Longer & Pierce?

[saintspremiers]

I doubt Stanley will make it but if he does he is now the ideal player as a second ruck.

Hey P66, I'm really hopefull that Stanley will make it, BUT what do you reckon we could get for him in a trade?

Just imagine the Hawks with Stanley at Full Forward, tall, fast, strong overhead mark, and long straight kick.....and with +5 pre-seasons....and excellent delivery........

About a third rounder. Not worth losing for that.

Certainly not worth losing for a 3rd round pick, I wonder how many here would trade Stanley for a 1st round pick (selection 1-18)?

Everyone should.

Except the other 17 teams which won't offer that deal.